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Featured The seven kings of Revelation 17:10

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by Douggg, Feb 27, 2020.

  1. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Nero was the last of the Julio-Claudian family leaders. The 7 kings are all related. Of the same family. The Julio-Claudians. Julius Caesar was the first of the Julio-Claudians, but was not an emperor, but dictator for life. Thus is not in the list of emperors.

    Julio-Claudian dynasty - Wikipedia

    "The Julio-Claudian dynasty was the first Roman imperial dynasty, consisting of the first five emperorsAugustus, Tiberius, Caligula, Claudius, and Nero[1]—or the family to which they belonged. They ruled the Roman Empire from its formation under Augustus in 27 BC until AD 68 (95 years), when the last of the line, Nero, committed suicide"

    The 7 kings of Revelation 17:10 are:

    1. Julius Caesar (dictator for life)

    2. Augustus (1st emperor)

    3. Tiberius (2nd emperor)

    4. Caligula (3rd emperor)

    5. Claudius (4th emperor)

    6. Nero (5th emperor)

    7. The end times little horn person (forthcoming leader of the EU)
     
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  2. summerville

    summerville Well-Known Member

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    You left out the Seleucids.
     
  3. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    The Seleucids were not kings of the fourth kingdom of iron in the Daniel 2 statue image, nor in the Daniel 7 fourth beast.

    The Seleucids were part of the four breakup kingdoms of Alexanders's Greek kingdom.
     
  4. summerville

    summerville Well-Known Member

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    Right..

    After Alexander the Great's death, his generals divided the empire amongst themselves, forming what we call today the Hellenistic kingdoms - Macedonia, Egypt, Syria and Pergamon.

    These kingdoms were progressively absorbed into the Roman Empire in the Second and First Centuries BCE.
     
  5. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    I am not in disagreement with any of that.

    What I am showing in my original post is that the 7 kings are all of one family, the Julio-Claudians.

    Whether it comes out publicly that the end times person is descended of the Julio-Claudians is not for certain. The connection though is that he will be leader of the end times Roman Empire, in the form of the EU.

    So, that the person also has to be a Jew, it should be possible to identify the person once he gets in the leadership position over the ten kings (leaders, as well) of the EU. There has to be some developments in the EU structure take place, before the ten kings themselves can be identified as a group.

    I am just saying let's keep an eye on it.
     
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  6. summerville

    summerville Well-Known Member

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    As soon as you throw in the EU you ankle deep in the Scofield heresy and Hal Lindsey..

    Consider this:

    Daniel 11 in Context - Livius

    Daniel 11 in Context - Livius
     
  7. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Well, in Daniel 11, parts are historic, up to verse 36; which verse 36 is end times after the person has become the beast of Revelation 13.

    Scofield and Hal Lindsey are a different topic. Let's just say I am not parroting anyone of them, nor any such commentator.

    Here is my overall end times view on a chart I made. At 71, I am basically the same age as you. 50 years eschatology intense life.

    upload_2020-2-27_7-34-40.jpeg
     
  8. summerville

    summerville Well-Known Member

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    Gog and Magog also invaded already.. In fact some stayed behind and settled Scythiopolis.

    Daniel chapter 1,8 to 12 was written in Hebrew. Daniel chapter 2 to 7 was written in Aramaic.
    You've noticed that Daniel is written in different languages??

    There is no Roman Empire nor Holy Roman Empire in prophecy. Its only been since the 1970s that so many Christians agreed with labeling modern people or countries to fit first century prophecy. Before then it was just fringe churches.

    You might find this very interesting.

    Beast of Revelation
     
  9. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Gog/Magog is time of the end. Latter days. Not happened yet. No massive grave of Gog's army. All requirements of Gog/Magog in Ezekiel 38/39.
     
  10. Josheb

    Josheb Christian Supporter

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    Nope. Nero was the head wound. The Roman Empire suffered a head wound that would have been fatal but recovered. Galba finishes the seven.

    Julius, Augustus, Tiberius, Caligula, Claudius, Nero, Galba.

    Revelation 17:10
    "and they are seven kings; five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come; and when he comes, he must remain a little while."

    Galba was Emperor for only a little while; he was Emperor for only seven months.

    Revelation 1:1-3
    "The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him to show to His bond-servants, the things which must happen quickly; and He sent and communicated it by His angel to His bond-servant John, who testified to the word of God and to the testimony of Jesus Christ, even to all that he saw. Blessed is he who reads and those who hear the words of the prophecy, and heed the things which are written in it; for the time is near."

    Revelation 22:10
    [i]"And he said to me, “Do not seal up the words of the prophecy of this book, for the time is near."[/i]​
     
  11. summerville

    summerville Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
     
  12. summerville

    summerville Well-Known Member

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    The Year of the Four Emperors, 69 AD, was a year in the history of the Roman Empire in which four emperors ruled in succession: Galba, Otho, Vitellius, and Vespasian. The suicide of the emperor Nero in 68 was followed by a brief period of civil war, the first Roman civil war since Mark Antony's death in 30 BC.
     
  13. Josheb

    Josheb Christian Supporter

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    Dispensationalism's far-futurism is very popular but it is not the majority-held eschatology of the Church. While it may be true of "many people," the greater truth is that most Christians do not agree with labeling modern people or countries to fit the first century prophesy. This is something often actively kept from Dispensational congregants by their seminaries and local pastors.
     
  14. summerville

    summerville Well-Known Member

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    Ezekiel lived and prophesied before and after the destruction of the First Temple in Jerusalem by the Babylonians, which took place in 586 BCE.
     
  15. summerville

    summerville Well-Known Member

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    Far flung futurism wasn't popular when I was a girl.. It seems to be the rule rather than the exception these days.. Dallas Theological Seminary turns out thousands of preacher who may not be aware of Scofield at all.
     
  16. Josheb

    Josheb Christian Supporter

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    Or we could accept the majority of the book of Revelation happened in the first century and get on with what we Christians are supposed to be doing (The Cultural Mandate, The Great Commission, being a light on a heill, etc.). "Keeping an eye on it" has proven and remains a fruitless act prompted by a litany of teachers whose highly interpretive teachings have proven false.
     
  17. Josheb

    Josheb Christian Supporter

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    Yep.
    Yes, it seems to be "the rule."

    But it is NOT the rule. Never has been. Yes, DTS is the leading progenitor of this misguided theology and yes, Scofield was an insidious influence propagating Darbyism unawares to millions because of a lack of congregational education in the historical positions of the church.

    Darbyism is popular. It is not the majority. Its popularity gives it the appearance of being the majority view, or even the mainstream or orthodox view but it is not and has never been any of those things.


    I first learned of it from Hal Lindsay. I read his books before I became a Christian and after becoming a Christ I thought that was it; that was the sole eschatology of the church and there was no other and had never been any other view of end times. I was a Dispensational Premillennialist for over a decade without ever knowing that's what it was called.

    Then a faithful friend took me out to lunch and walked me through the Bible, showing me how the events described have come an gone and it is easy to understand if and when a person stays couched in scripture's view of scripture and the tools of proper exegesis. I didn't accept a word he said. I became offended and yelled at him, making a scene right in the middle of the restaurant, but he remained calm and faithful and told me simply to examine the Bible to verify all he'd shown me and that's what I did. Days and weeks later I read through the pages of prophesy using scripture and not the 20th or 21st century newscasts, to understand scripture as written, plainly and exegetically read.

    As time went by I noted how false teacher after false teacher after false teacher came and went, never being held accountable for their falsehoods. I met Chuck Smith and Jack Hayford and many other evangelical Dispies personally. I listened to them as they tried to make the case for the eschatological claims that repeatedly proved false. I've watched the Dispies stop date-setting in favor of timeframe-setting in an attempt to hide behind "no one will know the day or time" while their congregants ignore the fact timeframe-setting isn't much different than date-setting (and has also proven false and fruitless).


    Anyone bothering to examine the Church history of the late 1800s will easily see Darbyism was decried from its inception and if it hadn't been for the progression ensconced in the shift away from creedalism to experientialism, followed by the popularity of the Scofield Study Bible and then the legitimizing effects of DTS , Darbyism would have never been accepted by masses of believers.



    Far-futurism is not the rule. It is popular, but it is not the majority nor the orthodox view of the Church now, nor historically.
     
  18. summerville

    summerville Well-Known Member

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    It takes courage and humility to change your mind.. Bravo.

    I hope you're right about futurism not being mainstream.

    I cannot even imagine Jesus neglecting his followers in favor of talking to people thousands of years in the future. That would be cruel in the extreme.
     
  19. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Galba was not a Julio-Claudian.

    From Wikiepedia.....

    "Galba was not related to any of the emperors of the Julio-Claudian dynasty, but he was a member of a distinguished noble family."

    Galba - Wikipedia


    The historic Julio-Claudians ended with Nero, king 6. King 7 is end times.
     
  20. summerville

    summerville Well-Known Member

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    Where does it say they have to be Julio-Claudians?
     
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