Staff/members discussion thread. Report-free.

[Edial]

Hi folks.

The purpose of this thread is to announce that the senior management would start giving out Admin bans to individuals we see arguing and bickering.

There is a difference between debating, making a point and arguing and bickering.

We are all adults so we know the difference.

The way meditation works is quiet simple.

Chaplaincy starts off by appealing to our Christian values.

Then Admins manage threads by doing cleanups, mod hats asking for self edits.

Then, if we see that there is no visible improvement - Admin bans.
Admin bans supersede the warning/infraction actioning system.

This is one of the tools mediators have and it will be used.

Questions? Please.

Thanks,
In Christ,
Ed

 

[mkgal1]

You mentioned "we all know the difference between bickering/arguing and making a point/debating"....but, I'm not being dense when I say that I don't know exactly where that line is drawn with the Admins. The link to this thread was placed in the middle of what I consider a "discussion"--where two people were "making points"....not arguing. I can only reason that it was perceived as bickering or else the link wouldn't have been posted at that point in the thread.

 

[chaz345]

Please, please address the real problem, which is not now and never was generalizations. The problem of reading meaning into posts that was never intended, and then refusing to accept clarifications at face value is and always has been a far bigger problem than generalizations.

 

[dallasapple]

Well its my thread apparrently that is the issue..I would like to point out..that one of the members who joined that discussion first commented that it wasnt even a serious topic in the first place..Then started to "discuss" it..and argue against what the whole subject was about..

Should I just not even discuss it?Im seriously asking..should I NOT discuss that I believe that gender is a divide that is in any way that "matters" made up?

And if I should stop discussign it(what I beleive)..then should others have to stop discussing what they beleive are the differences in gender ?

Dallas

 

[Edial]

You mentioned "we all know the difference between bickering/arguing and making a point/debating"....but, I'm not being dense when I say that I don't know exactly where that line is drawn with the Admins. The link to this thread was placed in the middle of what I consider a "discussion"--where two people were "making points"....not arguing. I can only reason that it was perceived as bickering or else the link wouldn't have been posted at that point in the thread.

I posted there because that was one of the threads where mod hats were posted.
It has nothing to do with the timing of your current posts.
I did not even read them.

 

[chaz345]

Well its my thread apparrently that is the issue..I would like to point out..that one of the members who joined that discussion first commented that it wasnt even a serious topic in the first place..Then started to "discuss" it..and argue against what the whole subject was about..

Should I just not even discuss it?Im seriously asking..should I NOT discuss that I believe that gender is a divide that is in any way that "matters" made up?

And if I should stop discussign it(what I beleive)..then should others have to stop discussing what they beleive are the differences in gender ?

Dallas

It was put in several threads so it's presence in your thread has nothing to do with anything being specifically wrong with that thread.

 

[Edial]

There will be bans.

If we cannot talk without screaming, pointing fingers, slamming doors, bickering ... there will be bans.

Maybe you guys know each other too well and simply developed a click.
Maybe. But it does not matter.

There will be bans.

 

[mkgal1]

This will probably sound quite snarky....but, I sincerely don't mean it that way.....there's no "slamming doors and screaming" going on....at least not over here, on my side of the computer.

What there *is* are people that have posted with one another long enough to know core beliefs....and often times those *do* collide. Obviously, I don't mind that much or else I wouldn't continue to post. Having something come against my beliefs causes me to go a little deeper to answer the questions asked. To outside admins....it may *seem* like arguing....but, unless it's things like the posts that were recently removed the other day....I don't see it as out-of-bounds.

I sincerely would like to be able to discuss these difficult topics....or else I agree emphatically with Cons; this forum will become lifeless and boring. Threads will be like this:

"How are things going with you, Frank?"
"Just following the LORD, so things are awesome, Charlie."
"Praise the LORD.....have a blessed day!"
"You too.....remain in Christ."

Nothing but surface level....."niceness."

 

[Edial]

This will probably sound quite snarky....but, I sincerely don't mean it that way.....there's no "slamming doors and screaming" going on....at least not over here, on my side of the computer.

What there *is* are people that have posted with one another long enough to know core beliefs....and often times those *do* collide. Obviously, I don't mind that much or else I wouldn't continue to post. Having something come against my beliefs causes me to go a little deeper to answer the questions asked. To outside admins....it may *seem* like arguing....but, unless it's things like the posts that were recently removed the other day....I don't see it as out-of-bounds.

I sincerely would like to be able to discuss these difficult topics....or else I agree emphatically with Cons; this forum will become lifeless and boring. ...

I understand EXACTLY what you mean.
You KNOW each other too long and might not even realize there is screaming going on.
this is called "a click".

Other posters however, peek in, see the drag-down fight ... rub their eyes in unbelief ... and move on.

That is why we have rules.

Marriage forum is a place for all married people, not just the "regulars".

And you people are very intelligent so you should be able to find ways of discussing about ANY topic under the sun without screaming and bickering.

Thanks,
In Christ,
Ed

 

[Conservativation]

I have to innocently say, a clique didn't mean that to me, not that the definition of clique even matters. If the whole group was a clique there would be zero arguing, a clique is a group of tight like minded folks

 

[dallasapple]

It was put in several threads so it's presence in your thread has nothing to do with anything being specifically wrong with that thread.

Oh..

Didnt note it on any other thread ...

Dallas

 

[chaz345]

What there *is* are people that have posted with one another long enough to know core beliefs....

I disagree. I'm quite sure, based on how you and others usually respond to what I've said that you have a completely mistaken impression of most if not all of my core beliefs, especially as relates to gender interactions. It is the refusal to let go of what you(specific and general you) "know" I really mean, and actually listen to clarifications that causes most of the problems around here. And for clarity, I'm not suggesting that I'm completely blameless in that area.

 

[Nilla]

It's not posts that adress the topic and are ongoing discussion that's going to get anyone banned. It's posts where it's bickering.."Like that's not what I said, read my posts for once." and "Always same thing with you".. that's not discussing.. that's bickering and not fruitful to anyone. (these are examples.. not pointing any fingers at anyone)

As long as you're discussing and getting along.. you've got noting to worry about.

 

[mkgal1]

I understand EXACTLY what you mean.
You KNOW each other too long and might not even realize there is screaming going on.
this is called "a click".

Other posters however, peek in, see the drag-down fight ... rub their eyes in unbelief ... and move on.

That is why we have rules.

Marriage forum is a place for all married people, not just the "regulars".

And you people are very intelligent so you should be able to find ways of discussing about ANY topic under the sun without screaming and bickering.

Thanks,
In Christ,
Ed

I thought I had been discussing without "screaming and bickering"....that's why I'm sort of baffled and confused. What I am saying is......there isn't even any "upset" on my end (I can't speak for others)....it is just perceived "screaming and arguing" from the outside.

The fact that there are stong opinions on either side shouldn't keep others from being able to join in.

Can you show me two posts* that you perceive as an "angry exchange of screaming"?

(*of mine....or me included)

 

[Nilla]

If you've asked "What do you mean by this.." and gotten an explaination, that's what you have to go by.. don't go on with "but that's not what you said.. you said this.. or that.." It's going to lead no where.. but to frustration and threads going south and possibly ending up closed.

 

[dallasapple]

It's not posts that adress the topic and are ongoing discussion that's going to get anyone banned. It's posts where it's bickering.."Like that's not what I said, read my posts for once." and "Always same thing with you".. that's not discussing.. that's bickering and not fruitful to anyone. (these are examples.. not pointing any fingers at anyone)

As long as you're discussing and getting along.. you've got noting to worry about.

I agree..(not that Im innocent at all) but it "irks" me when several posters say "herw "we" go again "..the "I dont know why I even bother with you"(then they proceed to bother anyway).."its a "waste of time to even try and discuss this with you"(again then they continue to post to you after sayign this repeatedly apparrently volunterrign to "waste their time")..that to me is a "pattern" ..like saying 'whatever"! over and over when you are talking to specific posters..

Im just saying that for one is a no brainer rude thing to say..that someone ELSE is "wasting " thier time..when the whole thing is optional..Like if Im going to a car dealership..and I have NO intentions of buying a car at all..that is "wasting " someones time(the sales person who is THERE to sell cars)..volunteering to have a converstion with someone unsolicted on a forum then telling THEM you are wasting their time ..???there is something backwards about that..

Dallas

 

[Conservativation]

It's not posts that adress the topic and are ongoing discussion that's going to get anyone banned. It's posts where it's bickering.."Like that's not what I said, read my posts for once." and "Always same thing with you".. that's not discussing.. that's bickering and not fruitful to anyone. (these are examples.. not pointing any fingers at anyone)

As long as you're discussing and getting along.. you've got noting to worry about.

You are definitely to the core of it....I think that leaves 3 or 4 of us with little choice but to stay "upstairs", which we've been trying to do more and more, because "hey thats not what i meant"......could almost be put in the form of some kind of macro where we hit one key and it appears, its needed so often, and Im sorry to say i have no reason to believe that that problem will ever be addressed, in all fairness I have no advice on how to address it, though i do suspect that if someone would dedicate a couple of days to close scrutiny, come down hard on those who mis represent others words as a matter of course, in the long run you'd save admin time.

Its at once the largest problem and the one thats never rec'd attention, in fact those who are victims of it get doubled down on

Others will respond Im sure, I wont say more on it...thats my piece

 

[chaz345]

If you've asked "What do you mean by this.." and gotten an explaination, that's what you have to go by.. don't go on with "but that's not what you said.. you said this.. or that.." It's going to lead no where.. but to frustration and threads going south and possibly ending up closed.

This is EXACTLY the source of my greatest frustration around here. Something will be misunderstood, and either asked about or I'll offer clarification and then the response to that clarification is "no you didn't say that", or a sort of "prove that's what you meant". It all stems from, IMO, an inability by some to conceive of the possibility that they may have been wrong in how they heard something, and so it has to remain 100% the speaker's fault.

 

[chaz345]

You are definitely to the core of it....I think that leaves 3 or 4 of us with little choice but to stay "upstairs", which we've been trying to do more and more, because "hey thats not what i meant"......could almost be put in the form of some kind of macro where we hit one key and it appears, its needed so often, and Im sorry to say i have no reason to believe that that problem will ever be addressed, in all fairness I have no advice on how to address it, though i do suspect that if someone would dedicate a couple of days to close scrutiny, come down hard on those who mis represent others words as a matter of course, in the long run you'd save admin time.

Its at once the largest problem and the one thats never rec'd attention, in fact those who are victims of it get doubled down on

Others will respond Im sure, I wont say more on it...thats my piece

I may be wrong, but I don't think it's the "hey that's not what I meant" that is the problem but the somewhat snippy "try actually reading what I said" that frequently follows. Something that I myself have certainly done on more than one occasion.

 

[dallasapple]

Oh one other one..."Im sure this will be pointles as it usually is with you "..is another COMMON "preface" of at least one particular poster here that is rude..

Another thing?On the clarification ?That is exaclty what they say many times.."its pointless to try and explain to you"..

I just reach a "point" if it so pointless and a "waste of time" for these particular posters what are they here for?Just to tell people they are volunterrign to 'waste thier time"?

Dallas