Tax the wealthy and they will leave.

[OldWiseGuy]

Painting realistic outcomes has been helpful with my daughter. Oftentimes I use real events to illustrate my point. Preparation and life navigation is our current focus. She’s begun to realize its impact on the life she’ll have and the necessity of heeding the path.

If you are successful it is likely that your daughter will be as well. My daughter's mother has set an example of utter failure for her, which I'm afraid has chartered her course as well. My example is pretty meaningless to her. I guess it's a mother-daughter thing.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

I think money is a challenging subject and often divisive.

A very successful fellow in my church confided to me that he dressed down and drove a modest car when attending services so as not to cause those very problems.

 

[yougottabekidding]

New York is a business capital with rubbish weather. Florida is a retirement home and sunshine state. Can you see how this might not be the best example you could have chosen?

I've been in both - maybe you should speak about something you have experienced instead of what you seem to be imagining. They are not moving because of the weather - they are moving because of the cost of living there.

The newest being the "Mansion tax"

Then look at the quality of the homes for the price and the taxes for them

It's a no brainer

It's a LOT easier to move to a different state within the US than to change countries.

Many of the 1% already own homes in foreign countries. It's not difficult setting up your residence there, moving accounts. They would still pay US taxes, but a whole lot lower than living in the high taxed blue states - Picture making 10,000,000 a year and being able to save 13% By moving out of NYC. Wouldn't you want to save over a million dollars a year?

But that's the only way conservatives can win these days considering the failure of practically every economic policy they manage to enact.

Failure? A booming economy that started growing exponentially AFTER Obama's regulations and taxing were removed?

Failure? A sustained growth in manufacturing - majic wand applied

Failure? Consumer confidence over 90%

Failure? a tax reduction that effects more than 80% of tax payers/

Failure? The lowest unemployment rate for minorities and woman in history.

I want more of that failure.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Not everyone wants to sell their soul to the devil just to acquire wealth in this realm.....

Not everyone, but multitudes do, and they seem deceived, are convinced they are something God wants for some reason, or they don't believe in Him nor in Jesus' Way ....

 

[bèlla]

I think many people buy the ingredients to destroy themselves without knowing it.

The heart is deceitful. If God presented Christians with the opportunity for wealth most would accept. We’re talking high 90’s. Supposition is dangerous. We often paint ourselves more benevolently than we are. But the truth is grimmer.

Blessings don’t transform us into different people. They reveal the hidden aspects of our person that weren’t visible with lesser means. Now they’re front and center.

Money is a truth serum and magnifier. In some, its an avenue for good works and others a fuel for debauchery. When you consider the value society assigns and our propensity for sin and recklessness; it should be in limited supply. The absence of sizable resources is a saving grace for most.

The world cheers each other on as entities in the background cheer for us to "Drink, Drink, Drink!" How many people can resist that manufactured "energy" in their daily lives, let alone of a mass scale of manipulation and control?

This picture comes to mind...

 

[RocksInMyHead]

Many of the 1% already own homes in foreign countries. It's not difficult setting up your residence there, moving accounts. They would still pay US taxes, but a whole lot lower than living in the high taxed blue states - Picture making 10,000,000 a year and being able to save 13% By moving out of NYC. Wouldn't you want to save over a million dollars a year?

OP's argument is targeted at people who want to raise federal taxes on the wealthy. I agree, individually high state taxes will just make people want to leave the state, but that doesn't do anything for increased federal taxes.

Additionally, very few people make more than $10 million/year (total of around 16,000). As I noted in a previous post, a significant portion of those people are elite professional athletes, actors, and Fortune 500 CEOs. Those people can't really leave the country as they are tied down by their employers.

 

[bèlla]

If you are successful it is likely that your daughter will be as well. My daughter's mother has set an example of utter failure for her, which I'm afraid has chartered her course as well. My example is pretty meaningless to her. I guess it's a mother-daughter thing.

That depends on your influence. Duty is forged in childhood and its a delicate balance. You must establish a sense of gratitude, familial pride, and honor.

If the child is ignorant of the costs and sacrifices that contributed to their welfare and moral compass. They’re less likely to respect it or embrace your values as adults.

It is better to work towards a shared goal that both can support. Something bigger than yourselves that benefits others. I have impressed the necessity of certain behaviors that will aid her family when she marries.

Contribution is many layered. But the gist is accepting our existence isn’t wholly for us. We are meant to affect others and the world in a positive fashion.

 

[iluvatar5150]

I've been in both - maybe you should speak about something you have experienced instead of what you seem to be imagining. They are not moving because of the weather - they are moving because of the cost of living there.

The newest being the "Mansion tax"

Then look at the quality of the homes for the price and the taxes for them

It's a no brainer

Cost of living != taxes alone. Yes, people are leaving because of the cost of living, real estate especially. No, that isn't necessarily just the taxes.

Many of the 1% already own homes in foreign countries.

Source?

Nationwide, making it into the top 1% requires an annual income of around $420,000 (as of 2015).

The new gilded age: Income inequality in the U.S. by state, metropolitan area, and county

That's about the average salary for a number of different medical specialties:
Doximity 2019 Physician Compensation Report

I know plenty of surgeons. I don't know any with a house in another country.

It's not difficult setting up your residence there, moving accounts. They would still pay US taxes, but a whole lot lower than living in the high taxed blue states - Picture making 10,000,000 a year and being able to save 13% By moving out of NYC. Wouldn't you want to save over a million dollars a year?

This is entirely dependent on what your job is. A lot of people who live in NYC do so because they either want to live there or because they have to. If you're, say, the CEO of a company with headquarters in NYC, then you have to be in the NYC office on a regular basis. And if you have to be in the NYC office regularly, you're going to want to have a residence close by. And if you use that residence more than a certain number of days per year, NYC considers that to be your primary residence.

Failure? A booming economy that started growing exponentially AFTER Obama's regulations and taxing were removed?

That just isn't true. There is no data to support that claim.

Failure? A sustained growth in manufacturing - majic wand applied

Manufacturing job growth has been relatively constant since the recession:
Bureau of Labor Statistics Data

Industrial output is also roughly on pace with Obama-era trends:
Industrial Production Index

The ISM PMI index dropped below 50 for the first time in years:
Institute for Supply Management | Established in 1915

Failure? Consumer confidence over 90%

CCI is back to where it was before the election:
Leading indicators - Consumer confidence index (CCI) - OECD Data

Failure? a tax reduction that effects more than 80% of tax payers/

...that ballooned the deficit

Failure? The lowest unemployment rate for minorities and woman in history.

Unemployment has been falling since 2010.
Bureau of Labor Statistics Data

I want more of that failure.

Every single point you listed was misleading if not entirely false. Trump hasn't tanked the economy like some predicted, but neither has he done anything special to boost it beyond what it was doing before he took office. The tax cuts juiced things to some degree, but as predicted, the effects constituted little more than a sugar high and added a ton to the deficit. The Obama regulations so many of you guys are so hyped up about were either small in scope/impact or haven't actually been repealed yet. This is the kind of magical, farcical Republican economic policy many of us are tired of and correctly see as a failure.

 

[mark46]

I do believe that this has been addressed. Many plans call for reduced deductions for companies that move jobs overseas. Others tax income made in the US, regardless of the location of the headquarters.

Just BTW, these two ideas have been supported by Trump, but obviously not the wealth tax.
====
Finally, many favor a minimum tax for businesses. This is for folks who don't understand the function of deductions. Do we really want top corporations to stop tax advantaged energy projects?

Data from the U.S. Census Bureau showed that while Florida received more movers than any other state last year, New York's outflows to the Sunshine State were the highest – 63,772 people. New York had the third-largest outflows of any state, with 452,580 people moving out within the year.

Found here

As shown with Apple holding 350,000,000 in overseas accounts because of the corporate tax rate, the top 1% can operate anywhere they please.

Hit them with oppressive taxes, like NY, they move to tax havens.

Has anyone in the “tax the wealthy” camp addressed this reality?

 

[Hank77]

One of the reasons the wealthy are leaving high tax states is because of the new federal tax code.

While the study analyzed data from 2016, this trend has likely only intensified thanks to recent changes to the U.S. tax code. A $10,000 cap on state and local tax deductions has caused an exodus from states like New York, Connecticut and California – where tax burdens were already onerous – to low-tax states like Florida, Texas and Nevada.

 

[-Sasha-]

Failure? The lowest unemployment rate for minorities and woman in history.

This seems to be leaving a very significant part of the population out. What about the white guys?

 

[Belk]

Data from the U.S. Census Bureau showed that while Florida received more movers than any other state last year, New York's outflows to the Sunshine State were the highest – 63,772 people. New York had the third-largest outflows of any state, with 452,580 people moving out within the year.

Found here

As shown with Apple holding 350,000,000 in overseas accounts because of the corporate tax rate, the top 1% can operate anywhere they please.

Hit them with oppressive taxes, like NY, they move to tax havens.

Has anyone in the “tax the wealthy” camp addressed this reality?

Why would anyone need to address this? Isn't this the whole idea behind the states? The ability to move to a local with policies that suit your preferences? They are free to move here to WA that has no income tax.

 

[miggles]

Data from the U.S. Census Bureau showed that while Florida received more movers than any other state last year, New York's outflows to the Sunshine State were the highest – 63,772 people. New York had the third-largest outflows of any state, with 452,580 people moving out within the year.

Found here

As shown with Apple holding 350,000,000 in overseas accounts because of the corporate tax rate, the top 1% can operate anywhere they please.

Hit them with oppressive taxes, like NY, they move to tax havens.

Has anyone in the “tax the wealthy” camp addressed this reality?

just like if democrats try to make the US a socialist country. the rich will leave.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

just like if democrats try to make the US a socialist country. the rich will leave.

< shrugs > okay! so what ?
(doesn't have to be the democrats)

 

[hislegacy]

Why would anyone need to address this? Isn't this the while idea behind the states? The ability to move to a local with policies that suit your preferences? They are free to move here to WA that has no income tax.

Thank you for addressing this.

 

[essentialsaltes]

From the article:

"Recently, changes to the U.S. [i.e. federal] tax code have encouraged an increasing number of people to move – taking their cash to lower-tax states like Florida."

Thanks, Trump.

Really, this is just people retiring to Florida.

But this particular tax they are pointing out is due to Trump.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

But this particular tax they are pointing out is due to Trump.

hmmm....
OR
Trummp is the 'figurehead' for the power that said to do it ? Maybe not for this thread?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

The heart is deceitful. If God presented Christians with the opportunity for wealth most would accept. We’re talking high 90’s. Supposition is dangerous. We often paint ourselves more benevolently than we are. But the truth is grimmer.

Blessings don’t transform us into different people. They reveal the hidden aspects of our person that weren’t visible with lesser means. Now they’re front and center.

Money is a truth serum and magnifier. In some, its an avenue for good works and others a fuel for debauchery. When you consider the value society assigns and our propensity for sin and recklessness; it should be in limited supply. The absence of sizable resources is a saving grace for most.

Actually the money supply is limited. Accounting figures are misleading. Most of the 'wealth' of a country is stuff produced by money, not money itself.

 

[Sparagmos]

Data from the U.S. Census Bureau showed that while Florida received more movers than any other state last year, New York's outflows to the Sunshine State were the highest – 63,772 people. New York had the third-largest outflows of any state, with 452,580 people moving out within the year.

Found here

As shown with Apple holding 350,000,000 in overseas accounts because of the corporate tax rate, the top 1% can operate anywhere they please.

Hit them with oppressive taxes, like NY, they move to tax havens.

Has anyone in the “tax the wealthy” camp addressed this reality?

So which countries do you predict the rich ppl would flee to? Most of Europe has higher tax rates than the U.S.

 

[Sparagmos]

I say, 'Good riddance and they shouldn't let the door hit them on the way out". I don't feel any need to pander to them like they are little demi-gods.

They are just money-grubbing misers who use up human beings and toss them out like machinery. There isn't enough money on the planet to make them happy enough pay a living wage to ordinary people.

Your mileage may well differ.

But wait! If the Waltons left all the wal-marts would close! What would we do without them?