Hal A Peno
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- Aug 3, 2017
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If not, why not, or if you think this is a ridiculous suggestion, what are your reasons? I am interested in hearing them.
In Daniel 7, the beasts coming out of the sea are kingdoms. But there are 4 notable kings to be associated with each of those kingdoms.Beasts are world empires in Daniel. Why would they be something different? Where does the grammar of Rev 17 say this?
Yes, I know... that was my point.I didn't compile the page, I forgot who did.
A million Sudanese were murdered in the Sudan between 97- 99. Over 5,000 villages and 15,000 churches were burned, all at the hands of Muslim's and it was hardly reported on. The average Christian has no clue about Islam and the atrocities they commit on a daily basis.
According to an apparently possible "preterist" interpretation of Revelations, swiftly summarized, the Christian conquering figure (Rev 19) was manifested physically in Christian emperor Constantine, the Millennium (Rev 20) was corporealized in the (admittedly shaky) unity of Medieval Christendom during the thousand-year Christian Byzantine empire, whose fall in 1453 AD ushered in the End Times (Rev 20:7-9) characterized, as Prophetically predicted, by a mass "apostasy" away from a united Church, down a slippery slope of Schism and "whatever thou willest" Protestantism, ultimately over the cliff off into secular "Leftist" Marxism.Why not? Because 99.9% of Revelations happened in the Apostles generation.
The "dragon" refers to the Devil who is called Satan. To speak as a "dragon" means that the Beast is not Satan, but is compared with the Devil.Also, do you feel that the US has begun to speak as a "dragon" ?
Glad to see we are on the same page and of the same mind. I just dug up some old files, I didn't edit it to update countries and kings...
FIVE ARE FALLEN....is a mistake, ARE is present, fallen is past!
The word ARE is a third person plural present indicative. This passage isn't a reflection of PAST world empires. It is a picture of a complete end-time entity. There are seven kings, "FIVE FALL" is the correct translation. That's how it's worded in the interlinear. Just like the four beast Daniel prophesy's about in Daniel 7, these kings are all present on earth at the same time. Take a look...
www.scripture4all.org/OnlineI...Tpdf/rev17.pdf
This is how it look in the interlinear...
...AND KINGS SEVEN ARE THE FIVE FALL AND THE ONE IS THE other NOT- as- yet CAME AND when-EVER he-MAY-BE-COMING FEW(briefly) him it-IS BINDING TO-REMAIN...
The word fallen doesn't mean to have died. It means to to descend from a higher place to a lower.
Kings that have already fallen from the current apostasy are...
Saddam Hussein-------------Iraq. Who I say could return as Nebuchadnezzars fulfillment of the 70 year prophecy "and when the 70 years are completed.", "the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.
11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition. Possible candidates...
Saddam Hussein---------------Iraq
Hosni Mubarak---------------Egypt
Moammar Gadhafi-----------Lybia
Ben Ali--------------------------Tunsinia
Ali Abdullah Saleh------------Yemen
These five have already fallen. I don't know if they are the 5 mentioned in Rev. 17.10.
Bashar Al-Assad--------------Syria...and one is. He's not going anywhere until Damascus is destroyed.
Ahmadinnejad------------------Iran
King Abdullah------------------Saudi Arabia
These are some if not most of the kings that are fallen in verse 10,
The 10 kings mentioned in verse 12 are probably people that already exist whether currently in power or not. Some possibilities are Abdullah Gul of Turkey, Amadinnejad of Iran, Hamid Karzai of Afghanistan, Talabani of Iraq, Asif Ali Zardari of Pakistan, Abdullah of Jordan, Mohamed Morsi,> Egypt, Mohammed Yusuf Magariaf >Yemen, Moncef Marzouki >Tunisia,...or any that replace these people. These countrys surround Israel. Other possibilities are the countries mentioned in Psalm 83. man of sin is the one that fell in the kings mentioned in verse 10 and the beast that was and is not and yet lives... the one who gets these kings of countries surrounding Israel to unite. This is the covenant with many. Israel isn't part of it other than being under the persecution of the Assyrian anti-christ.
There was a similar thread yesterday which I did not participate in. There is some overlapping powers and principalities between the Vatican and the US. Look at the Vatican and you wonder why they imported the largest Obelisk found in ancient Egypt and erected it there with a reflection pool and a domed building out front. If you dig into this you will see masonic Illuminati influences going way back. There is a documentary called the hidden faith of our founding fathers by Chris Pinto that is very good about looking way back and bringing the influences up to our current day that are shaping the NWO.If not, why not, or if you think this is a ridiculous suggestion, what are your reasons? I am interested in hearing them.
No IMO.If not, why not, or if you think this is a ridiculous suggestion, what are your reasons? I am interested in hearing them.
I know what you're saying and I don't accept it. It just doesn't set well with me that the 6 of the HEADS are sequencial and six are historic.
Those people are NOT in my camp. They change the words of the text fromPeople in your camp can't agree on this either. Some say Egypt is the first head, some say Assyria.
Again, you believe this because you believe in a global dictator a one world government and religion.
This world will never UNITE! The man of sin is said to enter in peaceably. Do you really think ONE or TWO men would somehow convince every government and religion on planet earth to unite under one mad with some sort of 10/7 alliance?? That's what causes WAR!
David Hocking is wrong. The beast has ten horns - not ten horns on a head. The beast in Daniel 7, has ten horns, the same ten horns as in Revelation.David Hocking says he believes the ten horns in Revelation 17 are likely all on one head. I disagree as thta would be such a significant enough of a difference that I believe John would have noticed and documented it. The heads, the horns, the harlot all represents end-time things. NOTHING in these visions are historical.
You are all mixed up. I am not the one who been saying anything about the heads being world empiresThe kingdoms of Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Medo-Persia, and Greece had fallen by John's time. Using them in a vision depicting the heads as sequencial ancient world empires makes no sense.
THE ONLY REASON WHY YOU'VE BEEN TAUGHT 6 OF THE HEADS ARE HISTORICAL WORLD EMPIRES IS BECAUSE INTERPRETERS BELIEVE THIS TO BE A WORLD EMPIRE!
For John to have a vision that prophesy's about of an end-time beast, only to have some of the elements of the beast be several thousands of years old, actually makes him a false prophet since a prophet cannot prophesy about kings (kingdoms not explicitly implied) that have already passed. The words ARE and FALL (not fallen or have fallen) indicates they are all end-time KINGS!
Two of those Julio-Claudian kings are mentioned by name in the gospels. Augustus Caesar in Luke 2:1 Tiberius in Luke 3:1,2Two words for that, PIPE DREAM. I just makes no sense that to explain an end-time empire John would use heads as Roman kings when ROME isn't mentioned in ONE verse of end-time prophecy, and the beast and harlot aren't Roman connected! You don't get it! Rome isn't found anywhere in prophecy YET YOU BELIEVE IT ANYWAY!
You need to stop saying Daniel is a false prophet - period. Jesus said Daniel the prophet. That's it. Daniel is a prophet. Not a false prophet.I'll stop with you calling Daniel a false prophet when you realize a prophet cannot prophesy about a kingdom rising that HAD RISEN 50 YEARS BEFORE! I'll stop when you people STOP coming up with interpretations that are so bad that an Atheist knows better and uses YOUR INTERPRETATION to DEBUNK Daniel and the bible! YOU DON"T CARE because, YOU'VE DEBUNKED YOURSELF!
If not, why not, or if you think this is a ridiculous suggestion, what are your reasons? I am interested in hearing them.
No. It is difficult to even read the US of A into the text anywhere, just as it is difficult to find the Church on earth as we know it, beyond the 7 letters. Now China aka the Kings of the East, on the other hand, that is a world power to be reckoned with that features strongly.If not, why not, or if you think this is a ridiculous suggestion, what are your reasons? I am interested in hearing them.
No, of course not. The Beast from the Sea are all Gentile Nations. The Land always refers to Israel, the Holy Land/Promised Land. The False Prophet exudes a strong hint at and Israeli person by the very name, False Prophet, hence it will be a Jew, there were no "Prophets" that were not Jewish !! So a False Prophet is a Jewish Man, he will be some kind of Rabbi it seems, or one that claims to be a Prophet of God, hence the False Moniker.If not, why not, or if you think this is a ridiculous suggestion, what are your reasons? I am interested in hearing them.
Sea of Gentiles, since the Land is always referring to the Holy Land and its peoples. We have to many people that make these things too complex, and over analyze.America is not the beast rising from the earth in Revelation 13.
The second beast that rises from the earth is Lucifer the Devil, our end time Antichrist. Lucifer is going to be allowed to appear as a man for the last 5 months prior to the second coming.
The first beast rises from the sea. But it's not really the sea. The sea is symbolic for many peoples and multitudes and nations and languages.
The second beast rises up from the earth, but it's not really the earth. The second beast does not have an earthly origin, it has a heavenly origin. The earth is a heavenly designated geological area that by default becomes a holy place. "Take off your sandals, for the ground where you are standing is holy".
And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
Lucifer was cast down into the earth, he and his angels will rise up out of the earth at the 5th trumpet and be allowed to manifest themselves in our realm for the last 5 months of the tribulation.
To the first beast he gives his power, his throne and great authority.
This is about something much bigger than the United States, or the Church of Rome.
Jacobs Troubles is the 70th Week.The great tribulation ends in the 6th seal. It will be time for the 7th trumpet.
Why does it have to be the second Rome? Did the first really die off?
Why not Judea in Israel. After all, Rome did destroy the great City of Jerusalem in ad70.
So land beast= Judea, where Satan's throne is... Sea Beast = Rome and rest of the Heathens