How the Wealthiest Americans Avoid Paying Their Taxes

[KCfromNC]

Our Tax System Explained in Beer - David R. Kamerschen, Ph.D. Professor of Economics

I guess someone who didn't understand what the wealth distribution of people in our country actually looks like might find this compelling.

 

[HARK!]

I guess someone who didn't understand what the wealth distribution of people in our country actually looks like might find this compelling.

I had a coworker/friend who defected from the Soviet Union.

I forgot what might have prompted this remark; but it seemed to come out of the blue.

One day he exclaimed, "I love America!"

I asked him why.

He said in the Soviet union, if everyone in the community has 5 cows per person, except one, who has 50 cows; then his neighbors will say, "look at him. He has 50 cows. We should kill 45 of his cows so that he will be like us."

My friend then said, "here in America, if someone has 5 cows; and his neighbor has 50 cows, he will say," how did he get 50 cows? If he can do it; I can do it.""

 

[wing2000]

My friend then said, "here in America, if someone has 5 cows; and his neighbor has 50 cows, he will say," how did he get 50 cows? If he can do it; I can do it.""

And today: The 100 cow family farm can not longer compete with the corporation owned 5,000 cow farm.

It's very convenient to have Amazon deliver that made in china $10 dollar hammer within 2 hours. But what price have we paid for that convenience?
- the factory that once made hammers in America
- the well paying manufacturing job
- the distribution network from the factory to the neighborhood hardware store
- the loss of that local store

But hey, that hammer doesn't cost $50 dollars and I can make it appear on my doorstep within hours...

 

[HARK!]

And today: The 100 cow family farm can not longer compete with the corporation owned 5,000 cow farm.

It's very convenient to have Amazon deliver that made in china $10 dollar hammer within 2 hours. But what price have we paid for that convenience?
- the factory that once made hammers in America
- the well paying manufacturing job
- the distribution network from the factory to the neighborhood hardware store
- the loss of that local store

But hey, that hammer doesn't cost $50 dollars and I can make it appear on my doorstep within hours...

America used to be the world's biggest exporter. We manufactured high quality products that were in high demand worldwide.

We broke down those pesky tariffs, designed to generate revenue to run the Federal government. We tossed the Constitution out the window, and started taxing individuals. Then we sent our dirty polluting industry overseas. Now instead of taking jobs as craftsmen, we can take jobs as delivery boys. It doesn't pay as well; but it doesn't cost as much to buy a hammer made out of chinesium alloy. (Don't forget to wear eye protection. Hammer may shatter.)

It's a Green Progressive paradise.

 

[Belk]

America used to be the world's biggest exporter. We manufactured high quality products that were in high demand worldwide.

We broke down those pesky tariffs, designed to generate revenue to run the Federal government. We tossed the Constitution out the window, and started taxing individuals. Then we sent our dirty polluting industry overseas. Now instead of taking jobs as craftsmen, we can take jobs as delivery boys. It doesn't pay as well; but it doesn't cost as much to buy a hammer made out of chinesium alloy. (Don't forget to wear eye protection. Hammer may shatter.)

It's a Green Progressive paradise.

So you believe we should return to a pre industrial revolution society?

 

[mark46]

And today: The 100 cow family farm can not longer compete with the corporation owned 5,000 cow farm.

It's very convenient to have Amazon deliver that made in china $10 dollar hammer within 2 hours. But what price have we paid for that convenience?
- the factory that once made hammers in America
- the well paying manufacturing job
- the distribution network from the factory to the neighborhood hardware store
- the loss of that local store

But hey, that hammer doesn't cost $50 dollars and I can make it appear on my doorstep within hours...

To better understand, you think that we should WANT to go to the local high priced hardware store rather than pay $10 and have the same quality product delivered within a day.
=====================================
I strongly, strongly disagree. That just isn't how our system of regulated capitalism has given us the best system in the world. Having US workers inefficiently make products for five times the price is just not the answer to whatever problem that you are positing. We need to provide more training for our workers so that they can produce products better and more cheaply in the US. We need higher paid jobs, sure, but only if those jobs produce more. Paying our workers more to produce less is the road to a declining economy.

How sad is your view of the American worker! You think that they can't compete. That is just plain nonsense. The US produces plenty of quality products, including, for example automobiles.

We need to stop the tariffs and the protectionism that many Democrats seem fine in keeping as a welcome legacy of the Trump administration. Instead, we need to trade more, produce more, and give our workers the skills and tools to continue to be the best workers in the world.

 

[HARK!]

So you believe we should return to a pre industrial revolution society?

How would that restore high paying industrial jobs, and a prosperous middle class in America?

 

[morningstar2651]

I haven't seen the article mentioned in this declaration. Do you have a link?

It's the link you posted earlier. He didn't write that.

Our Tax System Explained in Beer - David R. Kamerschen, Ph.D. Professor of Economics

 

[HARK!]

It's the link you posted earlier. He didn't write that.

Maybe you didn't notice that what I linked has a different title than the title you referenced.

 

[morningstar2651]

And today: The 100 cow family farm can not longer compete with the corporation owned 5,000 cow farm.

It's very convenient to have Amazon deliver that made in china $10 dollar hammer within 2 hours. But what price have we paid for that convenience?
- the factory that once made hammers in America
- the well paying manufacturing job
- the distribution network from the factory to the neighborhood hardware store
- the loss of that local store

But hey, that hammer doesn't cost $50 dollars and I can make it appear on my doorstep within hours...

 

[Belk]

How would that restore high paying industrial jobs, and a prosperous middle class in America?

It wouldn't. However, your claims were about a time prior to the income tax and when Americans were craftsman so that would put it around 1890 - 1915 or so, yes?

 

[morningstar2651]

Maybe you didn't notice that what I linked has a different title than the title you referenced.

It's the same content. The page you link to even points out that he didn't write it.

It's a google search to verify this stuff.

How Taxes Work

 

[Trogdor the Burninator]

It's a bit of a stretch to call that the 'true' tax rate.

We don't (not yet, anyway) tax wealth. Only income.

Agreed. Unfortunately this article confuses wealth with income. Taxing wealth is much harder than taxing income because wealth such as the value of a property or share portfolio can fluctuate from day-to-day.

That said, there are certainly changes that could be made to more fairly distribute taxation and wealth without unduly impacting people's living standards. Limiting the amount that can be deducted from base income would be a start.

 

[Ken-1122]

America used to be the world's biggest exporter. We manufactured high quality products that were in high demand worldwide.

After WW-II Europe an Asia was completely destroyed, and the USA was the only country open for business. It took about 25-30 years for the rest of the world to recover, so now we have to compete with all the other countries in the world.

 

[mark46]

After WW-II Europe an Asia was completely destroyed, and the USA was the only country open for business. It took about 25-30 years for the rest of the world to recover, so now we have to compete with all the other countries in the world.

Yes, it took 25-30 years for the world to recover (let's say 30). The brings us to 1975. So, we have been competing with the rest of the world for over 45 years. And we've done very well.

We can argue about how we treat the poor, the services that every citizen has a right to, and whether we are as happy as the rest of the world. But, there is little doubt that our standard of living as a country is impressive compared to the rest of the world. Of course, much depends on which part of the society that you are comparing.

That being said, I agree that our social safety net should be greatly increased. Our median income is not as high as many others. Our average wealth is higher than any country but Switzerland.

List of countries by wealth per adult - Wikipedia

 

[EmmaCat]

I'm not terribly concerned about who pays what in taxes. We pay our fair share.

What bothers me is where our tax dollars go. America doesn't have an income problem, it has a spending problem.

 

[morningstar2651]

I'm not terribly concerned about who pays what in taxes. We pay our fair share.

What bothers me is where our tax dollars go. America doesn't have an income problem, it has a spending problem.

What should we cut? Military? Benefits for veterans? Medicare? Social Security?

 

[EmmaCat]

What should we cut? Military? Benefits for veterans? Medicare? Social Security?

Those have already been cut. Look at what we're spending taxes on.

 

[morningstar2651]

Yes, it took 25-30 years for the world to recover (let's say 30). The brings us to 1975. So, we have been competing with the rest of the world for over 45 years. And we've done very well.

We can argue about how we treat the poor, the services that every citizen has a right to, and whether we are as happy as the rest of the world. But, there is little doubt that our standard of living as a country is impressive compared to the rest of the world. Of course, much depends on which part of the society that you are comparing.

That being said, I agree that our social safety net should be greatly increased. Our median income is not as high as many others. Our average wealth is higher than any country but Switzerland.

List of countries by wealth per adult - Wikipedia

Our average wealth appears to be 22nd in the world from the link you posted...or did you mean the mean?

The median appears to be the much more accurate measure of what's realistic for the average American. I don't know many people that have anywhere near the mean.

 

[morningstar2651]

Those have already been cut. Look at what we're spending taxes on.

They got cut over the last 4 years? By the people who promised not to cut them!?