Abomination of desolation

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Atkin

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Justme said:
Hi Atkin,

You wrote:
"When did the priests stop entering the holy place... once the Temple was destroyed

in the first century, the priests could no longer enter the holy place... IT WAS NO LONGER IN EXISTENCE. You cannot enter a place that does not EXIST.
*************

Exactly. AND you point out that you cannot enter a place that does not exist, and of course the abomination that causes desolation can't either.

I like your explanation of the wounds of Jesus.

Justme

Yes, the housing structure does not exist but regarding the abomination

that causes desolation , He can desolate a non structural temple.

The whole key lies in what a temple means in the post 20th century.

That is what determines how it can be made desolate by the abomination.

We KNOW FOR sure it is not some physical structure like the old temple that was destroyed in the 1st century.

SO WHAT DID GOD mean by a temple , in the post 20th century, when

structurally built temple buildings, do not exist anymore?
 
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Justme

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Hi Atkin,

Yes, but to follow what is written the abomination must appear in the holy place. There was a holy place in the temple. There is no longer any holy place for the A of D to APPEAR in.

You wrote:
The whole key lies in what a temple means in the post 20th century.
**************

Let's see ...
there was a holy place in the temple ...
People were present in Jerusalem and would be capable of SEEING said Aof D...
Josephus does speak of a flight of people out of Jerusalem to a place in the mountains called Pelly.
It would be difficult for nursing mothers to flee when the temple was destroyed as would travel in the winter be difficult at that time.....

Every nation under heaven was present in Jerusalem at the time of the destruction of the temple...
The bible mentions the 'end of the ages/world being at that time...

What didn't fit from that temple that was destroyed, why is it necessary to talk about a present day temple if everything fit the old one?

Justme
 
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Atkin

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Justme said:
Hi Atkin,

Yes, but to follow what is written the abomination must appear in the holy place. There was a holy place in the temple. There is no longer any holy place for the A of D to APPEAR in.

You wrote:
The whole key lies in what a temple means in the post 20th century.
**************

Let's see ...
there was a holy place in the temple ...
People were present in Jerusalem and would be capable of SEEING said Aof D...
Josephus does speak of a flight of people out of Jerusalem to a place in the mountains called Pelly.
It would be difficult for nursing mothers to flee when the temple was destroyed as would travel in the winter be difficult at that time.....

Every nation under heaven was present in Jerusalem at the time of the destruction of the temple...
The bible mentions the 'end of the ages/world being at that time...

What didn't fit from that temple that was destroyed, why is it necessary to talk about a present day temple if everything fit the old one?

Justme

Did the leader of the Roman empire sit in the temple and declare
himself to be God or do anything along those lines?

Why do you assume that Romans and Jews made up all nations under heaven who were in Jerusalem?

Less prominent smaller nations in remote Asia, Europe Africa etc
were not present in Jerusalem when the Temple was destroyed.

Are you very sure that that temple and the events accurately fit
the events surrounding the abomination of desolation?
 
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Atkin said:
1 Thessalonians 4:16. For the LORD HIMSELF shall DESCEND FORM HEAVEN with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the DEAD IN CHRIST shall RISE FIRST:
17. Then WE which are ALIVE and remain shall be CAUGHT UP TOGETHERWITH THEM in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.”

You falsely added events concerning sinners not mentioned in the point of 1 Thess 4:16

Does it state that unbelievers ARE NOT resurrected?..... You are wrong, it does not teach us there... refer to Daniel 12:2 for the SINNERS EVENTS AT 2ND ADVENT and there is no TIME GAP stated in 1 Thess 4;16 or Daniel 12;2 and do not force Revelation 20:5 wrongly into Daniel 12:2 and 1 Thess 4:16

THERE IS NOTHING ABOUT 1000 YEARS EXPLICITLY STATED IN 1 THESS 4:16-- you cannot show a thing there.

The key word is being with the Lord forever. That is the resurrected righteous and those alive will be with the Lord forever.

The resurected unrighteous and those alive not in Christ WILL NOT be with the Lord forever FOR THEY WILL BE IN SHAME AND CONTEMPT... DANIEL 12:2.. 2nd advent.

That is the correct interpretation which MATCHES DANIEL 12:2 exactly.

Daniel 12:2 MANY OF THOSE WHO SLEEP IN THE DUST SHALL AWAKE

1--- SOME TO EVERLASTING LIFE --those in Christ

2 and some to SHAME AND EVERLASTING CONTEMPT. Anything you add involving some time between Daniel the TWO resurrections in 12:2 is false teaching.

SHOW US IN DANIEL 12:2 where it states the 1000 year reign between

:2 many shall awake , some to everlasting life and YOU FALSELY INSERT 1000 YEARS before some resurrect to shame and everlasting contempt.

Revelations 20:5 is fulfilled in Daniel 12:2..... so simple you cannot miss it.

1 Thess 4:16 DOES NOT MENTION that the dead unbelievers REMAIN DEAD FOR 1000 years and neither does it mention anything about the sinful alive BECAUSE THAT IS TAUGHT SEPARATELY IN DANIEL 12;2 AND REVELATION 20:5

1 THESS 4:16 should NOT BE MISCONSTRUED AND DISTORTED TO SAY THAT THE SINFUL ALIVE WILL REMAIN ON EARTH FOR 1000 YEARS..... what is the point of that?
Many people will be alive in sin after 1 THESS 4:16... and will ENJOY THE MILLENIAL REIGN?


If you place your false time gap between resurrecting to life and resurrecting to SHAME WHAT HAPPENS THEN TO THE SINFUL ALIVE .... who remain on earth in YOUR FICTIONAL TIME GAP BETWEEN 1 THESSALONIANS AND REVELATIONS 20:5??

Again, what happens to the millions of sinners BETWEEN THE FICTIONAL TIME GAP YOU HAVE PLACED BETWEEN 1 Thessalonians 4:16, REVELATION 20:5 Rest of the dead come alive and Daniel 12:2?

Daniel 12:2 IS THE COMPLETE DESCRIPTION OF THE EVENTS AT THE 2ND COMING
DANIEL 12:2 includes 1 Thess 4:16 and the simultaneous condemnation of the sinners
at the second coming to everlasting shame and contempt.
1 Thess 4:16 CANNOT BE USED to introduce a FICTIONAL DELAY between the words in Daniel 12:2 that take place at the same time.



The Bible says.
MANY SAINTS RAISED AROUND 33AD.
Does the Bible confirm this? YES in the next verses!
Matt 27:50 And the graves were opened; and MANY BODIES of the SAINTS which slept AROSE, 53And came OUT OF THEIR GRAVES AFTER HIS RESURRECTION, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

Now for the next group of SAINTS to come up at the SECOND COMING.
Does the Bible confirm this? YES!

“1 Thessalonians 4:16. For the LORD HIMSELF shall DESCEND FORM HEAVEN with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the DEAD IN CHRIST shall RISE FIRST:
17. Then WE which are ALIVE and remain shall be CAUGHT UP TOGETHERWITH THEM in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.”


The above verse is the fulfilment of Daniel’s prophecies below.

Daniel 12:1. And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy PEOPLE SHALL BE DELIVERED EVERYONE that shall be FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK.

Have All the righteous been raised? YES!
“EVERYONE that shall be FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK”.
Are there ANY bad people in the book of life? NO!

All the folk that are raised have been raised unto the resurrection of life!

These next folk are to be raised at the resurrection of damnation.


Rev 20:5.But THE REST OF THE DEAD lived not again until the THOUSAND YEARS were finished.
Rev 20: 7. And when the THOUSAND YEARS are EXPIRED, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, 8And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea. 9And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and FIRE CAME DOWN FROM GOD out of heaven, and DEVOURED THEM.
That was the resurrection of damnation.
Does the BIBLE say that the Saints were raised AFTER the millennium? NO!
Do the verses above fulfil Daniel 12:2. “And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.”
Answer. Yes!
 
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Atkin

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Prophecy Countdown said:
Does the BIBLE say that the Saints were raised AFTER the millennium? NO!
Do the verses above fulfil Daniel 12:2. “And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.”
Answer. Yes!

The Bible says it but you cannot understand what the Bible says if YOU FORCE Revelation 5 in between where it does not belong.

Let me help you

you asked --Does the BIBLE say that the Saints were raised AFTER the millennium?

Daniel 12:2 answers your question

The Saints resurrected to everlasting life.
So simple.
 
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Atkin

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The above verse is the fulfilment of Daniel’s prophecies below.

Daniel 12:1. And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy PEOPLE SHALL BE DELIVERED EVERYONE that shall be FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK.

Have All the righteous been raised? YES!
“EVERYONE that shall be FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK”.
Are there ANY bad people in the book of life? NO!

All the folk that are raised have been raised unto the resurrection of life!

These next folk are to be raised at the resurrection of damnation.


l Daniel 12:2. “And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.”
Answer. Yes!

Do you have difficulty understand the MEANING OF AT THAT TIME in Daniel 12:1

I REPEAT AT THAT TIME

AT THAT SAME TIME --- both resurrection to life AND AT THAT SAME TIME RESURRECTION to damnation.

It is amazing to see the efforts you make at twisting the scripture.

If you do not understand Revelation 20:5 and Rev 20:7, avoid misplacing them in Daniel 12.

This is so simple to prove.
DANIEL SAID AT THAT TIME.....AT THAT TIME SOME WILL RISE TO LIFE AND SOME TO EVERLASTING SHAME AND CONTEMPT.

READ DANIEL 12:1-2
Daniel 12:1. And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy PEOPLE SHALL BE DELIVERED EVERYONE that shall be FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK.
Daniel 12:2. “And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.”

AT THAT TIME.... NOT AT TIMES BUT AT THE SAME TIME.....
THE GOOD PEOPLE ARE DELIVERED (some to everlasting life) AND AT THE SAME TIME THE BAD ARE CONDEMNED (and some to shame and everlasting contempt.”

AT THAT SAME TIME

AT THAT TIME...... do you get it now??
This is elementary English.


Daniel 12:2. “And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, [AT THE SAME TIME] some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.” THE SAME TIME ..NO TIME GAP

DANIEL 12:2 THE SAME TIME SOME TO LIFE -- AND SOME TO SHAME.
Do not reply to this post since your point is baseless.
The Bible will not be selectively quoted to suit you.
 
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Justme

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Hi Atkin,

You wrote:

Did the leader of the Roman empire sit in the temple and declare
himself to be God or do anything along those lines?
**********************
Something like that according to Luke:

20"When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near. 21Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those in the city get out, and let those in the country not enter the city.

You wrote:
Why do you assume that Romans and Jews made up all nations under heaven who were in Jerusalem?
**********************
Acts 2
5Now there were staying in Jerusalem God-fearing Jews from every nation under heaven.

You wrote:
Less prominent smaller nations in remote Asia, Europe Africa etc
were not present in Jerusalem when the Temple was destroyed.

Who said they had to be?
Matthew 10
5These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: "Do not go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans.

There were certain ones to be talked to by the twelve as described in Matthew 10.

Also this verse adds more:Matthew 10
23When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. I tell you the truth, you will not finish going through the cities of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

You wrote:

Are you very sure that that temple and the events accurately fit
the events surrounding the abomination of desolation?
**********************

Absolutely not sure at all, it is all on faith in the word of God being correct.

Biblically, it all fits. If it didn't I would change my understanding.

Now may I ask you a question?
What doesn't fit concerning the abomination that causes desolation?

Were the people of Judea not supposed to see it in the holy place?
Was there not a holy place in the temple?
How can the people of Judea physically SEE any abomination in the temple today?
Would it be difficult to flee Judea in the winter in the year 2003?
Would it be difficult for nursing mothers to flee JUdea in the year 2003?
How would anyone flee from the Judea that is talked about in the bible in this day and age?????
......it returned to the procurators until A. D. 66; and in A. D. 70 Judea disappeared as an individual district. ..........Catholic Encyclopedia........

Justme
 
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Atkin said:
Do you have difficulty understand the MEANING OF AT THAT TIME in Daniel 12:1

I REPEAT AT THAT TIME

AT THAT SAME TIME --- both resurrection to life AND AT THAT SAME TIME RESURRECTION to damnation.

It is amazing to see the efforts you make at twisting the scripture.

If you do not understand Revelation 20:5 and Rev 20:7, avoid misplacing them in Daniel 12.

This is so simple to prove.
DANIEL SAID AT THAT TIME.....AT THAT TIME SOME WILL RISE TO LIFE AND SOME TO EVERLASTING SHAME AND CONTEMPT.

READ DANIEL 12:1-2
Daniel 12:1. And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy PEOPLE SHALL BE DELIVERED EVERYONE that shall be FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK.
Daniel 12:2. “And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.”

AT THAT TIME.... NOT AT TIMES BUT AT THE SAME TIME.....
THE GOOD PEOPLE ARE DELIVERED (some to everlasting life) AND AT THE SAME TIME THE BAD ARE CONDEMNED (and some to shame and everlasting contempt.”

AT THAT SAME TIME

AT THAT TIME...... do you get it now??
This is elementary English.


Daniel 12:2. “And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, [AT THE SAME TIME] some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.” THE SAME TIME ..NO TIME GAP

DANIEL 12:2 THE SAME TIME SOME TO LIFE -- AND SOME TO SHAME.
Do not reply to this post since your point is baseless.
The Bible will not be selectively quoted to suit you.


Greetings folks.
Atkin accuses me of the following.

Quote “If you do not understand Revelation 20:5 and Rev 20:7, avoid misplacing them in Daniel 12.”

He has a very short memory of how miserably he failed to answer the few questions I asked in an earlier post!

I am still waiting for Atkin, to answer them and give us all an explanation of the questions asked regards the “2300 evening and morning,” the “1260 days,” “1290 days,” the “1335 days,” also the “time times and a half,” how long between the day of Atonement and the Passover, and the “little season”

Atkin was as silent as a mouse!
What does that tell me?
It tells me that when it comes down to detail and understanding,,, there isn’t much going in there,,, hello!
Let’s see if I “misplace” or misapply Daniel and Revelation.

I look at the intent of the Bible and to do this I use parallels and patterns.

You may ask yourselves, is what I do sound and reasonable?

If I find that there is biblical harmony and that the intent of the Bible is clear then that is safe, what I do not do, is add anything that is not related to the verse of scripture or add words to twist it around, as Atkin has accused me of doing, yet has done the very same thing himself.

I will use capital letters to emphasise the intent of the Bible verse only.
What is the TRIBULATION PERIOD? Please NOTE. The same story is recorded by Matt 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21, the intent is the same, and how is all this related to “the time of the end,” spoken of by Daniel

Matt 24:3. And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be THE SIGN OF THY COMING, and of the END OF THE WORLD?

Part of the answer Jesus gave was that we should watch and pray.
Keep our eyes open, pray always and be alert to the signs indicating the second advent. We all want to be able to stand in front of Jesus when He returns.

Luke 21:36. Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted WORTHY TO ESSCAPE all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

The following tribulation period is hard to imagine. It is so bad that the days that are concerned with it will have to be shortened, otherwise nobody would be saved, so for God’s people’s sake the time is going to be cut.

Mark 13: 19. For in those days shall be AFFLICTION, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be. 20And except that the LORD HAD SHORTENED those DAYS, NO FLESH should be saved: but for the ELECTS SAKE, whom he hath CHOSEN, he hath SHORTENED THE DAYS.


Jesus mentions “DAYS” Now my mind tells me, that I should follow up and see if I can find out about who and what is going to happen and where and for how long?
Part of the answer given by Jesus in the following verse.
Because this thread is about the abomination of desolation, I should follow that course.

Matt 24: 15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)

Now the first thing any Bible student should do is listen to his or her Master/Teacher, and go straight to Daniel. Does that sound reasonable?
Of course.

Daniel 11: 31. Speaks of God’s people being strong during this dreadful period.

Daniel 11: 31. And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall TAKE AWAY THE DAIL, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate. 32And such as do wickedly against the covenant shall he corrupt by flatteries: but the people that do know their God shall be STRONG, and do exploits.

When I go to Daniel, I find out about the who and for how long. Daniel is told about the duration periods involved in each of the things that are to occur. We know that this thing involves the daily being taken away and the abomination that makes it desolate.
I am looking for the reason for all of this and how long it is going to go on for.
The Bible tells me, for how long the set up is going to last. I am not lying or making it up, it is what the Bible says.
Daniel 12:11. And from the time THE DAILY shall be TAKEN AWAY, and the ABOMINATION that MAKETH DESOLATE SET UP, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

This evil thing that is “set up” can only go on for 1290 days, about 3 ½ years.
It could be worse it could have been longer.
When we go to the next verse of Daniel we are told about a blessing.

Daniel 12:12. Blessed is he that WAITETH, and COMETH to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

What blessing comes for those who wait? Daniel is told rest. This could refer to his ultimate death and resurrection at the “end of the days.”

Daniel 12: 13. But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days.
Now again I ask, what blessing?
If we are patient we can find the biblical answers sooner or later.

Rev 19:1-6. God’s people receive salvation as the Bible says.

The Bible states that “many” of the Saints are raised.
 
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We have not been told that all the Saints were raised at our Lord’s resurrection in Matt 27:50.
That would be around 33AD.
Millions of Saints had not been borne in 33AD so there must be a later resurrection of life that includes them.

Does the Bible confirm this fact that not all were raised?
YES in the next verses!

Matt 27:50 And the graves were opened; and MANY BODIES of the SAINTS which slept AROSE, 53And came OUT OF THEIR GRAVES AFTER HIS RESURRECTION, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

Now for the next group of SAINTS, which of course belong to later generations and includes ALL those who died many centuries ago up until now and those that are to be killed during the tribulation at the second advent.
ALL of them come up from their graves.
There are those that manage to survive, through the tribulation period and reach the end of the 1335 days.

Does the Bible confirm this? Yes because the righteous living are raised AFTER the dead and are caught up with them!
Please note that the wicked are NOT mentioned as being in the groups raised in 33AD or at the second advent when Jesus descends in the following verse.
Please keep in mind Daniel 12: 12. The promised blessing We will get to that later.

When I read the following verse I see that it is in harmony with the rest if the Bible and is about the same subject
“1 Thessalonians 4:16. For the LORD HIMSELF shall DESCEND FORM HEAVEN with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the DEAD IN CHRIST shall RISE FIRST:
17. Then WE which are ALIVE and remain shall be CAUGHT UP TOGETHER WITH THEM in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.”

This last resurrection of life occurs within the last trumpet of God a period that includes 2300 days which the 1260, 1290, 1335, days fit into.
I don’t want to go down this path, because I will get too much information and the subject post is long enough as it is, so I will just touch on it.
Daniel 8:13. Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, HOW LONG shall be the vision concerning THE DAILY, and the TRANSGRETION of DESOLATION, to give both the SANCTUARY and the host to be trodden under foot? 14. And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall THE SANCTUARY be CLEANSED.

That is about 6 and a bit years. Is there a problem with the time period?
No, because if it were shorter the 1260, 1290, 1335 and 42 months and the “time times and dividing of time” spoken of in Daniel and Revelation would not fit into it.

Rev 11: 2. But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the GENTILES: and the HOLY CITY shall they tread under foot FORTY TWO MONTHS.

3. And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a THOUSAND TWO HUNDRED THREESCORE DAYS, clothed in SACKLOTH.
All these time periods are put there so that those living in the “time of the end” can at least see and “understand’ that it is only for a short time that will be shortened, Thanks to our Heavenly Father who is the only One that knows when it will all end.

Now back to the resurrection of life for all that are found in the book of life will be saved.
Rev 3:5. He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angel

1 Corinthians 15: 52. In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the LAST TRUMP: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

The two witnesses are raised at this time.

Rev 11: 11. And after three days and an half the Spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them. 12And they heard a GREAT VOICE from heaven saying unto them, COME UP hither. And THEY ASCENDED up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.
Rev 11: 14. The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly. 15And the SEVENTH angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The KINGDOMS of this WORLD are become of our Lord, and of his Christ; and HE SHALL REIGN for ever and ever

Have the condemned been raised yet?
The Bible has not said that they were a part of the resurrection of life. So they are still waiting.

The above verses are a fulfilment of Daniel’s prophecies below.
Both, Daniel calls this period “A time of trouble” and Revelation calls it, the “great tribulation.”

Rev 7: 13. And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in WHITE ROBES? and whence came they? 14And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are THEY which CAME OUT OF THE GREAT TRIBULATION, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.


Daniel 12:1. And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy PEOPLE SHALL BE DELIVERED EVERYONE that shall be FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK.

Have All the righteous been raised? YES!
“EVERYONE that shall be FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK”.
Are there ANY bad people in the book of life? No.
What TIME does it mean by saying “at that time?”
The time is named the “great tribulation” in Rev, and the “time of trouble” in Daniel.
Have I changed the intent of the Bible? Is it still all intact? Of course.

Now for the blessing promised in Daniel 12:12. Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

Rev 19: 1. And after these things I heard a great voice of MUCH PEOPLE IN HEAVEN, saying, Alleluia; SALVATION, and glory, and honour, and power, unto the Lord our God:

In the last verse why are God’s people celebrating? Am I presuming that they have been saved?
After all they are in Heaven, “much people in heaven.”

We have studied the “Resurrection of life,” ask yourself, has the BIBLE said if any of the wicked dead have been raised with the righteous?
Isn’t it only the righteous that are found in the book of life and therefore raised?

Who is the harlot?
Rev 19: 2. For true and righteous are his judgements: for he hath judged the great harlot, which did corrupt the earth with her fornication, and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand.

If you want to know who the “harlot” is, see Ezekiel 16:
What great city killed the servants of God?
Let me see.
Luke 13:34. O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under her wings, and ye would not!
Now if you have read Ezekiel 16, and included the last verse, you would have quickly recognised what city and nation it refers to.

Also the two witnesses are to be killed in that same city. Rev 11:8. And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, WHERE ALSO OUR LORD WAS CRUCIFIED.
Now back to Heaven and the saved.
Rev 19: 3. And again they said, Alleluia. And her smoke rose up for ever and ever.
4. And the four and twenty elders and the four beasts fell down and worshipped God that sat on the throne, saying, Amen; Alleluia.
 
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5. And a voice came out of the throne, saying, Praise our God, all ye his servants, and ye that fear him, both small and great.
6. And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth.

God takes back His power.
Let’s have a look and see who it is that is able to open the book.

Revelation 5: 9. And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and HAST REDEEMED US TO GOD by thy blood out of EVERY KINDRED, and tongue, and PEOPLE, and NATION.

So am I jumping to conclusions when I state that God’s people have been redeemed?
Look at the last verse who is it that says that Jesus is worthy to open the Book?
Can you believe it is created beings, “REDEEMED MEN?”
“Thou art worthy,” “and HAST REDEEMED US TO GOD.”
How many have been made “Kings and priests” and “reign?” Are they out of every “PEOPLE, and NATION.”

Revelation 5: 10. . And hast made US unto our God KINGS and PRIESTS: and WE shall REIGN on the earth.

The next question is who is found worthy?
IF THE Lamb received the things mentioned below. He must have given them up, otherwise He would not need to receive them back.

11. And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the BEASTS and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands;

12. Saying with a loud voice, WORHTY IS THE LAMB that was slain to RECEIVE POWER, and RICHES, and WISDOM, and STRENGTH, and HONOUR, and GLORY, and BLESSING.

How many creatures are there praising God?
All the Saints who were resurrected at His resurrection and at His second coming including angels.


13And EVERY creature which is IN HEAVEN, and ON the EARTH, and under the earth, and such as are IN THE SEA, and ALL that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.
14. And the four beasts said, Amen. And the four and twenty elders fell down and worshipped him that liveth for ever and ever.

Now isn’t that a blessing folks and a short 1335 day period is worth the wait, isn’t it when you think how long eternity is?
Did I misalign anything or use the Bible out of context?
Have I kept with the intent of the Bible? Of course. The Bible speaks for itself if we let it.
Let’s go back to Rev 19 and see if we are reading the same story both in Daniel and Revelation to check and see if what I’m saying is with the Bible.

Rev 19:7. Marriage of the Lamb.

7. Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.

Rev 19: 8. The Saints are given white garments.
8. And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the RIGHEOUSNESS OF THE SAINTS.

Let me ask you, my peers a question. When all the above happens will the following verse of Daniel have been fulfilled yet? I think yes.

Daniel 12:1. And AT THAT TIME shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a TIME OF TROUBLE, such as never was since there was a nation even to that SAME TIME: and AT THAT TIME thy PEOPLE SHALL BE DELIVERED EVERYONE that shall be FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK.
I think we can say. YES. Amen!

John 5: 28. Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, 29And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Has the hour come for the wicked to be raised yet? No.
Have they been mentioned as being resurrected yet? No.
Has the hour of the resurrection of damnation come yet? No.
Does John use the word together or that the wicked will be raised along with the righteous? No.
Has John 5: 28 been fulfilled completely yet? No.

John 5: 28. Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
Will all in their graves hear His voice? Yes.
Have we only read about the resurrection of life so far? Yes.
So the next verse is yet to be fulfilled regards the “resurrection of damnation.
Be patient it will all fall into place if we keep reading what the Bible says.
John 5: 29.. And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Daniel is told the vision “concerns the time of the end.”

Has the next verse of Daniel been fulfilled yet?
The “resurrection of life” as John calls it and the resurrection “to everlasting life,” as Daniel calls it has been fulfilled.
We have just studied it.
Daniel 12:2. And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
John mentions the “resurrection of life” firstly then speaks of the resurrection of “everlasting damnation” after it.” In that order.

Also this applies to Daniel. The resurrection “to everlasting life” is mentioned first. “And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life.” Then After mentioning The resurrection of “everlasting life” he then mentions the resurrection of “everlasting contempt.”
In that order. Both Prophets are meticulous in the order of these two events. Not once is the second resurrection mentioned until the resurrection of life is referred to, in their correct order.
John nor Daniel state that both resurrection occur at the same time, so I do not assume that, because I know that some of the Saints were raised back in 33 at the resurrection of Jesus and are part of the “resurrection of life.”

Will this part of Daniel and John occur later? “and some to shame and everlasting contempt.”
“they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”
Yes this prophecy will be fulfilled when our God is good and ready.


The resurrection of damnation will occur when we get to Revelation 20:

Now we have the promise of Daniel 12:12 of the promised blessing and it is delivered as promised by our Lord in Heaven.

Rev 19: 9. The Saints attend marriage supper of the Lamb.

Rev 19: 9: And he saith unto me, Write, BLESSED are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.
I ask my peers.
Did I do wrong bringing Daniel in with Revelation?
Is what I am saying, sound reasonable?
Is it the intent of the Bible?
Is it clear and precise to follow?
Does it make sense?
Rev 19:10. Messenger tells John, worship God only.

Rev 19: 10. And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.


Rev 19:11. John sees our Lord, Faithful & True on His white horse readying for war.
11. And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
 
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Rev19:12. John sees God, in all His great glory with an unknown
name.

Rev19: 12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.

Vesture dipped in blood, name, WORD OF GOD.
Rev19: 13. And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

Rev 19:14. His armies dressed in white, on white horses follow
HIM TO WAR!
Rev 19: 14. And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

Rev 19:15. Jesus leads with a two edged sword, TO SMITE THE
NATIONS TO RULE with a Rod of iron.

Rev 19: 15. And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

Rev 19: 16. King of kings Lord of lords. Birds feast on the slain.
Rev 19: 16. And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

Is this the place to insert the following verse? I think so.

Luke 17: 35. Two shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

Luke 17: 36. Two shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
Luke 17: 37. And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever THE BODY, thither will the eagles be GATHERED together.

Rev 19:17. Feast yourselves on Kings, captains, great and small.
Rev 19: 17. And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all THE FOWLES that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;

Rev 19: 18. EAT THE FLESH OF kings of the Earth who gather for war.

Rev 19: 18. That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.

Rev 19:19. The beast and King’s armies gather for war against
He that rides on the white horse.
Rev 19: 19. And I saw the BEAST, AND THE KINGS OF THE EARTH, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.


Rev 19:20. Beast & false prophet are captured & thrown into lake
Of fire.
Rev 19: 20. and the BEAST WAS TAKEN, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were CAST alive INTO A LAKE OF FIRE burning with brimstone.


The Armageddon War lasts within 15 months, NOTE, see Daniel 7:11,12. Remembering Parallels and patterns, we can see that Daniel is speaking about the same people involved and gives a time period for all this to go down.

Daniel 7: 11. I beheld then because of the voice of the great words which the horn spake: I beheld even till THE BEAST WAS SLAIN, and HIS BODY destroyed, and GIVEN TO THE BURNING FLAME.

Daniel 7: 12. As concerning THE REST OF THE BEASTS, they had their dominion taken away: yet THEIR LIVES PROLONGED FOR A SEASOND and TIME.

Time = one year. Season = 3 months total 15 months.
Daniel is speaking of the Armageddon battle.
Rev 19:21. The rest were put to the sword that’s the end of Armageddon.

Rev 19:21. And THE REMNANT WERE SLAIN WITH SWORD of him that sat upon the horse, which proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

Rev 16: 14. For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the KINGS OF THE EARTH and of the WHOLE WORLD, to GATHER THEM FOR BATTLE of that GREAT DAY OF GOD ALLMIGHTY.
Rev 16: 15. Behold, I come as a thief. BLESSED is he that WATCHETH, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.

Rev 16: 16. And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.

Rev 16: 17And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, IT IS DONE.

The last verses quoted of Daniel and Revelation are of the same story.
So what does Joel have to say about the great battle?

Joel 2:1. Blow ye the trumpet in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of the LORD cometh, for it is nigh at hand;

Joel 2: 2. A day of darkness and of gloominess, a day of clouds and of thick darkness, as the morning spread upon the mountains: a great people and a strong; there hath not been ever the like, neither shall be any more after it, even to the years of many generations.

Joel 2: 3. A fire devoureth before them; and behind them a flame burneth: the land is as the garden of Eden before them, and behind them a desolate wilderness; yea, and nothing shall escape them.

Joel 2: 4. The appearance of them is as the appearance of horses; and as horsemen, so shall they run. 5Like the noise of chariots on the tops of mountains shall they leap, like the noise of a flame of fire that devoureth the stubble, as a strong people set in battle array.

Joel 2: 6. Before their face the people shall be much pained: all faces shall gather blackness.

Joel 2: 7. They shall run like mighty MEN; they shall climb the wall like men of war; and they shall march every one on his ways, and they shall not break their ranks:

Joel 2: 8. Neither shall one thrust another; they shall walk every one in his path: and when THEY FALL UPON THE SWORD, they shall NOT BE WOUNDED.

Joel 2: 9. They shall run to and fro in the city; they shall run upon the wall, they shall climb up upon the houses; they shall enter in at the windows like a thief.

Joel 2: 10. The earth shall quake before them; the heavens shall tremble: the sun and the moon shall be dark, and the stars shall withdraw their shining:

Joel 2: 11. And the LORD shall utter his voice before HIS ARMY: for HIS CAMP is very great: for he is STRONG that executeth his word: for the day of the LORD is great and very terrible; and who can abide it?

Joel 2: 12. Therefore also now, saith the LORD, turn ye even to me with all your heart, and with fasting, and with weeping, and with mourning:

There is an angel and he has been introduced to us in Rev 9: 1. And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and TO HIM WAS GIVEN A KEY of the BOTTOMLESS PIT.

Rev 9: 11. And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon


Rev 20:1. Angel comes down from heaven with a great chain.
WITH THE KEY TO THE PIT.

Rev20: 1. And I saw an angel come down from heaven, HAVING THE KEY of the BOTTOMLESS PIT and a great chain in his hand.

Rev 20: 2. He grabs Satan & ties him up for the Millennium.

Rev 20: 2. And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a THOUSAND YEARS,
 
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Rev 20:3. Seals Satan in pit for the Millennium. He will not be able
Deceive anyone until the 1000 years are up.

3. And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more TILL THE THOUSAND YEARS SHOULD BE FULFILLED: and after that he must be loosed a LITTLE SEASON.

Rev 20: 4. During the 1000 years, judgement is given to God’s
Children, to judge the dead who are yet to be raised
At the second resurrection OF DAMNATION when they are to be burned.

Rev 20: 4. And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgement was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

What about the wicked dead not raised yet?

In Rev 20: 5. The rest of the dead those killed at Armageddon and those without faith who were not in the book of life and not raised at the second coming, stay dead until the 1000 years are up!
God’s children reign as Priests with Him a 1000
Years!

Rev 20: 5. But the REST OF THE DEAD LIVED NOT again UNTILL THE THOUSAND YEARS WERE FINISHED.

Will the dead who are to be raised after the 1000 years get a blessing?
Or will they get burned to death?

The first resurrection of life, and all those at the second coming have received a blessing at the wedding supper, nobody does after it!

Rev 20: 6 God’s children are blessed for being a part of the first
Resurrection. The promised blessing, of Daniel 12:12 is fulfilled. The second death can’t effect them. Some find it so hard to see that Daniel goes right to the end and claim that “Daniel is all a done deal in the past.”
Some folk make a BIG issue out of the fact that because Daniel does not mention the Millennium it is a problem.
Their argument is based heavily on that fact, in arguing that there is no 1000 years separating the two resurrections.
Well that is nonsense because some of the Saints have been raised 1900 years ago.
That fact alone makes their unsound reasoning ridiculously implausible.

Daniel does not mention the “false prophet” or the “two witnesses” or the “thousand years” or “Armageddon,” But, Revelation does, and only fools ignore the facts because they show as erroneous their man made and strange teachings, the teachings of proud foolish men!

The blessing is given, the blessing of Daniel 12: 12 is received.

Rev 20: 6. Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

In Rev 20: 7. The 1000 years is now up and Satan is released to deceive
Those raised at the second resurrection.
I know that the wicked have been raised because the 1000 year period is up because we have been told. “But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished.” In Rev 20 :5.

Rev 20: 7. And WHEN the THOUSAND YEARS are EXPIRED, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

Rev 20: 8. Nations are deceived by Satan. He gathers them for war.

Rev 20: 8. And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea

Rev 20: 9. They surround the camp of God and His city. Are the righteous mentioned? Yes the are in the city of God and not like the wicked who are outside of it over the breadth of Earth.

How do I know that this is the second “resurrection of Damnation” as John calls it and the resurrection of “everlasting contempt” spoken of by Daniel?
The answer is they ALL go up in flames and NOT ONE of them is mentioned as being righteous or as being written in the Book of life.
Also it’s a bit late, 1000 years later to expect a second wedding supper blessing.

Rev 20: 9. And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the SAINTS about, and the beloved city: and FIRE CAME DOWN FROM GOD out of heaven, and DEVOURED THEM.

In Rev 20:10. Satan is thrown in the lake of fire where the false
Prophet and beast were thrown earlier. The rest are
Burned with fire!

Rev 20: 10. And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Has the hour come for all to hear His voice?
Has the following prophecy now been fulfilled?

John 5: 29.. And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Have ALL the following verses been fulfilled?

Daniel 12: 1. And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. 2And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.


In Rev 20: 11. Our great God makes the old heaven and the Earth flee away.

Rev 20: 11. And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.

The way they were judged was fair as the records now show.
In Rev 20:12. John sees the dead as they were judged out of the
Books.

Rev 20: 12. And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

In Rev 20.13. They were all judged according to their works fairly.

Rev 20: 13. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

In Rev 20:14. Death hell are thrown into the fire of all consuming.

Rev 20: 14. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

As the Bible says they WERE thrown into the lake of fire because they were not found in the Book of life.

Rev 20: 15. And whosoever was NOT FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF LIFE was cast into the LAKE OF FIRE.

Rev 20:15. As we know all who were not in the book of life
Were destroyed.

Chapter 21
Rev 21:1. A new Earth for the old is no more. No sea!
And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea


Rev 21:2. The city of God descends upon the new Earth.
2. And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them,

How easy was that to understand?
 
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I find this subject terribly interesting and I pray you do as well. I have really answered all of Atkin’s questions in the above study so I will keep it brief and deal with the remarks of Atkin.

Atkin quote.
The Bible says it but you cannot understand what the Bible says if YOU FORCE Revelation 5 in between where it does not belong.

My reply.
I did not “force anything!

Atkin ,,,,,
Let me help you you asked --Does the BIBLE say that the Saints were raised AFTER the millennium?


My reply.
Yes The BIBLE says this.
“But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished.”
So they will be resurrected after the 1000 years boy if you can’t grasp that fact then you need counselling in comprehension skills.

Atkin,,,,
Daniel 12:2 answers your question
The Saints resurrected to everlasting life.
So simple.

My reply.
Daniel 12: 2. And AT THAT TIME shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a TIME OF TROUBLE, such as never was since there was a nation even to THAT TIME: AND AT THAT TIME thy PEOPLE SHALL BE DELIVERED, EVERY ONE that shall be FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK.
The above happens during the tribulation period, when the second coming occurs and to those who are found written in the book of life are raised.
They are the good folk.

Thessalonians 4:16. For the Lord himself shall DESCEND FROM HEAVEN with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the DEAD IN CHRIST RISE FIRST:
17THEN WE which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
Rev 20: This is the first resurrection. 6Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
The righteous are first found written in the book of life before they are raised not after their resurrection.
The same applies to the wicked they are judged first DURING THE 1000 years,,, then they are raised after the 1000 years are up.

Now for the wicked they are judged, and that is done during the 1000 years, then they are raised unto the resurrection of damnation!
Do you get it Atkin? Has the penny dropped yet?
They are judged during the millennium and are not raised before it is past.

Rev 20 5. “But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished.”

Daniel 12: 2. many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.


The resurrection of damnation after the 1000 years. Rev 20 5. “But the rest of THE DEAD LIVED NOT AGAIN UNTIL THE THOUSAND YEARS WERE FINISHED.”
Rev 20: 7. And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

8. And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9. And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and FIRE CAME DOWN FROM GOD OUT OF HEAVEN, AND DEVOURED THEM.
Do you understand Atkin, that they all burn, and that, that is the second resurrection of damnation.

Atkin ,,,,
Do you have difficulty understand the MEANING OF AT THAT TIME in Daniel 12:1 I REPEAT AT THAT TIME
AT THAT SAME TIME --- both resurrection to life AND AT THAT SAME TIME RESURRECTION to damnation.
It is amazing to see the efforts you make at twisting the scripture.

My reply.
You accuse me of “twisting the scripture?”

The words you add (“and at that SAME TIME resurrection to damnation” ) ARE NOT FOUND IN DANIEL 12:1.
In the first part of Daniel’s verse 1. the righteous are saved first during the “time of trouble.”
Then when their names are found in the book during “the time of trouble” that is when the second coming will occur, as has my last short study proved we are then raised.

But the wicked are judged during the 1000 years and they are raised after their judgement after the 1000 years.
Now if the wicked are judged during the millennium how can they be raised before their judgement call is decided by the resurrected Saints? Your timing is off!

Daniel 12: 1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which STANDETH FOR THY CHILDREN OF THY PEOPLE: and there SHALL BE A TIME OF TROUBLE, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and AT THAT TIME THY PEOPLE SHALL BE DELIVERED, EVERYONE that shall be FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK.
The time of trouble is when Michael shall stand for the good people only, and that happens at the second coming.


Daniel 12: 2. And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
At the end of the 1000 years when the unrighteous are raised at the resurrection of damnation then Daniel 12: 2. will have been fulfilled and not before. So stop trying to force a construct to suite you’re churchly learned theories.


Atkin ,,,
If you do not understand Revelation 20:5 and Rev 20:7, avoid misplacing them in Daniel 12.

My reply.
Now you are one to talk telling me what I don’t understand when you could not even answer one of those questions I asked of you about Rev and Daniel. You got 0 out of 20 questions. So you are in no position to judge others when you have a dismally poor record yourself!

Atkin ,,,
This is so simple to prove.
DANIEL SAID AT THAT TIME.....AT THAT TIME SOME WILL RISE TO LIFE AND SOME TO EVERLASTING SHAME AND CONTEMPT.


My reply.
Yeah! You are the one verse wonder man, is that the best you can do? It does NOT say the resurrections occurs “AT THE SAME TIME” only you do.
In order to get yourself out of the churchly taught religious mess you find yourself in, you start making up things that ARE NOT in the Bible.


Let’s see if you are telling the truth by reading DANIEL 12:1-2?
Daniel 12:1. And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy PEOPLE SHALL BE DELIVERED EVERYONE that shall be FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK.
 
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Again Daniel speaks of the “righteous” “at that time” during “the tribulation” when they will be saved. Note Atkin the wicked are not yet mention as being raised with them at all.
“At that time” means at the “time of trouble” when the righteous are saved after the 1335 days. AT THAT TIME of TROUBLE where Daniel states it lasts for 1335 days UNTILL THEY receive A BLESSING.
When all the righteous are raised at the resurrection of life at the second coming then later the wicked will be raised at the resurrection of damnation as we have studied in Revelation, occurs after 1000 years.
The next verse will then be fulfilled.
Daniel 12:2. “And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.”

Atkin ,,,,
AT THAT TIME.... NOT AT TIMES BUT AT THE SAME TIME.....
THE GOOD PEOPLE ARE DELIVERED (some to everlasting life) AND AT THE SAME TIME THE BAD ARE CONDEMNED (and some to shame and everlasting contempt.”
AT THAT SAME TIME

My reply.
You have added the words “at the SAME TIME,” again! They are your own words!
They are NOT in Daniel 12: 2.
The Bible says, that this is what will happen to folk that do as you have just done.
Rev 22:18. For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man SHALL ADD UNTO THESE THINGS, GOD SHALL ADD UNTO HIM the PLAGUES that are written in this book:
19. And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.


Atkin ,,,,
AT THAT TIME...... do you get it now??
This is elementary English.

My reply.
Yes it is “At that time,” what time? “The time of trouble.”
What happens at the” time of trouble?”
God delivers “thy people” “found in the Book of life.” At the second advent, so get used to it.
That does not include the wicked dead, or the wicked living, they are left behind.
See Luke 17:35.
Daniel 12:1. And AT THAT TIME shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for THE CHILDREN OF THY PEOPLE: and there shall be A TIME OF TROUBLE, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy PEOPLE SHALL BE DELIVERED EVERYONE that shall be FOUND WRITTEN IN THE BOOK.
Daniel speaks firstly of the resurrection of life then again firstly in verse two before he gets to the resurrection of damnation. In that order he places them just as is done in the next verse.
This matches 1 Thessalonians 4 16. When Jesus descends at His second coming! None of the wicked are mentioned.

1 Thessalonians 4 16. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the DEAD IN CHRIST SHALL RISE FIRST: 17Then we which are ALIVE and remain SHALL BE CAUGHT UP TOGETHER with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
Are the wicked mentioned in the Daniel 12: 1. “at that time” “the time of trouble” as being raised and in the last verse? NO! Do verses 16, 17, sof I Thessalonians mention the wicked being raised? NO! So down the drain goes your theory.

Atkin.,,
Daniel 12:2. “And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, [AT THE SAME TIME] some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.” THE SAME TIME ..NO TIME GAP

My reply.
Daniel 12: 2. Many of those whose bodies lie dead and buried will rise up, some to everlasting life and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
Are the words ( “at the same time” ) mentioned in Daniel 12: 2.?

No! They are not, who do you think you are? A second Daniel?
You add your own words to try and win points, that is a sign of desperation,
and of great arrogance, you need a humble heart, that is why you do not understand Daniel or Revelation because you are indoctrinated and are making a construct to try and salvage churchly taught religious dogmas


Atkin ,,,
DANIEL 12:2 THE SAME TIME SOME TO LIFE -- AND SOME TO SHAME.
Do not reply to this post since your point is baseless.
The Bible will not be selectively quoted to suit you.

My reply.
Don’t reply? You wish!
You have proved that you can’t let the Bible speak for itself you are in direct conflict with Rev 22: 18.
Rev 22 18. And I SOLEMNLY declare to everyone who hears the prophetic words of this book: IF ANYONE ADDS ANYTHING to what is WRITTEN HERE, God will add to that person the plagues described in this book.
When pride drives a person to break the rules, just to try to prove themselves right, instead of the Bible right then that is pride gone wild and leads to self destruction.

Well you can’t get away with it Atkin, there are a lot of folk out there that know their Bibles, and will see right through you.

Maranatha.

Prophecy Countdown.
 
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Justme

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Hi PC,

I really don't believe you are still flogging this. I doubt there is a single soul here that is buying your 'at two different times' resurrection scenario, but as I said it doesn't have any bearing on things anyway.

Follow carefully.

The first resurrection are those who reign with Jesus for 1000 years.Who cares who they are for now!!!!!!Rev 20:4 and 6

The REST of the DEAD do NOT rise until the 1000 years are over.Who cares who they are for now!!!!!!!!!!Rev 20:5

There are some people being resurrected before the ones who are alive at the parousia..BEFORE, BEFORE....1 Thess 4:15..not verse 16, verse 15!!!!

Do you understand this part?

Justme
 
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Linda8

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Prophecy Countdown said:
Rev 22 18. And I SOLEMNLY declare to everyone who hears the prophetic words of this book: IF ANYONE ADDS ANYTHING to what is WRITTEN HERE, God will add to that person the plagues described in this book.
When pride drives a person to break the rules, just to try to prove themselves right, instead of the Bible right then that is pride gone wild and leads to self destruction.



Maranatha.

Prophecy Countdown.

That describes you perfectly, desperately seeing things that are NOT in verses leading to fallacies.

Mr Revelation 20:7 single verse repeater.
 
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Prophecy Countdown

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Linda8 said:
That describes you perfectly, desperately seeing things that are NOT in verses leading to fallacies.

Mr Revelation 20:7 single verse repeater.

How clever and enlightening you are. I must write that down for posterity. :sleep:

Has anyone got a needle and thread, so that I can to stitch up my sides from laughing? :D ;)
 
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Linda8 said:
Please cease your mixture of Revelation 20:5 and Revelation 20:9
It is wrong doctrine and cannot be justified whatsoever. Avoid moulding the word to suit your personal plan.

Revelation 20: 5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

Revelation 20:8.And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog

You must understand that Revelation 20:5 does not in any way whatsoever lend itself to your theory of those resurrecting at the end of 1000 years making up the NATIONS at the 4 quarters of the earth.

Revelation 20:8.And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

Kindly stop confusing and mixing up the millions of the people in the nations Revelation 20:8 GOG AND MAGOG with the rest of the dead who resurrect after 1000 years Revelation 20:5.

The nations GOG and Magog in Revelation 20:9 who followed Satan were not empty GHOST nations... for you imply they were INSTANTLY populated by millions of dead people who had suddenly resurrected to life after 1000 years. That is fairly inaccurate doctrine. Please discuss and seek teachings on this error.

These errors typically occur when you try to rewrite scripture.
The Holy Bible does NOT SUPPORT this. Rev 20:8 the nations Gog and Magog ARE not those who resurrect after 1000 years.



Linda8
Please cease your mixture of Revelation 20:5 and Revelation 20:9
It is wrong doctrine and cannot be justified whatsoever. Avoid moulding the word to suit your personal plan.

Linda8
Revelation 20: 5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

My reply. :idea:
You forgot Rev 20: 6 and 7. You let a verse reference number 6 dictate THE clear intent of what the Bible states?
You conveniently forget that the wedding supper which is after the resurrection of life has already occurred in Rev 19 and Armageddon has been a victory for Jesus and the Saints, Rev 19: 21. In Rev 20:1,2 Satan has already been bound.
So with that in mind we have to understand what the next battle is about that occurs AFTTER the thousand years?
This next battle ends with fire before it even starts, unlike Armageddon where they are all put to the sword and are eaten by the birds.
Rev 20: 5. But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished.
We have those that have been resurrected and standing IN HEAVEN being blessed.
The resurrection of All found in the book of life has been completed in Rev 19.
You conveniently forget that the wedding supper which is after the resurrection of life has already occurred in Rev 19 and Armageddon has been a victory for Jesus and the Saints. In Rev 20:1,2 Satan has already been bound.
The wicked living were left behind and the wicked dead staid dead and were NOT a part of the first resurrection of life.

Rev 20 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This the first resurrection.6 This the first resurrection. 6.
Do you think that those that are not resurrected to life in verse 5.are part of the resurrection of life? Obviously you do because of a number 6 placed after the sentence This the first resurrection. 6 in the year1611AD in the King James version.

What happens to the, quote, “rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished” in verse 5?

7And when THE THOUSAND YEARS ARE EXPIRED, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, 8And shall go out TO DECEIVE THE NATIONS which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together TO BATTLE: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and FIRE CAME DOWN FROM GOD out of heaven, and DEVOURED THEM.
It is impossible that those that do not live again after the thousand years and deluded by Satan and destroyed by fire from God are blessed and are a part of the resurrection of life.
Now let’s see the intent of the BIBLE and ignore your poor rendering of it!
“The Authorised King James version which was originally produced by a group of 54 scholars under the direction of King James of England in 1611AD.
The original writings did not have verses or chapters.

Rev 20:5. But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This the first resurrection.

Now don’t tell me that the dead not yet raised are a part of the first resurrection of life. Quote, “ This the first resurrection.6” and applies to the previous sentence in verse 5 just because the number 6 is placed after the word “resurrection,” in 1611 in the King James version. They are Book referencing points only and have no influence or value over the INTENT of scripture.
How does the Bible read without verse numbers

Armageddon Has now been completed and ALL the wicked remain dead as previously explained.
BIBLE
The remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which proceeded out of his mouth and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.
I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand, he laid hold on the dragon that old serpent which is the Devil, Satan and bound him a thousand years cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled.
After that he must be loosed a little season.
I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them.
The souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands, they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years
But the REST OF THE DEAD lived not again until the thousand years were finished.

This the first resurrection. Blessed and holy he that hath part in the first resurrection on such the second death hath no power, they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

When the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prisons, Shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle.

The number of whom as the sand of the sea.
They went up on the breadth of the earth, compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city.
Fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
The devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Maranatha.
Prophecy Countdown. :clap:
 
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