The Elven-speaking thread

[Lubiana]

ACK! Yes, I knew there would be mistakes. Thanks Mor! I should have known Mornië, Twas a boo boo! Yes, I definitely ment aurë, not aute. With your help I hope to remember more. Thanks!

Lycana, I'd love to see your language. What is it called?

 

[Lycana]

It's called Hallekífri pronounced Ha-leh- KEE- free. I went crazy one day and made it up over a few weeks. It's not half as pretty as Tolkien's language but I don't know- I've heard stranger words from real languages.

Here's a link where you can learn about it if you want (my name is Eluso Licanu on that site): http://eldanore.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=991&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

Let me know what you think.

 

[Lycana]

Oh darn, never mind- you have to register if you want to see it there. I'll just post some of it here. Here's a quote from the Bible translated into Hallekífri. It's from Psalms 10:

Pase O Id chetef sempa afa vakte? Pase chetef lufa tefrosa channisina so teshan? Hita tefro pat O Kristor! Che nelpe gana utt paldisa!

Translation: Why O Lord, do you stand far off? Why do you hide yourself in times of trouble? Lift up your hand O God! Do not forget the helpless!

 

[jochanaan]

That looks fascinating, Lycana! I assume the pronunciation is pretty much phonetic, with A being "ah," E "eh," I "ee", and so on. Is the CH as in "church" or more like the German/Welch/Hebrew guttural CH?

 

[Lycana]

Here's the info on how to pronounce the words:

You pronounce "a" like you do in the word "father", e is prounounced like "eh", o is pronounced the same way as in the LOTR movie, like "Mordor", u is "oooo", and i is prounced "eeee". For constanants, k and c are always hard, never pronounced like an "s". Two "l's" together are still pronounced like in the word "lion", and you roll your r's like in Quenya. "Ch" is always pronounced like in the work "cherry", and "th" like in the word "thistle".

There are some dipthongs:

ou= "ow" sound, example souche= milk (SOW- che)
oa= pronounced "Oh, ah" like saying "stow away", that "ohah" sound. Example= soa means "peace", (SO- ah)
ua= pronounced "oooo- ah", example "kua"- to live

ai= (pronounce like saying the letter 'i' in english) is an ending to add onto the end of words to form our "ing". Example: tis (allow)= tisai (allowing)

ea= (ay-ah) like in the word jea (to come)= JAY-ah
ey= pronounce like saying the letter "a" in english. Example weynan, to cry (WAY- nan)
qu- another dipthong, you pronounce it like you do in English, like in the word "quiet"

Thanks for your interest, Jochanaan!

 

[jochanaan]

That's about what I would have guessed, except that I would probably said "ou" as the English letter O.

Being a singer, I find myself able to understand and reproduce alien sounds quickly. Singing Chinese, though, was a real challenge! Quenya is comparatively rudimentary.

 

[Lycana]

How Cool! Sing in Chinese? That must be VERY hard! So you can sing in Quenya too? That's amazing! Any way we can hear a sample?

 

[jochanaan]

How Cool! Sing in Chinese? That must be VERY hard! So you can sing in Quenya too? That's amazing! Any way we can hear a sample?

No, I've never tried singing in Quenya. Interesting idea, though: maybe I could write a tune for Galadriel's Farewell! Or has someone already done so?

I learned the Chinese songs a few years ago when I went to China with the University of Colorado (Boulder) Singers. (No, I'm not a student; they invited some community people, including myself, to go with them.)

 

[Lycana]

How very cool! I'm sure someone HAS written a tune for Galadriel's Namarie but that shouldn't stop you. I'd LOVE to hear you sing if you happen to have any WAV files. That is so cool that you got to go to China. Tell us more!

 

[Lubiana]

Oh yes Jochanaan! Please tell us more, this sounds fascinating! Lycana: your language sounds really neat!

 

[morvaltur]

Would someone actually like to hear Quenya singing? I can record some if anyone likes. Aside from Jochanaan's work, of course. I am most definitely not as good of a singer as he.
I believe this site sells some book/CD combinations with the CD containing tracks of some of Tolkiens poems set to music: http://www.abebooks.co.uk/search/sortby/1/an/Tolkien/tn/Road+Goes+Ever+On

 

[morvaltur]

Hallekífri sounds like a very interesting language. What is the basic verb conjugation?

 

[morvaltur]

Friends, I have done some researching and this is what I have found as far as free musical versions of "Namarie" online. Go to this webpage: Music Website .
Scroll down to the bottom of the page. In the last CD's sample tracks (the CD name is Starlit Jewel), the seventh track is a sample of Namarie. I do not know what it sounds like, but I will check later. If someone else can listen to it now, tell us what it sounds like.

 

[jochanaan]

Friends, I have done some researching and this is what I have found as far as free musical versions of "Namarie" online. Go to this webpage: Music Website .

It's lovely, with harp and flute and a fine singer--but unfortunately it's in English.

(Is the composer the same Marion Zimmer Bradley who wrote the Darkover novels and stories? I had no idea she was a musician too! That puts her on a par with Mercedes Lackey, Elizabeth Ann Scarborough, and (I believe) Charles de Lint.)

 

[Eponine]

Yeah... I really want to see the Elvish version of Ave Maria set to music. Or perhaps the Lord's Prayer or Galadriel's lament. Quenya is beautiful enough spoken; I imagine it would be even better sung. If anyone here has any talent at music composing and wants to take up the challenge I too have some talent at singing (though be warned: I am an alto, so anything higher than a high G is out of my range.)

 

[Lycana]

Mor, I would LOVE to hear you sing in Quenya! That would be awesome! I'd also love to hear Jochanaan! These are all wonderful ideas!

Hallekífri sounds like a very interesting language. What is the basic verb conjugation?

Well here are some examples:

Verbs: Forming Tenses

As in English, the normal form of the verb serves as present tense AND the command form. Using the verb sedoa, to sleep you can say "I sleep in the day time" - Ef sedoa ubrechansina (Ehf seh DOE ah oo breh chan SEE nah) and you can also say "Sleep, little one"- Sedoa, eltún (seh DOE ah el TUNE) and you are using the same form of the verb for both.

To make verbs past tense you add "se" at the end of the verb (pronounced seh). If the verb end in "a" like most of them do, you can simply add "se" to the end of it. If it ends in "m", "n" or "u", you still can add "se" to the end. For example: the verb "to whisper", hu, ends in "u" and to make it past tense it will look like this: huse, whispered. (HOO-seh) Another example is the verb "to do", che. To make that in the past tense, add "se" to the end, chese, did.

To form the future tense: change last vowel to "i" at the end of your verb. For most verbs, you can drop the 'a' at the end and change it to an "i". Example: to balance, "bela" will become "beli"= will balance. For those verbs that end in any vowel other than "a" we use a helping 's". You add "si" to the end of these verbs. For example: to do, che will become chesi, will do. To whisper, "hu" will become husi, will whisper. If the verb ends in a constonant, you just add the "i" to the end of it. Example: to taste, "Lanon," becomes lanoni, will taste. (lan ON ee)

And finally in the future tense, if you have verbs that already end in the letter "i", like kepri, to close, then you use your helper "s" again and add "si" to the end of these verbs. So kepri becomes keprisi, will close. Hope that's not too confusing.

 

[morvaltur]

Yeah... I really want to see the Elvish version of Ave Maria set to music. Or perhaps the Lord's Prayer or Galadriel's lament. Quenya is beautiful enough spoken; I imagine it would be even better sung. If anyone here has any talent at music composing and wants to take up the challenge I too have some talent at singing (though be warned: I am an alto, so anything higher than a high G is out of my range.)

Unfortunately, I only compose music on the Native American Flute, or I would love to try it. It is unfortunate that all of us could not gather together somewhere and spend a time singing Elven. 'Twould be a great time.
Also, to hear Quenya singing, get the FotR soundtrack and listen to the two songs Aniron and May It Be. The Elven in both is Quenya, I believe. At least, the May It Be lyrics are.
*laughs* Lycana, thank you for the compliment. Others have told me, though, that I sing like a lovesick elk. Hmmm, perhaps I shall try to record some this weekend. I shall try not to make it too large of a file. And yes, good friends, I will get the poem/contest typed up and posted so you may have the great joy of translating Elven.

 

[Eponine]

Unfortunately, I only compose music on the Native American Flute, or I would love to try it. It is unfortunate that all of us could not gather together somewhere and spend a time singing Elven. 'Twould be a great time.
Also, to hear Quenya singing, get the FotR soundtrack and listen to the two songs Aniron and May It Be. The Elven in both is Quenya, I believe. At least, the May It Be lyrics are.
*laughs* Lycana, thank you for the compliment. Others have told me, though, that I sing like a lovesick elk. Hmmm, perhaps I shall try to record some this weekend. I shall try not to make it too large of a file. And yes, good friends, I will get the poem/contest typed up and posted so you may have the great joy of translating Elven.

*Sighs* The real shame is that neither of us has any talent at composing music. Maybe once I escape from this prison of a school I go to I can learn how to compose. I think I could do it if I had training... hmm... I wonder if my school's musicianship class offers any beginner's training in composition. I know of one boy in my grade (who happens to sit behind me in history) who can compose, but I don't know him well enough to just randomly ask him to set some Elvish lyrics to music. Besides, I think the person doing the composition should be familiar with Elvish pronounciation or else we could have problems.

 

[morvaltur]

Do you all really want me to try? I suppose I could try doing that and singing. I am not much one for excellent singing and tune writing, but perhaps I could do something.
Or did you have someone better in mind? I am sure there are those out there.

 

[Eponine]

Do you all really want me to try? I suppose I could try doing that and singing. I am not much one for excellent singing and tune writing, but perhaps I could do something.
Or did you have someone better in mind? I am sure there are those out there.

Well, I think that if we're going to put Quenya to music, it had better be music that will do justice to the beauty of the language. That means we need to get someone who is good at composing, and said composer needs to know how Quenya is pronounced. More specifically, they need to know where the stress falls in each word so they can make sure to put the stressed syllables on the right beats.