Flat Earth

[ewq1938]

The ancients did not know that.

You said that many times yet you want to agree with them about what you interpret to be their understanding of the shape of the Earth?

I think they were incredibly insightful about the Atmosphere and where water comes from and the generic circular shape of the Earth. Not a flat circle but a circle due to the roundness which is correct.

 

[d taylor]

they consider Christians crazy (or misguided at least)


talk of flat earth is not helping…

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Christianity is its own worst antagonist and has been rendered very ineffective. I am sure a strategy of satan the list is long of the many areas that have made their home in christianity's beliefs that are not base in a Biblical foundation. The globe earth is just one of these beliefs.

 

[essentialsaltes]

You said that many times yet you want to agree with them about what you interpret to be their understanding of the shape of the Earth?

It's not just my interpretation. It's the interpretation of the source you specifically quoted. It's the interpretation of expert historians.

And he explains that when he says, "The globular form of the earth was then unknown;

[your emphasis] They didn't know the earth was spherical. It was then unknown.

I think they were incredibly insightful about the Atmosphere and where water comes from

They did know about rain. And the sky. Not so sure about 'atmosphere'.

 

[ewq1938]

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Christianity is its own worst antagonist and has been rendered very ineffective. I am sure a strategy of satan the list is long of the many areas that have made their home in christianity's beliefs that are not base in a Biblical foundation. The globe earth is just one of these beliefs.

The globe earth is not satanic. It's the real shape of the Earth.

 

[d taylor]

The globe earth is not satanic. It's the real shape of the Earth.

Lets see has it been a flat stationary earth with a sun, moon and stars placed in the raqia above the earth, to give light on the earth. With these lights close to earth and not thousand, millions to billions of miles/light years away. To give birth to evolution.

Or has it been a globe earth existing in an endless outer space with all the stated millions, billions, trillions of miles/light years. That has been the birth of evolution. Because that is what evolution requires to exist. An outer space and million, billions, etc.. of miles/light years for the need space and time for this satanic deception.

So if a christian believes in the globe earth they may as well add evolution to their beliefs. As evolution goes with a globe earth and outer space, like miracles go with The Messiah.

 

[JohnEmmett]

So if a christian believes in the globe earth they may as well add evolution to their beliefs.

No… they're different ideas

Earth is observed from space (admit it)

Evolution seems true…

I think humanity is more ancient

~

 

[ewq1938]

Lets see has it been a flat stationary earth with a sun, moon and stars placed in the raqia above the earth, to give light on the earth. With these lights close to earth and not thousand, millions to billions of miles/light years away. To give birth to evolution.

Or has it been a globe earth existing in an endless outer space with all the stated millions, billions, trillions of miles/light years. That has been the birth of evolution. Because that is what evolution requires to exist.

Evolution has NOTHING to do with the shape of the Earth.

 

[Job 33:6]

We don't have to be "hyper-literal". We just need to think about what the ancient authors would have known and believed. To understand what they wrote, we have to put ourselves in their shoes.



The ancients did not have crafts in space.



The ancients did not know that.



The ancients had no way of knowing they were deceived by this appearance.



The ancients did not know that. The ancients did not know what 'space' was.



The ancients did not know that. The ancients did not know what 'space' was. The ancients had never been to space.

I think the problem is not that my reading is hyper-literal, but that your reading is anachronistic. The text was written by people who did not have the advantage of your knowledge. When they talk about rain falling through windows, you immediately think, "Oh, what a splendid metaphor! Of course we really know that..."

But the people who wrote it did not know that.

If I could like this post 100 times, I would.

 

[JohnEmmett]

The ancients were wondrous and subtle. They were too deep to know. And because of this, all we can do is describe their conduct. They were careful, as someone crossing an iced-over stream. Alert as a warrior. Polite and quiet as a guest. Yielding, like ice about to break up. Authentic, they were like uncut wood. Empty as a valley. Mysterious, like deep water.

-Laozi

 

[Job 33:6]

Some literalist or conservative Christians teach that the Bible lacks error in every way in all matters: chronology, history, biology, sociology, psychology, politics, physics, math, art, and so on.[17] Other Christians believe that the scriptures are always right (do not err) only in fulfilling their primary purpose: revealing God, God's vision, God's purposes, and God's good news to humanity.[18]

Since God speaks in Sacred Scripture through men in human fashion, the interpreter of Sacred Scripture, in order to see clearly what God wanted to communicate to us, should carefully investigate what meaning the sacred writers really intended, and what God wanted to manifest by means of their words."

From wiki.
Biblical inerrancy - Wikipedia

For @ewq1938, the question is, why must scripture be accurate in all matters, physics, art, biology, astronomy etc. Rather than simply just being accurate in other ways such as revealing God, God's vision and purpose and God's good news?

 

[ewq1938]

For @ewq1938, the question is, why must scripture be accurate in all matters, physics, art, biology, astronomy etc. Rather than simply just being accurate in other ways such as revealing God, God's vision and purpose and God's good news?

I was the first to introduce that very thought:

I don't think that is accurate language. God used the only language that people could understand. He was not trying to give detailed information. The bible is not a technical instruction manual.

 

[Job 33:6]

I was the first to introduce that very thought:

And yet, your position proposes that the authors of Genesis did in fact know modern scientific information, such as the idea that the earth is spherical, does it not? That these ancient people were accurate in their minds, in all modern scientific matters?

 

[ewq1938]

And yet, your position proposes that the authors of Genesis did in fact know modern scientific information, such as the idea that the earth is spherical, does it not?

No. They knew the Earth was a circle, which it is but what they may not have known is the circular aspect of the Earth was spherical. To know that either God would have to reveal it to them or they would have to be able to fly around the world.

That these ancient people were accurate in their minds, in all modern scientific matters?

All scientific matters? That doesn't need an answer.

 

[Job 33:6]

No. They knew the Earth was a circle, which it is but what they may not have known is the circular aspect of the Earth was spherical. To know that either God would have to reveal it to them or they would have to be able to fly around the world.

All scientific matters? That doesn't need an answer.

Do you think it's possible that they could have simply believed that the earth was fully a circle with no spherical aspect to it?

If they hypothetically didn't know of the Earth's spherical properties, or stars, moon, sun etc. Then is there any reason that they couldn't simply have believed that these objects did not have spherical shapes?

 

[d taylor]

Evolution has NOTHING to do with the shape of the Earth.

Yes it does, it has everything to do with evolution.

 

[JohnEmmett]

Yes it does, it has everything to do with evolution.

If you say so

 

[d taylor]

No… they're different ideas

Earth is observed from space (admit it)

Evolution seems true…

I think humanity is more ancient

~

No they are not, a globe earth supports evolution. Just like fire needs fuel to burn, evolution needs a creation to exist in.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Yes it does, it has everything to do with evolution.

On the Origin of Species is a very long book that presents a detailed argument based on a multitude of facts. I defy you to present a passage in it that relies on the shape of the earth.

 

[ewq1938]

Do you think it's possible that they could have simply believed that the earth was fully a circle with no spherical aspect to it?

No way to know. They didn't use the Hebrew words that mean a ball or sphere but they also did not say the circle was flat. Anyways, what they wrote isn't evidence for a flat Earth. We know far more about the Earth than they did and it isn't flat. That only comes from misinterpretations of various things they did write.

 

[JohnEmmett]

No they are not, a globe earth supports evolution. Just like fire needs fuel to burn, evolution needs a creation to exist in.

evolution under estimates the antiquity of humanity

your holy text… as well