Sabbath Anxiety (PLEASE HELP)

[listed]

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Not really. The passages you quoted only state that salvation is not inherited by keeping Moses Law, but by having faith in Jesus Christ - EPH.2:14, GAL.3:13, etc. Paul emphasized this because his ex-fellow Jews were still falsely believing that the keeping of Moses Law would save them from hell when they die.

On what basis do you say no the law wasn't removed from the text I posted?

 

[listed]

In the Garden of Eden, Eve disobeyed GOD.

Jesus says
John 14:15
If ye love me, keep my commandments.

That isn't the law given to Israel. Jesus didn't give that law (see John 1:17).

 

[listed]

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Most adult Gentiles have led lawless lives from childhood, wrt God's Law or Moses Law, very unlike adult Jews who are mostly law-abiding.
... So, most new Gentile Christians have been born-again of the Spirit as spiritual babes who are commanded by ACTS.15:24-29 to at least keep the 4 non-burdensome laws of Moses. Thereafter, as they grow in spirituality towards spiritual adulthood/maturity, it is expected of them to gradually learn to keep the other non-burdensome laws of Moses, especially morality laws, eg the Ten Commandments at EXODUS.20(cf; 1COR.6:9-11, GAL.5:19-21).

In comparison, most new Jewish Christians or Messianic Jews are born-again of the Spirit as spiritual adults and have little need to be taught about the Law, (eg the apostle Paul and John) except that they are required by God to continue to keep Moses Law, as many laws as possible, because it is not a burden to them.

P S - The breaking of God's Law/commandments will result in being cursed by God or His agents(eg the government/police - ROMANS.13) = lead a sad and short life on earth. Gentile Christians who ignorantly or wantonly break the non-burdensome laws will risk losing their salvation while suffering for their sins/evil-deeds,(1COR.5:1-5) like the wife of Job who likely cursed God and died.(JOB2:9)

If you're talking about practicing immoral activities, yes. If you're talking about keeping the law, no. Simply not stealing isn't obedience to the law. Many non Christians don't do this. Please note I didn't make a cover all statement.

 

[discipler7]

On what basis do you say no the law wasn't removed from the text I posted?

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MATTHEW.5: = 18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.

Have the heaven and earth pass away.?

"Till all is fulfilled" is not what you think it means, ie as to mean it removes the Law from this earth. Can Christians commit murder and break the Law at EXODUS.20:13.?.

 

[discipler7]

Simply not stealing isn't obedience to the law. Many non Christians don't do this

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ROMANS.2: =
12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law 13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified; 14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.

 

[BobRyan]

BobRyan said: ↑
Hebrews 8:6-10 Paul says it is Jesus who is speaking the TEN Commandments at Sinai
No he doesn't or you'd have posted it.

No he doesn't or you'd have posted it. .

I find your logic "illusive" just then - since I just posted the text above that shows the point you appear to claim... does not exist.

However as with all Bible teaching - this involves paying attention to Bible details. Let's use the example above.

Hebrews 8
6 But now He (Christ) has obtained a more excellent ministry, by as much as He (Christ) is also the mediator of a better covenant, which has been enacted on better promises.

A New Covenant
7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, there would have been no occasion sought for a second. 8 For finding fault with them, He (Christ) says,

“Behold, days are coming, says the Lord,
When I (Christ) will effect a new covenant
With the house of Israel and with the house of Judah;
9 Not like the covenant which I (Christ) made with their fathers
On the day when I (Christ) took them by the hand
To lead them out of the land of Egypt;
For they did not continue in My covenant,
And I did not care for them, says the Lord.
10 “For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel
After those days, says the Lord:
I will put My laws into their minds,
And I will write them on their hearts.
And I will be their God,
And they shall be My people.

 

[BobRyan]

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ROMANS.2: =
12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law 13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified; 14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.

Amen

 

[HARK!]

I question how claim to follow something and actually doing something else is doing the claimed.

How anyone can claim to follow Jesus by following the something else is interesting. I don't understand how this can be true.

Its seems elementary to me. Yahshua followed Yahweh's law. Yahshua told us to follow him. How can you follow Yahshua, without following Yahweh's law; if Yahshua was following Yahweh's law?

Think of it as a conga line, with Yahweh leading the way. Come and join us. It's FUN!

 

[BobRyan]

I'm wondering why a person claiming to be a new Christian has such an issue. .

John 15:10 is spot on of course
Hebrews 8:6-10 Paul says it is Jesus who is speaking the TEN Commandments at Sinai
Ex 20:6 "Love Me and KEEP My Commandments" spoken by Christ at Sinai
John 14:15 "if you Love Me KEEP My Commandments" spoken by Christ BEFORE the cross.
1 John 5:2-3 "This IS the Love of God that we KEEP His Commandments"
James 2 - commandments of God with examples that are NOT listed in John 15:10
Matthew 19 "KEEP the Commandments... Which ones?" Jesus gives a list of examples NOT in John 15:10

Even though none of the NT examples include the commandment "do not take God's name in vain" that is ALSO still IN.

And of course for all eternity after the cross all mankind keeps the Sabbath in the New Earth "From Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL mankind come before Me to worship" Isaiah 66:23

No he doesn't or you'd have posted ... Your intention is to by pass John 10. Isn't this mocking Jesus?I don't believe you understand this or the NT (new covenant).Where does your verse say anything about what happens of the sabbath? I read it says between sabbaths. Your verse says from...to. It doesn't say on.

Interesting response seems to be in a long string of false accusations one after another.

 

[BobRyan]

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... IOW, God has exempted Gentile Christians from any law of Moses which is a burden, eg circumcision and kosher foods. They are not exempted from any law which is not a burden, esp morality laws, eg the Ten Commandments(EXODUS.20), DEUT.18:9-14, LEV.10:9 & 18:22, etc.

Certainly it is true that the Ten Commandments are included in the moral law of God - written on the heart. But it is not true that God says that any part of his Word that one may find inconvenient -- may be ignored. There is no such rule as that. So be careful on that point.

Romans 8:4-9 says that the unconverted heart - the sinful nature - "does not submit to the Law of God - neither indeed CAN it" -- which would leave a wide road of rejection open to the unsaved to claim that they find this or that part of God's Word to be inconvenient or a burden... if that were the rule to be used for rejecting something in the Bible.

 

[BobRyan]

I would have to disagree with this deeply. While I can appreciate the zeal that goes into striving to obey Moses for the sake of Christ, it is simply not necessary, nor does it make any sense.

Law of Moses
Deut 6:5 "Love God with all your heart"
Lev 19:18 "Love your neighbor as yourself"
Ex 20:7 "Do not take God's name in vain"
Ex 20:12 "Honor your parents"

It is a mistake to preach against the LAW of Moses according to Christ in Mark 7:6-12

So while it is true that sacrifices and offerings have ceased - Hebrews 10:4-12
And it is true that the earthly priesthood has ended according to Hebrews 7

One must be careful about wholesale rejection of scripture as if Moses is the author and not God.

 

[HARK!]

Luke 24:44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

Good point; and all has not yet been fulfilled, only the Spring Moedim, not the Fall Moedim.

 

[BobRyan]

If you're talking about practicing immoral activities, yes. If you're talking about keeping the law, no. t.

The Law defines what sin is.

"Sin is transgression of the Law" 1 John 3:4

The Law defines compliance and by doing so - also defines rebellion

 

[HARK!]

One must be careful about wholesale rejection of scripture as if Moses is the author and not God.

^^^^^^^THIS!^^^^^^^

 

[FireDragon76]

The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath.

You, as a Christian, have no particular Sabbath obligations. Anybody who tells you otherwise is a false shepherd who is seeking the ruin of your soul. You need to be under the care of a good pastor or priest who is experienced with scrupulosity or works-righteousness and how poisonous it is.

God wants us to do real good works. Being a good son, daughter, father, mother, friend, co-worker, employee, etc. He is not so petty and cruel that he judges anyone for not keeping the Sabbath. Our love of God is best expressed in how much we care for our family and our neighbors, more than how we follow religious rules.

 

[HARK!]

Being a good son, daughter, father, mother, friend, co-worker, employee, etc.

Mk 10:18
Now Yahshua said to him, "Why are you terming Me good? Not one is good except One, The God. (ho theos) (YHWH)

 

[BobRyan]

The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath.

You, as a Christian, have no particular Sabbath obligations.

That appears to be nonsense.

1. The Sabbath was made for mankind.. It is an obligation to do as God directed and doing so will be a benefit to mankind.
2. The illogical argument that ignoring God's Sabbath is what he intended when He made it for mankind as a benefit for us ... is utter nonsense.

Marriage and the Sabbath are the two institutions in Eden that man took with him when expelled from paradise. both are made "for mankind". But that does not mean that a married person can ignore the boundaries set for marriage and still have it as a "benefit". Same with God's Sabbath memorial of creation made for all mankind.

"from Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to worship" Isaiah 66:23
Specifically pointing to gentiles for Sabbath keeping Isaiah 56:5-8

hint: God wants us to "not take God's name in vain" AND ALSO to "remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy".

It is not "either or" but "Both and" -- when we read the actual Bible on that detail.

Rebellion against the Word of God is not pleasing to God - as Christ points out in Mark 7:6-13 and we all know it.

 

[FireDragon76]

Bob, if you believe keeping the Sabbath makes you a Christian, then I am afraid you and I have completely different religions. You are also no friend to those whose consciences are tortured by doubt, who need to hear the simple message that God accepts them for the sake of Christ, without any merits of their own doing.

In short you have just betrayed the Protestant reformation, even if you are not a Romanist.

 

[listed]

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MATTHEW.5: = 18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.

Have the heaven and earth pass away.?

"Till all is fulfilled" is not what you think it means, ie as to mean it removes the Law from this earth. Can Christians commit murder and break the Law at EXODUS.20:13.?.

Luke 24:44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

Hebrews 7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

This verse could be a lie because Jesus never violated the law or it could be proof indeed jots and tittles of the law have passed. The quoted Luke text allows for Hebrews 7:12 to be true.

 

[listed]

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ROMANS.2: =
12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law 13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified; 14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.

What is your point here? Acts 15 says the Gentiles didn't keep the law evidenced bu the Pharisees demand of verse 5 and the Apostles said they didn't have to. Peter and Paul were living like gentiles in Antioch.