Is the Book of Jubilees Torah?

[HARK!]

I don't use the Tanakh. I use the Old Testament.

YHWH isn't dead.

 

[ViaCrucis]

That's because it's not there. The word is a fabrication. There was no official canon in the time of Yahshua.

I don't know who "Yahshua" is. But in the time of Jesus the Torah was very firmly accepted and known.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[ViaCrucis]

YHWH isn't dead.

And the noonday sky is blue. But what do either of these statements have to do with what I posted?

-CryptoLutheran

 

[HARK!]

I don't know who "Yahshua" is. But in the time of Jesus the Torah was very firmly accepted and known.

Do tell!

(4Q266, fr. 8 i, 6-9).
(For God made) XVI a Covenant with you and all Israel; therefore a
man shall bind himself by oath to return to the Law of Moses (TORAH), for in it all
things are strictly defined.
As for the exact determination of their times to which Israel turns a
blind eye, behold it is strictly defined in the Book of the Divisions of
the Times into their Jubilees and Weeks. And on the day that a man
swears to return to the Law of Moses (TORAH)

Here is a list of how many copies of each book were found at Qumran:

Book Number found
Psalms 39
Deuteronomy 33
1 Enoch 25
Genesis 24
Isaiah 22
Jubilees 21
Exodus 18
Leviticus 17
Numbers 11
Minor Prophets 10[note 1]
Daniel 8
Jeremiah 6
Ezekiel 6
Job 6
Tobit 5[note 2]
1 & 2 Kings 4
1 & 2 Samuel 4
Judges 4[515]
Song of Songs (Canticles) 4
Ruth 4
Lamentations 4
Sirach 3
Ecclesiastes 2
Joshua 2

When they found these books at Qumran, Jubilees and Genesis were often found together in the same jar.

 

[HARK!]

And the noonday sky is blue. But what do either of these statements have to do with what I posted?

He didn't leave a last will and testament. He's eternal.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Do tell!

(4Q266, fr. 8 i, 6-9).
(For God made) XVI a Covenant with you and all Israel; therefore a
man shall bind himself by oath to return to the Law of Moses (TORAH), for in it all
things are strictly defined.
As for the exact determination of their times to which Israel turns a
blind eye, behold it is strictly defined in the Book of the Divisions of
the Times into their Jubilees and Weeks. And on the day that a man
swears to return to the Law of Moses (TORAH)

Here is a list of how many copies of each book were found at Qumran:

Book Number found
Psalms 39
Deuteronomy 33
1 Enoch 25
Genesis 24
Isaiah 22
Jubilees 21
Exodus 18
Leviticus 17
Numbers 11
Minor Prophets 10[note 1]
Daniel 8
Jeremiah 6
Ezekiel 6
Job 6
Tobit 5[note 2]
1 & 2 Kings 4
1 & 2 Samuel 4
Judges 4[515]
Song of Songs (Canticles) 4
Ruth 4
Lamentations 4
Sirach 3
Ecclesiastes 2
Joshua 2

When they found these books at Qumran, Jubilees and Genesis were often found together in the same jar.

You forgot to mention all the books found at Qumran, what about the Community Rule? The War Scroll? The Genesis Apocryphon? The Testament of Levi? The Book of Noah?

The Qumran community had these books too.

But you know what they didn't have? They didn't have Jubilees as part of the Torah. The Torah was still the Torah at Qumran. The five books.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[ViaCrucis]

He didn't leave a last will and testament. He's eternal.

Okay, so, you don't know what the word "testament" means when referring to the Bible.

The word testament comes from the Latin testamentum, "I testify". A last will and testament refers to the final statement left by someone after their death. But a testament is simply witness-bearing.

We call the two halves of the Christian Bible the "Old Testament" and the "New Testament" because these are the two testaments--witnesses--to Jesus Christ. That which came before Him, the Old Testament, and that which came after Him, the New Testament.

The Bible, in what it is for us as Christians, are those books which bear witness to Jesus Christ, which testify of Him, confess Him, and through which we as God's people can hear Him, receive Him, and believe Him.

That's what the Bible is. And that's why it's the Old Testament and the New Testament. And it's why some random person on the internet can't just pick and choose which books belong or don't belong in the Bible--because the Bible doesn't belong to you, or to me, but to the entire Church.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[HARK!]

You forgot to mention all the books found at Qumran, what about the Community Rule? The War Scroll? The Genesis Apocryphon? The Testament of Levi? The Book of Noah?

The Qumran community had these books too.

But you know what they didn't have? They didn't have Jubilees as part of the Torah. The Torah was still the Torah at Qumran. The five books.

You left out a notable document. It's called the Damascus Document. I just quoted it; and it refutes your argument.

(4Q266, fr. 8 i, 6-9).
(For God made) XVI a Covenant with you and all Israel; therefore a
man shall bind himself by oath to return to the Law of Moses (TORAH), for in it all
things are strictly defined.
As for the exact determination of their times to which Israel turns a
blind eye, behold it is strictly defined in the Book of the Divisions of
the Times into their Jubilees and Weeks. And on the day that a man
swears to return to the Law of Moses (TORAH)

I'll take the historical record, over some random internet guy's word for it.

 

[ViaCrucis]

You left out a notable document. It's called the Damascus Document. I just quoted it; and it refutes your argument.

(4Q266, fr. 8 i, 6-9).
(For God made) XVI a Covenant with you and all Israel; therefore a
man shall bind himself by oath to return to the Law of Moses (TORAH), for in it all
things are strictly defined.
As for the exact determination of their times to which Israel turns a
blind eye, behold it is strictly defined in the Book of the Divisions of
the Times into their Jubilees and Weeks. And on the day that a man
swears to return to the Law of Moses (TORAH)

I'll take the historical record, over some random internet guy's word for it.

Did you notice that "the Book of Divisions" is not called Torah here? But that God's instructions/Law are Torah.

You really want this to be true, and so you are reaching desperately and failing to do so.

What you want to be true, and what is true, are not the same thing.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[HARK!]

The word testament comes from the Latin testamentum, "I testify". A last will and testament refers to the final statement left by someone after their death. But a testament is simply witness-bearing.

Etymology
From Middle English, from Old French, from Latin testāmentum (“the publication of a will, a will, testament, in Late Latin one of the divisions of the Bible”), from testor (“I am a witness, testify, attest, make a will”), from testis (“one who attests, a witness”).

Pronunciation

• IPA(key): /ˈtɛst.ə.mənt/

Noun
testament (plural testaments)

1. (law) A solemn, authentic instrument in writing, by which a person declares his or her will as to disposal of his or her inheritance (estate and effects) after his or her death, benefiting specified heir(s).
   Synonyms: will, last will and testament, last will
2. One of the two parts to the scriptures of the Christian religion: the New Testament, considered by Christians to be a continuation of the Hebrew scriptures, and the Hebrew scriptures themselves, which they refer to as the Old Testament.
3. A tangible proof or tribute.
   The ancient aqueducts are a testament to the great engineering skill of the Roman Empire.
4. A credo, expression of conviction
   The prime minister's speech was a glowing testament to the cabinet's undying commitment to the royal cause.
   
   testament - Wiktionary
   
   I'll just stick with TaNaK. Thanx.
   
   
   

 

[HARK!]

Did you notice that "the Book of Divisions" is not called Torah here? But that God's instructions/Law are Torah.

Have you read the Book of Jubilees? It dovetails with Genesis. Genesis is Torah. YHWH's times are Torah.



(4Q266, fr. 8 i, 6-9).
(For God made) XVI a Covenant with you and all Israel; therefore a
man shall bind himself by oath to return to the Law of Moses (TORAH), for in it all
things are strictly defined.
As for the exact determination of their times to which Israel turns a
blind eye, behold it is strictly defined in the Book of the Divisions of
the Times into their Jubilees and Weeks. And on the day that a man
swears to return to the Law of Moses (TORAH)

Here is the rest of this fragment:


the Angel of Persecution shall
cease to follow him provided that he fulfils his word: for this reason
Abraham circumcised himself on the day that he knew.
And concerning the saying, You shall keep your vow by fulfilling it
(Deut. xxiii, 24), let no man, even at the price of death, annul any
binding oath by which he has sworn to keep a commandment of the
Law.
But even at the price of death, a man shall fulfil no vow by which he
has sworn to depart from the Law.

 

[Dkh587]

Why not?

I just don’t see where any prophet or apostle gave it credibility in terms of authority or it being classified as scripture.

 

[DamianWarS]

Where did Luke get this? It's not in the Pentateuch.:

(CLV) Ac 7:30
"And, at the completion of forty years, a messenger was seen by him in the wilderness of mount Sinai, in the flame of a thorn bush fire.


It can be explained with Jubilees.

JUBILEES 48
Mosheh returns from Midian to Egypt
1 And in the sixth year of the third week of the forty-ninth jubilee you did depart and dwell (in [2372 A.M.] the land of Midian, five weeks and one year. And you did return into Egypt in the second week in the second year in the fiftieth jubilee.
2 And you yourself know what He spoke to you on [2410 A.M.] Mount Sinai, and what prince Mastema desired to do with you when you were returning into Egypt.

Don't confuse this passage with Moses wandering the desert for 40 years. He killed an Egyptian and fled to Midian for 40 years, before he came to the burning bush, before returning to Egypt.


Where did he get this?:

(CLV) Ac 7:53
who got the law for a mandate of messengers and do not maintain it!"

Again, not in the Pentateuch. Here it is:

Jubilees 1

27 And He said to the malak of the presence: Write for Mosheh from the beginning of creation till My sanctuary has been built among them for all eternity.

13 And I will hide My face from them, and I will deliver them into the hand of the Gentiles for captivity, and for a prey, and for devouring, and I will remove them from the midst of the land, and I will scatter them amongst the Gentiles.

14 And they will forget all My Torah and all My commandments and all My judgments, and will go astray as to new months, and Shabbats, and festivals, and jubilees, and ordinances.

Luke says he's quoting "what is written in the book of the prophets" he doesn't say Torah so why are you saying he did? To be honest I'm confused about what the goal of the OP is, are you trying to say it was wrong of Luke to quote outside of the Torah, suggesting this was a later addition to the text or perhaps that Jubilees should be included in the canon? my response with the passage in question is "so what. why does Luke have to quote only the Torah" but I'm getting the impression that it does matter to you... I'm just not sure why.

 

[James Honigman]

Where did Luke get this? It's not in the Pentateuch.:

(CLV) Ac 7:30
"And, at the completion of forty years, a messenger was seen by him in the wilderness of mount Sinai, in the flame of a thorn bush fire.


It can be explained with Jubilees.

JUBILEES 48
Mosheh returns from Midian to Egypt
1 And in the sixth year of the third week of the forty-ninth jubilee you did depart and dwell (in [2372 A.M.] the land of Midian, five weeks and one year. And you did return into Egypt in the second week in the second year in the fiftieth jubilee.
2 And you yourself know what He spoke to you on [2410 A.M.] Mount Sinai, and what prince Mastema desired to do with you when you were returning into Egypt.

Don't confuse this passage with Moses wandering the desert for 40 years. He killed an Egyptian and fled to Midian for 40 years, before he came to the burning bush, before returning to Egypt.


Where did he get this?:

(CLV) Ac 7:53
who got the law for a mandate of messengers and do not maintain it!"

Again, not in the Pentateuch. Here it is:

Jubilees 1

27 And He said to the malak of the presence: Write for Mosheh from the beginning of creation till My sanctuary has been built among them for all eternity.

13 And I will hide My face from them, and I will deliver them into the hand of the Gentiles for captivity, and for a prey, and for devouring, and I will remove them from the midst of the land, and I will scatter them amongst the Gentiles.

14 And they will forget all My Torah and all My commandments and all My judgments, and will go astray as to new months, and Shabbats, and festivals, and jubilees, and ordinances.

Hi. It has been roughly 3,500 years since the sanctuary was last cleansed, that is, 70 jubilee years ago. Just something for everyone to think about.

 

[Bruce Leiter]

Where did Luke get this? It's not in the Pentateuch.:

(CLV) Ac 7:30
"And, at the completion of forty years, a messenger was seen by him in the wilderness of mount Sinai, in the flame of a thorn bush fire.


It can be explained with Jubilees.

JUBILEES 48
Mosheh returns from Midian to Egypt
1 And in the sixth year of the third week of the forty-ninth jubilee you did depart and dwell (in [2372 A.M.] the land of Midian, five weeks and one year. And you did return into Egypt in the second week in the second year in the fiftieth jubilee.
2 And you yourself know what He spoke to you on [2410 A.M.] Mount Sinai, and what prince Mastema desired to do with you when you were returning into Egypt.

Don't confuse this passage with Moses wandering the desert for 40 years. He killed an Egyptian and fled to Midian for 40 years, before he came to the burning bush, before returning to Egypt.


Where did he get this?:

(CLV) Ac 7:53
who got the law for a mandate of messengers and do not maintain it!"

Again, not in the Pentateuch. Here it is:

Jubilees 1

27 And He said to the malak of the presence: Write for Mosheh from the beginning of creation till My sanctuary has been built among them for all eternity.

13 And I will hide My face from them, and I will deliver them into the hand of the Gentiles for captivity, and for a prey, and for devouring, and I will remove them from the midst of the land, and I will scatter them amongst the Gentiles.

14 And they will forget all My Torah and all My commandments and all My judgments, and will go astray as to new months, and Shabbats, and festivals, and jubilees, and ordinances.

Who is speaking in Acts 7? The deacon Stephen gives a long sermon challenging the religious leaders for their trust in the law or Torah and the temple, not in the God of those objects. That's why they stoned him to death just as they crucified Jesus. Dr. Luke quotes Stephen, first of all, in verse 30, as saying that after 40 years in Midian, Moses saw the unburnable burning bush on the hillside and heard the voice of the angel of the LORD, who commissioned him to go back to Egypt and deliver Israel from their slavery.

Therefore, Jubilees 48 is wrong. Again, in verse 53, Stephen accuses them of not maintaining the law, which they outwardly professed to keep. This accusation got them really steamed. The "messengers" in both passages refer to angels. Many Bible interpreters including me think that the "angel of the Lord" in the Old Testament is really the Second Person of God later to join humanity as Jesus (Yahshua is Hebrew; Jesus is English).

Jubilees 1 is referring to a different time from Stephen's because the people were returned by King Cyrus to Palestine so that Jesus could be born in Bethlehem. If I were you, I would find Greek and Hebrew Bibles and different translations. Also, this comparison shows that you can't depend on Jubilees or the other apocryphal books. God the Holy Spirit guided the early church to the inspired books. That's why I stick with them.

 

[Ronit]

Where did Luke get this? It's not in the Pentateuch.:

(CLV) Ac 7:30
"And, at the completion of forty years, a messenger was seen by him in the wilderness of mount Sinai, in the flame of a thorn bush fire.


It can be explained with Jubilees.

JUBILEES 48
Mosheh returns from Midian to Egypt
1 And in the sixth year of the third week of the forty-ninth jubilee you did depart and dwell (in [2372 A.M.] the land of Midian, five weeks and one year. And you did return into Egypt in the second week in the second year in the fiftieth jubilee.
2 And you yourself know what He spoke to you on [2410 A.M.] Mount Sinai, and what prince Mastema desired to do with you when you were returning into Egypt.

Don't confuse this passage with Moses wandering the desert for 40 years. He killed an Egyptian and fled to Midian for 40 years, before he came to the burning bush, before returning to Egypt.


Where did he get this?:

(CLV) Ac 7:53
who got the law for a mandate of messengers and do not maintain it!"

Again, not in the Pentateuch. Here it is:

Jubilees 1

27 And He said to the malak of the presence: Write for Mosheh from the beginning of creation till My sanctuary has been built among them for all eternity.

13 And I will hide My face from them, and I will deliver them into the hand of the Gentiles for captivity, and for a prey, and for devouring, and I will remove them from the midst of the land, and I will scatter them amongst the Gentiles.

14 And they will forget all My Torah and all My commandments and all My judgments, and will go astray as to new months, and Shabbats, and festivals, and jubilees, and ordinances.

 

[Ronit]

I wish that the book of Jubilees was included in our Bible

 

[HARK!]

I wish that the book of Jubilees was included in our Bible

Here's a good place to read it:

The Book Of Jubilees Chapter 1 - Yahweh's Scriptures

 

[HARK!]

Hi. It has been roughly 3,500 years since the sanctuary was last cleansed, that is, 70 jubilee years ago. Just something for everyone to think about.

That is something to think about.

 

[Ronit]

That is something to think about.

Thank You