Anyone have a brief overview of what is to come?

[Douggg]

whaaat???

"Came back"???

Please be serious.

I meant back in the 1st century. Not came back as in returned.

 

[Douggg]

When the Messiah appeared - 2000 years ago. "AFTER" the 69 weeks... which is the 70th -- "Then shall Messiah the prince"

25 So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks; it will be built again, with plaza and moat, even in times of distress. 26 Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off

4 days after, not 3 1/2 years after.

Jesus rode into Jerusalem, hailed as the messiah, King of Israel.

John 12:
12 On the next day much people that were come to the feast, when they heard that Jesus was coming to Jerusalem,

13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

4 days later, Jesus was crucified. The 70th week is still ahead.

 

[iamlamad]

4 days after, not 3 1/2 years after.

Jesus rode into Jerusalem, hailed as the messiah, King of Israel.

John 12:
12 On the next day much people that were come to the feast, when they heard that Jesus was coming to Jerusalem,

13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

4 days later, Jesus was crucified. The 70th week is still ahead.

Amen!

 

[BABerean2]

4 days after, not 3 1/2 years after.

Jesus rode into Jerusalem, hailed as the messiah, King of Israel.

John 12:
12 On the next day much people that were come to the feast, when they heard that Jesus was coming to Jerusalem,

13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

4 days later, Jesus was crucified. The 70th week is still ahead.

You are attempting to ignore the time when Christ's ministry began, which was 3 1/2 years before He was crucified.

Mat 3:16 When He had been baptized, Jesus came up immediately from the water; and behold, the heavens were opened to Him, and He saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and alighting upon Him.
Mat 3:17 And suddenly a voice came from heaven, saying, "This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased."

.

 

[BobRyan]

The fundamental timeline of the end times is the 7 years of Daniel 9:27. .

Daniel 9 does not have a seven year prophecy.

1. It has a 70 year prophecy in Daniel 9:1-7
2. It has a 490 year prophecy in Daniel 9:24-27 -- but it has no "7 year" prophecy.
3. All Bible timelines without exception are contiguous. So no slicing-dicing them up and scattering them all over history. This is irrefutable.

457B.C. - 27 A.D. -- 69 weeks (483 years)
(Christ is baptized, anointed for ministry as Messiah)
457B.C - 34 A.D. - 70 weeks... 490 years.
27A.D. Christ baptized, 31A.D. Crucified, 34 AD. Gospel goes to gentiles.


That means you cannot claim to have the last 2 years of Jeremiahs 70 year timeline that Daniel 9 mentions - happen 'starting tomorrow'.

And it means you cannot have the last 2 years of the 490 year timeline in Daniel 9 -starting tomorrow either.

All of that would be nonsense.

Dan 9
In the first year of Darius the son of Ahasuerus, of Median descent, who was made king over the kingdom of the Chaldeans— 2 in the first year of his reign, I, Daniel, observed in the books the number of the years which was revealed as the word of the Lord to Jeremiah the prophet for the completion of the desolations of Jerusalem, namely, seventy years

70 week timeline (490 years)

24 “Seventy weeks have been decreed for your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to make an end of sin, to make atonement for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the most holy place. 25 So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks; it will be built again, with plaza and moat, even in times of distress. 26 Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and have nothing, and the people of the prince who is to come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. And its end will come with a flood; even to the end there will be war; desolations are determined. 27 And he (Christ) will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate.”

"this is the new covenant in My blood "This cup is the new covenant in my blood, which is poured out for you" Luke 22:20

Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and have nothing, and the people of the prince who is to come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. And its end will come with a flood; even to the end there will be war; desolations are determined.

========================
27 And he (Christ) will make a firm covenant with the many for one week,

27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week:

Yes. seven weeks and sixty-two weeks; and one week... makes it 70 week - 490 year prophecy - using that consistent day-for-year model of apocalyptic texts.

==========================
and in the midst of the week he (Christ) shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease,

Heb 10
4 For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins. 5 Therefore, when He comes into the world, He says,
“Sacrifice and offering You have not desired,
But a body You have prepared for Me;
6 In whole burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin You have taken no pleasure.
7 “Then I said, ‘Behold, I have come
(In the scroll of the book it is written of Me)
To do Your will, O God.’”
8 After saying above, “Sacrifices and offerings and whole burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin You have not desired, nor have You taken pleasure in them” (which are offered according to the Law), 9 then He said, “Behold, I have come to do Your will.” He takes away the first in order to establish the second. 10 By this will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

The Bible provides its own fulfillment statements in Christ - for the predictions made in the greatest Messianic prophecy in the Bible.

Jeremiah's 70 years is the time Israel would be in Babylon captivity.

A contiguous timeline that if "sliced-and-diced" and scattered all through history - would mean the Jews would STILL be in Babylon.

Just stating "the obvious" at that point.

The 70 weeks (of years) is the time determined on Daniel's people and Jerusalem.

True.

24 “Seventy weeks have been decreed for your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to make an end of sin, to make atonement for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness

The 70 week - 490 year timeline began in 457 B.C. with the decree of Artaxerxes -- Ezra 6:14 says it was a 3 part decree and started with Cyrus -- ending with Artaxerxes.

536 B.C. -- Cyrus -- Ezra 1.
?? Darius - unknown date before Artaxerxes and after Cyrus. See Ezra 5.
457 B.C. Artaxerxes - Ezra 6:14 and Ezra 7:1-8

The 70th week, the 7 years, will begin when

When the Messiah appeared - 2000 years ago. "AFTER" the 69 weeks... which is the 70th -- "Then shall Messiah the prince"

25 So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks; it will be built again, with plaza and moat, even in times of distress. 26 Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off

Ha! You believe the messiah came (in)... the first century.

Christ's ministry began in the first century as "the Messiah" the "Anointed one". (The language used in Dan 9)
27 A.D.

4 days after, not 3 1/2 years after.

Jesus begins His ministry around day of atonement and is crucified on Passover - so it is a half-year boundary when crucified. 3.5 years seems more reasonable.

The 70th week is still attached to the 70 week timeline that began in 457 B.C. and ended in 34 A.D.

Funny thing about timelines -- they are contiguous.

(Just stating the obvious)

 

[Douggg]

You are attempting to ignore the time when Christ's ministry began, which was 3 1/2 years before He was crucified.

Mat 3:16 When He had been baptized, Jesus came up immediately from the water; and behold, the heavens were opened to Him, and He saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and alighting upon Him.
Mat 3:17 And suddenly a voice came from heaven, saying, "This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased."

.

The prophecy is not based on when Jesus's ministry began, nor when he was baptized, nor when the messiah was born, but when he arrived in Jerusalem as the messiah. And also Jesus was not baptized in Jerusalem, but in the Jordan river. Look at a map of Israel to see the distance away.

25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

7 weeks plus 62 weeks is 69 weeks. Jesus rode into Jerusalem - the focus of the prophecy as far as the messiah is concerned - hailed as the messiah, King of Israel, John 12:12-13. 4 days later he was crucified.

Then almost 40 years later, the city and sanctuary were destroyed. 70AD. A lot more than 7 years or more than 3 1/2 years. Which means the counting of the 70 weeks has to stop when Jesus was crucified.

The 7 years are still remaining. The counting down of the 7 years begin when the Antichrist confirms the covenant for 7 years.

Last night, I was watching a You Tube video by Irving Baxter's group and they are so convinced - but wrong - that President Trump's peace plan is that covenant. And plan to put up billboards all over that the 7 years have begun. And send mailings out to every household in Israel. That's not a good idea imo. It could have the same effect as Harold Camping's prediction of the rapture.

I only watched half of the video, because it irritated me listening to the speaker....

 

[BobRyan]

The prophecy is not based on when Jesus's ministry began,

Yes it is. I says "until Messiah the Prince" - the anointed one - anointed at his baptism and 3.5 years later He is "cut off". Crucified. He ratifies the New Covenant - "this is the New Covenant in my blood" and causes sacrifices and offerings to cease - all during that time of his ministry as "the Messiah".

Bible details matter.

 

[Douggg]

2. It has a 490 year prophecy in Daniel 9:24-27 -- but it has no "7 year" prophecy.

Of the 70 weeks of Daniel 9, the last week is specifically called out separately... in the text, of Daniel 9:27.

Jesus begins His ministry around day of atonement and is crucified on Passover - so it is a half-year boundary when crucified. 3.5 years seems more reasonable.

The prophecy is not based on when Jesus's ministry began, nor when he was baptized, nor when the messiah was born, but when he arrived in Jerusalem as the messiah. And also Jesus was not baptized in Jerusalem, but in the Jordan river. Look at a map of Israel to see the distance away.

25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

7 weeks plus 62 weeks is 69 weeks. Jesus rode into Jerusalem - the focus of the prophecy as far as the messiah is concerned - hailed as the messiah, King of Israel, John 12:12-13. 4 days later he was crucified.

 

[Douggg]

Yes it is. I says "until Messiah the Prince" - the anointed one - anointed at his baptism and 3.5 years later He is "cut off". Crucified. He ratifies the New Covenant - "this is the New Covenant in my blood" and causes sacrifices and offerings to cease - all during that time of his ministry as "the Messiah".

Bible details matter.

Yes bible details matter.... and it is unto messiah comes to Jerusalem. What you are referring to is Jesus baptized in the Jordan River - not when he comes to Jerusalem as the messiah.

John 12:
12 On the next day much people that were come to the feast, when they heard that Jesus was coming to Jerusalem,

13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

I will give you another passage, by Jesus's words Himself...

Luke 18:
31 Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished.

32 For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on:

33 And they shall scourge him, and put him to death: and the third day he shall rise again.

 

[BobRyan]

View attachment 241521
Yes bible details matter.... and it is unto messiah comes to Jerusalem. What you are referring to is Jesus baptized in the Jordan River - not when he comes to Jerusalem as the messiah.

Jesus came to Jerusalem as Messiah not just at the start of His ministry - baptized for ministry as the Messiah,, but also on Palm Sunday as the Messiah.

The disciples of John first announce 'we have found the Messiah' at His baptism. It is John that declares Him to be the promised Messiah -- from the very start.

Many unsaved, non-Christian Jews today will argue that the Messiah did NOT come 2000 years ago... but we know better as Christians.

Daniel 9 says that 483 years into that 490 year timeline - the Messiah would come -- and that is what happened.

That timeline starts in 457 B.C with the decree of Artaxerxes , the three-phase, three-part decree according to Ezra 6:14

and 483 years later we have 27 A.D. the baptism of Christ "the anointed One" starting His ministry as the Messiah as Daniel 9:25

And in the midst of that final week of 7 years - the Messiah is cut off. Crucified. Daniel 9:26 --- 31 A.D.

So that the entire 490 year timeline then ends in 34 A.D.

 

[BABerean2]

The prophecy is not based on when Jesus's ministry began, nor when he was baptized, nor when the messiah was born, but when he arrived in Jerusalem as the messiah. And also Jesus was not baptized in Jerusalem, but in the Jordan river. Look at a map of Israel to see the distance away.

25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

7 weeks plus 62 weeks is 69 weeks. Jesus rode into Jerusalem - the focus of the prophecy as far as the messiah is concerned - hailed as the messiah, King of Israel, John 12:12-13. 4 days later he was crucified.

The prophecy as He is concerned is about the New Covenant fulfilled in His blood, at Calvary.

You are ignoring the fulfillment of Daniel 9:24, which is found in the scripture below.

Heb 10:16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
Heb 10:17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more. (from Jeremiah 31:31-34)
Heb 10:18 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.


Act 10:38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.


You are also ignoring Matthew 10:5-7, and Romans 1:16, and Galatians 1:14-18, which reveal the time period of about 7 years when the Gospel was taken "first" to the Jews, before Paul began his ministry to the Gentiles.

We are now in the times of the Gentiles.
Based on Luke 21:24-28, that time period ends at the Second Coming of Christ.

.

 

[Seville90210]

You are also ignoring Matthew 10:5-7, and Romans 1:16, and Galatians 1:14-18, which reveal the time period of about 7 years when the Gospel was taken "first" to the Jews, before Paul began his ministry to the Gentiles.

We are now in the times of the Gentiles.
Based on Luke 21:24-28, that time period ends at the Second Coming of Christ.

The times of the Gentiles is a near future prophecy about Jerusalem that last only 42 months in length. The church age is not the times of the gentiles as it consists of both Jews and gentile Christians. Luke, Paul and Matthew were all Jewish followers representing the church.

Luke 21:24 King James Version (KJV)
And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

Revelation 11:2 King James Version (KJV)
But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.​

Jerusalem has been occupied by Jews and gentiles for thousands of years but has never in history been own by or made a capital to a gentile nation. Non-Jewish occupation in the past and present does not fulfilled this prophecy. Revelation 11:2 is telling you a part of Jerusalem will be given to the gentiles. Don't be surprise if Donald Trump's peace plan (to be announce this coming week or a revision in the near future) involves giving East Jerusalem to the Palestinians as their capital with West Jerusalem being Israel's capital.

 

[BABerean2]

The times of the Gentiles is a near future prophecy about Jerusalem that last only 42 months in length.

Almost all Bible scholars agree that the beginning of Luke 21:24 is about the events of 70 AD.
The end of that verse refers to a time period known as "the times of the Gentiles".
Luke 21:25-28 is about the future Second Coming of Christ.
Therefore, the "fullness" of the Gentiles occurs at the Second Coming.

Luk 21:24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

Luk 21:25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;
Luk 21:26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
Luk 21:27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.


Paul made reference to the same time period in the verse below.

Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.


You are attempting to make John Nelson Darby's Two Peoples of God doctrine work, which was brought to America about the time of the Civil War.
It is a form of "Dual Covenant" Theology, which claims that those who are of a certain bloodline have a separate covenant with God.

.

 

[Seville90210]

Almost all Bible scholars agree that the beginning of Luke 21:24 is about the events of 70 AD.
The end of that verse refers to a time period known as "the times of the Gentiles".
Luke 21:25-28 is about the future Second Coming of Christ.
Therefore, the "fullness" of the Gentiles occurs at the Second Coming.

That's the bandwagon interpretation on Luke 21:24. Jerusalem will never be a "Jews only, no gentile allowed" city. The fullness of the gentiles does not mean gentiles will stop living in Jerusalem after the second coming. The city has always been occupied by both people: Jews and gentiles, and will not cease when Christ returns. After the second coming, all of Jerusalem will be Israel's capital forever, but gentiles will continue to live there in harmony with the Jews for all eternity.

 

[BABerean2]

After the second coming, all of Jerusalem will be Israel's capital forever, but gentiles will continue to live there in harmony with the Jews for all eternity.

Based on 2 Peter 3:10-13, that city on this rotten, sin-cursed earth is going to burn up.

Therefore, it cannot last "forever", or for an "eternity".

.

 

[iamlamad]

The times of the Gentiles is a near future prophecy about Jerusalem that last only 42 months in length. The church age is not the times of the gentiles as it consists of both Jews and gentile Christians. Luke, Paul and Matthew were all Jewish followers representing the church.

Luke 21:24 King James Version (KJV)
And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

Revelation 11:2 King James Version (KJV)
But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.​

Jerusalem has been occupied by Jews and gentiles for thousands of years but has never in history been own by or made a capital to a gentile nation. Non-Jewish occupation in the past and present does not fulfilled this prophecy. Revelation 11:2 is telling you a part of Jerusalem will be given to the gentiles. Don't be surprise if Donald Trump's peace plan (to be announce this coming week or a revision in the near future) involves giving East Jerusalem to the Palestinians as their capital with West Jerusalem being Israel's capital.

Seville, the church of today is mostly a Gentile church. And God is waiting for the fullness of the Gentiles to come in, and then the church age will end. It started as a Jewish church, but the Jewish church died out.

Acts 13:46
Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles.
47 For so hath the Lord commanded us, saying, I have set thee to be a light of the Gentiles, that thou shouldest be for salvation unto the ends of the earth.

Romans 11:11
I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.

Romans 11:25
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

What is John really telling us in Rev. 11:1-2?
Do you remember how Paul taught that the man of sin would enter the Jewish temple and declare that HE was the god of the Jews? Understand, before he can enter the temple in Jerusalem, he must first ARRIVE in Jerusalem. Rev.11:1-2 is showing us his arrival in Jerusalem with his Gentile (I suspect Muslim) armies. The armies will remain in Jerusalem for 42 months. I also think he will arrive in Jerusalem about 3 1/2 days before he will enter the temple and cause the abomination Daniel and Jesus spoke of.

 

[iamlamad]

That's the bandwagon interpretation on Luke 21:24. Jerusalem will never be a "Jews only, no gentile allowed" city. The fullness of the gentiles does not mean gentiles will stop living in Jerusalem after the second coming. The city has always been occupied by both people: Jews and gentiles, and will not cease when Christ returns. After the second coming, all of Jerusalem will be Israel's capital forever, but gentiles will continue to live there in harmony with the Jews for all eternity.

That would be "forever" until God creates a NEW heaven and earth!

 

[BABerean2]

It started as a Jewish church, but the Jewish church died out.

When did it die out?

The man in the video below is from a Jewish background.
He found the promise of the New Covenant in Jeremiah 31:31-34, and accepted Jesus as his Messiah.

The Church as a whole has never been a "Gentile Church".
You are attempting to make the Two Peoples of God doctrine work.

.

 

[Seville90210]

Based on 2 Peter 3:10-13, that city on this rotten, sin-cursed earth is going to burn up.

Therefore, it cannot last "forever", or for an "eternity".

If you're trying to tell us Jerusalem is going to be burn up, at least use the right scripture.

2Th 1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
2Th 1:9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

You are attempting to make your doctrine work by ignoring the New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, which is found fulfilled by Christ during the first century in Hebrews 8:6-13, and Hebrews 10:16-18, and specifically applied to the Church in Hebrews 12:22-24, and 2 Corinthians 3:6-8.

 

[Seville90210]

Seville, the church of today is mostly a Gentile church. And God is waiting for the fullness of the Gentiles to come in, and then the church age will end. It started as a Jewish church, but the Jewish church died out.

Acts 13:46
Then Paul and Barnabas waxed bold, and said, It was necessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you: but seeing ye put it from you, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, lo, we turn to the Gentiles.
47 For so hath the Lord commanded us, saying, I have set thee to be a light of the Gentiles, that thou shouldest be for salvation unto the ends of the earth.

Romans 11:11
I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.

Romans 11:25
For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

What is John really telling us in Rev. 11:1-2?
Do you remember how Paul taught that the man of sin would enter the Jewish temple and declare that HE was the god of the Jews? Understand, before he can enter the temple in Jerusalem, he must first ARRIVE in Jerusalem. Rev.11:1-2 is showing us his arrival in Jerusalem with his Gentile (I suspect Muslim) armies. The armies will remain in Jerusalem for 42 months. I also think he will arrive in Jerusalem about 3 1/2 days before he will enter the temple and cause the abomination Daniel and Jesus spoke of.

I give up, you win. Guess you'll have to find someone else to argue your theory.