Israel-Hamas Thread II

[rjs330]

None of those offers gave the Palestinians a fully independent, sovereign state.

Yes they did. They just had to make it happen.

 

[ralliann]

Deadly Israeli strike on Rafah was a "tragic mistake," Netanyahu says​

At least 45 people were killed and 200 wounded after the Israeli strike hit a camp for displaced people, according to the government media office in Gaza.

The United Nation's High Commissioner for Human Rights Volker Türk has decried Israel's "horrific" strike on a camp housing displaced people in Rafah on Sunday.

"The images from the camp are horrific and point to no apparent change in the methods and means of warfare used by Israel that have already led to so many civilian deaths," Türk said in a statement Monday.

Were Hamas killed? It is claimed two senior officials were killed. If this is so, why were they in this camp, among these Palestinians? Or rather why did the un place this camp with Hamas?

 

[rjs330]

The UN also recognizes that Israel illegally occupies that territory and controls its borders.

You're just being disingenuous.

You didn't answer the question. Are they a state or not?

 

[JosephZ]

Yes they did. They just had to make it happen.

Every offer presented by Israel to date has prevented the creation of a sovereign Palestinian state. A state is not sovereign if another country puts restrictions on or has some level of control over its resources, airspace, borders, movement of its people, and/or security, which Israel has included to some degree in each of its proposals to the Palestinians over the years. I have asked you if you would accept what had been offered to the Palestinians in this post, but you never answered the question.

 

[Philip_B]

You didn't answer the question. Are they a state or not?

maybe the answer is not binomial!

 

[ralliann]

Every offer presented by Israel to date has prevented the creation of a sovereign Palestinian state. A state is not sovereign if another country puts restrictions on or has some level of control over its resources, airspace, borders, movement of its people, and/or security, which Israel has included to some degree in each of its proposals to the Palestinians over the years. I have asked you if you would accept what had been offered to the Palestinians in this post, but you never answered the question.

Wow, imagine the current Palestinian government having that sovereignty? No way...

 

[essentialsaltes]

Deadly Israeli strike on Rafah was a "tragic mistake," Netanyahu says​

At least 45 people were killed and 200 wounded after the Israeli strike hit a camp for displaced people, according to the government media office in Gaza.

The United Nation's High Commissioner for Human Rights Volker Türk has decried Israel's "horrific" strike on a camp housing displaced people in Rafah on Sunday.

"The images from the camp are horrific and point to no apparent change in the methods and means of warfare used by Israel that have already led to so many civilian deaths," Türk said in a statement Monday.

UN Security Council will hold emergency meeting today after Israeli strike in Rafah​

The UN Security Council will hold an emergency meeting today to discuss a deadly Israeli airstrikeon a displaced person tent camp in the southern Gaza city of Rafah on Sunday, according to a UN diplomat.

The meeting was requested by Algeria, the diplomat said.

 

[essentialsaltes]

This is why there is a need for a two-state solution, including the drawing of borders agreed to by both sides. The most practical solutions seem to involve "pre-1967 borders with land swaps".

Spain (and the EU and the UN) agrees.

Spain won’t recognize changes to Palestinian borders after 1967 unless agreed by all parties​

“Although it is not up to Spain to define the borders of other countries, our position is aligned with the UN Security Council resolutions 242 and 338, and with the position of the European Union. Therefore, we won’t recognize changes in the 1967 lines other than those agreed to by the parties,” [Prime Minister] Sanchez said.

 

[rjs330]

UN Security Council will hold emergency meeting today after Israeli strike in Rafah​

The UN Security Council will hold an emergency meeting today to discuss a deadly Israeli airstrikeon a displaced person tent camp in the southern Gaza city of Rafah on Sunday, according to a UN diplomat.

The meeting was requested by Algeria, the diplomat said.

I guess Hamas shouldn't have been there and the people in the camp shouldn't have let them. The complicity of the Paleatinians just continues.

 

[Philip_B]

I guess Hamas shouldn't have been there and the people in the camp shouldn't have let them. The complicity of the Paleatinians just continues.

It is odd that you should have taken that position when Netanyahu said the strike was a tragic mistake.

 

[rjs330]

It is odd that you should have taken that position when Netanyahu said the strike was a tragic mistake.

It sounds like Hamas was there at least in the area and Israel hit the area and it's strike started a fire and collateral deaths. Yea it was a tragic mistake and they were not actually targeting the civilians.
But with Hamas is the area, yea I absolutely believe they were there among the civilians. That's where they operate all the time. And you know why.
Once again Hamas is to blame. If they were far away this wouldn't have happened. But they operate close to civilian areas and in civilian areas in hope this kind of thing will occur. Once again Hamas is totally to blame. And Palestinians allow them to.

 

[Philip_B]

It sounds like Hamas was there at least in the area and Israel hit the area and it's strike started a fire and collateral deaths. Yea it was a tragic mistake and they were not actually targeting the civilians.
But with Hamas is the area, yea I absolutely believe they were there among the civilians. That's where they operate all the time. And you know why.
Once again Hamas is to blame. If they were far away this wouldn't have happened. But they operate close to civilian areas and in civilian areas in hope this kind of thing will occur. Once again Hamas is totally to blame. And Palestinians allow them to.

I don't buy that

 

[essentialsaltes]

I guess Hamas shouldn't have been there and the people in the camp shouldn't have let them. The complicity of the Paleatinians just continues.

You have hardened your heart even harder than Netanyahu's.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Deadly Israeli strike on Rafah was a "tragic mistake," Netanyahu says​

US-made munitions used in deadly strike on Rafah tent camp, CNN analysis shows​

In this image which CNN geolocated to the scene of Sunday's strike in Rafah, four explosive weapons experts identified the tail of a US-made GBU-39 small diameter bomb (SDB).

The GBU-39, which is manufactured by Boeing, is a high-precision munition “designed to attack strategically important point targets,” and result in low collateral damage, explosive weapons expert Chris Cobb-Smith told CNN Tuesday. However, “using any munition, even of this size, will always incur risks in a densely populated area,” said Cobb-Smith, who is also a former British Army artillery officer.

 

[essentialsaltes]

U.S. officials see strategic failure in Israel’s Rafah invasion
A number of current and former U.S. and Israeli officials expressed doubt that a full-scale invasion of Rafah would bring an end to the conflict or achieve the government’s goal of eliminating Hamas.
A broad, armored invasion into Rafah would ensure a quagmire and lead to more civilian deaths, said Alon Pinkas a veteran Israeli diplomat and former senior government adviser. “Wake up,” Pinkas said. “‘Toppling Hamas’ is only possible through diplomatic means.”

Israel confirms its forces are in central Rafah, defying international condemnation of operation in southern Gazan city​

The IDF statement confirms what eyewitnesses told CNN earlier this week, when tanks were spotted in central Rafah for the first time since it entered the city earlier this month.

“IDF troops in central Rafah located Hamas rocket launchers, terror tunnel shafts, and weapons. The troops also dismantled a Hamas weapons storage facility in the area,” the IDF said in the statement.

Israel’s incursion into Rafah earlier in May marked a new phase in its war against Hamas in Gaza, which has killed more than 36,000 Palestinians, according to health officials in the enclave, displaced the majority of the strip’s population and sparked a humanitarian catastrophe that has appalled international agencies.

Israel resumed fighting in northern Gaza earlier this month, despite having said it had dismantled Hamas’ command structure in the area back in January.

The renewed fighting show the challenges Israel faces in achieving its goal of destroying Hamas, with a top security official this month warning the war could last into next year.

 

[Valletta]

...and 6 months into the conflict, after Israel made this decision, we still don't know what progress the Israeli military has made in destroying the tunnel network. We do know the Israelis no longer have sufficient forces to take and hold territory as demonstrated by their need to return to the main hospital and root out hundreds of Hamas fighters last month (and in doing so, the hospital is completely non-functional). We also know that at least 30 thousands Palestinian lives have been lost, nearly 200 aid workers, etc. And thousands more face malnourshiment and starvation. It's hard for me to accept the military value gained (whatever that may be) is worth the human cost.

In World War II the Japanese were not stopped for many years and ended up killing approximately 30 million people. Iran today has a greater population than did Japan, and then add in Hezbollah and Hamas and and all of the rest. The Japanese goal was to conquer and enslave, the terrorist goal is to first kill every Jew and then every Christian. The majority of civilians have been killed by the deliberate actions of Hamas. Israel's goal is not to occupy, but to defeat the terrorists and free the hostages. Many of us don't want to see the terrorists eclipse the death toll of the Japanese.

 

[rjs330]

Israel confirms its forces are in central Rafah, defying international condemnation of operation in southern Gazan city​

The IDF statement confirms what eyewitnesses told CNN earlier this week, when tanks were spotted in central Rafah for the first time since it entered the city earlier this month.

“IDF troops in central Rafah located Hamas rocket launchers, terror tunnel shafts, and weapons. The troops also dismantled a Hamas weapons storage facility in the area,” the IDF said in the statement.

Israel’s incursion into Rafah earlier in May marked a new phase in its war against Hamas in Gaza, which has killed more than 36,000 Palestinians, according to health officials in the enclave, displaced the majority of the strip’s population and sparked a humanitarian catastrophe that has appalled international agencies.

Israel resumed fighting in northern Gaza earlier this month, despite having said it had dismantled Hamas’ command structure in the area back in January.

The renewed fighting show the challenges Israel faces in achieving its goal of destroying Hamas, with a top security official this month warning the war could last into next year.

However long it takes. Maybe the good Palestiniabs should join the Isreali forces andxwork with them. It might help end the war sooner. But then they might actually be a Hanas supporter and turn around and kill Isrealis instead. Like they were taught to. Never mind.

 

[Philip_B]

However long it takes. Maybe the good Palestiniabs should join the Isreali forces andxwork with them. It might help end the war sooner. But then they might actually be a Hanas supporter and turn around and kill Isrealis instead. Like they were taught to. Never mind.

I should mention that the people you are referring to are Palestinians that you are asking to join the Israeli forces, and the group you are referring to is Hamas. I can only assume that your misspelling of their names was intentional and as pointless as your proposed actions. I wonder what you feel about Palestinian Christians? Maybe that is who your "Never Mind" was directed to!?

 

[essentialsaltes]

Trump Is Desperate for Miriam Adelson's Cash. Her Condition: West Bank Annexation​

The former president and convicted felon is holding a fire sale on future presidential authority. Miriam Adelson wants to be his biggest donor, but in return she wants Israeli sovereignty over the West Bank

Well, that would certainly calm things down. The Adelsons have been deep pocket GOP donors for some time.

 

[rjs330]

I should mention that the people you are referring to are Palestinians that you are asking to join the Israeli forces, and the group you are referring to is Hamas. I can only assume that your misspelling of their names was intentional and as pointless as your proposed actions. I wonder what you feel about Palestinian Christians? Maybe that is who your "Never Mind" was directed to!?

Once again this is Hamas' fault in conjunction with their Palestinian supporters. There is really no way to tell them from anyone else. And the moment you think you can they blow themselves up and kill you.