Conversions to Orthodoxy

Aria said:

Even the British spelling can drive one batty.

Practising, for example

I find myself getting royally confused over how to spell words once I read a British publication.

Are the Harry Potter books published in American or British English or both?

I don't have the time to read novels since I'm preparing for the GRE and getting ready for the Master's program.

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It is we who speak the Queen's English who can spell! Blame Mr Webster and his "American Shorthand" for the confusion.
Come on, let's speak to Erwin. We must be able to sort some kind of trans-Atlantic solution out.

Marjorie said:

The Harry Potter books have American and English editions... a lot of the English slang is kept in American editions but some things that would be completely unintelligible to Americans are changed.

In IC XC,
Marjorie

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I've noticed a few "britishisms" in HP. That's where I came across "hosepipe" last night. There are some others I can't think of right now.

Mary

Mary of Bethany said:

I've noticed a few "britishisms" in HP. That's where I came across "hosepipe" last night. There are some others I can't think of right now.

Mary

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There's practise instead of practice.

And honour instead of honor.

When we say put the bill on the table - we mean we are going to discuss it.

When the British table a bill - discussion is closed.

Mary of Bethany said:

Wireless = radio

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Yes, but it's very old fashioned. It's the sort of thing you'll hear people who lived through WWII say.

James

Wireless = radio

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jmbejdl said:

Yes, but it's very old fashioned. It's the sort of thing you'll hear people who lived through WWII say.
James

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Yes, makes one think of the old crystal set, with 'cats whisker' antenae and old headphones.

Xpycoctomos said:

I was told that to decide the location of the Church or Monastery he would shoot out an arrow and wherever it landed would be the site of the next location of the holy place. Is this true or just folklore?

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This is true. He chose the rough area (usually under the guidance of St. Daniel) went to the top of nearest hill and shot an arrow to let God decide the precise spot. At Putna it stuck into a tree and they still have a slice of wood with the arrow hole in it in the monastery museum.

Xpycoctomos said:

Cool. All I knew was that he was the most important national hero and Saint of Romania (of course I did stay in Suceava for half the time and then just a little ways a way in Iasi so perhaps the excitement about this Saint is more pronounced there. I actually saw where he was buried.

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Ah, so you've been to both Suceava and Putna? Did you see Daniil Sihastru's cell? That's my favourite place in the whole world. You're probably right that both of these saints are more venerated in Moldova than elsewhere (2nd July in Putna is amazing - that's his feast day) but I've seen icons of him in the south, too, and the 500th anniversary of his death last year was a massive national event.

Xpycoctomos said:

I hadn't realized that he was so recently glorified. The people must have been treating him like a saint for generations though, it would seem. But I don't know. Was this so?

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Yes, that's right. It followed the usual Orthodox way of the people venerating him pretty much from the time of his death onwards and the Church taking a very long time to recognise him officially. There's actually a very old icon of him that was painted well before he was officially glorified.

Xpycoctomos said:

You could always name the baby Danielle or Daniela if it's a girl.

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Well, we could, but we won't (and if it's a boy it will be Daniil as I don't really care for the sound of Daniel in English). If the next child is a daughter she'll be named Sabina-Ioana. We'd decided that before my son was born. Sabina is my wife's grandmother's name and we both like Ioana. St. Sabina ought to be perfectly Orthodox because she's a fourth century martyr, but she doesn't seem to appear in any Orthodox calendars, so her patron saint would probable be Ioana (Joannah the Myrrh-bearer).

Hope that helps.

James

Yiannis550,

It just occurred to me that what you heard about 'Count Dracula' is true of Vlad Dracul, though not his grandson Vlad Tepes. I was probably a little over-hasty in my reply because 'Count Dracula' was based on Hungarian stories of Vlad Tepes even though the name is clearly derived from Vlad Dracul. I imagine that what you heard about the staunch Orthodoxy of 'Dracula' was actually a reference to the grandfather rather than the grandson.

James

James,

I stayed with the family of a friend in Suceava and the Family of another friend in Iasi. We also took a day and went around what SEEMED to be the nothern part of Romania (though surely not the entire northern part by any means) and saw a bunch of monasteries. It was great. I don't remember the names of them except for going to Putna. We stayed in the village there with my friend's boyfriend's uncle (if that isn't generous! housing some american that isn't your friend, nor your nephews, but your nephew's girlfriend's! but they treated me like a friend) and it was fantastic. They had electricity but no running water (note to others, this is what Romania is like on the countryside, but in the city everyone has running water... they just might shut the hot water off from time to time or day to day... but the water still runs lol). There were goats and cows and chickens everywhere (in the streets etc). It was quite an experience. But, I was actually able to stay on the Visitor grounds of the Monastery at Putna for a couple days. They were so hospitable there, the grounds keeper searched me down and gave me an icon of a very important monk of theirs whose name i still have to research. I will scan it another day and see if y'all know who he is. He's deceased ad I saw his grave. I just have a bad memory with names. That grounds keeper (doesn't know English) told one of the people there (who was my age but seemed very contemplative adn who I would not be surprised if he were a novice to be a monk now) to "keep an eye on me" not because he didn't trust me but because he was very curious that there was an American, who wanted to see monasteries... and who was Orthodox! I only found this out later. By the way, for anyone who goes, Romania (even post Iraqi war) is one of the few countries left where we Americans still have a warm welcome for being American.

I wish I could go back. Sorry, I know this thread is for conversions... but it was nice to reminisce.

God bless!

John

Xpycoctomos said:

James,

I stayed with the family of a friend in Suceava and the Family of another friend in Iasi. We also took a day and went around what SEEMED to be the nothern part of Romania (though surely not the entire northern part by any means) and saw a bunch of monasteries. It was great. I don't remember the names of them except for going to Putna. We stayed in the village there with my friend's boyfriend's uncle (if that isn't generous! housing some american that isn't your friend, nor your nephews, but your nephew's girlfriend's! but they treated me like a friend) and it was fantastic. They had electricity but no running water (note to others, this is what Romania is like on the countryside, but in the city everyone has running water... they just might shut the hot water off from time to time or day to day... but the water still runs lol). There were goats and cows and chickens everywhere (in the streets etc). It was quite an experience. But, I was actually able to stay on the Visitor grounds of the Monastery at Putna for a couple days. They were so hospitable there, the grounds keeper searched me down and gave me an icon of a very important monk of theirs whose name i still have to research. I will scan it another day and see if y'all know who he is. He's deceased ad I saw his grave. I just have a bad memory with names. That grounds keeper (doesn't know English) told one of the people there (who was my age but seemed very contemplative adn who I would not be surprised if he were a novice to be a monk now) to "keep an eye on me" not because he didn't trust me but because he was very curious that there was an American, who wanted to see monasteries... and who was Orthodox! I only found this out later. By the way, for anyone who goes, Romania (even post Iraqi war) is one of the few countries left where we Americans still have a warm welcome for being American.

I wish I could go back. Sorry, I know this thread is for conversions... but it was nice to reminisce.

God bless!

John

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Yes, Putna is a wonderful place. Did you see St. Daniel's cell? It's a little way outside the village and looks like this:

http://65.113.70.41/iew/gallery/images/28.jpg

You were lucky being in Suceava and Iasi (did you see Sf. Parascheva's relics, by the way, that's something I want to see) with your running water. In Siret, when I first went there they only had running water at all twice a day for about 30 minutes and no hot water ever. It's got better now, but it still isn't constant. I'm better off when I visit my wife's grandparents in Balinesti (a village, whereas Siret's a large town and former capital of Moldova) because they have their own well.

To get back on topic, though, my road to Orthodoxy really started with a conversation with a monk at the monastery of St. John the New in Suceava. He was an absolutely wonderful man and something about his humility and faith just touched me deeply. Did you ever go to that monastery (it's in the centre of Suceava)? That was the first time I'd ever come across incorruptible relics and I can tell you that was quite a shock for a Lutheran who didn't believe in 'that sort of thing'. That experience probably helped me on my way to the catechumenate more than any book could have done.

James

I have to run but I just wanted to confrim that I have gone to see St. Daniel's Cell. It was something else. I saw the comfortable slab of stone he chisled out for himself to sleep on (if I remember correctly) lol.

The other stuff I don't think I saw. When I was in Suceava and Iasi I saw some CHurches but I don't rmemeber even those too well. I do remember a small wooden one my friend took me too in town. It was so beautiful, small and simple. i loved it. It was her favorite too.

John.

Xpycoctomos said:

I have to run but I just wanted to confrim that I have gone to see St. Daniel's Cell. It was something else. I saw the comfortable slab of stone he chisled out for himself to sleep on (if I remember correctly) lol.

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You remember correctly. Was it already in use as a chapel when you were there, or not? It wasn't when I first visited in the '90s, but is now. There's something about being in that tiny cell listening to a monk singing prayers that seems to affect me very strongly. It's almost like St. Daniel's still there with you, which I suppose, in a way, he is.

James

jmbejdl said:

You remember correctly. Was it already in use as a chapel when you were there, or not? It wasn't when I first visited in the '90s, but is now. There's something about being in that tiny cell listening to a monk singing prayers that seems to affect me very strongly. It's almost like St. Daniel's still there with you, which I suppose, in a way, he is.

James

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This stated, BUT it does not work.... And I do not know how it worked this time, because it only one time from 30 trying to quote or submit new messages

It's posted on a sticky topic above, but here 'tis again...

I grew up Southern Baptist, but I had had some exposure to the charismatic movement in high school, so ORU was a wonderful thing, I thought, in terms of all the charismatic stuff. I liked the upbeat, energetic thing that was happening...finally, it was all right to be emotional in worship instead of just tolerating dry, stuffy ritual! But after about a semester and a half...well...all of a sudden I was having second thoughts about emotionistic worship. I saw the weird excesses that emotional experiences can drive Christians to. These included falling on the ground a la Benny Hinn (who used to be Orthodox, BTW), barking like dogs, "manifestations" of the "Spirit" like speaking in tongues (nonsensical babbling), "prophetic words" from God (appeals to the law of averages for getting something accurate about a total stranger (either that or wonderful, positive messages that the receiver WANTED to be true) and bizarre mantras we were expected to chant ("MONEEEEEEEEEY COMETH! TO ME! NOW!") No foolin'. It made me realize that this could not be authentic, original, New Testament Christianity -- at which point I realized I didn't even know what original, NT Christianity was. So I started looking into early Christian history towards the end of my freshman year, for two reasons. One, I wanted to compare the spirituality of the early Church with all the prosperity, all-healing-all-the-time, and/or everything-is-all-good-between-me-and-God sprituality that goes on today in American Charismaticism. Two, I wanted, to borrow a Southern Baptist phrase, "to get back to the New Testament Church."

So I looked at the earliest documents outside the Bible in order to get some context going...specifically, I read the Apostolic Fathers (i.e., Clement of Rome, Ignatius of Antioch, Polycarp), followed by Ireneaus, Cyprian, Tertullian, Origen. To make a long story VERY short, I got more than I bargained for. Not only did I quickly find condemnations of the things that went on at ORU (which was pretty much Montanism revisited), I found my own Baptist upbringing being uprooted by things like strictly liturgical worship, an elevated role for Mary, prayers for the dead and to the saints, confession to a priest, the Eucharist being the actual body/blood of Christ, baptismal regeneration, the absence of "Eternal Security," and adamant anti-denominationalism.

So I couldn't stay were I had been. I went from Episcopalian masses to Roman Catholic masses, to see what they had to say. I loved the worship; this was my first taste of apostolic Christian worship, or "heaven on earth," as it's been called. Due to things I was finding in the Fathers (and things I wasn't finding), I stopped going to masses and attended an Eastern Orthodox liturgy at St. Antony's Antiochian Orthodox Church. Hated it the first time I went; much preferred the Western confessions' worship. Nevertheless, after a while I was amazed to see such similarity in doctrine between what the early Church said, what Scripture said in light of her interpretation, and what this Orthodox priest was saying. Several liturgies (which began to grow on me), books, prayers, questions, answers, and all-nighters later (I did so much research on this that my studies suffered!), I decided to become a catechumen.

Something was happening at the time at ORU, unbeknownst to me, in terms of Orthodoxy; I found out that I was not the only one to be moving in on this train of thought. I was shocked (yet again) to find ORU grads already in St. Antony's ! More than that, there were a few folks here on campus who were beginning to ask similar questions! And more that that, the priest himself was an alum from ORU, and said that back in the late 70s or early 80s, when he was in seminary there, he and about 20 other people converted to Orthodoxy (about 6 of whom became priests). Something similar apparently started up again, as I can think of about 30 to 40 other people from ORU right off the top of my head that either have become Orthodox already or are seriously considering becoming so.

I don't know if the faculty at ORU really knew what to do with all this; letters were circulated, professors started bringing it up in classes (some of which had nothing to do with theology!) even the president of the university mentioned during the chapel service that ORU was in complete agreement with the early church Fathers! Why I would want to look to the past was lost on many there (My RA one year actually said I was crazy to look to the past for my belief). I blame what I call the "chosen generation syndrome" for this. This horrible mindset is VERY attractive to teenagers and young adults, and even to some adults who haven't grown up yet! The idea, basically, is that our parents' generation has dropped the ball (along with that of our grandparents, and so on) regarding taking Christ to the nations, bringing healing and a change to the political climate of the US, but never fear, because God is doing A NEW THING, which (of course), we were on the front lines of! WE were the ones who would CHANGE IT ALL, and the power of God would be evident in this. Which basically gave us license, in our eyes, to let happen whatever we wanted or deemed necessary, because we were on the verge of some "breakthrough" that would require something the world had NEVER SEEN BEFORE--certainly nothing a 2,000-year-old liturgical, man-made religion could provide. So we were left to either swallow what they gave us or suffer the guilt trips of "Don't touch God's annointed!" if we questioned what someone said in chapel. No wonder we all left. No wonder ORU is now jokingly dubbed the "St. Vlad's of the South"; I think more Orthodox come out of there than any other school that's not an Orthodox seminary than any other school in the country.

So there y'go.

jmbejdl said:

You remember correctly. Was it already in use as a chapel when you were there, or not? It wasn't when I first visited in the '90s, but is now. There's something about being in that tiny cell listening to a monk singing prayers that seems to affect me very strongly. It's almost like St. Daniel's still there with you, which I suppose, in a way, he is.

James

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Hmmm... not sure. When I went it was locked (but you could see through the door as you know. But I don't know if it was being used as a chapel at that time. I was there the summer of 2002 if that tells you anything. Let me know.

John

Xpycoctomos said:

Hmmm... not sure. When I went it was locked (but you could see through the door as you know. But I don't know if it was being used as a chapel at that time. I was there the summer of 2002 if that tells you anything. Let me know.

John

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Yes, I think it probably was. When I first visited there was no door or window frame and it was never closed. Now, if you're unlucky you might find that it's closed up as they only seem to open it when there is a monk to look after it - or a novice at least.

James

My Conversion – Part II



I had become non-denominational after becoming dissatisfied with my previous church, and was looking around for a new home. But in the meantime, I had already been attending DL at the Russian OC (Still in a house at that time) before I left my previous church. This was a result of my wife's 'Russian Spirit', and because she wanted to meet Russian's to improve her conversational skills. I was participating and observing, but at the time I was not aware of their doctrines, and to tell the truth, they seemed to be too ‘Catholic’ for me. J I was looking for the ‘Apostolic Church’, and I did not even know I was standing in it!

Anyhow, time went by, about 18 months, and I tried ‘Home Church’ and ‘Cell Church’, but they on the other hand seemed too ‘charismatic’ for me. In the meantime, the new Russian Orthodox Temple had been built (The one in my avatar), and my wife informed me she wanted to join them. So she started as a catechumen. I still attended with her, as I had to drive her over there due to her disability. I still was not interested in this ‘Catholic’ church though.

Then one day in the church parking lot, I saw a bumper-sticker on a car that said “Orthodoxy – the same today as in AD33!” That made me do a double take, and I asked myself, “can this be true?”

For the first time I started doing the research, and the digging. I did not read any of the books recommended on the Boards here. All I had was a Catechism, and I went through the doctrines and beliefs. One by one, I accepted them, as they concurred with the bible verses supplied. (I was still on the Sola Scriptura ride) I knew very well about the icons and prayers to the Saints going on, but I pushed that to one side, and tried not to think about them, but concerned myself with the ‘Theology of Orthodoxy’.

All was well and good, but there came a point where I was confronted with Holy Tradition, and there I got stuck. I could not reconcile myself to it. I prayed for guidance, but no answers came, until, one day I was standing in DL again. I stood there, the choir music and the Liturgy and prayers flowed around me. I looked at all the Icons, and I wondered to myself still, “Is this God’s True Church?” I was very smug with my “Theological Knowledge”. I looked up into the dome above my head, and a voice in my head that I recognized that had spoken to me before said, “Don’t think you know everything, because you know NOTHING!”

That shook me. I knew Who had spoken. I determined then to open my mind, and let Him speak to me. From that moment, my life changed. I was still skeptical, but I allowed the Spirit to direct me. And I prayed even harder. I began to see things in scripture, and the Church Fathers that I had not noticed before. I joined the catechumen class, and listened, and listened.

My last barrier was the Theotokos. I could believe the doctrine of the Mother of God. That made sense, but praying to her in praise was so difficult for me, I still held back.

One day the Voice said to me “Just try, just do it, and see what happens.” I opened my Jordanville Prayer Book, and started to pray the Prayers there. That in itself was at first a strange thing to do, praying out of a book. But I discovered that there is Power in those prayers. They were written by pious men, and they work! Issues that had been a problem in my life before, now became non issues. My habits, and tastes in music and entertainment changed. I became a ‘new person’. I am still sinful old me, but I am aware of my weaknesses, and I gave them up to the Lord to take care of for me, and He does.

I only began to read the convert stories and “The Orthodox Way” after I became an Orthodox Christian, and now they have meaning. If there is anyone out there struggling to understand this “Orthodox Way”, I have been where you are now, and struggled with the same issues you do.

My advice is, take your time. Let God work slowly and thoroughly in your heart. Ponder and pray over each issue. Step back a while, and look where you are, and where you came from. You will be surprised at what you find. I can’t stress enough, take your time, take your time, take your time! And also, stay in touch with the Priest in your area. He is going to become one of the most important people in your life. He will be your guide and counselor, and your friend.

Also remember, this Church has withstood the ‘hates and gates’ of Hades, and has come through the centuries triumphant. As individuals, we will always make mistakes, even the clergy do. But the Church as the Whole, is still on the straight and narrow way that Christ ordained us to walk.

I ask your forgiveness if this has been a ramble, but I hope that it will encourage someone out there who is still struggling to understand Orthodoxy not to give up. God will guide you into all Truth.

In IC XC
Kolya

Also remember, this Church has withstood the ‘hates and gates’ of Hades, and has come through the centuries triumphant. As individuals, we will always make mistakes, even the clergy do. But the Church as the Whole, is still on the straight and narrow way that Christ ordained us to walk.

I ask your forgiveness if this has been a ramble, but I hope that it will encourage someone out there who is still struggling to understand Orthodoxy not to give up. God will guide you into all Truth.

Remarkable ! All these conversions, when no missionary stops you on streets or is knocking at your door and then begins to offer and promise various "materials" are the wonders / miracles of our days as important as it was 100, 500, 1000 or 2000 years ago and it is proof of the Holy Spirit's working among people.

Be blessed !

Petronius said:

Remarkable ! All these conversions, when no missionary stops you on streets or is knocking at your door and then begins to offer and promise various "materials" are the wonders / miracles of our days as important as it was 100, 500, 1000 or 2000 years ago and it is proof of the Holy Spirit's working among people.

Be blessed !

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Thank you kind sir! The Holy Spirit is indeed working on the hearts of many.
Your humble servant in Christ
IC XC
Kolya

Its So Great to see so many other people who converted to orthodoxy becides myself. I had offically bacame Orthodox on pentecost of this year . It was exciting and fun especally because most of the church was making a fuss over my Chrismation at the fellowship hour (Partailly because the priest brought up my name in the Sermon because he was talking about doing stuff such as charity and working for the church and i Just so happen work on the church website ) .Lol and one woman said its so nice to see an Italian converting to orthodoxy ... guess she didn't think before she talked

Well, I'm not Orthodox myself - I'm kind of an inquiring guest who hangs out in TAW a lot of the time, but welcome to TAW, Constantine82!!!

With love in Christ,
Grace