I said this:
I said this:
" Rom 1:20 says all are without excuse. But if one didn't receive "the" call, that would be an excuse.
But if God chooses who will believe, then those not chosen have an excuse."
Not sure how my comment violates principles of logic. Please clarify.
I laid it out to show how an excuse is created by the idea that God chooses who will believe.
Jumping in here, all are called to repent (Acts 17:30) according to the light they have, and all who hear the gospel are called to repentance, with their rejection testifying to their rejection of the light they already had, for which they are accountable. Thus even if one is never given the gospel, and is never granted the level of grace other have, yet such are without excuse for rejecting the light they have (which in essence is rejecting The Light), which is what Rm. 1:20 teaches.
By God's grace, such "knew God" in the sense of natural revelation, as in "when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves." (Romans 2:14) But the Gentiles in Rm. 1 "when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened." (Romans 1:21)
Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. (Romans 1:22-23)
This is a progression, from light given but not responded to by honoring God and acknowledging gratitude to and need for Him (which the U.S. forbid in any official manner in 1961,62), which is contrary to evidential fruit of saving faith. And thus in substitution they came up with perverse alternatives to God, and their foolish heart was progressively darkened. They did not have all the light God could give them, which He owes to no one, but by rejecting what they had the progressed into darkness and works thereof.
Which in principle corresponds to John 12:35:
Then Jesus said unto them, Yet a little while is the light with you. Walk while ye have the light, lest darkness come upon you: for he that walketh in darkness knoweth not whither he goeth. (John 12:35)
Re. the Rm. 1 Gentiles, having rejected the light they had:
Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: (Romans 1:24-26)
(Which declension the U.S. examples) but for which declension from the light and the deeds that followed (and sins of omission) they had no excuse, and which is what they will be punished for, not Adam's sin, or for rejecting the actual hearing of the gospel, though to reject the light one has is in essence rejecting Christ,
"the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world." (John 1:9)
And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. (Revelation 20:13-15)
Now if Calvinism teaches that man will essentially be punished because of what they could not do, that of believing on the risen Lord Jesus with repentant faith, versus what they could have done but acted contrary to, then God would be actually punishing the sons for their father's iniquity. We can suffer effects of the actions of others, but eternal punishment is based on what the person themselves did, contrary to the grace given.
Thus Sodom (the lost of it) will be judged for what they did, but not for actually rejecting God manifest in the flesh by mighty acts of grace, though God could have given that level of grace, and which would have led to their repentance (but God owes grace to no one), while those who were provided such great grace of Christ are more accountable and will suffer the greater damnation.
And thou, Capernaum, which art exalted unto heaven, shalt be brought down to hell: for
if the
mighty works, which have been done in thee, had been done in Sodom, it would have remained until this day. But I say unto you, That it shall be more tolerable for the land of Sodom
in the day of judgment, than for thee. (Matthew 11:23-24)
Thus while all the good we have is of God, as it is written, "for all things
come of thee, and of thine own have we given thee," (1 Chronicles 29:14) and who shows mercy and grace to all, "for he is kind unto the unthankful and
to the evil." (Luke 6:35) yet the degree of mercy and grace is not uniform, but man will be judged according to what he has been given, for as in giving, it is "according to that a man hath,
and not according to that he hath not," (2 Corinthians 8:12) and "as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law." (Romans 2:12)
And those who never were given the grace of hearing the gospel and effectually believing it (for which God has his reasons) will have no excuse (versus the charge being that they did no do what they could not do, by no fault of their own). Yet all must repent when convicted of being and acting contrary to the true light they have, and all who hear the gospel are called to repentance, their rejection of which testifies to their rejection of the light they had.
That's about the best i have figured this issue out for now.