A forever hell

[Der Alte]

Another tract from ETЯUS?

I like that "Я." The name of that character in Cyrillic is "yah." I decided to study Russian back about the time John Glenn took his first flight..
Not a tract that is the culmination of 2 decades+ on this same forum. I realized early on that the same tired old arguments and the same out-of-context proof texts are posted over and over again ad nauseum, so I started saving my replies and revising them as I made new discoveries. You're lucky you get the 2021 edition.

 

[Saint Steven]

[I decided to remove the image I posted because some might see it as sacrilegious]

Wow, "sacrilegious" is a curious word. I agree that we don't want to be overly offensive, but a bit of sacrilege is probably healthy. As the saying goes, "Sacred cow makes the best hamburger." - lol

Sorry to hear about your accident/injuries. I pray for rapid healing/pain relief and the provision of transportation for you. Not to mention a generous settlement. - AMEN

 

[Clare73]

Very defensive Clare. Even the suggestion of the KJV's use as a doorstop can bring the KJVOs down on you like fire from heaven. I happen to own a 1650 or so edition of the KJV, it's like a grimoire, a huge bound thing. The KJV is high English literate and poetic. Like all other translations, it has its pros and cons imho. We shouldn't use any Bible as a doorstop.

Thy speech doth betray thee.

 

[ozso]

I like that "Я." The name of that character in Cyrillic is "yah." I decided to study Russian back about the time John Glenn took his first flight..
Not a tract that is the culmination of 2 decades+ on this same forum. I realized early on that the same tired old arguments and the same out-of-context proof texts are posted over and over again ad nauseum, so I started saving my replies and revising them as I made new discoveries. You're lucky you get the 2021 edition.

I got the idea from your "URitesRUS.C0M" which of course is a takeoff from "Toys Я Us" . You crack me up with the constant historical references. I can tell your posts are often delivered bot fashion from an archive. Someone else made a near identical post to one of those. I don't know if he lifted it from you, or if you both lifted it from some website.

 

[ozso]

Wow, "sacrilegious" is a curious word. I agree that we don't want to be overly offensive, but a bit of sacrilege is probably healthy. As the saying goes, "Sacred cow makes the best hamburger." - lol

Sorry to hear about your accident/injuries. I pray for rapid healing/pain relief and the provision of transportation for you. Not to mention a generous settlement.

Der Alte called it "blasphemous", but I thought "sacrilegious" was closer to what he meant. I decided it might possibly offend others who don't realize it's aimed at a doctrine and not at our Lord or scripture.

Thanks. I'm driving a rental for the time being.

 

[Der Alte]

I got the idea from your "URitesRUS.C0M" which of course is a takeoff from "Toys Я Us" . You crack me up with the constant historical references. I can tell your posts are often delivered bot fashion from an archive. Someone else made a near identical post to one of those. I don't know if he lifted it from you, or if you both lifted it from some website.

Memory's a bit fuzzy at times but I don't think I copied from anyone else. My picture over there upper left was taken when FDR was in the 4th year of his second term.

 

[Der Alte]

Der Alte called it "blasphemous", but I thought "sacrilegious" was closer to what he meant. I decided it might possibly offend others who don't realize it's aimed at a doctrine and not at our Lord or scripture.
Thanks. I'm driving a rental for the time being.

"Sacrilegious" was the word I was looking for but I had a memory block. Hope your insurance pays for loaner. Someone backed into me with a wheel chair carrier in a parking lot once ruined my right front quarter. Fortunately insurance paid. The PL had cameras but none of them were pointing in the right direction.

 

[ozso]

Memory's a bit fuzzy at times but I don't think I copied from anyone else. My picture over there upper left was taken when FDR was in the 4th year of his second term.

All I know is someone on CF posted a list of quotes from early church fathers that was identical to one you posted. Sounds like you're a little younger than the senior pastor of the church I attend.

 

[Navair2]

What you showed is a difference in translating the same Greek text!!!

OK.
Then who translated it wrong and why?

 

[Andrewn]

OK. Then who translated it wrong and why?

You tell me why. But I dislike the NIV and when there is a discrepancy it is always an error in the NIV. For a long time I hoped that people would stop reading NIV. Now they're doing this but many are replacing it with NLT, which is even worse :-(.

 

[Saint Steven]

You tell me why. But I dislike the NIV and when there is a discrepancy it is always an error in the NIV. For a long time I hoped that people would stop reading NIV. Now they're doing this but many are replacing it with NLT, which is even worse :-(.

That would be an interesting topic. I have wanted to move away from the NIV, but it is so readable. I agree that moving to a paraphrase (like the NLT) is the wrong direction to go.

 

[Andrewn]

That would be an interesting topic. I have wanted to move away from the NIV, but it is so readable. I agree that moving to a paraphrase (like the NLT) is the wrong direction to go.

I've participated in a few discussions about Bible translations. The following discussions are interesting:

Bible Translations

Translations

 

[Neogaia777]

I think when you don't know very much of the original Hebrew or Greek, translations that use multiple words, or several different ways to describe things, etc, like the Amplified Versions of the Bible, etc, are very useful, and very handy, etc, and gives you a very much more accurate, and good, and in my opinion, very much more far better, more accurate general idea and understanding of what the original Hebrew or Greek was meant to mean, or was trying to describe and/or convey, etc, or imply or express or convey, etc, very good study Bibles when you don't know very much of that like me, etc, as I just know that much of the original Bibles/Scrolls, in their original languages, etc, had more than one meaning from many of the words we now use in and from many of our modern day languages we now use today, etc...

So one that uses multiple different words, and that adds just a little bit more added description at times, can be very useful, and very handy, etc...

Anyway,

God Bless!

 

[GOD Shines Forth!]

I have wanted to move away from the NIV, but it is so readable.

So true. Whenever I’m on BibleHub comparing translations I find the NIV to just roll off the tongue. I switched to ESV years ago because I found a good audio version of it, but I learned a lot of the Word through the NIV (used to have audio cassettes of it, too). I have never understood the hate for it.

 

[Psalm 27]

Halo there,

not very long time ago we had a discussion in our chalcedonian orthodox forum with a catholic and our orthodox priest if there is a for ever hell. Well the catholic could not name any text passeges or so but he had good reason to say hell can never be for ever. I "miss the times" so to say, do not know how to say it otherwise, when people had neither bible nor church and had themselves direct contact to God. They were better in that times. How can you think God will punish forever? This is impossible. It is so that God leads the church to say such things because we people need the anxiety to be saved! This is nothinig more than church politics. There will never be a for ever hell but a very long hell. This is absolutely enough to be afraid. enough to be saved.

God will never make someone suffer without reason and never for ever. I know this because I wanted to jump from 14th floor more than 10 years ago and God started talking to me. Therefore I also know about the frequency and possibility of reincaranation, ment that a soul can be born again(in another body on earth)! This does not change that Jesus came to earth. I wish all a good experience this year with Pascha/Easter. I would like to know your sincere opinions. Leave politics aside. Do you really think God will "kill" you for ever by never ever again delivering you from hell? You should always think the best of God, you know and use your reason also. Your reason existed before the bible. And I heard this passage is translated wrongly, it could mean for ever and it could mean one aeon/one million years or so.

What does Jesus say on the subject of hell? He is The authority on this subject. No politics, but His plain words

 

[ozso]

What does Jesus say on the subject of hell? He is The authority on this subject. No politics, but His plain words

Like others are saying above, what Jesus says depends on how one translates the Greek recordings of what he said in Aramaic. For starters his name wasn't even Jesus, but rather Yeshua.

If you traveled back in time to when and where Jesus was speaking, you wouldn't understand a word he said without subtitles.

 

[ozso]

That would be an interesting topic. I have wanted to move away from the NIV, but it is so readable. I agree that moving to a paraphrase (like the NLT) is the wrong direction to go.

My background has always been either the NKJV or the NSAB. Most pastors I knew used one or the other. But I also like the NIV because it's so readable. And sometimes I'll take a look at verses in Eugene Peterson's extreme paraphrase called The Message.

 

[Lazarus Short]

Well, since the thread has drifted into a translation discussion, I'll share. When I became a Christian, I read the New American Standard, which has now spent years on the shelf, unread. I remember it was "choppy" to read. Later, I got an NIV, an expen$ive one, but eventually sold it at the local used Christian book store. After that, under the influence of what I was reading, I sent off for a Ferrar Fenton Bible - I liked it "warts and all." I have a YLT, but don't use it much, as the font is too small. Lately, I'm reading a version simply called "The Scriptures," from a group in South Africa, and I like it a lot. The KJV has always been around, but I'm no longer an advocate - I use it for reference, research and often, quotes.

 

[Saint Steven]

I've participated in a few discussions about Bible translations. The following discussions are interesting:

Bible Translations

Translations

Thanks. I'll check those out.

 

[Saint Steven]

So true. Whenever I’m on BibleHub comparing translations I find the NIV to just roll off the tongue. I switched to ESV years ago because I found a good audio version of it, but I learned a lot of the Word through the NIV (used to have audio cassettes of it, too). I have never understood the hate for it.

Thanks. I agree.
The craziest criticism I have ever heard is the claim the there are verses missing in the NIV translation. That these verses were intentionally left out. Say what? As it turns out, there are verses that don't need to be there. It is essentially a translation fix.

16 verses missing from the NIV