My `homework` on Daniel`s 4 beasts.

Marilyn C said:

So those kingdoms/kings are not in the same time.

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Correct.

Marilyn C said:

So how then can they be the `kings` in the days that God will set up His kingdom rule through Israel?

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God set up His Kingdom during the days of Roman Emperor Tiberius.

Douggg said:

I never said Israel anoints XXXX. The false prophet will anoint XXXX the King of Israel.

XXXX is an abominable branch. Jesus is the righteous branch. Descended from David.

XXXX destroys his land and his people.

Isaiah 14:
18 All the kings of the nations, even all of them, lie in glory, every one in his own house.

19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.

20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.

Daniel 11:
37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.


XXXX will be killed by strangers for going into the temple, sitting, claiming to be God. Ezekiel 28:1-10.

Not at the midpoint, but before then. At the Midpoint - "that is a false teaching that you have learned from someone" (to use your words).

The AoD is the statue image made of XXXX after XXXX has been killed and come back to life. Setup 1335 days before Jesus returns. On day 1185. day 1260 is the midpoint.

You are holding a false teaching regarding the mid-point, Nolidad, "that you have learned from someone" (to use your words).

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I always thought it was mid week. Maybe I'm missing something?

but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate.”

3I saw one of his heads as if it had been slain, and his fatal wound was healed. And the whole earth was amazed and followed after the beast; 4they worshiped the dragon because he gave his authority to the beast; and they worshiped the beast, saying, “Who is like the beast, and who is able to wage war with him?” 5There was given to him a mouth speaking arrogant words and blasphemies, and authority to act for forty-two months was given to him. 6And he opened his mouth in blasphemies against God, to blaspheme His name and His tabernacle, that is, those who dwell in heaven.

“How long will it be until the end of these wonders?” 7I heard the man dressed in linen, who was above the waters of the river, as he raised his right hand and his left toward heaven, and swore by Him who lives forever that it would be for a time, times, and half a time; and as soon as they finish shattering the power of the holy people, all these events will be completed.

Running2win said:

I always thought it was mid week. Maybe I'm missing something?

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mid week is right. But mid-point is not.

We don't have enough information to know the exact day that XXXX stops the daily sacrifice (Daniel 8:11). And then goes into the temple sits and and claims to be God (the transgression of desolation in Daniel 8:12-13).

We do know that XXXX's transgression of desolation act is sometime in the middle part of the week, still in the first half of the week - because those events have to precede the setting up of the AoD on the temple mount with 1335 days left in the seven year.

jgr said:

God set up His Kingdom during the days of Roman Emperor Tiberius.

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Not even. When God sets up His Everlasting Kingdom here on earth - men will learn war no more. Meaning the nations are not going to be going to war against one another.

Douggg said:

mid week is right. But mid-point is not.

We don't have enough information to know the exact day that XXXX stops the daily sacrifice (Daniel 8:11). And then goes into the temple sits and and claims to be God (the transgression of desolation in Daniel 8:12-13).

We do know that XXXX's transgression of desolation act is sometime in the middle part of the week, still in the first half of the week - because those events have to precede the setting up of the AoD on the temple mount with 1335 days left in the seven year.



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I always had it in my mind that it will happen during the Passover feast. Christians and Jews will both all be in Jerusalem then. And what a great time for a the counterfeit resurrection of the beast.

Running2win said:

I always had it in my mind that it will happen during the Passover feast. Christians and Jews will both all be in Jerusalem then. And what a great time for a the counterfeit resurrection of the beast.

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It could. I don't know.

I don't think I would call the coming back to life of the beast "a resurrection" because in Isaiah 14:18-20, it indicates that his body will not be buried in a fancy tomb like other well known kings. But his soul figuratively cast out of the grave - which I think what will happen is that during the globally broadcast funeral, open casket review - XXXX will suddenly sit up in the casket back alive.

Revelation 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

Douggg said:

Not even. When God sets up His Everlasting Kingdom here on earth - men will learn war no more. Meaning the nations are not going to be going to war against one another.

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Colossians 1
12 Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:
13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

Have you been translated into His Kingdom?

Marilyn C said:

Hi Richard,

The 3 Benelux countries had a customs agreement in 1944, (Benelux Customs Union) and then when they joined the Treaty of Paris in 1951, they continued as a Customs union.

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Yes, the did but the wider European Agreement was totally separate and different. So to count them as one in the Euro group, when they each had individual representation is in the Euro body, seems quite the stretch.

jgr said:

What's with the "we"?

I'm in the kingdom. I've been translated.

You haven't?

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If you have been translated, transported, they have Internet in Paradise? You have to physically die to enter the current kingdom. The kingdom is there waiting for you to complete your earthly mission. Right now, with the help of The Holy Spirit you wrestle against a spiritual enemy, not your fellow humanity. But you do not yet exist in the kingdom. The feeling that you do is just a temporary adrenaline rush in this sinful flesh and blood body, which cannot enter nor inherit the current kingdom. It is not by physical observation. It is by faith, and sight is rewarded at physical death.

Running2win said:

Yeah, we are reallly living in the kingdom age!.. Not!

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Well as far as yours and Mohamed's and the Mormons, JW's, Adventists etc etc vision of what that kingdom age will look like I would have to agree wholeheartedly. Of course I reject yours and their vision as false prophecy. Since the scripture has well over 100 chapters of prophecy about that age that describe it. I'm going to go with that.

Isaiah 2: 2 And it shall come to pass in the last days, [that] the mountain of the LORD'S house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.1 3 And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem. 4 And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.2 5 O house of Jacob, come ye, and let us walk in the light of the LORD.

So are you disputing that the believers both Old and New Testament are not the Lords house? That for the last two thousand years the peoples of all nations once they begin to hear the real gospel don't flow to God's saints, the Bible, a church? That is not where they learn of God's ways to walk in his paths? Are you denying that the Kingdom of God in ancient Israel was heavily reliant on the sword and the spear just to maintain the influence of Gods invisible kingdom in their midst but that with the coming of the Messiah. The sword and the spear were beat into farming instruments..... and the sower sows the word into the hearts of the peoples of all nations? That this is how the the Kingdom of God is spread? Not with the sword and the spear but with the preaching and teaching of the God's Word? Of course you not denying this. But your blinded as to the meaning of prophecy like this because of the false prophecy you've accepted as gospel truth. N

As to that blindness of heart. You just smugly ignored the prophecies I already gave you, of which I guess I'll have to point them out again below, because they cannot be made to fit into what you believe the future holds. Even though they have been coming to pass in the world now for 2000 years . Especially in the last 500 when the Roman Empire ended and immediately following that, for the first time in human history. The Bible started (illegally) getting into the hands of the general public. Isaiah 20:18 And in that day shall the deaf hear the words of the book, and the eyes of the blind shall see out of obscurity, and out of darkness. 19 The meek also shall increase [their] joy in the LORD, and the poor among men shall rejoice in the Holy One of Israel. 20 For the tyrannical one is brought to naught, and the scorner is consumed, and all that watch for iniquity are cut off: 21 That make a man an offender for a word, and lay a snare for him that reproved in the gate, and turn aside the just for a thing of naught.

Strange isn't it? The Roman empire ends. The world has known nothing but despotic human government and slavery for its entire existence. The Bible illegally gets into the hands of the general public in northern Europe. As usual and expecting the usual success. The despots raise a great army to destroy the people getting the Word but for the first time outside ancient Israel, lose. Then those northern Europeans who are reading their Bibles every day found the free world and the tyrannical despots of the world have been being slowly eliminated ever since, and the free world keeps slowly growing.

Isaiah 60: 3 And nations shall come to your light, and kings to the brightness of your rising. 4 Lift up your eyes all around, and see; they all gather together, they come to you; your sons shall come from afar, and your daughters shall be carried on the hip. 5 Then you shall see and be radiant; your heart shall thrill and exult, because the abundance of the sea shall be converted to you, the wealth of the nations shall come to you. (ESV)
So one hundred thousand people per day in the last 20 years coming to Christ isn't fulfilling this prophecy? Just 50 years ago Brazil, as one example was pretty much a mixture Roman Catholicism and animism. Now they claim to be 50% evangelical \ Pentecostal. One day maybe even in our lifetime we will wake up to the news that China has announced they are now a Christian nation. This isn't the "sea" meaning the nations being converted or turning to Christ, turning to the New Jerusalem?

Isaiah 49:6 He says: “It is too light a thing that you should be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob and to bring back the preserved of Israel; I will make you as a light for the nations, that my salvation may reach to the end of the earth.”...8 Thus said the LORD, In an acceptable time have I heard you, and in a day of salvation have I helped you: and I will preserve you, and give you for a covenant of the people, to establish the earth, to cause to inherit the desolate heritages;

So, the salvation of Christ is not reaching to the ends of the earth? Of course you say. But why do you ignore that he is establishing the earth not destroying it. That he came to do that?

42:Behold my servant, (the messiah) whom I uphold; my elect, in whom my soul delights; I have put my spirit on him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles. 2 He shall not cry, nor lift up, nor cause his voice to be heard in the street. 3 A bruised reed shall he not break, and the smoking flax shall he not quench: he shall bring forth judgment to truth. 4 He shall not fail nor be discouraged, till he have set justice in the earth: and the isles shall wait for his law. 5 Thus said God the LORD, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which comes out of it; he that gives breath to the people on it, and spirit to them that walk therein: 6 I the LORD have called you in righteousness, and will hold your hand, and will keep you, and give you for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles; 7 To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.

What is this about bringing justice to the earth? And when you compare the free world that is based in Biblical principle to the ancient world. When you compare it to the world not yet transformed by the Gospel and the influnce of God's Word. Has not Jesus been setting justice in the earth? Isn't the standard the rule of his law? "Well we haven't arrived yet." Duh; but compared to what the world was for its entire existence to the free world. Its like night and day.

Now I have got a hundred chapters of this stuff. I'll be happy to keep sharing it with you.

Marilyn C said:

The `bride`revelation known before in the Old Testament. The Body of Christ is never called the bride.

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Rev. 21:9 And there came to me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come here, I will show you the bride, the Lamb's wife. 10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and showed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God.

I guess if you ignore all the references in the OT that illustratively call Gods people his wife, bride, spouse, beloved etc etc have now been changed into his bride being a physical city. You may be right. But are you just conveniently ignoring those three chapters of Isaiah I linked that describe our present world?

Marilyn C said:

I agree that the beast kingdoms are consecutive.

Now God has judged all the kingdoms of Babylon, Medes and Persians, Greece & Rome. They are ALL judged and gone. There is NO world Ruler at the moment, (though one is forming).

So I ask you which do you see as the `most terrifying beast, that devours, breaks in pieces and tramples.` (Dan. 7: 7)? The EU or Islam.

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It will be the next phase of the fourth beast! The fourth beast started with Rome but continues to this day!

Dan 7: 23 Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.

24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

Rome never conquered the whole world or even the whole known world or even the whole "civilized world" so this is yet to be!

Douggg said:

I never said Israel anoints XXXX. The false prophet will anoint XXXX the King of Israel.

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Well only the high priest can anoint a descendant of David as King! So now you are saying teh false prophet is Jewish as well?

Douggg said:

Isaiah 14:
18 All the kings of the nations, even all of them, lie in glory, every one in his own house.

19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.

20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.

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Ripping these passages out of context still doesn't prove this is the Antichrist- it is actually his Father Lucifer as the earlier verses show!

Douggg said:

Daniel 11:
37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.

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Too bad you didn't check with history! This is the prophecy of the battles of the kings that reigned after Alexander the great (the third beast, leopard with four wings) and the waist of brass

Douggg said:

Not at the midpoint, but before then. At the Midpoint - "that is a false teaching that you have learned from someone" (to use your words).

The AoD is the statue image made of XXXX after XXXX has been killed and come back to life. Setup 1335 days before Jesus returns. On day 1185. day 1260 is the midpoint.

You are holding a false teaching regarding the mid-point, Nolidad, "that you have learned from someone" (to use your words).

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Well AS your XXXX is the Antichrist and the prince of the people, He violates teh covenant midpoint as Daniel says by ending the sacrifice. Paul says that the man of sin enters into the temple and declares himself God. Jesus warns of the one who is the AOD (in Daniel it is a person not a thing)

Also given that REv. 12 has the Jews being saved for 3 1/2 years and the two witnesses witnessing 3 1/2 years and the outer court trampled for 3 1/2 years

And given that Revelation says that power was given to teh beast for 42 months after he rose- I take the Bible at face value and not rely on complicate maps and charts.

Douggg said:

XXXX will be killed by strangers for going into the temple, sitting, claiming to be God. Ezekiel 28:1-10.

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Now all you have to do is prove that the Prince of Tyre is another name for your XXXX.

Timtofly said:

If you have been translated, transported, they have Internet in Paradise? You have to physically die to enter the current kingdom. The kingdom is there waiting for you to complete your earthly mission. Right now, with the help of The Holy Spirit you wrestle against a spiritual enemy, not your fellow humanity. But you do not yet exist in the kingdom. The feeling that you do is just a temporary adrenaline rush in this sinful flesh and blood body, which cannot enter nor inherit the current kingdom. It is not by physical observation. It is by faith, and sight is rewarded at physical death.

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Your Scripture disproving Colossians 1:12-13?

nolidad said:

Well only the high priest can anoint a descendant of David as King! So now you are saying teh false prophet is Jewish as well?

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No, you are wrong about that. Saul and Samuel were anointed King of Israel by Samuel the prophet. And Solomon by Nathan the prophet. XXXX will be anointe the King of Israel, coming in his own name by the false prophet.

nolidad said:

Ripping these passages out of context still doesn't prove this is the Antichrist- it is actually his Father Lucifer as the earlier verses show!

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You are not understanding the mystery of the scarlet colored beast in Revelation 17:7.

The scarlet colored beast is Satan, who wants to exalt his throne, as Lucifer in Isaiah 14:12-14..

But like in revelation 17:8b, it is not talking about Satan, Lucifer, any longer in Isaiah 14:15-20, but about xxxx.

for Isaiah 14:20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.

....would not apply to Satan.