Yom Kippur/The Rapture connection?!

[visionary]

Don't rightly know.

The Queen of England is handing over the reigns.

 

[aniello]

The Queen of England is handing over the reigns.

The Queen better hold her horses.

 

[daq]

I am not understanding your answer to my question.

What else can be said? Watch therefore, and pray always, that you may be accounted worthy to nuwc-ekpheugo, to flee, to escape, to flitter, to fly, to run the mountain valley that reaches to the House of the Side; even to swim back up to the surface out from all of that which shall come to pass, like the good iron axehead that swims to the surface when the good tree is cast into the bitter waters and the staff of the Shepherd passes over it. Pray that you may be accounted worthy to stand before the Son of man, (upon a Sea of transparency, like glass, having been mingled with fire). And as Micaiah said; Behold, thou shalt see in that day, when thou shalt chamber in chamber to hide thyself. And for the one who overcomes in that hour; there shall be no more need for the Molten Sea, for he shall be cleansed.

 

[HannibalFlavius]

THE MATRIX: THERE IS NO SPOON - YouTube



There is no metal, no axe head.

 

[visionary]

The Queen better hold her horses.

Not the throne yet, but just the responsibilities of running the queen ship.... so far... probably preparing him and the world for the eventual, but personally I hope that his son gets the position.
Queen Elizabeth II to hand over reigns to Prince Charles in historic 'job share' - Mirror Online

 

[mercy1061]

What else can be said? Watch therefore, and pray always, that you may be accounted worthy to nuwc-ekpheugo, to flee, to escape, to flitter, to fly, to run the mountain valley that reaches to the House of the Side; even to swim back up to the surface out from all of that which shall come to pass, like the good iron axehead that swims to the surface when the good tree is cast into the bitter waters and the staff of the Shepherd passes over it. Pray that you may be accounted worthy to stand before the Son of man, (upon a Sea of transparency, like glass, having been mingled with fire). And as Micaiah said; Behold, thou shalt see in that day, when thou shalt chamber in chamber to hide thyself. And for the one who overcomes in that hour; there shall be no more need for the Molten Sea, for he shall be cleansed.

In laman terms what does rapture mean?

 

[aniello]

Not the throne yet, but just the responsibilities of running the queen ship.... so far... probably preparing him and the world for the eventual, but personally I hope that his son gets the position.
Queen Elizabeth II to hand over reigns to Prince Charles in historic 'job share' - Mirror Online

Yeah, I was just doing a silly play on reigns/reins in the dog/pony thingey vein/vain/vane, Charlie being the bow-wow. Under Charlie's leadership along with the aid of his harpie

the U.K. may become known as the United Kaliphate.

Ghastly prospects.

 

[daq]

In laman terms what does rapture mean?

Again it depends on who you talk to. For most it appears to mean "taken from the earth, whisked away into heaven, never to be seen again" but that concept is nowhere found and flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of the Father, (even Enoch is said to have died not having received the promises, Hebrews 11:13). Does Pharisee Paul use the same word "harpazo", (which is the Greek word used for "rapture") in his own testimony from 2Cor.12? Yes, Pharisee Paul employs "harpazo" twice in that passage. Was Philip "harpazo-caught-up" also? Yes, he was and yet he was later "found at Azotus". So perhaps it is more like Leviticus 14, previously referenced herein, where the house of the man must first be emptied of its contents before the Priest can enter in to do the cleansing. Therefore practice that "affliction of the soul" which we are commanded to do in the Great Day for if indeed the soul is torn from the body then there shall be no greater tribulation than that hour, nor shall ever be, (whether in the body, or whether out of the body, not I know, and it is a day known only to the Father).

 

[daq]

THE MATRIX: THERE IS NO SPOON - YouTube



There is no metal, no axe head.

I spoke of this axehead of the good iron that swims:

2 Kings 6:4-6 KJV
4. So he went with them. And when they came to Jordan, they cut down wood.
5. But as one was felling a beam, the axe head fell into the water: and he cried, and said, Alas, master! for it was borrowed.
6. And the man of God said, Where fell it? And he shewed him the place. And he cut down a stick, and cast it in thither; and the iron did swim.

Likewise I spoke of the bitter waters made sweet by the tree shown to Moses:

Exodus 15:24-25 KJV
24. And the people murmured against Moses, saying, What shall we drink?
25. And he cried unto the Lord; and the Lord shewed him a tree, which when he had cast into the waters, the waters were made sweet: there he made for them a statute and an ordinance, and there he proved them,

There is good and evil in all things Scripture. The trees and metals are no different: iron is spirit for the good or for the evil, like the Canaanites which have chariots of iron, (spirit) or the ten toes of the image-statue in the dream-vision of Nebuchadnezzar which are iron, (spirit) mixed with potters' clay, (man).

 

[mercy1061]

Not the throne yet, but just the responsibilities of running the queen ship.... so far... probably preparing him and the world for the eventual, but personally I hope that his son gets the position.
Queen Elizabeth II to hand over reigns to Prince Charles in historic 'job share' - Mirror Online

Why doea Israel and Englad have no kings?

 

[Avodat]

Not the throne yet, but just the responsibilities of running the queen ship.... so far... probably preparing him and the world for the eventual, but personally I hope that his son gets the position.
Queen Elizabeth II to hand over reigns to Prince Charles in historic 'job share' - Mirror Online

There are many in the UK who refuse to accept Charles as King. If Liz-the-Last abdicated in his favour it would cause a lot of un-rest. Bringing him in by the back door is less controversial, but I note that his son is also being 'prepared' so we shall have to wait and see. Perhaps Buck house are keeping the son in hand in case Charles cannot accede to the throne for any reason. It is on the news as I write: how much work will Charles take on (but no reference to 'the other woman', thankfully).

I favour the Monarchy (as per my signature) but not with Charles and 'the other woman' holding the Crown.

Having said all that my home address may suddenly change to c/o Her Majesty's Tower of London.

 

[David Ben Yosef]

What does British politics have to do with the so called rapture? I haven't read the entire thread, but that seems like a pretty big leap.

 

[Yahudim]

Though it is not stated outright in the thread, the elephant in the room is this; while Charles has been accused of being the antiMessiah, there are fresh rumors that Camilla may well be the 'beast'. Really! Just ask anyone!

What does British politics have to do with the so called rapture? I haven't read the entire thread, but that seems like a pretty big leap.

 

[David Ben Yosef]

Though it is not stated outright in the thread, the elephant in the room is this; while Charles has been accused of being the antiMessiah, there are fresh rumors that Camilla may well be the 'beast'. Really! Just ask anyone!

Oh, okay, that makes perfect sense. What was I thinking?!

Makes about as much sense as the rapture doctrine.

 

[Avodat]

Though it is not stated outright in the thread, the elephant in the room is this; while Charles has been accused of being the antiMessiah, there are fresh rumors that Camilla may well be the 'beast'. Really! Just ask anyone!

That is an interesting development . Charles has rejected the title of Defender of The Faith and has chosen the title Defender of All Faiths if he becomes King. It has caused quite a stir because he will be the Head of Church of England and is expected to be the Defender of the Christian Faith, as started by Henry 8th in order to marry his 6 wives!

 

[Norbert L]

1Corinthians 5:5

2Corinthians 12:7 ¶

How do you reconcile this with what Messiah said?

And having called His twelve apostles near, He gave them authority over unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal every disease and every bodily weakness. Mt 10:1

See, I give you the authority to trample on serpents and scorpions (σκορπίων/skorpions/pointed stinger), and over all the power of the enemy, and none at all shall hurt you. Lk 10:19
​

Seems to me Paul was being disciplined in order to deal with a personal spiritual weakness. Hebrews 12:9-10

9 Furthermore, we had physical fathers who disciplined us, and we respected them; how much more should we submit to our spiritual Father and live! 10 For they disciplined us only for a short time and only as best they could; but he disciplines us in a way that provides genuine benefit to us and enables us to share in his holiness.

 

[mercy1061]

Again it depends on who you talk to.

Well I am asking you what rapture means.

For most it appears to mean "taken from the earth, whisked away into heaven, never to be seen again" but that concept is nowhere found and flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of the Father, (even Enoch is said to have died not having received the promises, Hebrews 11:13).

Now you have answered my question. What does Job say about rapture? What does Job say about the pride of the wicked being raptured?



5 that the triumph of the wicked is always short-lived,
and the joy of the ungodly is gone in a moment?
6 His pride may mount to the heavens,
his head may touch the clouds;
7 but he will vanish completely, like his own dung —
those who used to see him will ask, ‘Where is he?’

Does Pharisee Paul use the same word "harpazo", (which is the Greek word used for "rapture") in his own testimony from 2Cor.12? Yes, Pharisee Paul employs "harpazo" twice in that passage.

Job speaks about the pride of the wicked being raptured, his head touching the clouds. It is also interesting that in 2 Cor 12 Pharisee Shaul also speaks about pride while speaking about rapture. Thank you calling Shaul a pharisee.

2 Cor 12
6 If I did want to boast, I would not be foolish; because I would be speaking the truth. But, because of the extraordinary greatness of the revelations, I refrain, so that no one will think more of me than what my words or deeds may warrant.
7 Therefore, to keep me from becoming overly proud, I was given a thorn in my flesh, a messenger from the Adversary to pound away at me, so that I wouldn’t grow conceited.

In fact 2 Cor 12 is mostly about Pharisee Shaul remaining humble and not being prideful, in this same "spirit" he speaks about the rapture. The pharisees were full of pride.

Was Philip "harpazo-caught-up" also? Yes, he was and yet he was later "found at Azotus".

The first definition you gave of rapture for most "taken from the earth, whisked away into heaven, never to be seen again". I guess now you are using a lesser popular definition of rapture, being caught up but also seen again in a different location.

Now if Pharisee Shaul was caught up, he was definitely seen again (2 Cor 12) because he is writing a letter to the church. Philip appears in another city. So Pharisee Shaul and Philip fit into the lesser popular defintion of rapture, appearing again on earth, more like transported to another place by the wind.

So perhaps it is more like Leviticus 14, previously referenced herein, where the house of the man must first be emptied of its contents before the Priest can enter in to do the cleansing. Therefore practice that "affliction of the soul" which we are commanded to do in the Great Day for if indeed the soul is torn from the body then there shall be no greater tribulation than that hour, nor shall ever be, (whether in the body, or whether out of the body, not I know, and it is a day known only to the Father).

I am unsure if Lev 14 fits your popular definition of rapture "taken from the earth, whisked away into heaven, never to be seen again". Now if Enoch died, then Enoch was transported to another place to be buried; maybe like Lazarus in the parable that Yeshua tells. I think the purpose of rapture was for "hiding" the prophets; this is evidence in the ministry of Elijah.

1 Kings 18

10 As Adonai your God lives, there can’t be a single nation or kingdom where my master hasn’t sent to search you out; and in each kingdom or nation where they said, ‘He isn’t here,’ he made them take an oath that they hadn’t found you. 11 Now you say, ‘Go tell your master, “Eliyahu is here.”’ 12 But as soon as I leave you, the Spirit of Adonai will carry you off to I don’t know where; so that when I come and tell Ach’av, and he can’t find you, he will kill me. But I your servant have revered Adonai from my youth —

 

[daq]

Well I am asking you what rapture means.




Now you have answered my question. What does Job say about rapture? What does Job say about the pride of the wicked being raptured?



5 that the triumph of the wicked is always short-lived,
and the joy of the ungodly is gone in a moment?
6 His pride may mount to the heavens,
his head may touch the clouds;
7 but he will vanish completely, like his own dung —
those who used to see him will ask, ‘Where is he?’






Job speaks about the pride of the wicked being raptured, his head touching the clouds. It is also interesting that in 2 Cor 12 Pharisee Shaul also speaks about pride while speaking about rapture. Thank you calling Shaul a pharisee.

2 Cor 12
6 If I did want to boast, I would not be foolish; because I would be speaking the truth. But, because of the extraordinary greatness of the revelations, I refrain, so that no one will think more of me than what my words or deeds may warrant.
7 Therefore, to keep me from becoming overly proud, I was given a thorn in my flesh, a messenger from the Adversary to pound away at me, so that I wouldn’t grow conceited.

In fact 2 Cor 12 is mostly about Pharisee Shaul remaining humble and not being prideful, in this same "spirit" he speaks about the rapture. The pharisees were full of pride.



The first definition you gave of rapture for most "taken from the earth, whisked away into heaven, never to be seen again". I guess now you are using a lesser popular definition of rapture, being caught up but also seen again in a different location.

Now if Pharisee Shaul was caught up, he was definitely seen again (2 Cor 12) because he is writing a letter to the church. Philip appears in another city. So Pharisee Shaul and Philip fit into the lesser popular defintion of rapture, appearing again on earth, more like transported to another place by the wind.




I am unsure if Lev 14 fits your popular definition of rapture "taken from the earth, whisked away into heaven, never to be seen again". Now if Enoch died, then Enoch was transported to another place to be buried; maybe like Lazarus in the parable that Yeshua tells. I think the purpose of rapture was for "hiding" the prophets; this is evidence in the ministry of Elijah.

1 Kings 18

10 As Adonai your God lives, there can’t be a single nation or kingdom where my master hasn’t sent to search you out; and in each kingdom or nation where they said, ‘He isn’t here,’ he made them take an oath that they hadn’t found you. 11 Now you say, ‘Go tell your master, “Eliyahu is here.”’ 12 But as soon as I leave you, the Spirit of Adonai will carry you off to I don’t know where; so that when I come and tell Ach’av, and he can’t find you, he will kill me. But I your servant have revered Adonai from my youth —

And when the Most High left off speaking with Job, the Spirit Holy set him gently back down out of the whirlwind; and Job had now come to understand that he never truly knew the Most High as he once thought he did. Job had rather only "heard by the hearing of the ear" about the Almighty One which indeed he so reverenced. And yet now, after all of his Great Tribulation, Job knew first hand of a surety the truth concerning his own Yesha-Salvation by the hand of the Mighty 'El! Apocalypse of Job (Yobab)

 

[HannibalFlavius]

I spoke of this axehead of the good iron that swims:

2 Kings 6:4-6 KJV
4. So he went with them. And when they came to Jordan, they cut down wood.
5. But as one was felling a beam, the axe head fell into the water: and he cried, and said, Alas, master! for it was borrowed.
6. And the man of God said, Where fell it? And he shewed him the place. And he cut down a stick, and cast it in thither; and the iron did swim.

Likewise I spoke of the bitter waters made sweet by the tree shown to Moses:

Exodus 15:24-25 KJV
24. And the people murmured against Moses, saying, What shall we drink?
25. And he cried unto the Lord; and the Lord shewed him a tree, which when he had cast into the waters, the waters were made sweet: there he made for them a statute and an ordinance, and there he proved them,

There is good and evil in all things Scripture. The trees and metals are no different: iron is spirit for the good or for the evil, like the Canaanites which have chariots of iron, (spirit) or the ten toes of the image-statue in the dream-vision of Nebuchadnezzar which are iron, (spirit) mixed with potters' clay, (man).

I really enjoyed what you said, and it really made me think of some things.

Thanks.

 

[Laureate]

Hey Laureate,

Forgive me for snipping your response, but I am a bit foggy from the medication that I am on and I wanted to limit my response to the parable and the context of your post, if not the content. The parable given was prophetic and symbolic; true, but the context of the letter was directed to the branch of the Zadokim that had taken the position of Cohen Gadol by guile. Their family controlled the Temple concessions by political favor and might, granted from Rome; hence the ironic honorific 'rich man' given by the Master. The rich merchant class and the family of the high priests were pretty much the same thing.

Luke's letter itself was addressed to the sixth (using the cultural rather than literal designation of) 'brother' of this family and the parable was a prophetic look at this priest's past relations and future predicament, should he not change his ways. Most agree that a great deal of this letter (at least the first parts) dealt with the issues Messiah had with the cohens. This parable dealt with issues that might move the current Cohen Gadol reconsider his denial of all things spiritual.

Granted that there were elements that might be considered symbolic of the resurrection. That was part and parcel of the message of the Messiah. But certainly not a consideration of the Zadokim in that day. They had to be convinced; and what better way than through a personal prophecy where the Cohen Gadol was mentioned and that had already come true in part?

As far as considering this an illustration of 'rapture'; I don't think so. Isn't 'in the bosom of Abraham' an idiomatic reference to the sleep of the righteous dead? The exchange in the parable was between the rich man (representing the priesthood) and Abraham (representing the inheritors of the promise). The beggar was silent throughout. Take a look.

19 “Once there was a rich man who used to dress in the most expensive clothing and spent his days in magnificent luxury. 20 At his gate had been laid a beggar named El‘azar who was covered with sores. 21 He would have been glad to eat the scraps that fell from the rich man’s table; but instead, even the dogs would come and lick his sores. 22 In time the beggar died and was carried away by the angels to Avraham’s side; the rich man also died and was buried.

23 “In Sh’ol, where he was in torment, the rich man looked up and saw Avraham far away with El‘azar at his side. 24 He called out, ‘Father Avraham, take pity on me, and send El‘azar just to dip the tip of his finger in water to cool my tongue, because I’m in agony in this fire!’ 25 However, Avraham said, ‘Son, remember that when you were alive, you got the good things while he got the bad; but now he gets his consolation here, while you are the one in agony. 26 Yet that isn’t all: between you and us a deep rift has been established, so that those who would like to pass from here to you cannot, nor can anyone cross over from there to us.’

27 “He answered, ‘Then, father, I beg you to send him to my father’s house, 28 where I have five brothers, to warn them; so that they may be spared having to come to this place of torment too.’ 29 But Avraham said, ‘They have Moshe and the Prophets; they should listen to them.’ 30 However, he said, ‘No, father Avraham, they need more. If someone from the dead goes to them, they’ll repent!’ 31 But he replied, ‘If they won’t listen to Moshe and the Prophets, they won’t be convinced even if someone rises from the dead!’”

I'm sure that a few have a different take on this, but what else is new?

Be Well Brother,
Phillip

Your apologies are no good here, you are too dear to me, besides, our diversities plus our ability to not be offended by others, is a good example unto the denominations who glance through our threads, and the more accurate information we can get out there only helps whomsoever to put the pieces together for themseld