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My YEC Evidence Challenge

Discussion in 'Creation & Evolution' started by Bugeyedcreepy, Feb 21, 2017.

  1. AV1611VET

    AV1611VET SCIENCE CAN TAKE A HIKE Supporter

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    I don't know if you know this or not, but at first Mohammad was friendly with Christians.

    That's because he had plans to convert them.

    He believed in a three-part redemption of mankind:

    1. God sent the prophet Moses to convert the infidels to Jews.

    2. God sent the prophet Jesus to convert the infidels & Jews to Christians.

    3. God sent the prophet Mohammad [him] to convert the infidels, Jews & Christians to Islam.

    But when the Christians refused to convert ... calling him a false prophet instead ... he was furious and persecuted them with a vengeance.
     
  2. Obliquinaut

    Obliquinaut Сделайте Америку прекрасной

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    Not sure what BMOC is ("Big Man on Campus"?) but indeed there is a geographic component to how religions are placed, but not a perfect correlation of course. And not really the point of my position.

    Christianity is, indeed, borne of many inputs over millennia. Even the concept of the Trinity, core to Christianity in some ways, is of questionable origin (see the discussions on Erasmus' translations etc.)

    I don't really know what to believe on the possible tie-ins of paganism in relation to the early Christian traditions. The fact that some of the early Church Fathers (eg Justin Martyr) came up with the concept of "Diabolical Mimicry" to explain some commonalities between Christianity and prior pagan religions seems to indicate it was a concern for some in the early Church.

    The battles of orthodoxy and heterodoxy in the very earliest Christian communities is also interesting, as is the choice from among a large number of writing of those books which finally made the "cut" to be included in the standard canon (Bible).

    It's all fascinating! Karen Armstrong has a good book worth reading on the history of God (and I believe she comes from a position of belief if I am not mistaken), but there are many other good books out there about the evolution of the BIble we have today, the analytics involved in assessing the date of the books and the authorship. It's all really cool stuff!
     
  3. Obliquinaut

    Obliquinaut Сделайте Америку прекрасной

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  4. KWCrazy

    KWCrazy Newbie

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    On what planet did this happen?
    The Shah succeeded his father Reza Shah Pahlavi who came into power after conducting a coup against the pro-British government.

    Mohammad Reza, the last Shah of Iran, also introduced the White Revolution, a series of economic, social and political reforms with the proclaimed intention of transforming Iran into a global power and modernising the nation by nationalising certain industries and granting women suffrage. Iran was a peaceful ally under the Shah. Not it is a terrorist supporting enemy responsible for death around the globe.
     
  5. Bugeyedcreepy

    Bugeyedcreepy Well-Known Member

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    Oh dear.... How could you fail this so hard and so repeatedly? Absolute Magnitude is required for spectrosopic parallax, not for a Type Ia Supernova. As far as Spectroscopic Parallax goes though, this distance is derived from a number of correlated observations that indicate a star type so the absolute magnitude can be derived according to its spectroscopic output. See Spectroscopic parallax - Wikipedia:

    "To apply this method, one must measure the apparent magnitude of the star and know the spectral type of the star. The spectral type can be determined by observing the star's spectrum. If the star lies on the main sequence, as determined by its luminosity class, the spectral type of the star provides a good estimate of the star's absolute magnitude."​

    From there, we can calculate its distance and then compare the results with other forms of distance measuring to see if it correlates - nothing circular there at all I'm afraid. As we'd expect, you've avoided all the facts and the point to shelter your creationists bliss in ignorance. I reckon deep down, you must know you're wrong...
    I showed you how to do it, why don't you? Here's one done for you that you can follow along on for Gamma Crucis: Spectroscopic Parallax - and of course, here's the original data including the original parallax measurements for the same star.... along with quite a lot else that science has been able to determine from its observations: Gacrux (Gamma Crucis) - HD108903 - HIP61084 - HR4763 . Let me know how you go and also feel free to tell me what the Bible told us about it first before science found all this out. Something meaningful we didn't already know would be handy...
    and all the evidence, of course.
    Therefore the cosmic speed limit REQUIRES time when traversing 'spacetime'.
    And we know of everything we observe requires time to move, including electromagnetic radiation - after all, we know space and time are necessarily connected in our universe.
    Because the very fabric of our universe involves interconnected space and time, they aren't separate.
    unsupported assertion of no value or substance. discarded on imaginative say-so.
    Well, this universe is our fishbowl then, and that's why we don't see anything outside of it.
    unsupported nonsense with no substance whatsoever, discarded.
    "I Don't Like It!" is still not a valid response. discarded.
    ...because there is. Discarded as well.
    Oh, Look! More Baseless and unfounded asser.... DISCARDED!
    except the evidence, of course.
    No belief, let alone a system of it... I simply accept the evidence in support of it, and That's it! I'm seriously curious to know how you get through life denying as much reality as you do.
     
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2017
  6. Obliquinaut

    Obliquinaut Сделайте Америку прекрасной

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    Planet Earth 1953.

    The US (CIA) helped overthrow the Mossadegh government in Iran. A freely elected government who then proceeded to make noises about nationalizing the Iranian petroleum reserves which caused a stir with British petroleum companies.

    We (the US) helped install the Shah of Iran and propped him up for decades. During that time he conducted some pretty unpleasant repressions of his people.


    CIA admits role in 1953 Iranian coup
     
  7. Obliquinaut

    Obliquinaut Сделайте Америку прекрасной

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  8. Kylie

    Kylie Atheist and Proud

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    So? Some anonymous guy wrote it down late in the first century. What's your point? There are lots of people who disagree. Even in the Bible we find conflicting claims about this. Here's a list of almost 200 things it is claimed are what you need to do in order to be saved.

    1. Say the right things.For by thy words thou shalt be justified. -- Matthew 12:37
    2. Do the right things. (Be a do-gooder.)And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life. -- John 5:29I the Lord ... give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings. -- Jeremiah 17:10For we must all appear before the jugment seat of Christ, that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad. -- 2 Corinthians 5:10
    3. Believe the right things.A man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law. -- Romans 3:28Therefore, being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. -- Romans 5:1A man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ. -- Galatians 2:16For by grace are ye saved through faith. -- Ephesians 2:8
    4. Do and believe the right things.Faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. -- James 2:17
    5. Work your way to heaven.For you render to each one according to his works. -- Psalm 62:12For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will reward each according to his works. -- Matthew 16.27And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. -- Revelation 20:12-13Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works. -- 2 Corinthians 11:15The Father, who without partiality judges according to each one's work. -- 1 Peter 1:17What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? -- James 2:14, 17, 20, 24, 26I will give unto every one of you according to your works. -- Revelation 2:23Behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work. -- Revelation 22:12
    6. Burn your work.If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. -- 1 Corinthians 3:15
    7. Work it out with fear and trembling.Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. -- Philippians 2:12
    8. Be hungry now and never get full.Blessed are ye that hunger now: for ye shall be filled. ... Woe unto you that are full! for ye shall hunger. -- Luke 6:21, 24
    9. Hunger and thirst after righteousness.Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled. -- Matthew 5:6
    10. Do what is lawful and right.When the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness ... and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul. -- Ezekiel 18:27
    11. Obey the law of the wise.The law of the wise is a fountain of life, to depart from the snares of death. -- Proverbs 13:14
    12. Do God's willHe that doeth the will of God abideth for ever. -- 1 John 2:17
    13. Do the will of Jesus' father.Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. -- Matthew 7:21
    14. Be a doer of the law.Who will render to each one according to his deeds. ... For not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified. -- Romans 2:6, 13
    15. Call on the name of the Lord.Whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved. -- Acts 2:21, Romans 10:13
    16. Call upon God.As for me, I will call upon God; and the LORD shall save me. -- Psalm 55:16
    17. Trust in the Lord.The LORD shall ... save them, because they trust in him. -- Psalm 37:40
    18. Get to know God.In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction. -- 2 Thessalonians 1:8-9
    19. Wait for him.Wait on the LORD, and he shall save thee. -- Proverbs 20:22Lo, this is our God; we have waited for him, and he will save us. -- Isaiah 25:9
    20. Wait and come for 1335 days.Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days. -- Daniel 12:12
    21. Just look at him.Look unto me, and be ye saved. -- Isaiah 45:22
    22. Get lost.The Son of man is come to save that which was lost. -- Matthew 18:11, Luke 19:10
    23. Get scourged.Whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth. -- Hebrews 12:6
    24. Get tortured."Others were tortured ... that they might obtain a better resurrection." -- Hebrews 11:35
    25. Get lucky.I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. ... Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth. ... Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: -- Romans 9:15-22
    26. Hope.For we are saved by hope. --
    27. Repent.Except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish. -- Luke 13:3, 5
    28. Overcome.He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God. -- Revelation 2:7He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death. -- Revelation 2:11He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels. -- Revelation 3:5Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God ... and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem ... and I will write upon him my new name. -- Revelation 3:12
    29. Don't be so darned wicked.When the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness that he hath committed, and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul. -- Ezekiel 18:27
    30. Don't offend the little ones.But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea. -- Matthew 18:6, Mark 9:14, Luke 17:2
    31. Don't be filthy or naughty; receive the engrafted word.Lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls. -- James 1:21
    32. Walk upright.Whoso walketh uprightly shall be saved. -- Proverbs 28:18
    33. Endure temptation.Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life. -- James 1:12
    34. Don't lust.Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. -- James 1:15
    35. Bridle your tongue.If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain. -- James 1:26
    36. Believe in Jesus.Whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. -- John 3:16I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live. And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. -- John 11:25-26
    37. Believe on Jesus.He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life. -- John 3:36Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life. -- John 6:47Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved. -- Acts 16:31
    38. See Jesus and believe on him.Every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day. -- John 6:40
    39. Confess with your mouth "Jesus is Lord" and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead.If thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. -- Romans 10:9
    40. Confess Jesus before men.Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven. -- Matthew 10:32Whosoever shall confess me before men, him shall the Son of man also confess before the angels of God. -- Luke 12:8
    41. Obey Jesus.And [Jesus] being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him. -- Hebrews 5:9
    42. Hear the words of Jesus and believe in whoever sent him.He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life. -- John 5:24
    43. Hear and do the sayings of Jesus.Whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock. -- Matthew 7:24
    44. Keep Jesus' saying.If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death. -- John 8:51
    45. Drink Jesus' water.Whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life. -- John 4:14
    46. Get saved by the grace of Jesus.Through the grace of the LORD Jesus Christ we shall be saved. Acts 15:11
    47. Be dead with Jesus.It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him: -- 2 Timothy 2:11
    48. Be born again.Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. -- John 3:3
    49. Be born of water and the spirit.Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. -- John 3:5
    50. Be spiritually minded.To be spiritually minded is life. -- Romans 8:6
    51. Believe Paul's gospel.Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. 1 Corinthians 15:1-2
    52. Listen to Peter's words. (They will save you and your whole familiy!)Peter ... shall tell thee words, whereby thou and all thy house shall be saved. Acts 11:13-14
    53. Believe and be baptized.He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved. -- Mark 16:16
    54. Just get baptized (you can keep the filth of the flesh).Baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh). -- 1 Peter 3:21
    55. Have a contrite spirit.The LORD ... saveth such as be of a contrite spirit. -- Psalm 34:18
    56. Don't be deluded by God.God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned. -- 2 Thessalonians 2:11-12
    57. Don't be blinded by God.Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded. ... God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear;) unto this day. ... Let their eyes be darkened, that they may not see. -- Romans 11:7-10
    58. Bear good fruit.Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. -- Matthew 7:19, Luke 3:9, 13:9
    59. Be grafted in.And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again. -- Romans 11:23
    60. Be chosen, not just called.For many are called, but few are chosen. -- Matthew 22:14, 20:16God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation. -- 2 Thessalonians 2:13
    61. Be perfect.Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. -- Matthew 5:48
    62. Be meek.When God arose to judgment, to save all the meek of the earth. -- Psalm 76:9Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth. -- Matthew 5:5
    63. Be washed by the Holy Ghost.Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost. -- Titus 3:5
    64. Get your sins remitted by someone who has received the Holy Ghost. (Or who has been breathed on by Jesus)And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost: Whosesoever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whose soever sins ye retain, they are retained. -- John 20:22-23
    65. Be pure in heart.Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God. -- Matthew 5:8
    66. Be upright in heart.My defence is of God, which saveth the upright in heart. -- Psalm 7:10
    67. Be converted and become like a little child.Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven. -- Matthew 18:3, Mark 10:15
    68. Be a saint.The LORD ... forsaketh not his saints; they are preserved for ever.. -- Psalm 37:28
    69. Be a child of the needy.He shall save the children of the needy. -- Psalm 72:4
    70. Be persecuted for righteousness sake.Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. -- Matthew 5:10
    71. Be righteous.Righteousness delivereth from death. -- Proverbs 10:2, 11:4And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal. -- Matthew 25:46
    72. Be more righteous than the scribes and Pharisees.Except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven. -- Matthew 5:20
    73. Forsake all that you have.Whosoever he be of you that forsaketh not all that he hath, he cannot be my disciple. -- Luke 14:33
    74. Hate your own life.The man who loves his life will lose it, while the man who hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life. John 12:25
    75. Lose your life.Whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it. -- Luke 17:33
    76. Lose your life for Christ's sake.For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. -- Matthew 10:39, 16:25, Mark 8:35, Luke 9:24, 17:33
    77. Belong to a household that has at least one believer.And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house. -- Acts 16:31For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy. -- 1 Corinthians 7:14
    78. Get saved by your spouse.For what knowest thou, O wife, whether thou shalt save thy husband? or how knowest thou, O man, whether thou shalt save thy wife? -- 1 Corinthians 7:16
    79. Follow the commandments (at least some of them).If you want to enter into life, keep the commandments. He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. -- Matthew 19:17-19And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life? ... Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother. -- Mark 10:17-19Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life. -- Revelation 22:14
    80. Keep some of the commandments, give all your money to the poor, and follow Jesus.And a certain ruler asked him, saying, Good Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? ... Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother. And he said, All these have I kept from my youth up. ...thou one thing: sell all that thou hast, and distribute unto the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me.-- Luke 18:18-22
    81. Keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus. -- Revelation 14:12
    82. Do the commandments and teach others to do them.Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. -- Matthew 5:19
    83. Sow to the Spirit.He that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting. -- Galatians 6:8
    84. Endure to the end.He that endureth to the end shall be saved. -- Matthew 10:22, 24:13, Mark 13:13
    85. 1 Corinthians 15:29
    86. Wait until you die and then hear the voice of the Son of God.The dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live. -- John 5:25
    87. Be faithful unto death.Be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life. -- Revelation 2:10
    88. Get buried with Jesus by being baptized into death.We are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection. -- Romans 6:4-5
    89. Always wear a wedding garment.And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment: And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? And he was speechless. Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness, there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. -- Matthew 22:11-13
    90. Don't get married. (Married people don't go to heaven.)They which shall be accounted worthy to obtain that world, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage. -- Luke 20:35
    91. Have lots of babies (and be faithful, charitable, holy, and sober).And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety. -- 1 Timothy 2:14-15
    92. Become a eunuch for the kingdom of heaven's sake.There be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it. -- Matthew 19:12
    93. Don't defile yourself with women. (Be a virgin male.)...the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. -- Revelation 14:4
    94. Don't love your family more than Jesus.He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. -- Matthew 10:37
    95. Abandon your home and family for Jesus' name's sake.And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life. -- Matthew 19:29, Mark 10:29-30, Luke 18:29-30
    96. Hate your father, mother, wife, children, brothers, sisters, and your own life.If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple. -- Luke 14:26
    97. Don't hate your brother.Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him. -- 1 John 3:15
    98. Ask your parents to beat you with a rod.Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die. Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell. -- Proverbs 23:13-14
    99. Receive a child in the name of Jesus.Whosoever shall receive this child in my name receiveth me: and whosoever shall receive me receiveth him that sent me. -- Luke 9:48a, Matthew 18:5
    100. Receive a Christian.He that receiveth you receiveth me, and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me. -- Matthew 10:40
    101. Receive a prophet in the name of a prophet.He that receiveth a prophet in the name of a prophet shall receive a prophet's reward. -- Matthew 10:41
    102. Receive a righteous man in the name of a righteous man.He that receiveth a righteous man in the name of a righteous man shall receive a righteous man's reward. -- Matthew 10:41
    103. Receive the gift of eternal life from God through Jesus.The gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. -- Romans 6:23
    104. Don't despise government or walk after flesh.The Lord knoweth how ... to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished: But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. -- 2 Peter 2:9-10
    105. Don't resist the powers that be.Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. -- Romans 13:2
    106. Mortify the deeds of your body.If ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. -- Romans 8:13
    107. Wash your wicked heart.Wash thine heart from wickedness, that thou mayest be saved. -- Jeremiah 4:14
    108. Wash your face and anoint your head when you fast.When thou fastest, anoint thine head, and wash thy face; hat thou appear not unto men to fast, but unto thy Father which is in secret: and thy Father, which seeth in secret, shall reward thee openly. -- Matthew 6:17-18
    109. Heed yourself and the doctrine.Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee. -- 1 Timothy 4:16
    110. Get saved by Jesus' name.Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name [beside's Jesus'] under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved. -- Acts 4:12
    111. Get saved by God's name.Save me, O God, by thy name. -- Psalm 54:1
    112. Get saved by God's shining face.Turn us again, O God, and cause thy face to shine; and we shall be saved. -- Psalm 80:3, 7, 19
    113. Isaiah 63:9
    114. Don't doubt.He that doubteth is damned. -- Romans 14:23
    115. Don't fall away after you're saved.For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance. -- Hebrews 6:4-6
    116. Don't eat your own vomit.For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them. But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire. -- 2 Peter 2:21-22
    117. Don't blaspheme the Holy GhostHe that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation. -- Mark 3:29, Matthew 12:31-32, Luke 12:10
    118. Don't let God make you wicked.The LORD hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil. -- Proverbs 16:4
    119. Be converted from the error of your ways.Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death. -- James 5:20
    120. 1 Corinthians 5:1-5

    121. Luke 16:9
    122. Enter at the strait gate.Then said one unto him, Lord, are there few that be saved? And he said unto them, Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able. -- Luke 13:23-24
    123. Enter through the Jesus door.I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved. -- John 10:9
    124. Isaiah 30:15
    125. Don't look back.Jesus said unto him, No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God. -- Luke 9:62
    126. Isaiah 63:8

    127. Become an Israeli citizen.Israel shall be saved in the LORD with an everlasting salvation. -- Isaiah 45:17And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob. -- Romans 11:26

    128. Obtain mercy through Jewish unbelief.For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their [Jewish] unbelief. -- Romans 11:30God hath concluded them [the Jews] all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all. -- Romans 11:32

    129. Be an unbelieving Jew.Even so have these [Jews] also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. -- Romans 11:31
    130. Don't be a Jew.But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. --Matthew 8:12
    131. Don't be a serpent or a viper, and make sure none of your ancestors were prophet killers.Ye are the children of them which killed the prophets ... Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell? -- Matthew 23:31-33
    132. Don't be an unrighteous fornicator, idolater, adulterer, effeminate, thief, covetous, drunkard, reviler, extortioner, or an abuser of yourself with mankind.The unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. -- 1 Corinthians 6:9-10
    133. Don't be fearful, unbelieving, abominable, murdering, whore mongering, a sorcerer, an idolater, or a liar.The fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. -- Revelation 21:8
    134. Fear God.The fear of the LORD is a fountain of life, to depart from the snares of death. -- Proverbs 14:27
    135. Fear God and cry a lot while praying.[Jesus] who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared. -- Hebrews 5:7
    136. Don't let your eye become evil.But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness! -- Matthew 6:23
    137. Pluck out your eye if it offends you.And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell. -- Matthew 5:29-30, 18:8-9, Mark 9:43-49
    138. Cut off your right hand if it offends you.If thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell. -- Matthew 5:29-30, 18:8-9, Mark 9:43-49
    139. Don't let your left hand know what your right hand is doing.Let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth: That thine alms may be in secret: and thy Father which seeth in secret himself shall reward thee openly. -- Matthew 6:4-5
    140. Be ordained to eternal life.As many as were ordained to eternal life believed. -- Acts 13:48
    141. Be drawn by by the Father.No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day. John 6:44
    142. Be elected by God before you're born.For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth. -- Romans 9:11Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God. -- 1 Thessalonians 1:4
    143. Don't be ashamed of Jesus.Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels. -- Mark 8:38, Luke 9:26
    144. Don't let anyone see you do anything good.Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven. -- Matthew 6:1
    145. Don't let anyone say anything nice about you.Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! -- Luke 6:26
    146. Don't love the world or the things in it.Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. -- 1 John 2:15
    147. Don't be a friend to the world.Whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God. -- James 4:4
    148. Be given by the Father and come to the Son.All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. -- John 6:37
    149. Come to the Father by Jesus.Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. -- John 14:6
    150. Be given by God to Jesus (or whatever).These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee: As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him. -- John 17:1-2
    151. Be saved by Jesus' life (if you're a friend) or by his death (if your an enemy).For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. -- Romans 5:10
    152. Don't get circumcised.Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing ... ye are fallen from grace. -- Galatians 5:2-4
    153. Be dead in your sins and uncircumcised flesh, and then let God quicken you with Christ.But God ... when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ. -- Ephesians 2:4-5
    154. Be chosen from the beginning.But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation. -- 2 Thessalonians 2:13And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses. -- Colossians 2:13
    155. Be predestinated by God.For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate ... Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified. -- Romans 8:29-30He hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love. Having predestinated us ... according to the good pleasure of his will. -- Ephesians 1:4-5

    156. Give your excess food and clothes to the poor.The people asked him [John the Baptist], saying, What shall we do then? He answereth ... He that hath two coats, let him impart to him that hath none; and he that hath meat, let him do likewise. Luke 3:10-11
    157. Be poor, not rich.He shall ... save the souls of the needy. -- Psalm 72:13Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. --Matthew 5:3Blessed be ye poor: for yours is the kingdom of God. ... But woe unto you that are rich! for ye have received your consolation. -- Luke 6:20, 24Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven. And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. -- Matthew 19:23-24Ye rich men, weep and howl for your miseries that shall come upon you. -- James 5:1
    158. Be poor in this world, be rich in faith, and love God.Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him? -- James 2:5
    159. Be sad.Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted. -- Matthew 5:4
    160. Cry a lot.Then they cried unto the LORD in their trouble, and he saved them. -- Psalm 107:13, 19Blessed are ye that weep now: for ye shall laugh. -- Luke 6:21
    161. Don't laugh.Woe unto you that laugh now! for ye shall mourn and weep. -- Luke 6:25
    162. Be last.But many that are first shall be last; and the last shall be first. -- Matthew 19:30, 20:16; Mark 10:31; Luke 13:30
    163. Be least.He that is least among you all, the same shall be great. -- Luke 9:48b
    164. Eat the bread that comes down from heaven.This is the bread which cometh down from heaven, that a man may eat thereof, and not die. -- John 6:50
    165. Eat Jesus' body and drink his blood.Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you. Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day. -- John 6:53-54
    166. Have faith in Jesus' blood.God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood. -- Romans 3:25
    167. Be saved and justified by Jesus' blood.Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. -- Romans 5:9
    168. Make people revile you, persecute you, hate you, avoid you, say bad things about you, and call you names for Jesus' sake.Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. -- Matthew 5:11Blessed are ye, when men shall hate you, and when they shall separate you from their company, and shall reproach you, and cast out your name as evil, for the Son of man's sake. Rejoice ye in that day, and leap for joy: for, behold, your reward is great in heaven. -- Luke 6:22-23
    169. Follow peace and holiness with all men.Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord. -- Hebrews 12:14
    170. Take heaven by force.From the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force. Matthew 11:12
    171. Believe in the foolishness of preaching.For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. -- 1 Corinthians 1:21
    172. Be innocent.He [God] shall deliver the island of the innocent. -- Job 22:30
    173. Give alms to the poor. (May only work for Catholics.)Alms deliver from all sin, and from death, and will not suffer the soul to go into darkness. -- Tobit 4:11
    174. Give a cup of water to a Christian.For whosoever shall give you a cup of water to drink in my name, because ye belong to Christ, verily I say unto you, he shall not lose his reward. -- Matthew 10:42, Mark 9:41
    175. Love Christians.We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death. -- 1 John 3:14
    176. Love your enemies, do good to them, and give them lots of money.But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. -- Luke 6:35, Matthew 5:44-45
    177. Love God and your neighbor.He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself. And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live. -- Luke 10:26-28
    178. Be a peacemaker.Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God. -- Matthew 5:9
    179. Feed the hungry, give drink to the thirsty, take in strangers, clothe the naked, visit the sick and imprisoned.Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in: Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me. -- Matthew 25:34-36

    180. Be merciful.Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy. -- Matthew 5:7For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment. -- James 2:13
    181. Forgive people.For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. Matthew 6:14
    182. Don't judge.Judge not, and ye shall not be judged. -- Matthew 7:1, Luke 6:37
    183. Be humble.He [God] shall save the humble person. -- Job 22:29Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven. -- Matthew 7:1He that humbleth himself shall be exalted. -- Luke 14:11
    184. Love the truth.And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. -- 2 Thessalonians 2:10
    185. Psalm 37:27
    186. Don't pray in public.And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. -- Matthew 6:5
    187. Be saved by other people's unbelief.
      (You can have some of mine; I've got plenty.)For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief. -- Romans 11:30
    188. Just ask.Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you: For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened. -- Matthew 7:7-8
    189. All you need is love.Love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God. -- 1 John 4:7
     
  9. Bugeyedcreepy

    Bugeyedcreepy Well-Known Member

    +1,419
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    No scientific evidence supports any other claim, let alone your wild wacky version of it. you discard everything regardless the evidence then assert completely unsupported 'ideas' as if you knew something about them. it is literally mindnumbing how you d
    It could be if they were derived by faith - but they're not - so that can be discarded as unchallenged...
    just like everywhere else we see light, matter & energy, so this too can be discarded....
    ...As it does here in reality too, so another discard for lack of substance - We're doing Great!
    Correct, I know nothing outside our universe. Everything in our universe though is in our fabric of spacetime. Another one we can discard for lack of substance!
    lol! :D I bet you still stand by 'versions' of reality... Your version, My version, some other random's version - when in actual fact, we all share the one & only version of reality. That you hate what reality tells us through facts and evidence is contrary to your particular worldview is just tough. Denial will just cost you ulcers in the end....
     
  10. Aman777

    Aman777 Christian

    +572
    Baptist
    The things you listed are good and perfect things, such as this one:

    Mat 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

    How can a sinful Human be perfect and keep every Law perfectly? Answer:

    Rom 3:12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

    Since NO person is perfect, HOW can one be saved?
     
  11. Bugeyedcreepy

    Bugeyedcreepy Well-Known Member

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    Nope, As much as you wish you had, you're just asserting they're just beliefs, they aren't. They're based on evidence we've collected in spades on this topic. The Hertzsprung-Russell diagram is just such an evidence based collection of facts. You are just wrong on this.
    No, This is done because of every observations we make and how what we know of physics and its dependencies of time is necessarily linked. For your far fetched and completely unevidenced idea to be considered, you'll have to provide evidence on how the properties of electromagnetic radiation would work in low/no time without it being glaringly obvious to us. The burden of 'some other state past' is on you, just asserting it is so while ignoring the enormous amount of evidence that supports a pervasive same-state universe. Until then, you can be safely ignored as a proper loon.
    Which of course we have. All of the evidence indicates that pervasive same state universe. Go find some evidence that shows otherwise.
    "I Don't Like It!" isn't a valid argument. Go find some evidence.
    Imagined fails in your head doesn't equate to anything here in reality. Go find some evidence for some other state somewhere else and we can talk. "Claims asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence".
    waffle.
    I've given you reams of evidence which you just discard on unevidence supposition. Everyone has seen this unfold quite plainly, so I'm good with that. Some people just have a vested interest in ignorance and you're clearly one of them. Science isn't godless any more than gravity is godless. If your worldview doesn't agree with reality, then there's something wrong with your worldview. The very same understanding of atomic theory and quantum mechanics that allows you to access the internet via a smartphone or computer is exactly the same science that tells us the universe and everything in it is in the same pervasive state throughout. You should be honest and live without all the benefits science has afforded you, rather than allow you access to these very benefits of science to reach susceptible minds to sell your destructive worldview and dark age inducing ignorance. Thankfully there's a sizeable divide in favour of scientific education in almost every first world economy, spare the US. My country has a great science education and we (like most first world economies) are largely sheltered from the mind-numbing stupidity of young earth creationism that vices the USA.
     
  12. Kylie

    Kylie Atheist and Proud

    +3,279
    Australia
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    Oh, dad, you never disappoint.

    You always resort to the same old tired ways of dismissing any arguments that you don't like. Make fun of it. Declare it wrong without saying why. Ignore it. You'll never change, will you?
     
  13. Kylie

    Kylie Atheist and Proud

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    This does not answer the question I asked, and I don't see how it answers any other question.
     
  14. Speedwell

    Speedwell Well-Known Member

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    I guess we must live on different planets--but I suspected that already. The overthrow of the Mossadegh government was jointly engineered by the British Secret Service and the CIA (which they have since admitted, at least on this planet) in reaction to a threat by the Iranians to nationalize the assets of the Anglo-Iranian Oil Company.
     
  15. Aman777

    Aman777 Christian

    +572
    Baptist
    My point is that by keeping the Law, no one can be saved since NO person has EVER kept the Law perfectly, except Jesus.

    Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

    The only way to heaven is to be born again Spiritually in Christ.

    Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His.

    God Bless you
     
  16. Kylie

    Kylie Atheist and Proud

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    So what? The list of things I posted was not about being perfect, it was a list of things that people have to do to be saved, according to various passages scattered throughout the Bible.

    Now stop trying to move the goalposts and address what I actually wrote instead of addressing what you want the conversation to be about.
     
  17. Aman777

    Aman777 Christian

    +572
    Baptist
    In order to go to Heaven, you MUST be without sin for your entire life. IF you break one command, you are guilty of all.

    Jas 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

    See? I didn't move any goalpost since the things you listed are NOT the way to Heaven. Jesus told doubting Thomas, who also asked the way to Heaven:

    Jhn 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by Me.

    There is NOTHING wrong with keeping every Law you can, but keeping the Law is NOT the way to Heaven. IF it was, then Jesus would NOT have had to die for our sins. Jesus is THE only way. God Bless you
     
  18. Kylie

    Kylie Atheist and Proud

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    Witness my list of Biblical passages that give almost 200 DIFFERENT instructions on what you need to do.

    Should I go with the Bible or you, Aman?
     
  19. Aman777

    Aman777 Christian

    +572
    Baptist
    Ask yourself WHY Jesus had to die IF we could follow ALL of the 200 different instructions? It's because Jesus led that sinless life God demands and gave His life so that those who believe that He was raised from the dead, according to the Scriptures, could have eternal life. IF there was any other way, Jesus would NOT have had to die. The Laws/instructions are our schoolmasters:

    Gal 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

    Unless you have never and will never break ANY of God's commandments, you should believe in Jesus, since He's the ONLY way to Heaven. Jhn 14:6 Those who are judged are all found guilty. God Bless you
     
  20. Kylie

    Kylie Atheist and Proud

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    So lemme get this straight...

    God sets up impossible to meet standards and then decides that we deserve death and eternal torment when we *GASP* can't meet those standards. God then sets up a system of rules for sacrificing animals, because apparently, punishing innocent animals for the crimes of others is A-OK in God's book. Then God changes his mind about that, and impregnates a woman with himself so he can be sacrificed to himself to convince himself to forgive us for the crime of not meeting standards he set up knowing we would not be able to meet.

    Also, God is apparently unable to just say, "I forgive you" the way I do with my daughter when she misbheaves. No, God needs blood before he can forgive, and apparently he doesn't care who, since he is quite happy to accept the blood of innocents for the crimes of others.

    Delightful.
     
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