MARK OF THE BEAST - REVELATION 13-14; 17; 18

LoveGodsWord

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When you say this over and over- after I prove using scripture after scripture - it indicates that you are in a state of denial of the truth. You just can't handle it. You have too much of this platitude filler in your posts, that make them difficult to read. Please dispense with the platitudes.

Sorry brother God's Word disagree with you. You have been provided scripture that you have not adressed and you have not proven a single claim. In our discussion here we have gone through all of your posts and scriptures section by section and with scripture and questions that disagree with your claims but you simply ignore these. That is why I posted earlier that all I am hearing is your words over God's WORD. Ignoring God's WORD does not make it disappear. Only God's WORD is true and we should beleive and follow it. If you disagree please show why with the scriptures and respond to the questions and scriptures provided that disagree with you.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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So, you agree that the Mark of his name (the beast), his name, the number of his name is physical? So what is his name, not his title, but his name? And provide a picture of the Mark of his name (the beast).

Brother this has already been answered in post # 93 linked, with all the linked posts attached showing the MARK OF THE BEAST according to the scriptures is NOT a physical mark. It seems you did not read them and is a good example of what I have been saying that your ignoring the posts and the scriptures in them that disagree with you. Please brother this is said in all love and respect. Take some time and look at the scriptures provided. If you disagree show why. You do not have to agree. We can always agree to disagree.

God bless.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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It has to be ten kings, leaders. The ten leaders are unknown at this time. It is not ten kingdoms; that's one of the flaws of some of SDA thinking. When the EU reorganizes and those ten leaders are in place, the end times bible prophecy leading into the 7 years is going to be like a whirlwind.

See brother your not able to show any links to the scriptures of your interpretation of DANIEL 7 and the EU. This is because this is your own private interpretation which is against the rules of prophetic scripture study *2 PETER 1:20.

Nothing you have said above you can prove from DANIEL 7. I suggest you revisit the scriptures there and also read posts # 79 linked; and post # 80 linked you will see that everthing shown to you in DANIEL 7 fits perfectly with DANIEL 2 and all the links in to the scriptures in DANIEL 7.

With all respect and love brother this only shows flaws brother in your own interpretations here as your not able to prove your claims by the scriptures. If you disagree with the linked posts and the scriptures in them prove it. If you cannot than should you not pray about it more as your not able to prove your claims.

Only sent in love brother and all respect. I actually enjoy our conversations together. As JESUS says there is nothing that is hidden that shall not be revealed. Time will tell who is right and who is not. So to me it is a blessing to share God's WORD with you and to listen to your thoughts here.

Thanks for sharing brother Dougg.

God bless.
 
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Douggg

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Brother you posted the same scriptures that disagree with the very statement you make claiming that the scriptures do not say kingdoms. Yet the scripture says that the forth beast is the fourth kingdom and the horns represent kings that will arise out of this BEAST. Now brother really, think about what you are saying here. Can a king be a king without a kingdom? *DANIEL 7:23-25
No, it is I and SDA, who disagree over the same scriptures. It is ten kings, leaders, of one kingdom. Right now there are 28 kings in the EU. 28 leaders over the 28 nation states. Like Angela Merkel, Teresa May, Macron.

Do you know how many presidents there are right now over the EU? There are three.

We don't know right now what the exact structure of the ten leader form of government with one leader over them is going to exactly look like because it is not in place yet.

But it will not be long, because Russia, Iran, Turkey are close to forming up the Gog/Magog invasion of Israel group.
 
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Douggg

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Brother this has already been answered in post # 93 linked, with all the linked posts attached showing the MARK OF THE BEAST according to the scriptures is NOT a physical mark. It seems you did not read them and is a good example of what I have been saying that your ignoring the posts and the scriptures in them that disagree with you. Please brother this is said in all love and respect. Take some time and look at the scriptures provided. If you disagree show why. You do not have to agree. We can always agree to disagree.

God bless.
You send me to a link to dig out from a volume of other material, taking up my time. Don't give me a link, just respond directly with your own words in the post.

I don't need the platitudes either.
___________________________________________________________

How are people going to know whether to sell to someone or not, if there is no physical identification ?
 
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Douggg

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See brother your not able to show any links to the scriptures of your interpretation of DANIEL 7 and the EU. This is because this is your own private interpretation which is against the rules of prophetic scripture study *2 PETER 1:20.
This in blue is platitude. And your statement in the first sentence is false on top of that.
 
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Douggg

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DANIEL 7 says that the little HORN that comes out of the fourth BEAST continues for 1260 years.
No, it doesn't. SDA is taking the time, times, half times and misinterpreting it as being 1260 years.

PLEASE explain how a person can live for 1260 years, conqour and uproot three kingdoms on it's rise to power and come out of the fourth BEAST of DANIEL 7?
You question is flawed because it presupposes that the time, times, half times is 1260 years. Corrected to a time, times, half times - the timeframe fits within the general lifetime of three score and ten years in Psalms 90:10.

And the text says subdue three kings, not three kingdoms.

24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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No, it is I and SDA, who disagree over the same scriptures. It is ten kings, leaders, of one kingdom. Right now there are 28 kings in the EU. 28 leaders over the 28 nation states. Like Angela Merkel, Teresa May, Macron.

Do you know how many presidents there are right now over the EU? There are three.

We don't know right now what the exact structure of the ten leader form of government with one leader over them is going to exactly look like because it is not in place yet.

But it will not be long, because Russia, Iran, Turkey are close to forming up the Gog/Magog invasion of Israel group.

Indeed you are saying the same thing over and over. Yet you can cannot show why it is you disagree or can you respond to any of the scriptures in the post here that disagree with you as highlighted in the previous linked posts. Please see, posts # 79 linked; post # 80 linked; posts # 82 linked; 83 linked; 84 linked and 85 linked. You cannot show how your view of the forth BEAST of DANIEL 7 being the EU matches all the descriptions of the fourth BEAST power of DANIEL 7. Does this not concern you brother?
 
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LoveGodsWord

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You send me to a link to dig out from a volume of other material, taking up my time. Don't give me a link, just respond directly with your own words in the post. I don't need the platitudes either. How are people going to know whether to sell to someone or not, if there is no physical identification ?

I responded to you directly in the post you are quoting from and also provided the linked post that you ignored with all the supporting scriptures. All the scriptures provided in the linked post earlier show very clearly that the MARK is not a physical MARK. I asked you if you disagree to prove with the scriptures that the MARK is physical. You have not responded to the post or the scriptures in them or the question asked of you to prove why you disagree from the scriptures and to prove the mark is physical. Only God's WORD is true brother and we should believe and follow it.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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This in blue is platitude. And your statement in the first sentence is false on top of that.

Not at all brother Dougg. Your post was addressed with the God's WORD and shown that it does not agree with it. It is ok we can agree to disagree.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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No, it doesn't. SDA is taking the time, times, half times and misinterpreting it as being 1260 years.

Brother this has already been proven to be a false statement through the scriptures and is repetition that has already been addressed with the scriptures that you have not responded to *see post # 52 linked with all the scriptures applied to the 42 months which = 1260 day/years and time and times and half a time (3 1/2 years = 3 x 360 + 180 = 1260 day/years) in reference to DANIEL 7:25; 12:7; REVELATION 11:3; 12:6; 14; 13:5 .

You question is flawed because it presupposes that the time, times, half times is 1260 years. Corrected to a time, times, half times - the timeframe fits within the general lifetime of three score and ten years in Psalms 90:10.

The question is not flawed brother you have been shown through the scriptures that prophetic scriptures and timlines according to God's WORD uses 1 year for a day as it is written in God's WORD.

The timelines in God's WORD that relate to the 1260 day/year timeline include the 42 months of Revelation 11:2; 12:6; 14' 13:5 also the time, times and half a time are all in relation to the 1260 day/year time prophecy of Daniel 7:25, the little HORN and first BEAST of REVELATION 13.

Dan 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

Dan 12:7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

Rev 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

The word time in this context refers to a period of a year. In the story of King Nebuchadnezzar, because of his pride, he went crazy for seven years and ate grass as an ox-

Dan 4:32 And they shall drive thee from men, and thy dwelling shall be with the beasts of the field: they shall make thee to eat grass as oxen, and seven times shall pass over thee, until thou know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will.

So on a literal level, time, times and half a time means time (1 year), times (2 years) and half a time (1/2 year) or 3 1/2 years. Most people who study Bible prophecy stop at this point and accept the 3 1/2 years only at face value. The period that this is generally attributed to by most people, is the last half of the 70th week of Daniel and the reign of the AntiChrist, which is proposed to be fulfilled at some time in the future.

A Day Equals One Year

The 70 week prophecy of Daniel 9:24, however, establishes a principle related to prophetic time that few completely understand. Virtually everyone acknowledges that the 70 weeks are not literally 70 weeks, but rather 70 weeks of years, or 490 years. The principle is that in Bible prophecy, you must substitute a period of a year in place of a day. This is the day=year principle. This equation is clearly established in scripture-

Num 14:34 After the number of the days in which ye searched the land, even forty days, each day for a year, shall ye bear your iniquities, even forty years, and ye shall know my breach of promise.

In this verse, a relationship between day and year is clear, each day will equate to a literal year. For the forty days that Israel spied in Canaan in unbelief, they would be punished by wandering forty years in the desert.

Ezek 4:6 And when thou hast accomplished them, lie again on thy right side, and thou shalt bear the iniquity of the house of Judah forty days: I have appointed thee each day for a year.

Here again, the equation is stated quite openly, a prophetic day represents a literal year. So to return to the 70 weeks of Daniel, you must first determine the number of days represented. Seventy weeks is 70 x 7 or 490 days, which will then equate to a literal 490 years in the fulfillment of the prophecy.

The Lunar Calendar

So now to apply this formula to the 3 1/2 times we must first establish just exactly how many days this represents. The Jews did not use a solar calendar as we do today, they used instead a lunar calendar, as indicated in Psalms-

Psa 104:19 He appointed the moon for seasons: the sun knoweth his going down.

The length of the lunar month can be determined from Genesis-

Gen 7:11 In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened.

Gen 7:24 And the waters prevailed upon the earth an hundred and fifty days.

Gen 8:4 And the ark rested in the seventh month, on the seventeenth day of the month, upon the mountains of Ararat.

Note that the there were exactly 5 months from the point where the flood began and the ark came to rest on Ararat, and that this was a period of 150 days. This demonstrates that the lunar calendar set forth in the Bible has a 30 day month, therefore the year is counted as 360 days. (This 360 day lunar year also accounts for the reason that there are 360 degrees in the compass).

The 1260 Days

Returning to the 3 1/2 times, which we now know represents 3 1/2 lunar years of 360 days each, using the same methodology as is used for the 70 weeks of Daniel we calculate it to actually represent 1260 literal years. So, Time, Times and half a Time in prophecy is really 1260 years! To confirm this formula we need only to look to the 12th chapter of the book of Revelation-

Rev 12:6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

Here the woman represents the faithful church, who flees into the wilderness for 1260 days. Again using the day=year formula, this actually speaks of 1260 years that the church would be persecuted. Now look at this next verse from the same chapter-

Rev 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

Here the exact same time of persecution is referred to as 3 1/2 times, again meaning the same period of 1260 days/years as found in verse 6. In the book of Daniel, this exact same period of persecution in church history is found-

Dan 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

This verse in context is referring to a period of time that the little horn or AntiChrist will persecute the true believers or true church, again for 1260 years. The same is true for this next verse-

Dan 12:7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished.

The Two Witnesses

The exact same 1260 years is found in Revelation chapter 11-

Rev 11:3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.

The commonly accepted interpretation of the verse is that the two witnesses are real prophets, perhaps Moses and Elijah. When you understand that the time period does not represent 1260 literal days, but rather 1260 years, it can be seen that it cannot be referring to real people as witnesses. One clue is in the next verse-

Rev 11:4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

The two witnesses are also called two olive trees standing before God. This links us to-

Zec 4:2 And said unto me, What seest thou? And I said, I have looked, and behold a candlestick all of gold, with a bowl upon the top of it, and his seven lamps thereon, and seven pipes to the seven lamps, which are upon the top thereof:
Zec 4:3 And two olive trees by it, one upon the right side of the bowl, and the other upon the left side thereof.
Zec 4:4 So I answered and spake to the angel that talked with me, saying, What are these, my lord?

Zechariah sees a candlestick and two olive trees and asks what they are. Note the answer-

Zec 4:5 Then the angel that talked with me answered and said unto me, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.
Zec 4:6 Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the LORD unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the LORD of hosts.

The candlestick and two olive trees are the word of the Lord! So the language used in Revelation 11:4 is prophetic and symbolic, the two witnesses actually representing the word of God, the Old and New Testament, that would "prophesy in sackcloth" or be suppressed during the very same 1260 years of persecution we are considering.

The 42 Months = 1260 day/years

This same period of persecution is found in the following verses-

Rev 11:2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

Again as in Rev 12, we have a strong relationship between this 42 months of verse 2 and the 1260 days of Rev 11: 3. Forty two months calculates as 42 x 30 (30 days in a lunar month) which equals 1260 days/years. This verse is saying that the Gentiles or unbelievers would trample the people of God (the holy city) for 1260 years. Again this same time period of 42 months is found in Revelation 13-

Rev 13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
Rev 13:6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
Rev 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

This passage speaks of the great and terrible beast from the sea, which actually is the same as the little horn of Daniel, which is to say the AntiChrist power that would persecute the people of God for 1260 years.

So, here is a complete listing of the passages that deal with the same 1260 year time period of persecution-

* 3 1/2 Times - Rev 12:14, Dan 7:25, Dan 12:7
* 1260 days - Rev 11:3, Rev 12:6
* 42 Months - Rev 11:2, Rev 13:5

If you know much about what is called the Dark Ages, then you probably know who this persecuting power is already. So now, to find out exactly when this 1260 years is fulfilled, and the real identity of the little horn and beast from the sea in Revelation that persecuted God's people for those 1260 years. Everything above is a fulfillment of the acts of the ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH (source and more information).

Now brother you have been provided scripture to show that the prophetic timelines represent 1 day = 1 year.

Prove that it is not? If you cannot prove that it does not than your claim is that the little HORN of DANIEL 7 is a person. DANIEL 7 says that the little HORN that comes out of the fourth BEAST continues for 1260 years (according to God's WORD alone). PLEASE explain how a person can live for 1260 years, conqour and uproot three kingdoms on it's rise to power and come out of the fourth BEAST of DANIEL 7?

And the text says subdue three kings, not three kingdoms. 24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

The same scripture reference in *DANIEL 7:8 not only say subdues but says PLUCKED UP BY THE ROOTS. The HEBREW word used for SUBDUE שׁפל; shephal means to abase, humble, put down, subdue. So when the scripture says that when the little Horn shall rise to power it will UNROOT BY THE ROOTS ABASE AND PUT DOWN it means to destroy. Sorry brother God's WORD disagrees with you.

God bless.
 
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Douggg

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Brother this has already been proven to be a false statement through the scriptures and is repetition that has already been addressed with the scriptures that you have not responded to *see post # 52 linked with all the scriptures applied to the 42 months which = 1260 day/years and time and times and half a time (3 1/2 years = 3 x 360 + 180 = 1260 day/years) in reference to DANIEL 7:25; 12:7; REVELATION 11:3; 12:6; 14; 13:5 .
How is a time, times, half times; the 42 months; the 1260 days a false statement when those are the exact words in the text ?

What is being altered the meaning of - is SDA taking two specific cases in the bible, exceptions to the rule of the plain meaning of the text, and misapplying a day is a year universally.

The text is not a false statement. It is SDA altering the meaning of the text that is false.
 
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Douggg

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Here the woman represents the faithful church, who flees into the wilderness for 1260 days. Again using the day=year formula, this actually speaks of 1260 years that the church would be persecuted. Now look at this next verse from the same chapter-
The woman is not the church. The woman in Revelation 12:5 who gives birth to Jesus is Israel.

Revelation 12:5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

Isaiah 9:
6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.

Now brother you have been provided scripture to show that the prophetic timelines represent 1 day = 1 year.

Prove that it is not? If you cannot prove that it does not than your claim is that the little HORN of DANIEL 7 is a person
It is easy. None of the trumpets judgments, nor the vials containing the wrath of God during the 42 months and the time, times, half times have taken place yet.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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How is a time, times, half times; the 42 months; the 1260 days a false statement when those are the exact words in the text ?

Hello brother, no the time, times and half time; 42 months and the 1260 days is not a false statement. These are the scriptures and I did not say these are the false statements. The false statement is this claim that you said here that was being responded to.

Douggg said: No, it doesn't. SDA is taking the time, times, half times and misinterpreting it as being 1260 years.

This is a false statement brother as the scripture references for time, times and half a time are referring to 3 and a half years.

In the OLD language a time is represented one year. In fact if you look at the HEBREW word used here for time, times and half a time in DANIEL 7:25 that shows the timeline of the little Horn speaking great things against the most high, the HEBREW word used for "TIME" here is עדּן; ‛iddân (Chaldee); from a root corresponding to that of H5708; a set time ; technically a year. So a time, times and half a time is equal to 3 and a half years.

Sometimes for establishing prophetic timelines God tells us through his WORD that one day is equal to one year.

NUMBERS 14:34 After the number of the days in which ye searched the land, even forty days, each day for a year, shall ye bear your iniquities, even forty years, and ye shall know my breach of promise.

and again

EZEKIEL 4:6 And when thou hast accomplished them, lie again on thy right side, and thou shalt bear the iniquity of the house of Judah forty days: I have appointed thee each day for a year.

Let's look at the timelines again for the time, times and half a time from DANIEL and REVELATION and the 1260 days/years


THE 1260 DAYS OF DANIEL 7 AND REVELATION


The number 1260 is not just a rough figure because it is mentioned seven
times in the Bible in various different ways:

Daniel 7:25 "a time, times and half a time"
Daniel 12:7 "a time, times and half a time"
Revelation 11:2 "42 months"
Revelation 11:3 "1260 days"
Revelation 12:6 "1260 days"
Revelation 12:14 "a time, times and half a time"
Revelation 13:5 "forty-two months"

It can be shown that all these texts are referring to the same period of
time:

* A time is one year = 360 days
* Times are two years = 720 days
* Half a time is half a year = 180 days
-----------------------------------------
* Therefore the total = 1260 days

A month in prophecy is equal to 30 days, therefore forty-two months is equal to 42 x 30 = 1260 days. So we can see that these seven texts are talking about the same period of
time, but what does it mean?

First of all, the prophecy is not referring to literal days. In prophecy a day is sometimes used to represent a year, and that seems to be the case here. (See Numbers 14:34 and Ezekiel 4:6) So the prophecy is talking about a period of 1260 years.

If we now go back to Daniel 7:25 we can see that it is the power of the Little Horn which will control the "saints" for this period of time. We have already suggested that the Little Horn represents "Papal Rome" so does our figure of 1260 years fit in with the records of history?

Papal Rome defeated the last of its major enemies (the Ostrogoths) in the year 538 A.D. when Emperor Justinian's decree came into effect. Throughout the Dark Ages the Catholic church was the most powerful political force in the whole world, and it used its power for political and financial gain as well as for religious purposes. Many millions were persecuted and put to death - "oppressing the saints of the Most High" as Daniel puts it.

However the power of the Papal Church came to an end when the armed forces of Napoleon, under general Berthier marched into Rome and took the Pope captive. This happened in the year 1798 A.D. surprisingly (or perhaps not so surprisingly) exactly 1260 years after the Papacy came to power in 538 A.D.

CONCLUSION: So in summary brother, NO there has been no misapplication of the scriptures and only scripture has been used to interpret the scriptures according to the rule of God's WORD in interpreting prophecy that no prophecy is of any private interpretations *2 PETER 1:20. Scripture has been used to interpret the scriptures and as proof using the day/year scripture the timelines work out perfectly.

What is being altered the meaning of - is SDA taking two specific cases in the bible, exceptions to the rule of the plain meaning of the text, and misapplying a day is a year universally. The text is not a false statement. It is SDA altering the meaning of the text that is false.

Well that has no truth in it at all brother and as shown above already in this post and elsewhere, through the scriptures alone God's WORD disagrees with you. If you disagree please respond to the scriptures provided here and this post. If you cannot why make claims you cannot prove with God's WORD? Said only in all love and respect brother. Only God's WORD is true and we should believe and follow it.

God bless
 
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LoveGodsWord

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The woman is not the church. The woman in Revelation 12:5 who gives birth to Jesus is Israel.

Revelation 12:5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

Isaiah 9:
6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.

Brother none of the scriptures you have provided here support your claim that a women does not represent a church in Gods WORD.

The GREEK WORD for CHURCH is ἐκκλησία; ekklēsia From a compound of G1537 and a derivative of G2564; which means a calling out, that is, (concretely) a popular meeting, especially a religious congregation (Jewish synagogue, or Christian community of members on earth or saints in heaven or both): - assembly, church.

So a Church is a called out people. God's saints and all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW GOD'S WORD.

In the NEW COVENANT ISRAEL are all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. Gentiles are now grafted in to God's ISRAEL *ROMANS 11:13-27 If you are not a part of God's ISRAEL you have no part in the NEW COVENANT *HEBREWS 8:10-12.

God Church (ISRAEL) or people have always been called the BRIDE of CHRIST and we are to prepare to meet the BRIDEGROOM. God's Church (ISRAEL) have always been represented in God's WORD as either a faithful pure WOMAN of an UNFAITHFUL HARLOT when breaking God's COMMANDMENTS and not BELIEVING and FOLLOWING God's WORD.

WOMAN PURE = God's people faithful (Jeremiah 6:2; 2 Corinthians 11:2; Ephesians 5:23-27)
WOMAN harlot
= God's people unfaithful to God fornicator, adulteress, unfaithful or false religion (Isaiah 1:21-27; Jeremiah 3:1-3; 6-9; Ezekiel 16:15-58; 23:2-21; Hosea 2:5; 3:1; Revelations 14:4)

MOTHER OF HARLOTS
= Gives birth to unfaithful or false religion offspring and children just like the Mother (Revelation 17:1-5)

Sorry brother God's WORD disagrees with you.

It is easy. None of the trumpets judgments, nor the vials containing the wrath of God during the 42 months and the time, times, half times have taken place yet.

Now where does it say this in DANIEL 7 which is what we are discussing? Can you see your error here brother? You have not answered the question asked of you which is directly related to DANIEL 7.

Everything provided here brother is only sent in LOVE. I enjoy our discussions and pray our discussion will give you something to think about. The most important thing is that we are ready to meet JESUS today.

God bless
 
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Douggg

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In the OLD language a time is represented one year. In fact if you look at the HEBREW word used here for time, times and half a time in DANIEL 7:25 that shows the timeline of the little Horn speaking great things against the most high, the HEBREW word used for "TIME" here is
עדּן; ‛iddân (Chaldee); from a root corresponding to that of H5708; a set time ; technically a year. So a time, times and half a time is equal to 3 and a half years.
But that is not the issue. The issue of what makes SDA teachings wrong is that SDA takes the 3 1/2 years you are describing and turns it into 1260 years.
Papal Rome defeated the last of its major enemies (the Ostrogoths) in the year 538 A.D. when Emperor Justinian's decree came into effect.
It doesn't matter what the Ostrogoths or Papal Rome did in 538 A.D., regarding the ten kings of Daniel 7 and Daniel 2 and Revelation 17 and Revelation 13 and Revelation 19 - because the ten kings are ten end times kings, alive when Jesus returns.
 
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Douggg

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Brother none of the scriptures you have provided here support your claim that a women does not represent a church in Gods WORD.
Why doesn't Isaiah 9:6-7 prove that Jesus was born to Israel ?

Isaiah 9:
6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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But that is not the issue. The issue of what makes SDA teachings wrong is that SDA takes the 3 1/2 years you are describing and turns it into 1260 years.

Please tell me brother what is the issue when the 3 and a half years = 1260 days/years and the timeline is proven to be on time? You have not proven that it is wrong and the evidence supports the timeline is correct as shown in the previous post. Do you mean you do not like it because it does not fit your interpretation of the EU?

It doesn't matter what the Ostrogoths or Papal Rome did in 538 A.D., regarding the ten kings of Daniel 7 and Daniel 2 and Revelation 17 and Revelation 13 and Revelation 19 - because the ten kings are ten end times kings, alive when Jesus returns.

Indeed but can you see your getting your interpretations mixed up between the different passages? Your trying to apply your own interpretations to scripture passages from REVELATION to DANIEL. Brother we need to let the scriptures interpret themselves as this is the the first rule of prophetic interpretation *2 PETER 1:20. DANIEL 7:8 says on the rise to power of the Little Horn three of the 10 kings/kingdoms will be plucked up by the roots (no more). Can you see this is a flaw to your inerpretation stated earlier that the 10 kings of DANIEL 7 and the 4th BEAST are the EU?
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Why doesn't Isaiah 9:6-7 prove that Jesus was born to Israel ?

Isaiah 9:
6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.

Indeed it does and that is not the problem. The question is, who God's ISRAEL is in the NEW COVENANT? God's ISRAEL in the NEW COVENANT is God's Church and are all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. Gentiles are now grafted in *ROMANS 11:13-27. If you are not a part of God's ISRAEL you have no part in the NEW COVENANT *HEBREWS 8:10-12.

God bless brother.
 
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God's ISRAEL in the NEW COVENANT is God's Church and are all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD.
Israel in Revelation 12, is the Israel who Jesus rescues in Zechariah 14. Is that the Church? No, it is not.

And it is not the Church who went into exile for rejecting Jesus.

In Ezekiel 39:21-29, following the Armageddon feast on the dead bodies of them who try to make war on Jesus in Ezekiel 39:17-20, is Jesus Himself speaking in Ezekiel 39:21-29.

That who Israel is Revelation 12. The church is not Israel. Jesus is not talking about the church in these verses.

Ezekiel 39:
22 So the house of Israel shall know that I am the LORD their God from that day and forward.

23 And the heathen shall know that the house of Israel went into captivity for their iniquity: because they trespassed against me, therefore hid I my face from them, and gave them into the hand of their enemies: so fell they all by the sword.

24 According to their uncleanness and according to their transgressions have I done unto them, and hid my face from them.



25 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Now will I bring again the captivity of Jacob, and have mercy upon the whole house of Israel, and will be jealous for my holy name;

26 After that they have borne their shame, and all their trespasses whereby they have trespassed against me, when they dwelt safely in their land, and none made them afraid.

27 When I have brought them again from the people, and gathered them out of their enemies' lands, and am sanctified in them in the sight of many nations;

28 Then shall they know that I am the LORD their God, which caused them to be led into captivity among the heathen: but I have gathered them unto their own land, and have left none of them any more there.

29 Neither will I hide my face any more from them: for I have poured out my spirit upon the house of Israel, saith the Lord GOD.
 
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