To reiterate again - no one here has or ever would approve of sin in their life after receiving Christ initially.
First, I have talked with Christians in person and online who said they can sin as much as they want and it would not effect their salvation. One man admitted to me that he could mow down a crowd with a sub machine gun and he would still be saved during the process of doing so. Granted, he had no intention of doing so or anything. He just said he would be saved even if he did that.
Second, when you say that a believer will never overcome serious sin in this life when the Bible teaches that it is possible to do so, you are going against what the Scriptures say. It sets a standard of morality that you are going against. Yes, God's grace is there for people who do sin (even later in their faith), but believers do not expect that they are going to sin as it is a matter of fact or fate. This is approval of sin because it is having a mind set that one will sin at some point in the future when the Bible says that this does not have to be this way for us at all.
"There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God
is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear
it." (1 Corinthians 10:13).
You said:
I believe that you and I will both do our best to refrain from sin and that we will both confess and receive forgiveness if we fail.
Do our best to refrain from sin is not the same as God Word's telling you that we as believers can overcome sin (1 Peter 4:1-2, 2 Corinthians 7:1, Galatians 5:24, Ephesians 4:17-27, Romans 6:14, Romans 6:19, Romans 6:22).
You said:
I'm assuming we'll both try our utmost to work out our salvation in all of it's various portions throughout our lives.
I thought you don't believe in working out your salvation? I thought you believe that salvation is in having a belief alone on Jesus as your Savior and that no works are involved?
You said:
The question remains in my mind whether your striving will count as trying to earn the salvation which the Lord paid such a great price for - rather than as faith in what He has done.
As I told you before. I believe Christ saves a person both initially (without works) and ultimately in regards to salvation through faith. This is Justification or the foundation of our faith. But it is not at the exclusion of good works that then come immediately after a person accepts Christ as their Savior. Belief in Jesus as one's Savior is not supposed to stop (even though some have later turned away from Jesus after accepting Him). But in addition to God's saving grace, the Scriptures also teach that Sanctification is the next step or stage in the salvation process. It is about getting rid of sin out of your life. It is about making good on the profession to Jesus that you are sorry about your sins and that you would do them no more. Jesus not only came to forgive us of our past sins, but He came to help us to overcome our sins. 1 John 3:8 says that Christ was manifested to destroy the works of the devil. If a believer commits serious sin again and does not repent of it (followed by the fruits of repentance - which is forsaking their sin), then they need to get their heart right with the Lord. They need to rededicate their life to Christ. They need to make a real committment. Jesus says pick up your cross, deny yourself, and come follow me. For he that shall save his life shall lose it, and he that shall lose his life for Christ's sake will save it. Sanctification is done when somebody is sold out to Christ. It is surrendering to Christ and allow Him to do the good work through you. Actually three persons of the Godhead or the Trinity work through the believer. If this is not the case, then a person is going against the will of God. Sanctification is supposed to compliment Justification. Why? Because Sanctification is a part of living out one's faith and we are saved by grace through faith. By faith, Noah built an Ark. If Noah did not build the Ark, he and his family would have perished along with everyone else. If he had just a belief alone, and he refused to obey God, that type of faith would not have saved him.
You said:
I may well be wrong about the Lord keeping me saved forever. But I don't see any warnings against my believing that He will being,
"
Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; but exhort one another daily, while it is called 'Today',
lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin." (
Hebrews 3:12-13)
"Therefore we must give the more earnest heed to the things we have heard, lest we drift away. For if the word spoken through angels proved steadfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just reward,
how shall we escape if we neglect so great a salvation? ..." (
Hebrews 2:1-3).
"Now all these things happened to them as examples, and they were written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the ages have come.
Therefore, let him who thinks he stands, take heed lest he fall." (
I Corinthians 10:11-12).
"Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness,
if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off." (Romans 11:22).
9 "
Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God?
Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God." (1 Corinthians 6:9-10).
"And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you:
depart from me, ye that work iniquity." (Matthew 7:23).
26 "And
every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell:
and great was the fall of it." (Matthew 7:26-27).
"And
cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." (Matthew 25:30).
41 "Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
45 Then shall he answer them, saying,
Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.
46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal."
(Matthew 25:41-46).
You said:
as it were, "another gospel".
Well, I showed you verses already that the gospel is tied to righteous actions or living out our faith. You obviously did not look at them closely enough. In addition, Mark 16:15-16 Jesus says to preach the gospel as a part of the great commission. Yet, in Matthew 28:19-20, Jesus tells the disciples to do the following as a part of the great commission.
19 "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway,
even unto the end of the world. Amen." (Matthew 28:19-20).
Did you catch verse 20? It says that the disciples are to teach others to observe all things that He had commanded them.
So it is more than telling others about the gospel.
In fact, Scripture says there are those who OBEY
not the gospel (2 Thessalonians 1:8) (1 Peter 4:17).
How exactly do you obey the gospel?
You said:
However I cannot say the same for your belief system.
Just as you see strong warnings about not living an obedient life before the Lord -- I see strong warnings about a person trying to be justified before the Lord by doing so.
You are ignoring the context that the word "Law" is in reference to the Law of Moses.
Paul said in Romans 3:1, what profit is there in circumcision? Paul says in Galatians 5:2 that if you seek to be circumcisied, Christ shall profit you nothing. Circumcision was of the Old Law and not the New Law (i.e. the commands given to us in the New Testament). Paul never condemned God's Eternal Moral Laws (that existed even before the written Law of Moses). Paul says that loving your neighbor fulfills the moral law (Romans 13:8-10). In fact, Paul says in 1 Timothy 6:3-4 that if a man speaks contrary to the words of Jesus Christ and the doctrine of Godliness, he is proud and he knows nothing.
James says God resists the proud and gives grace to the humble (James 4:6).
You are also ignoring the fact that faith without works is dead (James 2:17). True faith always leads to right action. You are ignoring the fact that we are justified by works (James 2:24).
You said:
It's undoubtedly not the best way to put it. But, seriously, I do wish for a good end for you and your view of the salvation process.
Why would you wish me a good end for my view of the salvation process if you disagree with it? Did you forget what Galatians 1:8 says?
Anyways, I believe I am preaching the true and complete gospel (that most are confused about today). Many today do not realize that the gospel is tied to sanctification (i.e. holy living) (See Ephesians 5:28-30 and Titus 2:14).
). It's just a recognition for most of us that we probably will.
