Adventist end time beliefs?

[CharismaticLady]

Love--the very essence of God.
“If you love Me, keep My commandments."
John 14:15

How can you love to that extent as God loves us. That is agape love.

John 15:10

10 If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.

Jesus kept His Father's commandments, The Ten Commandments, perfectly and fulfilled them. But the commandments of Jesus go deeper than the Father's commandments and we are held to a higher standard, not lesser as Adventists sometimes think we believe. But He also gave us the TRUE meaning of grace, which is only unmerited favor before we come to Christ when Jesus died for us while we were yet sinners. His Spirit turns grace into the power of God to be freed from sin, itself, not just the penalty of sin. The wages of sin is still death. A true Christian does not sin; therefore, is not under the law.

 

[Rod That Budded]

free will = law. Grace = unconditional love.

I don't get it. Is your answer to my question simply that free will is the opposite of unconditional love?
Jiminy Cricket = Cute little Disney character.
How does it feel to get a response that doesn't address your comment at all?

I'm not going to participate in derailing the thread by getting sucked into a Calvinism/Arminianism debate. Nice try.

 

[Dave L]

I don't get it. Is your answer to my question simply that free will is the opposite of unconditional love?
Jiminy Cricket = Cute little Disney character.
How does it feel to get a response that doesn't address your comment at all?

I'm not going to participate in derailing the thread by getting sucked into a Calvinism/Arminianism debate. Nice try.

That's the only answer I can think of. Sorry.

 

[Rod That Budded]

How can you love to that extent as God loves us. That is agape love.

John 15:10

10 If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.

Jesus kept His Father's commandments, The Ten Commandments, perfectly and fulfilled them. But the commandments of Jesus go deeper than the Father's commandments and we are held to a higher standard, not lesser as Adventists sometimes think we believe. But He also gave us the TRUE meaning of grace, which is only unmerited favor before we come to Christ when Jesus died for us while we were yet sinners. His Spirit turns grace into the power of God to be freed from sin, itself, not just the penalty of sin. The wages of sin is still death. A true Christian does not sin; therefore, is not under the law.

I must be a false Christian. The righteousness of fully converted Christians are not exempted from the diagnosis of "filthy rags." There is no excuse for sin. But it does happen. Even to Christians. This is the "essential message" contained in Scripture from 1 John 1:5 through 1 John 2:2.

This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all. If we claim to have fellowship with him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not live out the truth. But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus, his Son, purifies us from all sin.

If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us.

My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have an advocate with the Father—Jesus Christ, the Righteous One. He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.

 

[Rod That Budded]

That's the only answer I can think of. Sorry.

Apology wholeheartedly accepted. And I apologize for my mini-rant.

 

[klutedavid]

Love--the very essence of God.
“If you love Me, keep My commandments."
John 14:15

Which set of commandments is Jesus talking about here?

John 13:34
A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you, that you also love one another.

John 15:10
If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.

John 15:12
This is My commandment, that you love one another, just as I have loved you.

John 15:14
You are My friends if you do what I command you.

John 15:17
This I command you, that you love one another.

1 John 2:8
On the other hand, I am writing a new commandment to you, which is true in Him and in you, because the darkness is passing away and the true Light is already shining.

1 John 3:23-24
This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us. The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him.

1 John 4:21
And this commandment we have from Him, that the one who loves God should love his brother also.

1 John 5:3
For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments; and His commandments are not burdensome.

 

[Rod That Budded]

@Dave L Seriously though, would you consider free will to be the opposite of unconditional love

Which set of commandments is Jesus talking about here?

John 13:34
A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you, that you also love one another.

John 15:10
If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love.

John 15:12
This is My commandment, that you love one another, just as I have loved you.

John 15:14
You are My friends if you do what I command you.

John 15:17
This I command you, that you love one another.

1 John 2:8
On the other hand, I am writing a new commandment to you, which is true in Him and in you, because the darkness is passing away and the true Light is already shining.

1 John 3:23-24
This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us. The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him.

1 John 4:21
And this commandment we have from Him, that the one who loves God should love his brother also.

1 John 5:3
For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments; and His commandments are not burdensome.

There is only one set.

 

[Dave L]

@Dave L Seriously though, would you consider free will to be the opposite of unconditional love

There is only one set.

free will doesn't exists.

 

[Rod That Budded]

free will doesn't exists.

then how can it = law?

 

[CharismaticLady]

I must be a false Christian. The righteousness of fully converted Christians are not exempted from the diagnosis of "filthy rags." There is no excuse for sin. But it does happen. Even to Christians. This is the "essential message" contained in Scripture from 1 John 1:5 through 1 John 2:2.

This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all. If we claim to have fellowship with him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not live out the truth. But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus, his Son, purifies us from all sin.

If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us.

My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have an advocate with the Father—Jesus Christ, the Righteous One. He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.

Are you aware that everyone since Adam sinned has sinned themselves? Paul said, "for all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God." Sin is the reason Jesus came to earth. Now, did He come to save us to keep sinning without penalty, or to free us from slavery to sin?

You are not reading 1 John 1 correctly as is a common milady in today's Church. You are reading it as if John is contradicting chapter 3. There is more explanation, of course, but you need to get this straight first.

 

[klutedavid]

@Dave L Seriously though, would you consider free will to be the opposite of unconditional love

There is only one set.

Only one set of commandments and here they are.

1 John 3:23-24
This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us. The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him.

 

[CharismaticLady]

I must be a false Christian. The righteousness of fully converted Christians are not exempted from the diagnosis of "filthy rags." There is no excuse for sin. But it does happen. Even to Christians. This is the "essential message" contained in Scripture from 1 John 1:5 through 1 John 2:2.

This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all. If we claim to have fellowship with him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not live out the truth. But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus, his Son, purifies us from all sin.

If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. If we claim we have not sinned, we make him out to be a liar and his word is not in us.

My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have an advocate with the Father—Jesus Christ, the Righteous One. He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.

It looks like you don't understand my first response to you:

Are you aware that everyone since Adam sinned has sinned themselves? Paul said, "for all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God." Sin is the reason Jesus came to earth. Now, did He come to save us to keep sinning without penalty, or to free us from slavery to sin?

You are not reading 1 John 1 correctly as is a common milady in today's Church. You are reading it as if John is contradicting chapter 3. There is more explanation, of course, but you need to get this straight first.

1 John 1:6 "If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth."

Is this person a Christian who walks in darkness when God is light? The answer is NO. That is the same with verses 8 and 10 also. They have never confessed their sins from birth so have never been cleansed of ALL their unrighteousness. Once cleansed, THEN you are no longer a sinner, you are a child of God.

John 8:34-36

 

[Rod That Budded]

It looks like you don't understand my first response to you:

Well, you've made it pretty clear that you understand, I don't, and that I need to get it straight first.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Well, you've made it pretty clear that you understand, I don't, and that I need to get it straight first.

Here it is again, what part do you not understand?

1 John 1:6 "If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth."

Is this person a Christian who walks in darkness when God is light? The answer is NO. That is the same with verses 8 and 10 also. They have never confessed their sins from birth so have never been cleansed of ALL their unrighteousness. Once cleansed, THEN you are no longer a sinner, you are a child of God.

John 8:34-36

 

[Jesse Johnson]

The whole SDA scheme collapses when Jeremiah and Hebrews say the New Covenant replaced the Old Covenant. There are no Sabbath requirements in the New.

The new covenant replaces the old in the span of a person's life, not in the span of history. We are all born as self-justifying legalists. The new covenant is merely righteousness by faith through grace which Noah found in the eyes of the Lord hundreds of years before the "old covenant" even existed. Covenant Theology is just another -ism men like to invent to avoid the Holy Spirit's urging the necessity of being broken on the Rock. Most systematic theologies are just that--systems that tend to quiet the conscience.

 

[Dave L]

The new covenant replaces the old in the span of a person's life, not in the span of history. We are all born as self-justifying legalists. The new covenant is merely righteousness by faith through grace which Noah found in the eyes of the Lord hundreds of years before the "old covenant" even existed. Covenant Theology is just another -ism men like to invent to avoid the Holy Spirit's urging the necessity of being broken on the Rock. Most systematic theologies are just that--systems that tend to quiet the conscience.

“In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.” Hebrews 8:13 (KJV 1900)

 

[Jesse Johnson]

The SDA church as the name informs you is all about one commandment from the law of Moses.

The naming of the Seventh-day Adventist church was simple and self-defining by design. It was organized to restore the forgotten the fourth commandment (the one that begins with the word "Remember") and to herald the imminence of the Second Advent.

 

[Dave L]

The naming of the Seventh-day Adventist church was simple and self-defining by design. It was organized to restore the forgotten the fourth commandment (the one that begins with the word "Remember") and to herald the imminence of the Second Advent.

If you need to be told not to steal or murder, how can anyone trust you?

 

[Jesse Johnson]

“In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.” Hebrews 8:13 (KJV 1900)

Is this supposed to prove a pan-historic view of the juxtaposition between legalism and righteousness by faith?

 

[Jesse Johnson]

If you need to be told not to steal or murder, how can anyone trust you?

People who are presented the Gospel in remote areas often need to be told just such a thing. Further, Christ seemed to find it necessary to elaborate on these issues. Even within the law itself coveting is forbidden for what other purpose than to prevent the grosser crimes?
And if anyone thinks that he knows anything, he knows nothing yet as he ought to know. 1 Corinthians 8:2.