My YEC Evidence Challenge

[Bugeyedcreepy]

So, I've decided to ask this question of Young (or Young at Heart) Earth Creationists in a challenge response to AV's numerous 'Challenges'.... though, I'd like to think this would actually be constructive over AV's hypothetical scenarios with no fixed facts... (not meaning to offend of course AV! )

If this universe is a direct fiat creation by God, and the bible is God's word filtered through fallible men, why is it that the second option is believed above the directly observed evidence of the creator of the universe?

Points to consider in a reply:

• We don't have the original books making the Bible
• We can directly examine the world around us, life, the universe & everything in between
• There is tangible and demonstrable advantage to knowing facts about the world around us, life, the universe & everything in between
• The Scientific Method is the most effective method in narrowing in on these facts about the world around us, life, the universe & everything in between

 

[Everybodyknows]

Facts don't always tell the truth

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

Facts don't always tell the truth

That doesn't make sense. A fact is a truth.

 

[Bugeyedcreepy]

Facts don't always tell the truth

A Fact is a truthful point of data, no? or better still, a Fact is a Fact.

 

[Bungle_Bear]

A Fact is a truthful point of data, no? or better still, a Fact is a Fact.

Oh come on. Surely everyone, by now, has heard of "alternative facts". They're very fashionable in the USA at the moment.

 

[Everybodyknows]

That doesn't make sense. A fact is a truth.

A fact is only truth if it leads you to the conclusion that you already know is true.

 

[CrystalDragon]

A fact is only truth if it leads you to the conclusion that you already know is true.

That's called "confirmation bias".

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

A fact is only truth if it leads you to the conclusion that you already know is true.

No, that's starting with the conclusion and working the evidence to fit your beliefs. It's confirmation bias.
And yes, @CrystalDragon beat me to it. I don't care.

 

[Dave-W]

That doesn't make sense. A fact is a truth.

Facts are facts, but the Truth is a person:

"I am the way the TRUTH and the life ..."

 

[Dave-W]

The Scientific Method is the most effective method in narrowing in on these facts about the world around us, life, the universe & everything in between

42

 

[AV1611VET]

(not meaning to offend of course AV! )

No offense taken!

 

[AV1611VET]

That doesn't make sense. A fact is a truth.

Really?

1. Was it a fact at one time that Phlogiston existed?

2. Was it a fact at one time that we had two moons?

3. Was it a fact at one time that Thalidomide was a prenatal wonder drug?

4. Was it a fact at one time that the Titanic was unsinkable?

5. Was it a fact at one time that it was safe to go back into (or not leave) the Twin Towers? (A mistake that was repeated in L'Aquila, btw.)

6. Was it a fact at one time that Pluto was our 9th planet?

Can anyone answer any of these honestly YES or NO?

 

[Bugeyedcreepy]

Facts are facts, but the Truth is a person:

"I am the way the TRUTH and the life ..."

Even if I had a reason to accept this assertion of God's word filtered through fallible men, I've never met this person.

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

Really?

1. Was it a fact at one time that Phlogiston existed?

2. Was it a fact at one time that we had two moons?

3. Was it a fact at one time that Thalidomide was a prenatal wonder drug?

4. Was it a fact at one time that the Titanic was unsinkable?

5. Was it a fact at one time that it was safe to go back into (or not leave) the Twin Towers? (A mistake that was repeated in L'Aquila, btw.)

6. Was it a fact at one time that Pluto was our 9th planet?

Can anyone answer any of these honestly YES or NO?

You really need to get out more.

 

[AV1611VET]

Even if I had a reason to accept this assertion of God's word filtered through fallible men, I've never met this person.

You will someday ... that's a fact.

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

Facts are facts, but the Truth is a person:

"I am the way the TRUTH and the life ..."

That has no bearing on what I was talking about.

 

[AV1611VET]

You really need to get out more.

And you need to learn how to answer questions.

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

And you need to learn how to answer questions.

No, you just need to have a better understanding about... well, pretty much everything.

 

[Bugeyedcreepy]

Really?

1. Was it a fact at one time that Phlogiston existed?

2. Was it a fact at one time that we had two moons?

3. Was it a fact at one time that Thalidomide was a prenatal wonder drug?

4. Was it a fact at one time that the Titanic was unsinkable?

5. Was it a fact at one time that it was safe to go back into (or not leave) the Twin Towers? (A mistake that was repeated in L'Aquila, btw.)

6. Was it a fact at one time that Pluto was our 9th planet?

Can anyone answer any of these honestly YES or NO?

1. No.
2. I don't know.
3. Possibly, but its side effects turned out to be pretty horrific.
4. No.
5. No.
6. By definition, Yes. This is a Human classification, so is arbitrary, and the definition for what we regard as a planet has now changed.

 

[Dave-W]

That has no bearing on what I was talking about.

Actually it has EVERYTHING to do with what you were talking about.

The laws of science only go so far. But the Person of Jesus (the TRUTH) is not bound by physics or even logic. Indeed, if the bible is any indication, He operates on an entirely different logical framework.

It is called either Hebrew Block Logic or Adductive Logic.