Pommer said:

Why would that be “good”?

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Because it’s a beastly business. Best just let sleeping dogs lie and not make a fuss over nothing.

A New Dawn said:

I’m not sure you understand the whole concept of what moving the goalposts means. You responded to something that had nothing to do with Jesus being God and moved the goalposts to include that as the topic of the conversation.

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Whut? I simply pointed out the obvious fact that accepting that there was someone called Jesus has nothing to do with accepting that He is divine. It has nothing to do with God. Unless you also accept that what He was reported to have said and did is true.

I can't make that any clearer.

David Lamb said:

Neither I nor others who have replied to you seem to be able to make clear to you that your thinking is wrong for a Christian, so I will leave it there. I would just urge you to remember what Jesus endured fore you, and be full of praise to Him, rather than your contibualcomplaints about unfair punishments.

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wait please dont go yet my parents have offered me a deal , a chance for me to repair the damage i have done, they said i can start my punishment now , i will be locked in my room for the rest of the day friday, saturday and most of sunday, as i said my cousin is having her party saturday and i cant attend, but my cousin and uncle will be spending the night out our house after the party, and my parents are going to have a barbecue sunday evening, my parents have said its possible that my punishment could be lifted early under certain conditions 1 ) i clean , tidy and hoover my sister bedroom which i have already done ,2 i go to my room to start my punishment without complaint 3 i show remorse through writing punishment essays, my parents said they will mark my essays and i must show i real effort and explain why i have learned my lesson, the essay tiles are WHY ITS THE CHRISTIAN WAY TO ACCEPT WRONDOING AND TRY TO MAKE AMENDS, the 2nd essay is EXPLAIN WHY I SHOULD BE LET OFF MY PUNISHMENT EARLY, a 3rd essay WHY ITS IMPORTANT TO SHOW LOVE AND COMPASSION TOWARDS FAMILY MEMBERS, and a 4th essay on UNACEPTABLE BEHAVOUR AND PUNISHMENT, all essays must be a minimum of 4 pages, so its a LOT of work but i have the rest of today, all day saturday and most of sunday to finish, them, i am REALLY going to miss not being able to go to the theme park and party in the evening, but at least i have a chance to attend the barbecue on sunday evening, so that is something to aim for what do you think :?

Absolutely! It's very serious stuff. But it's not part of any biblical timetable that I can see. In fact, I defy anyone to prove a timetable that actually works for anything!

There is no timetable.

When Jesus told people to recognise the signs of the times, he was saying they should have recognised him! Who he was. What that meant. How salvation was going to arrive.

Jesus said to be aware of the signs of the times, which was basically a rebuke against the Jews who should have recognised who he was. That this was the day of the Lord's salvation.

Warnings about an abomination that causes desolation was simply to warn that if Israel did not repent the Romans were coming!

The abomination of desolation was a general reference to Antiochus, that's something horrible would desecrate the temple. The Romans burning it down while sacrificing to the eagle standard as an idol representing Caesar himself fulfils the criteria.

All we know is that the Lord will return one day and judge the living and the dead, and usher in the new heavens and the new earth.

We do not know when.

Your timetables have failed on multiple accounts and have zero credibility.

Your inability to read the Old testament prophets for what they are actually saying actually alarms me more than many things I've read on the internet! I hope nobody here takes anything you say seriously, because it is simply that shocking an example of ripping verses out of their context.

Landon Caeli said:

Not only are you right, but your tone is justified. Embrace yourself completely.

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I would have preferred to be wrong.
I would have preferred that the President of the United States displayed a rational, fact based,science driven sound and logical behaviour. I would have preferred that Donald Trump used valid and logical arguments.
Sadly enough, he didn't and doesn't. He used fallacies, lies and he distorts the truth.

HARK! said:

If we read down just a little further; Paul starts to pull this thought together.

21 Consequently, I am finding the law that, at my willing to be doing the ideal, the evil is lying beside me." 22 For I am gratified with the law of God as to the man within,

23 yet I am observing a different law in my members, warring with the law of my mind, and leading me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members."

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we know that the law is spiritual; but I am unspiritual, sold as a slave to sin. 15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16 And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17 As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18 For I know that good itself does not dwell in me, that is, in my sinful nature.[c] For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 19 For I do not do the good I want to do, but the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing. 20 Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.

21 So I find this law at work: Although I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22 For in my inner being I delight in God’s law; 23 but I see another law at work in me, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within me.''

As you mentioned the above, what law is being transgressed? In what regard is sin being committed?
Is Saul committing murder, adultery, stealing, carving out idols, failing to honour his parents, bearing false witness? Are these the things he cannot stop doing?
Are these the things he is a slave to doing?
Are these the things he hates but continues doing anyway?
Are these the evils that are there with him, that he is a slave to doing?

No! its all about what goes on, on the inside of him, thoughts/desires, coveting! You cannot control your thoughts as easily as you can obey outwardly
A fuller explanation of what he wrote in verses7-11, which is the reason he wrote 4-6

KevinT said:

I don't know why I missed your reply before. I just stumbled back across this. I have largely lost the gist of this thread, and I don't want to take the time to go back through it all. So I apologize if I am off track.

I think what you are saying is that Ellen White was incorrectly teaching that meat was bad in her time (with her newly discovered health principles), and then applying that same understanding to the children of Israel. And that when God punished them with the quail in the desert, they should have known better than to eat meat -- because meat is immoral.

If that is what you are saying, then I would say that she was over zealous in applying health principles. Ultimately, any understanding or teaching we receive from others must be analyzed for truth. Finding examples of middle school teachers putting silly (and wrong) things on math tests is a fun internet past time. But even with their mistakes, it would be tragic to discount all the effort those professionals are doing to educate children to their best ability.

Best wishes,
Kevin

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Indeed, discounting everything a person said based on their identity would be a logical fallacy (argumentum ad hominem) whereas conversely automatically accepting anything someone says based solely on their identity is leads to the logical fallacy of appeal to unqualified authority (interestingly, any television commercial featuring a celebrity spokesman who is a noted film star, for example, and not someone with particular technical expertise relevant to the product, constitutes an appeal to unqualified authority (unless perhaps the actor was acting in a role as a spokesman for some service of unique relevance to Thespians).

By the way, I want to say I greatly appreciate your friendly and relaxed style of dialogue with traditional Christians. You might not be aware of this, but I really have no problems with Adventists or Sabbatarians in general, except for a very small minority (who are not exclusively SDA but also include members of other denominations) who seem to regard it as a religious duty to aggressively criticize the Roman Catholic Church and all other traditional liturgical churches that worship on Sunday (even if the same church also worships on Saturday - Roman Catholic clergy and religious are required to worship on Saturday as well as Sunday and the RCC has the most worship services of any denomination, with my church, the Eastern Orthodox, along with the Oriental Orthodox), with Anglicans probably tied with the SDA for no. 3. Thus when we are accused of breaking the fourth commandment and of being somehow defective in our practice of Christianity, it is extremely hurtful, and I appreciate the fact that you have never made comments along those lines.

On the contrary I’ve found you to be responsive and responsible in discussion, and I recall one thread where you took the time to look up some theological concepts I mentioned that you were unfamiliar with, and to post what you had found, without bashing whatever it was I had mentioned as being vain philosophy or traditions of men or what have you, and I really greatly appreciated that.

God bless you!

dms1972 said:

I don't think it trumps other realities, because reality is something we have to reckon with eventually when we get something wrong. If we feel our car has enough petrol, and will get us to our destination, and we don't check the gauge, those feelings if wrong, don't trump reality. The car rather splutters to a halt before we arrive were we want to go!

This was the essay were Willard gave an explanation of Facts and Reality

https://www.independent.org/article/1998/07/21/truth-in-the-fire-c-s-lewis-and-pursuit-of-truth-today/

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I agree and should have explained this better. I was being descriptive rather than proscriptive. I was comparing the secular ideologies that have come about which actually contradict reality.

I agree sonner or later reality comes to bite us if we deny it. Not just in objective and empirical sciences. But in social truth and experiences. If you tell a lie socially you will eventually get caught out.

In fact taking such a position to deny facts or truths reflects a wider ideological belief. Its usually the case that holding such unreal ideas or contradicting realities is the result of belief itself. Whether its religious belief or ideological beliefs. Its a clear sign that the persons thinking has been biased or distorted by a belief. Not science or objective reality or social truths based on reasoning..

I had a good day. There are things that can overcome not having any energy. I trust my best male friend so much that I’ve learned to be myself. Perhaps too much. I feel full of satisfaction and grace.

I practice laughter.

JacquelineDeane55 said:

I personally don't, I think a lot of you Republicans get caught up in ridiculous sounding stuff like this.

If any of you have any hard evidence proving a conspiracy theory, I might believe it.

But until then: Nope.

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Do Republicans in the United States really have more of a tendency to believe things like a fat earth, the moon landings being faked, etc. than Democrats do? Here in the UK, I don't imagine that Conservatives re more likely to believe in conspiracy theories than Labour supporters, or vice versa.

The Barbarian said:

I thought this was another thread on Donald Trump's social media posts.

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Trump needed to take over rather than let the governor of Maryland handle the disaster. What with the Democrats defunding FEMA, and so many claiming to be pro-environment, is it not a surprise that the major media is paying little attention to this ecological disaster. FEMA personnel are working without pay.

No, water doesn't remove sin.

But, through the Sacrament of Holy Baptism, God declares that we are His and washes us clean by His grace.

NewLifeInChristJesus said:

Brethren, if a man is overtaken in any trespass, you who are spiritual restore such a one in a spirit of gentleness, considering yourself lest you also be tempted. (Ga 6:1)​

Paul tells people "who are siritual" to restore others who have been overtaken in any trespass. Who are these spiritual people and how do they determine that they qualify? I was a bit surprised that there are so few Bible verses that contain the adjective πνευματικός (i.e., spiritual). Here are all the examples:

​

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When a brother or sister has gotten themselves in a bind--going down the wrong path, the rest of the Church responds by guiding, correcting, teaching--calling them back to restoration and communion by being kind, gentle (not harsh, and cruel).

The contrast is spiritual with carnal, those who are following their appetites rather than being faithful. Because the Holy Spirit doesn't lead us down the wrong path, but calls us to and keeps us in true faith.

I would argue that, quite frequently, when Paul uses pneumatikos this is to be understood as connected to the Holy Spirit.

Pommer said:

…and therefore worthy of derailing the thread?

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Usually the way to do that is not to implicate your self in the thing.

Apple Sky said:

And when it suits you, you claim that Scripture is non literal.

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Not remotely.

chevyontheriver said:

I foresee many many new power plants in our future, and many of those nuclear. But also a huge solar and wind push so they can claim this is all 'carbon neutral'. All the farmland that will be used for solar panels will be it's own catastrophe, but the power plants will be needed to provide for those frequent times when the wind does not blow and the sun does not shine. All so they can store and manipulate more and more data about our personal lives. It's all rather distopian.

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Nuclear is a great source for electrical generation, until it’s not. Then the “not” turns into a long time.
But as it is, we will have no choice but to make it easier to run nuclear reactors for this reason.

A2SG said:

Sounds more like a bad sitcom on CBS, lasts about a season, last few unaired episodes available online.

-- A2SG, featuring Judy Greer as the wacky next door neighbor.....

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I would watch that!

rambot said:

Oh. You seem to think I have access the same evidence as the DOJ or the justice departments of other countriess.

That information is incorrect. That is why I compared countries and that is why this thread, SPECIFICALLY is asking "Why isn't america prosecuting them?"

This thread, actually has nothing to do with who I THINK should be prosecuted.

Thomas Massie is a Republican who has access to everything. Not sure if you heard his quote....but I think my question is pretty straight forward.

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Here you go.


Now you have the same access as everyone else. So have fun searching for that person the Trump DOJ should be prosecuting.

Re: SCOTUS will punt.
The High Court is not going to want to weigh in on a squabble betwixt the other Two Branches, if it can reasonably avoid it.
If Congress, by its inaction cedes it’s “power of the purse” (for a time, without actually passing a Laws saying “Here, Mr President, the Congress allows you to set tariffs in our stead, for [certain but not unlimited time])”, then the Court won’t want to interfere with “what’s working”. Trump wins. The system will have “worked”. Amazing, ain’t it?

Spiritual Jew said:

Many of the details in each passage are identical which shows that the two passages are two accounts of the same event.

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Many of the details in each passage are identical which shows that the two passages are two accounts of the same event about the same topics.

Luke 21 took place in the temple. Matthew 24, Mark 13 took place on the mount of Olives.

Bear