Save everyone?

[Johnny4ChristJesus]

You wouldn't care if there were billions of human beings burning in a fiery torture chamber for all eternity?

If endless conscious torments were true, is God a monster?

Ahhh, more gamesmanship and emotional manipulation.

I care when, in this world, I see people make terrible choices that terribly damage many other people's lives and they don't get what they deserve. How many lives were affected when a 37 year old convicted sex offender claimed another victim, a 21 year old? How many lives were affected when a family is taken into DSS custody after a father rapes his way underage step-child? How many are sacrificed by others' love of money and power every day? I just heard a true story of a 2nd grader who stole a kid's bike, then brought a gun back and threatened the police officer dad with a police car in the driveway. How on earth does a 2nd grader become so wayward? I am saddened and even angry about generations of gang involvement or drug selling that corrupt the thinking of little ones to think police are bad and robbery and murder are good. My 30 year old cousin is dead, because he got hooked on drugs so others could get rich. I see horrible and sad things every day here in this world. If God brings all that unrepentant mess into heaven, without taking away their free will, I would have no reason to believe that heaven could look the way God promises. I would have every reason to believe the new heaven and new earth would become as perverted as what is here has become.

God provided a way--that we don't deserve--to escape what every one of us deserves. God is willing to accept anyone who comes; but coming comes at a cost. Nobody will be able to say they weren't warned and given the opportunity. God will ensure that. If they choose against Him, that was their choice. Whether their consequence includes punishment that goes on as long as true believes share life or whether God in his mercy allows them to be destroyed/annihilated or even if God circles back for them later: That is God's to decide, not yours or mine. He shared a lot that suggests there is a hell and He wouldn't have done that if there wasn't one.

So, if someone chooses not to answer His supernatural call, or chooses not to believe the full Testimony of God because they believe a lie someone led them to believe over what God told them, why should I feel tormented over their choice? They made the choice. They will have had the same choice to make that I had.

You are free to say I'm heartless, but God Himself said that people--in a place where there is no more suffering, sorrow, crying, pain, or death--will look on the carcases of those who didn't come in. God Himself said that there are people who were beheaded for their faith and are now under the altar in heaven crying out to God "How long, O Lord, holy and true, do you not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?" Please note, God's reply doesn't chastise them for their "wrong thinking" or for "not caring about the souls of those who will be on the receiving end of God's avenging." And, these are souls that are "of God" and "in Christ", based on what God says about them!

 

[Pneuma3]

And someone said to him, “Lord, will those who are saved be few?” And he said to them, “Strive to enter through the narrow door. For many, I tell you, will seek to enter and will not be able. Luke 13:23–24

That verse has NOTHING to do with the afterlife, it is talking about the here and now.

 

[Dave L]

That verse has NOTHING to do with the afterlife, it is talking about the here and now.

really?

 

[Dave L]

Dear Dave: The last time I checked, the koine Greek is the Lord's word. Your impoverished state will become greatly enhanced as you wait before Him contemplating the same.

The whole of created life shall be set free/delivered/emancipated from the tyranny of change & decay...

“God has made everything fit beautifully in its appropriate time, but he has also placed ignorance in the human heart so that people cannot discover what God has ordained, from the beginning to the end of their lives.” (Ecclesiastes 3:11)

 

[Pneuma3]

really?

Yes really. all scripture speaking of the kingdom of heaven are talking about the here and now and have nothing to do with what takes place after death. Few are entering in NOW.

 

[Dave L]

Yes really. all scripture speaking of the kingdom of heaven are talking about the here and now and have nothing to do with what takes place after death. Few are entering in NOW.

What about all the verses that contradict this?

“All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.” (John 6:37)

Many (most) never heard of Christ.

 

[Pneuma3]

What about all the verses that contradict this?

“All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.” (John 6:37)

Many (most) never heard of Christ.

context Dave. that verse does not contradict that few are entering into the kingdom of heaven NOW.

If it is talking about only FEW ever being saved did God then forget his promise to Abe that his seed would be as the stars of heaven and as the sand by the seashore?

Are the stars of the heavens FEW?
Are the sands by the seashore FEW?

 

[Dave L]

context Dave. that verse does not contradict that few are entering into the kingdom of heaven NOW.

If it is talking about only FEW ever being saved did God then forget his promise to Abe that his seed would be as the stars of heaven and as the sand by the seashore?

Are the stars of the heavens FEW?
Are the sands by the seashore FEW?

How are these to be saved?

“And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.” (Romans 1:28–32)

 

[Pneuma3]

How are these to be saved?

“And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.” (Romans 1:28–32)

The same way you were via regeneration. By the way just for clarification those scriptures are talking about people who know God and have nothing to do with the unbeliever.

 

[Dave L]

The same way you were via regeneration. By the way just for clarification those scriptures are talking about people who know God and have nothing to do with the unbeliever.

But only the regenerate will come to Jesus and most never heard of him.

 

[Pneuma3]

can you make an answer to this post please.

context Dave. that verse does not contradict that few are entering into the kingdom of heaven NOW.

If it is talking about only FEW ever being saved did God then forget his promise to Abe that his seed would be as the stars of heaven and as the sand by the seashore?

Are the stars of the heavens FEW?
Are the sands by the seashore FEW?

 

[Pneuma3]

But only the regenerate will come to Jesus and most never heard of him.

again what does that have to do with the FEW entering into the kingdom of heaven NOW?

Your putting two different topics together and calling them the same. they are not.

 

[Dave L]

again what does that have to do with the FEW entering into the kingdom of heaven NOW?

Your putting two different topics together and calling them the same. they are not.

No, it means apart from coming to Christ people are lost. Was it God's will to save the Asians in Acts?

“Now when they had gone throughout Phrygia and the region of Galatia, and were forbidden of the Holy Ghost to preach the word in Asia,” (Acts 16:6)

“After they were come to Mysia, they assayed to go into Bithynia: but the Spirit suffered them not.” (Acts 16:7)

 

[Pneuma3]

No, it means apart from coming to Christ people are lost. Was it God's will to save the Asians in Acts?

“Now when they had gone throughout Phrygia and the region of Galatia, and were forbidden of the Holy Ghost to preach the word in Asia,” (Acts 16:6)

“After they were come to Mysia, they assayed to go into Bithynia: but the Spirit suffered them not.” (Acts 16:7)

again what does that have to do with FEW entering in via the strait gate?

these scripture you keep posting have NOTHING to do with the verses that were under discussion.

Now can you answer the post I asked you to answer.

 

[Dave L]

again what does that have to do with FEW entering in via the strait gate?

these scripture you keep posting have NOTHING to do with the verses that were under discussion.

Now can you answer the post I asked you to answer.

It means they were not exposed to Christ until later = some died and went to hell in the meantime.

 

[Pneuma3]

It means they were not exposed to Christ until later = some died and went to hell in the meantime.

again this has nothing to do with FEW entering in NOW. And why do you keep avoiding the post I asked you to make an answer to?

Yes people die and go to the grave, so what, when those in the grave hear the voice of God they will LIVE.

 

[Dave L]

again this has nothing to do with FEW entering in NOW. And why do you keep avoiding the post I asked you to make an answer to?

Yes people die and go to the grave, so what, when those in the grave hear the voice of God they will LIVE.

Only those who did good will go to heaven, the rest to hell.
“And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.” (John 5:29)

 

[Pneuma3]

Only those who did good will go to heaven, the rest to hell.
“And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.” (John 5:29)

again and again and again these scripture have NOTHING to do with FEW entering in NOW. Yet you keep equating it to the salvation of all in the future and those scripture say NOTHING about the future state of the rest of mankind.

Now for the 4 or 5 time can you please answer this post.

context Dave. that verse does not contradict that few are entering into the kingdom of heaven NOW.

If it is talking about only FEW ever being saved did God then forget his promise to Abe that his seed would be as the stars of heaven and as the sand by the seashore?

Are the stars of the heavens FEW?
Are the sands by the seashore FEW?

 

[Dave L]

again and again and again these scripture have NOTHING to do with FEW entering in NOW. Yet you keep equating it to the salvation of all in the future and those scripture say NOTHING about the future state of the rest of mankind.

Now for the 4 or 5 time can you please answer this post.

context Dave. that verse does not contradict that few are entering into the kingdom of heaven NOW.

If it is talking about only FEW ever being saved did God then forget his promise to Abe that his seed would be as the stars of heaven and as the sand by the seashore?

Are the stars of the heavens FEW?
Are the sands by the seashore FEW?

Why does Jesus mention the resurrection of damnation if all are saved in the end as you think?

 

[Pneuma3]

Why does Jesus mention the resurrection of damnation if all are saved in the end as you think?

Dave when people reason the scriptures together it should be quid pro quo. If you cannot be bother doing that then why should I keep answering any of your questions?

So if you answer my one post that I asked you to answer I will answer yours, the reason being is because you do not want to look at what you believe you only want to look at what I believe.

Fairs fair Dave, lets put BOTH views under the microscope, but to do that you have to be willing to look at your own belief.