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Featured Is it correct to say, "One aspect of the Bible is that it is like a rule book"?

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by Bible Highlighter, Dec 19, 2018.

  1. Gr8Grace

    Gr8Grace Well-Known Member

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    Jailer~~What must I do to be saved?

    Paul~~Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ.

    Jailer~~What must I do to be saved?

    Jason~~There is not enough free storage space on the internet to tell you the way.
     
  2. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    That is contradictory to say that. Any action taken towards God is a form of obedience. Especially if one is obeying a command of God. Believing in Jesus is a commandment (1 John 3:23). We are called to obey this command to be saved. We are also called to obey the command of repentance, too (See Acts of the Apostles 17:30). Jesus said to people to repent or they will perish (See Luke 13:3).
     
  3. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    That is where salvation starts. Believing in Jesus as one's Savior. When they learn more about their Savior, they are to also believe in the things that Jesus commanded them to do, too. Jesus said things like if you will enter into life, keep the commandments (Matthew 19:17). This is another aspect of part of Jesus that you have to believe in. This is the type of Jesus you have to believe and trust in. Believing in Jesus is more than just believing in His person alone for salvation but it is also believing in everything He taught, too. Otherwise we are making up our own version of Jesus. The teachings of Christ go hand in hand with who is as a person.
     
  4. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    This is not what we read what happened to those believers who did good works and yet they worked iniquity (sin). Jesus told certain believers to depart from him for they worked lawlessness or sin (iniquity) (See Matthew 7:23).
     
  5. Gr8Grace

    Gr8Grace Well-Known Member

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    Like I said. There is not enough free space on the internet for you to explain your version of salvation. It's more like evolution rather than salvation.
     
  6. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    What you teach and what they teach is really not all that different.
    You believe you can commit one grievous sin and still be saved and it takes lots of grievous sin to become unsaved. A believer must generally live a holy life to be a true believer. Many of them believe that, too. The difference? Some of them will just say that such a person who lives an excessive lifestyle of sin were never saved to begin with. Both of your teachings seek to justify sin on some level. You can both sin and still be saved. The heart of the problem is justifying sin under God's grace. However, salvation never really worked like that. We see in the Bible many examples of just one sin causing a separation between God and man.

    Adam and Eve were separated by one sin.
    Ananias and Sapphira were separated by one sin.
    Jesus warns that if a person speaks bad words against the Holy Ghost, it is a one time sin that can never be forgiven.
    Jesus said if a person looks upon a woman in lust, their whole body can be cast into hell fire. Jesus did not say that they had to do this many times in order to be in danger of hell fire.
    So yes. One sin can separate a person from God.
     
  7. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    You can insult, or you can explain the verses I put forth that refutes your belief.
     
  8. Tree of Life

    Tree of Life Hide The Pain

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    If you don't understand how to reconcile these two truths then you have not yet met the first wrung of Christianity.
     
  9. Gr8Grace

    Gr8Grace Well-Known Member

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    Nice try. Iniquity is anything done apart from THE faith and being filled with the Spirit and walking in the Spirit.
    Isaiah 64:6~~New American Standard Bible
    For all of us have become like one who is unclean, And all our righteous deeds are like a filthy garment; And all of us wither like a leaf, And our iniquities, like the wind, take us away.

    Matt 7:23 pretty much sums what you seem to be pushing.
     
  10. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    I don't believe any Eternal Security proponent is truly capable of obeying the Christian life. A person cannot speak against the faith by telling others they can sin and still be saved and yet overcome sin in their own life. The foundation is already destroyed. If a person's foundation is already founded upon immorality, then immorality is what will spread to the rest of the house.
     
  11. ToBeLoved

    ToBeLoved Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Jesus Christ says that He is the Only just and righteous judge.

    Should the Bible be amended to add your name with Jesus’? Comparable too God, huh
     
  12. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    If you were to keep reading in Isaiah 64, they are seeking forgiveness of their sins and they are not declaring, I will sin tomorrow and I know I am already forgiven of that. That is what you must force upon the text that is not there.

    Romans 3:10 and Romans 3:23 says a similar thing as Isaiah 64:6. No doubt you think Romans 3:10 and Romans 3:23 applies to the current present walk of a believer's life with GOD. If so, then what of the talk of before that a Christian can live holy? See the problem or contradiction in your belief?

    On top of that: If you believe Romans 3:10, and Romans 3:23 applies to the Christian's present walk with GOD (showing that they are always sinner), then you must also believe Romans 3:11 applies to the Christ's present walk with GOD, too. Lets read verse 11.

    "There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God." (Romans 3:11).

    So this verse must apply to the current present life of the Christian, too. It is a part of the context. So are you saying that Christians today do not have any understanding and they do not seek after God? This is the problem with your belief. It sets up contradictions in numerous places in the Bible.

    Oh, and again, Matthew 7:23 does not prove or support your belief. The believers in that scenario were not told to depart from Jesus because they did not trust in the finished sacrifice of Christ while ignoring their sin. Jesus said to depart from because they worked iniquity or sin.
     
  13. watchman 2

    watchman 2 Active Member

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    It's paradoxical, all God's deeper truths are paradoxical.

    When two people are fighting and one surrenders to the other is that an act of obedience? It's a last resort usually.

    And another point . If obedience to God's word is the key to recieving the Spirit of Christ, how would those who lived before the written word was available to the masses obey?

    The written word really wasn't available to all the Earth's inhabitants, or the spoken word either. But the Father could draw or call someone, and they could respond with a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender. That is what true saving Faith and faithing is, pistis and pisteuo, not obedience.

    You do know obedience is only worth anything if it's kept perfectly from the moment one is born till the moment one dies. ? If one commandment is broken, all have been broken . Even in thought, if you even think about breaking a command of God, you failed!

    That is why we need to be in Christ, and He in us. It's His obedience flowing through us because of His Spirit residing in us by Faith and faithing. By a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender.
     
  14. Gr8Grace

    Gr8Grace Well-Known Member

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    It's not an insult. It's the truth. Your plan of salvation can never be laid out in exact detail. It remains open ended and will forever be open ended.

    I have used basically 2 verses. Acts 16:30-31. And you haven't refuted anything, you just pit scripture against scripture.

    The verses you use describe what BELIEVERS/BORN-AGAIN CHRISTIANS/NEW CREATIONS Are commanded to do because they are saved. Not to be saved.
     
  15. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    Please use some Scriptures verses to convey what you are talking about.
     
  16. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    In the early church, they had the communicated Word of God in audible form and in some cases in written form (not entire Bible, but epistles, etc.).

    Here is an illustration or graphic I made not too long ago.

    [​IMG]
     
  17. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    This is a typical Calvinistic response. When a contradiction appears in their belief, they just leave it up to being a mystery (as if only they have the secret answer) instead of them speaking the truth to others openly. While I am not implying that you are a Mason, hiding the truth sounds like a tactic used by Masons. For why not tell the rest of us here this truth? Are you not hear to help and teach other believers?

    Are we not to feed the sheep as a part of loving Christ?
     
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2018
  18. Norbert L

    Norbert L Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I wouldn't disagree even to the point where people are blindly obedient to the Bible. Think of the Atheist who believes murder is wrong. It will benefit him as much as a Christian in this life. The issue I took was straying away from the OP. The reason for that is how common non-Christians view the Bible as solely a book of antiquated and out dated instructions.

    I'd like to at least see the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ be spoken with a greater understanding in society at large, rather than just a book of instructions for Christians only.
     
  19. Gr8Grace

    Gr8Grace Well-Known Member

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    The above makes about as much sense as a bowl of alphabet soup.

    They are not believers Jason. And Jesus Told them to depart from Him because he NEVER knew them.
    22“Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?’ 23“And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.’

    'on that day' is judgement day. All unbelievers are going to call Him Lord on that day. Because in their previous days they NEVER did the will of the Father.
    John 6:40~~New American Standard Bible
    "For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day."

    They worked evil/lawlessness in their'good' deeds for Him.
    Heb 11:6~~New American Standard Bible
    And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him.
     
  20. watchman 2

    watchman 2 Active Member

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    That's my point. So the Father was only able to call those who that was available to? No, the Father could call anyone on the planet and they could respond with saving Faith by a personal surrender to Him and a life inspired by such surrender . God's words are not the object of Faith and faithing, God Himself is!
     
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