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Featured The Restitution Of All Things A.K.A. Universalism

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by FineLinen, Jun 24, 2018.

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  1. Hillsage

    Hillsage One for Him and Him for all Supporter

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    So, we share a common bond with brother Eby. :clap: I truly consider him to be the 'anointed pen' of my life. I first started getting his monthly teachings in the early 80's. And I am continually amazed by the things that he shares. His 'Savior of the world' series was one of the early findings I had to help answer all the questions continuously asked by the ETer's here who can not hear the teaching which we have 'heard'. Just the other day my wife opened the mailbox and said, as she has every month, for years; "Your birthday present arrived." :) And then she hands me the latest monthly teaching from Preston.
     
  2. twin.spin

    twin.spin Trust the LORD and not on your own understanding

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    Last edited: Jul 1, 2018
  3. Der Alter

    Der Alter This is me about 1 yr. old. Supporter

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    Two youtube videos by some anonymous person saying "Eternal Punishment is not Biblical" so it must be true. I think Abraham Lincoln once said "Don't believe everything you see online."
    In the following twenty two verses αἰών and αἰώνιος are defined/described by association with other words and phrases as eternity, eternal, everlasting etc.: 1 Timothy 1:17, 2 Corinthians 4:17-18, 2 Corinthians 5:1, Hebrews 7:24, 1 Peter 1:23, 1 Timothy 6:16, Galatians 6:8, John 6:58, John 10:20, 1 John 2:17, 1 Peter 5:10, Romans 2:7, Luke 1:33, Revelation 14:11, John 10:28, John 3:15, John 3:16, John 5:24, Ephesians 3:21, Romans 1:20, Romans 16:26.

    …..In the NT “aion/aionios” are used to refer to things which are not eternal but are never defined/described as meaning a period of time less than eternal as in the following verses.

    [1]Romans 1:20
    (20) For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal [ἀΐ́διος/aidios] power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

    [2]Romans 16:26
    (26) But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting [αἰώνιος/aionios] God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:
    In Romans 1:20 Paul refers to God’s power and Godhead as “aidios.” Scholars agree “aidios” unquestionably means eternal, everlasting, unending etc. In Rom 16:26 Paul refers to God as “aionios,” therefore Paul evidently considers “aidios” and “aionios” to be synonymous.
    [3]1 Timothy 1:17.
    (17) Now unto the King eternal, [αἰών/aion] immortal, [ ̓́αφθαρτος/aphthartos] invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever [αἰών/aion] and ever [αἰώνιος/aionios]. Amen.
    In this verse “aion” is paired with “immortal.” “Aion” cannot mean “age(s),” a finite period and be immortal at the same time. Thus “aion” by definition here means “eternal.”
    [4]2 Corinthians 4:17-18
    (17) For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios] weight of glory;
    (18) While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal;[πρόσκαιρος/proskairos] but the things which are not seen are eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios]
    In this passage “aionios” is contrasted with “for a moment,” vs. 4, and “temporal,” vs. 5. “Age(s)” a finite period, it is not the opposite of “for a moment”/”temporal/temporary.” “Eternal” is. “Aionios” by definition here means “eternal.”
    [5]2 Corinthians 5:1
    (1) For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios] in the heavens.
    In this verse “aionios house” is contrasted with “earthly house which is destroyed.” Does the UR crowd think God is going to replace our destroyed earthly house with an ages long house which will also be destroyed at the end of an age? The aionios house is not destroyed, the opposite of “is destroyed.” Thus “aionios” by definition here means “eternal.”
    [6]Hebrews 7:24 but because Jesus lives forever [αἰών/aion] he has an unchangeable [ἀπαράβατος/aparabatos] priesthood.
    In this verse “aion” is paired with “unchangeable.” If “aion” means “age(s),” Jesus cannot continue “for a finite period” and be “unchangeable” at the same time. Thus “aion” by definition here means “eternal.”
    [7]1 Peter 1:23
    (23) For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, [ ̓́αφθαρτος/aphthartos] through the living and enduring word of God. …
    1 Peter 1:25
    (25) but the word of the Lord endures forever.[αἰών/aion] " And this is the word that was preached to you.
    In verse 23 “word of God” is paired with “imperishable.” In verse 25 the word of God “endures εις τον αιωνα unto eternity. ” Thus by definition “aion” here means “eternity.”
    [8]1 Timothy 6:16
    (16) Who only hath immortality, [ ̓́αφθαρτος/aphthartos] dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting[αἰώνιος/aionios]
    In this verse “aionios” is paired with “immortality.” If “aionios” is only a finite period, God cannot be “immortal” and only exist for a finite period at the same time. Thus “aionios” by definition means “eternal.”
    [9]Galatians 6:8
    (8) For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption;[φθορά/fthora] but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting. [αἰώνιος/aionios]
    In this verse “aionios” is contrasted with “corruption.” “Fleshly” people reap “corruption” but spiritual people reap “life aionios,” i.e. “not corruption.” “Age(s), a finite period, is not opposite of “corruption.” Thus “aionios life” by definition here means “eternal/everlasting life.”
    [10]John 6:58
    (58) This is the bread that came down from heaven. Your ancestors ate manna and died, but whoever feeds on this bread will live forever.[αἰώνιος/aionios]
    In this verse “aionios life” is contrasted with “death.” If “live aionios” is only a finite period, a finite period is not opposite “death.” Thus “aionios” by definition here means “eternal.”
    [11]John 10:28
    (28) I give them eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios] life, and they shall never [αἰών/aion] perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.
    Here “aionios” and “aion” are paired with “[not] snatch them out of my hand.” If “aion/aionios” means “age(s), a finite period,” that is not the opposite of “[not] snatch them out of my hand’” “Aionios life” by definition here means “eternal life.”
    [12]1 John 2:17
    (17) The world and its desires pass away, but whoever does the will of God lives forever. [αἰών/aion]
    In this verse “aionios” is contrasted with “pass away,” “lives aionios” cannot mean a finite period, A “finite period” is not opposite of “pass away.” Thus “lives aionios” by definition here means “lives eternally.”
    [13]1 Peter 5:10
    (10) And the God of all grace, who called you to his eternal [αιωνιον/aionion] glory in Christ, after you have suffered a little while, [ολιγον/oligon] will himself restore you and make you strong, firm and steadfast.
    In this verse “aionios” is contrasted with “little while” Does the UR crowd think that Jesus will give His followers an finite period of glory then they will eventually die? Thus “aionios” here means “eternal.”
    [14]Romans 2:7
    (7) To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, [ἀφθαρσία/apftharsia] he will give eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios] life.
    In this verse “aionios” is paired with “immortality.” If “aionios” is only a finite period, believers cannot seek for “a finite period,” and “immortality” at the same time. But they can seek for “eternal life” and “immortality” at the same time. Thus by definition “aionios life” here means “eternal life.”
    [15]Luke 1:33
    (33) And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; [αιωνας/aionas] and of his kingdom there shall be no end.[τελος/τελος]
    In this verse “aionas” is paired with “without end.” “aionas” cannot be paired with “without end” if it means only “ages” a finite period. “Aionas” by definition here means eternal.
    [16]Revelation 14:11
    (11) And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever:[εις αιωνας αιωνων/eis aionas aionon] and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
    In this verse “aionas aionon torment” is paired with “no rest day or night.” If “aionas, aionon” means “a finite period” at some time they would rest, “Aionas, aionon” by definition here means “forever and forever.”
    [17]John 10:28
    (28) And I give unto them eternal [αιωνιον] life; and they shall never [εις τον αιωνα] perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
    In this verse “aionion” is paired with “[no man can] “pluck them out of my hand.” If “aionion” is only a finite period then at some time they could be plucked out. “Aionion” by definition here means eternal.
    [18]John 3:15
    (15) That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal [αιωνιον] life.
    In this verse “aionion” is paired with “shall not perish.” They could perish in a finite period, “aionion life” by definition here means eternal life.
    [19]John 3:16
    (16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting [αιωνιον] life.
    In this verse “aionion” is paired with “shall not perish.” People could eventually perish in a finite period, “aionion life” by definition here means eternal life.
    [20]John 5:24
    (24) Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting [αἰώνιος] life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
    In this verse “aionios” is paired with “shall not come into condemnation” and “passed from life unto death.” “Aionios” does not mean “a finite period,” by definition here it means “eternal,” unless Jesus lets His followers come into condemnation and pass into death.
    [21]Romans 5:21
    (21) That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal [αἰώνιος] life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
    In this verse “aionios life” is contrasted with death. “A finite period” is not opposite death, “eternal life” is. “Aionios life” by definition here means ‘eternal life.”
    [22]Ephesians 3:21
    (21) to him be glory in the church and in Christ Jesus throughout all generations, for ever [του αιωνος/tou aionios] and ever! [των αιωνων/ton aionion] Amen.
    In this verse “tou aionios ton aionion” is paired with “throughout all generations.” "Age(s)" a finite period cannot refer to "all generations." By definition “tou aionios ton aionion” means forever and ever.


     
  4. ClementofA

    ClementofA Well-Known Member Supporter

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    That claim has been answered & disproven many times before, e.g.:

    https://www.christianforums.com/thr...os-based-on-aion.8040292/page-2#post-72110302

    https://www.christianforums.com/thr...torture-in-fire.8041369/page-25#post-72149978

    Even in this same thread:

    https://www.christianforums.com/thr...k-a-universalism.8070242/page-8#post-72862899

    OTOH here we see many examples where αἰών and αἰώνιος are defined/described as being of a finite duration:

    http://www.city-data.com/forum/christianity/2931562-does-aionios-always-mean-eternal-ancient.html

    http://www.hopebeyondhell.net/articles/further-study/eternity/

    12 points re forever and ever being a deceptive translation & being finite:
    https://www.christianforums.com/thr...-not-cast-off-for-ever.8041512/#post-72126038

    Jesus didn't use the best words & expressions to describe endlessness in regards to punishment, because He didn't believe in endless punishment:

    https://www.christianforums.com/thr...-a-universalism.8070242/page-14#post-72882151

    Der Alter has never answered & refuted any of the above, but rather continually ignores them.




     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2018
  5. twin.spin

    twin.spin Trust the LORD and not on your own understanding

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    That claim has been answered & disproven many times before, e.g.:

    https://www.christianforums.com/threads/what-does-aionios-mean-part-2-it-is-wrong-to-define-aionios-based-on-aion.8040292/page-2#post-72110302

    https://www.christianforums.com/threads/how-do-people-who-believe-in-eternal-torture-in-fire.8041369/page-25#post-72149978

    Even in this same thread:

    https://www.christianforums.com/threads/the-restitution-of-all-things-a-k-a-universalism.8070242/page-8#post-72862899

    OTOH here we see many examples where αἰών and αἰώνιος are defined/described as being of a finite duration:

    http://www.city-data.com/forum/christianity/2931562-does-aionios-always-mean-eternal-ancient.html

    http://www.hopebeyondhell.net/articles/further-study/eternity/

    12 points re forever and ever being a deceptive translation & being finite:
    https://www.christianforums.com/threads/for-the-lord-will-not-cast-off-for-ever.8041512/#post-72126038

    Jesus didn't use the best words & expressions to describe endlessness in regards to punishment, because He didn't believe in endless punishment:

    https://www.christianforums.com/threads/the-restitution-of-all-things-a-k-a-universalism.8070242/page-14#post-72882151

    Der Alter has never answered & refuted any of the above, but rather continually ignores them.

    [/QUOTE]

    So what if you repeat the same links over and over, or the same universalists like Rose2Love post (copy\paste) the same thing to and from City Data … it doesn't make Universalism any more truer.
     
  6. ClementofA

    ClementofA Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Once something is already true, can it get any truer?

    Since UR is 100% true, it cannot get any truer.

    If no one posted the truth, it would still be true. Posting doesn't make it true.

    Posting the truth counters the erroneous for those who have an open mind & heart to seek the truth. That is only possible if God grants one the grace to see it & be delivered from the darkness.

    FineLinen, Hillsage, mkgal1 & others are here spreading the incense of God's truth in love.
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2018
  7. Der Alter

    Der Alter This is me about 1 yr. old. Supporter

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    Two youtube videos by some anonymous person saying "Eternal Punishment is not Biblical" so it must be true. I think Abraham Lincoln once said "Don't believe everything you see online."
    .....In the following twenty two verses αἰών and αἰώνιος are defined/described by association with other words and phrases as eternity, eternal, everlasting etc.: 1 Timothy 1:17, 2 Corinthians 4:17-18, 2 Corinthians 5:1, Hebrews 7:24, 1 Peter 1:23, 1 Timothy 6:16, Galatians 6:8, John 6:58, John 10:20, 1 John 2:17, 1 Peter 5:10, Romans 2:7, Luke 1:33, Revelation 14:11, John 10:28, John 3:15, John 3:16, John 5:24, Ephesians 3:21, Romans 1:20, Romans 16:26.

    …..In the NT “aion/aionios” are used to refer to things which are not eternal but are never defined/described as meaning a period of time less than eternal as in the following verses.

    [1]Romans 1:20
    (20) For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal [ἀΐ́διος/aidios] power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

    [2]Romans 16:26
    (26) But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting [αἰώνιος/aionios] God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:
    In Romans 1:20 Paul refers to God’s power and Godhead as “aidios.” Scholars agree “aidios” unquestionably means eternal, everlasting, unending etc. In Rom 16:26 Paul refers to God as “aionios,” therefore Paul evidently considers “aidios” and “aionios” to be synonymous since he uses both words to refer to God's eternal nature.
    [3]1 Timothy 1:17.
    (17) Now unto the King eternal, [αἰών/aion] immortal, [ ̓́αφθαρτος/aphthartos] invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever [αἰών/aion] and ever [αἰώνιος/aionios]. Amen.
    In this verse “aion” is paired with “immortal.” “Aion” cannot mean “age(s),” a finite period and be immortal at the same time. Thus “aion” by definition here means “eternal.”
    [4]2 Corinthians 4:17-18
    (17) For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios] weight of glory;
    (18) While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal;[πρόσκαιρος/proskairos] but the things which are not seen are eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios]
    In this passage “aionios” is contrasted with “for a moment,” vs. 4, and “temporal,” vs. 5. “Age(s)” a finite period, it is not the opposite of “for a moment”/”temporal/temporary.” “Eternal” is. “Aionios” by definition here means “eternal.”
    [5]2 Corinthians 5:1
    (1) For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios] in the heavens.
    In this verse “aionios house” is contrasted with “earthly house which is destroyed.” Does the UR crowd think God is going to replace our destroyed earthly house with an ages long house which will also be destroyed at the end of an age? The aionios house is not destroyed, the opposite of “is destroyed.” Thus “aionios” by definition here means “eternal.”
    [6]Hebrews 7:24 but because Jesus lives forever [αἰών/aion] he has an unchangeable [ἀπαράβατος/aparabatos] priesthood.
    In this verse “aion” is paired with “unchangeable.” If “aion” means “age(s),” Jesus cannot continue “for a finite period” and be “unchangeable” at the same time. Thus “aion” by definition here means “eternal.”
    [7]1 Peter 1:23
    (23) For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, [ ̓́αφθαρτος/aphthartos] through the living and enduring word of God. …
    1 Peter 1:25
    (25) but the word of the Lord endures forever.[αἰών/aion] " And this is the word that was preached to you.
    In verse 23 “word of God” is paired with “imperishable.” In verse 25 the word of God “endures εις τον αιωνα unto eternity. ” Thus by definition “aion” here means “eternity.”
    [8]1 Timothy 6:16
    (16) Who only hath immortality, [ ̓́αφθαρτος/aphthartos] dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting[αἰώνιος/aionios]
    In this verse “aionios” is paired with “immortality.” If “aionios” is only a finite period, God cannot be “immortal” and only exist for a finite period at the same time. Thus “aionios” by definition means “eternal.”
    [9]Galatians 6:8
    (8) For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption;[φθορά/fthora] but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting. [αἰώνιος/aionios]
    In this verse “aionios” is contrasted with “corruption.” “Fleshly” people reap “corruption” but spiritual people reap “life aionios,” i.e. “not corruption.” “Age(s), a finite period, is not opposite of “corruption.” Thus “aionios life” by definition here means “eternal/everlasting life.”
    [10]John 6:58
    (58) This is the bread that came down from heaven. Your ancestors ate manna and died, but whoever feeds on this bread will live forever.[αἰώνιος/aionios]
    In this verse “aionios life” is contrasted with “death.” If “live aionios” is only a finite period, a finite period is not opposite “death.” Thus “aionios” by definition here means “eternal.”
    [11]John 10:28
    (28) I give them eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios] life, and they shall never [αἰών/aion] perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.
    Here “aionios” and “aion” are paired with “[not] snatch them out of my hand.” If “aion/aionios” means “age(s), a finite period,” that is not the opposite of “[not] snatch them out of my hand’” “Aionios life” by definition here means “eternal life.”
    [12]1 John 2:17
    (17) The world and its desires pass away, but whoever does the will of God lives forever. [αἰών/aion]
    In this verse “aionios” is contrasted with “pass away,” “lives aionios” cannot mean a finite period, A “finite period” is not opposite of “pass away.” Thus “lives aionios” by definition here means “lives eternally.”
    [13]1 Peter 5:10
    (10) And the God of all grace, who called you to his eternal [αιωνιον/aionion] glory in Christ, after you have suffered a little while, [ολιγον/oligon] will himself restore you and make you strong, firm and steadfast.
    In this verse “aionios” is contrasted with “little while” Does the UR crowd think that Jesus will give His followers an finite period of glory then they will eventually die? Thus “aionios” here means “eternal.”
    [14]Romans 2:7
    (7) To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, [ἀφθαρσία/apftharsia] he will give eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios] life.
    In this verse “aionios” is paired with “immortality.” If “aionios” is only a finite period, believers cannot seek for “a finite period,” and “immortality” at the same time. But they can seek for “eternal life” and “immortality” at the same time. Thus by definition “aionios life” here means “eternal life.”
    [15]Luke 1:33
    (33) And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; [αιωνας/aionas] and of his kingdom there shall be no end.[τελος/τελος]
    In this verse “aionas” is paired with “without end.” “aionas” cannot be paired with “without end” if it means only “ages” a finite period. “Aionas” by definition here means eternal.
    [16]Revelation 14:11
    (11) And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever:[εις αιωνας αιωνων/eis aionas aionon] and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
    In this verse “aionas aionon torment” is paired with “no rest day or night.” If “aionas, aionon” means “a finite period” at some time they would rest, “Aionas, aionon” by definition here means “forever and forever.”
    [17]John 10:28
    (28) And I give unto them eternal [αιωνιον] life; and they shall never [εις τον αιωνα] perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
    In this verse “aionion” is paired with “[no man can] “pluck them out of my hand.” If “aionion” is only a finite period then at some time they could be plucked out. “Aionion” by definition here means eternal.
    [18]John 3:15
    (15) That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal [αιωνιον] life.
    In this verse “aionion” is paired with “shall not perish.” They could perish in a finite period, “aionion life” by definition here means eternal life.
    [19]John 3:16
    (16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting [αιωνιον] life.
    In this verse “aionion” is paired with “shall not perish.” People could eventually perish in a finite period, “aionion life” by definition here means eternal life.
    [20]John 5:24
    (24) Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting [αἰώνιος] life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
    In this verse “aionios” is paired with “shall not come into condemnation” and “passed from life unto death.” “Aionios” does not mean “a finite period,” by definition here it means “eternal,” unless Jesus lets His followers come into condemnation and pass into death.
    [21]Romans 5:21
    (21) That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal [αἰώνιος] life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
    In this verse “aionios life” is contrasted with death. “A finite period” is not opposite death, “eternal life” is. “Aionios life” by definition here means ‘eternal life.”
    [22]Ephesians 3:21
    (21) to him be glory in the church and in Christ Jesus throughout all generations, for ever [του αιωνος/tou aionios] and ever! [των αιωνων/ton aionion] Amen.
    In this verse “tou aionios ton aionion” is paired with “throughout all generations.” "Age(s)" a finite period cannot refer to "all generations." By definition “tou aionios ton aionion” means forever and ever.
    There have been erroneous claims that the above scriptural proofs which show that aion means eternity and aionios means eternal, everlasting have been refuted but that is not true. There have been some specious arguments presented which have been refuted.
    .....See e.g. this claim quoted in the preceding post "OTOH here we see many examples where αἰών andαἰώνιος are defined/described as being of a finite duration:" There are no, zero, none verses in which aion/aionios are compared or contrasted with other adjectives or phrases which show that either is of finite duration.
    .....I acknowledge that both words are sometimes used to refer to something that is finite as in Matt 13:39.

    Matthew 13:39
    (39) and the enemy who sows them is the devil. The harvest is the end of the age,[αἰών]and the harvesters are angels.
    This verse refers to something which has an end but there are no other adjectives or phrases in the verse which further indicate that aion is finite as in the 22 vss. listed above.
    .....
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2018
  8. FineLinen

    FineLinen Senior Veteran Supporter

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    We share a common bond on the basis of the anointing of the Holy One that has captivated us by His love and grace! You, my friend, are a rich treasure our Father uses here and where your path leads. Preston Eby has been a faithful teacher, and man of God who speaks words of life. The Father has in this age those who faithfully declare the whole council Of God. Every age must have a remnant who follow the Lamb in the withersover of His movings! I know you and others here are called to walk the High Road of His Presence. May He lift all of us into higher union with Him.
     
  9. ClementofA

    ClementofA Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Why did you just respond to - your own post?

    And why then post again the exact same material that was in that post (#283)?

    Both posts on the same page (15) of this thread & only 4 posts after spamming the other one.

    Weird.

    And BTW refuted by my post #284.
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2018
  10. FineLinen

    FineLinen Senior Veteran Supporter

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    My brother; we testify to what we have seen and heard. The only minds and hearts that will undergo transformation, are those who get into the same anointing of the Presence. We can only testify, Abba must quicken the eyes and ears to see and hear!
     
  11. needhugs

    needhugs Flibbertyjibbet

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    Hello all... i see the word eternal is out for another kick at the can...
    Hillsage... where can i get those teachings? is there an email? a snail mail addy, that i can write to?
    thanks, and have fun with the word 'eternal'... i grow weary of that silly argument.

    I like what Nehemia Gordon said about the word... (and he doesn't even have a dog in the race lol) ...that in the hebrew it was 'olam' and it meant 'universe' or 'as long as the universe will last'... and he assumed that that was 'eternal'... but we all know it's not, coz there will be a new heavens and a new earth...
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2018
  12. needhugs

    needhugs Flibbertyjibbet

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    whut? is there something in the Bible about that? do i get a prize from Jesus? :) i always assumed that i lost whatever kudos i might get from Jesus because HE is the only reason i have made it this far... i didn't 'overcome'... He made miracles happen to save my sorry life!!
    i remember reading 'the dark night of the soul' and it said that those that go thru it get to be 'God's darlings' after :)
    i don't see how i can help others, if somebody finds themselves so demonized, to hear that it can last 20 years, well... that could NOT be helpful
    i remember back when it first happened to me, i met a girl at a church that had gotten over the same problem, and i asked her how long it went on for, and she said 'oh a looooong time, TWO YEARS' and i freaked out and said 'two YEARS????'
    i can only imagine hearing 'TWENTY' from somebody.. telling somebody that might be an advertisement to the wrong side
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2018
  13. twin.spin

    twin.spin Trust the LORD and not on your own understanding

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    As you've been told, Universalism is the same demonic lie of old … "Did God really say".

    Jesus really describes hell as being “prepared for the devil and his angels” (Matthew 25:41). That same Bible verse Jesus speaks of hell as the place to which unbelievers will be sentenced forever when all people will be judged justly by Jesus with God's approval.

    Universalism will be exposed for the fraud that it is when Jesus' words come to fruition when he said:
    “And he has given him authority to judge because he is the Son of Man.
    Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his
    voice and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned."

    Unbelievers are "evildoers" (Matthew 25) and are not condemned to a eventual UR … they. are. cursed. to. hell. ~ Jesus
     
  14. needhugs

    needhugs Flibbertyjibbet

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    oh for pete's sake
     
  15. ClementofA

    ClementofA Well-Known Member Supporter

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    That quote is from the book of Genesis which never once mentions any Dante's Inferno type of "hell". Does it even once use the word "hell"?

    Well, "twin.spin", you have a different interpretation than the Universalists. Why should i believe your POV? Just because you say so? Do you speak authoritatively for Jesus like some infallible pontiff?

    https://www.christianforums.com/threads/augustines-ignorance-error-re-matthew-25-46.8041938/

    https://www.christianforums.com/threads/have-you-been-decieved-by-your-bible-translation.8039822/
     
  16. needhugs

    needhugs Flibbertyjibbet

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    besides... Jesus said that nobody can come to Him unless the Father makes them come to Him... So why would God put them in hell for eternity for not being made to come to Jesus?? is that 'justice'..??

    this whole thing is just not realizing that this 'age of grace' we are in isn't THE LAST AGE!!!! That God just might be a little bit bigger than that, and He works thru ALL the ages, to do ALL His pleasure...

    i mean, fudge, it's written in the Bible that there are ages to come, and it's also written that EVERY knee will bow, and that God will be ALL IN ALL.

    as obama once said 'folks ain't readin' yer Bible'
     
  17. needhugs

    needhugs Flibbertyjibbet

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    Isaiah 46
    8 “Remember this, and [b]show yourselves men;
    Recall to mind, O you transgressors.
    9 Remember the former things of old,
    For I am God, and there is no other;
    I am God, and there is none like Me,
    10 Declaring the end from the beginning,
    And from ancient times things that are not yet done,
    Saying, ‘My counsel shall stand,
    And I will do all My pleasure,’
    11 Calling a bird of prey from the east,
    The man who executes My counsel, from a far country.
    Indeed I have spoken it;
    I will also bring it to pass.
    I have purposed it;
    I will also do it.

    does anyone actually think that burning most of humanity in flames for a never ending amount of time IS GOD'S PLEASURE?? coz you have to read about God's pleasure, coz it says 'it's not His pleasure that ANY should perish, but come to repentance'
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2018
  18. needhugs

    needhugs Flibbertyjibbet

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    i wonder what the word 'obtuse' means in the greek lol let's look it up, since it just came to mind hahaha ... not saying it applies to anyone in particular lolol

    ob·tuse
    əbˈt(y)o͞os,äbˈt(y)o͞os/
    adjective
    1. 1.
      annoyingly insensitive or slow to understand.
      "he wondered if the doctor was being deliberately obtuse"
      synonyms: stupid, slow-witted, slow, dull-witted, unintelligent, ignorant, simpleminded, witless;
      insensitive, imperceptive, uncomprehending;

    2. 2.
      (of an angle) more than 90° and less than 180°.
    Gosh! that's harsh, dude lol i find you to be very angular :)
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2018
  19. FineLinen

    FineLinen Senior Veteran Supporter

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    J.Preston Eby

    http://www.sigler.org/eby/
     
  20. needhugs

    needhugs Flibbertyjibbet

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