Would you marry a woman who was a former stripper or X-rated star if she turned into a Christian ?

[RaymondG]

This has nothing to do with religion or being saved. If a man was in the word and committed a felony, even after he is saved, they will still have to be affected, in the world, by their past actions. They will have to live with it and navigate around it. There will be some jobs they will never be able to get....but they will get work eventually. Same with women.....if they were an intimate worker in the past, even after they are saved, they will be affected by their past, in the world. There will be some men, most I would say, that will not find them suitable for marriage......but they can marry....eventually. There is someone for everyone.

Which among you will raise a daughter in the Lord, pure and beautiful....and will gladly hand them to the born again x-star when there were pure men there who are saved as well?

Folly to teach our young women that there will be no consequences for indulging in intimate work in their youth....as long as they come to Jesus in the end....they will be just as desired as woman who remained pure. This just isn't true.

 

[RaymondG]

That gave me the thought: Is a former sex worker who confesses, repents, professes, and intends to lead a new life necessarily a worse bet as a mate than a man who professes but has no intention of giving up inappropriate contentography?

All depends on a person's options. There are plenty of woman out there that have not indulged in this behavior...... it would be better to compare them to those women and ask which a man, who could have either, would choose.

Of course if the man is in a position where he can only have former workers, he should take the born again worker and be happy.

 

[RDKirk]

The bonding I'm talking about has nothing to do with friendships and getting to know one another by choice. I'm talking about the chemical release in the body that happens during intimacy that affect the brain and the body unconsciously. This is why we should not fault people who stay in bad situations longer than they should and don't know why they can't just leave..... this is why it is easier to divorce the 2nd and 3rd time than it is the first. When the number of partners increase this subconscious connection decreases......the desire to stay through anything(sickness and health) decreases. This is hard to hear for people who aren't virgins, or who have reached the count science says that subconscious bonding is gone, but it is still reality....and we should instruct others on the best path....and not sugar coat it based on personal situations.

The oxytocin effect occurs, but it's not as definitive as you're claiming. Dogs' systems produce oxytocin every time they see their masters...and they're yet able to bond just as firmly with a new master.

Women are certainly more intelligent than dogs, which can either enhance or obviate the oxytocin effect depending on other factors of the relationship. Oxytocin matters, but only peripherally. Psychological and socially taught moral factors are far more significant in humans than the relatively slight physiological factor. The number of partners matters for men as well; a man who has had sex with many women will also be less able to commit to one woman, at least as much if not more, for entirely different psychological and moral reasons.

When we look at the fact that women do, indeed, initiate most divorces, we really have to look at all the circumstances of those divorces. I would argue that taught social morality--radical feminism combined with laws that encourage them to divorce--has more to do with it as a general factor in the divorce rate than various numbers of previous sex partners individual women may have had.

 

[RaymondG]

The oxytocin effect occurs, but it's not as definitive as you're claiming. Dogs' systems produce oxytocin every time they see their masters...and they're yet able to bond just as firmly with a new master.

So what I'm saying is true...but it is not definitive? I remembered you as being a better debater than this. Seems like you are arguing just to be argumentative.... Lets not promote promiscuity simply because the negative affects of being such is not "definitive."

Women are certainly more intelligent than dogs, which can either enhance or obviate the oxytocin effect depending on other factors of the relationship. Oxytocin matters, but only peripherally. Psychological and socially taught moral factors are far more significant in humans than the relatively slight physiological factor. The number of partners matters for men as well; a man who has had sex with many women will also be less able to commit to one woman, at least as much if not more, for entirely different psychological and moral reasons.

Let us not compare women to female , or male, dogs. Women are human beings made in the image of God... Dogs are not. I gave facts based on scientific research and years are surveys and studies. Where are the studies on the bond capabilities of dogs? How many masters can a dog have before they can forget the first few owners. And can a dog ever forget their first owner? Do you honestly believe that a dog, 10 years removed from there first owner, will not remember them when they return? Have you not seem the reactions of dogs after their military owner returns from years of service? Maybe you are right.....and humans have the same attachment to every person they 'bond" with as well.... but if they do....how does this help your argument? Lets just leave dogs out of this, shall we?

Men are not affected in the same way as women are, when it come to sexual partner.... this is Fact! you can research it..... this is not a religious phenomena. Nonetheless....they too, according to religion, should remain virgins until marriage. They have a greater urge to procreate yes.... but this does not affect their bonding with women....e.g. they can bond just as easily with the 1st woman as they can with the 100th..... But do me a favor..... Please do not try to test this theory out....we are just having grown men discussions.

This is not about committing or the desire to commit..... this is about the chemical makeup of women that causes them to attach to the first man they are are intimate with and not understand why they cant leave....even if the men arent good people. Here is another stat for you..... when a women cheats... who you think they are more likely to cheat with? You guessed it..... one whom they have already been with in the past. We no longer have to wonder why that is.

When we look at the fact that women do, indeed, initiate most divorces, we really have to look at all the circumstances of those divorces. I would argue that taught social morality--radical feminism combined with laws that encourage them to divorce--has more to do with it as a general factor in the divorce rate than various numbers of previous sex partners individual women may have had.

When giving advise, it is best to go with majority outcomes and not personal experiences or any outliers. I never said that a born again intimate worker can never remain with a new husband for the rest of their life. Im fully aware that there are virgins who marry and then divorce.....and there can be intimate workers who can can be the best wives ever.

I am also fully aware that there are people who win the lotto every day. But I would not tell a child to forget about education and hard work to, instead try to find that one winning lotto ticket. It is just too risky. It is more of a sure thing to prepare yourself for a good job or business..... just like it is more of a sure thing to marry one who has had as fewer partners as possible......if one is worthy of such a woman.

 

[RDKirk]

So what I'm saying is true...but it is not definitive? I remembered you as being a better debater than this. Seems like you are arguing just to be argumentative.... Lets not promote promiscuity simply because the negative affects of being such is not "definitive."


Let us not compare women to female , or male, dogs. Women are human beings made in the image of God... Dogs are not. I gave facts based on scientific research and years are surveys and studies. Where are the studies on the bond capabilities of dogs? How many masters can a dog have before they can forget the first few owners. And can a dog ever forget their first owner? Do you honestly believe that a dog, 10 years removed from there first owner, will not remember them when they return? Have you not seem the reactions of dogs after their military owner returns from years of service? Maybe you are right.....and humans have the same attachment to every person they 'bond" with as well.... but if they do....how does this help your argument? Lets just leave dogs out of this, shall we?

Men are not affected in the same way as women are, when it come to sexual partner.... this is Fact! you can research it..... this is not a religious phenomena. Nonetheless....they too, according to religion, should remain virgins until marriage. They have a greater urge to procreate yes.... but this does not affect their bonding with women....e.g. they can bond just as easily with the 1st woman as they can with the 100th..... But do me a favor..... Please do not try to test this theory out....we are just having grown men discussions.

This is not about committing or the desire to commit..... this is about the chemical makeup of women that causes them to attach to the first man they are are intimate with and not understand why they cant leave....even if the men arent good people. Here is another stat for you..... when a women cheats... who you think they are more likely to cheat with? You guessed it..... one whom they have already been with in the past. We no longer have to wonder why that is.


When giving advise, it is best to go with majority outcomes and not personal experiences or any outliers. I never said that a born again intimate worker can never remain with a new husband for the rest of their life. Im fully aware that there are virgins who marry and then divorce.....and there can be intimate workers who can can be the best wives ever.

I am also fully aware that there are people who win the lotto every day. But I would not tell a child to forget about education and hard work to, instead try to find that one winning lotto ticket. It is just too risky. It is more of a sure thing to prepare yourself for a good job or business..... just like it is more of a sure thing to marry one who has had as fewer partners as possible......if one is worthy of such a woman.

Well, you argue that a woman is so chained to her oxytocin that after a spurt or two she's unable to form any further bonds.

I pointed out that isn't even true of a dog (and, yes, those studies have been done), so why would it be true of a woman?

 

[RaymondG]

Well, you argue that a woman is so chained to her oxytocin that after a spurt or two she's unable to form any further bonds.

I pointed out that isn't even true of a dog (and, yes, those studies have been done), so why would it be true of a woman?

I just want to add that the research I mentioned are not my own....but that of medical professionals.

There are outliers in every case. When I give advice I lean toward the majority and not what can happen in a small number of cases.

The official count is actually 4 -5 partners..... but the affects of this chemical does decrease after each partner up until then.

I will need to research the genetic similarities between dogs and humans before I can comment further on why dogs and women do not behave the same.

 

[Paidiske]

When we look at the fact that women do, indeed, initiate most divorces, we really have to look at all the circumstances of those divorces. I would argue that taught social morality--radical feminism combined with laws that encourage them to divorce--has more to do with it as a general factor in the divorce rate than various numbers of previous sex partners individual women may have had.

I'd add to that, that many women are leaving abusive, harmful or dysfunctional husbands. And also that often, even when it is the man who has left, he leaves it up to the woman to do the admin work to make it all official.

 

[RaymondG]

I'd add to that, that many women are leaving abusive, harmful or dysfunctional husbands. And also that often, even when it is the man who has left, he leaves it up to the woman to do the admin work to make it all official.

This is false as well. Many women arent leaving because of abuse.... And although it is hard to believe.....most men are not abusive. Abuse accounts for less than 25% of divorce (and this includes the emotional, financial and all the other new forms of abuse created to help divorces along) . And here's another shocker for everyone.....the majority of one sided physical abuse is that from women. Why are these stats hidden and only "woman are leaving abusive relationship," shared over and over again?

Statistics show that the most common reason women give for filing for divorce is that, "they grew apart," namely irreconcilable differences....and they file on their own, sometimes unknown to their husbands, to find something better elsewhere. It happens a lot more now than in the past because women are more educated and "dont need no man," and they receive more compensation for leaving now...... and lastly....to keep in the context of the thread.....most are not coming into the marriage pure....making it harder to bond and easier to leave.

 

[Paidiske]

This is false as well. Many women arent leaving because of abuse....

The stats say about a quarter of divorces are because of abuse. That's a pretty significant figure.

My point is just, if you want to make anything of the fact that more women file for divorce, you need to understand the reasons driving it, and not just the ones that blame women and exonerate men.

 

[RaymondG]

The stats say about a quarter of divorces are because of abuse. That's a pretty significant figure.

My point is just, if you want to make anything of the fact that more women file for divorce, you need to understand the reasons driving it, and not just the ones that blame women and exonerate men.

Note that this quarter of divorces also includes the men that leave because of abuse as well.....although it is more common for them to stay.....as can be seen in the fact that most divorces are initiated by women while most one-side abuse is perpetrated by women.

Throughout my decades of living....I only really seen men vilified. Men are all bad and if a women leave, it was because of the man..... Which is why I was as shocked as everyone else reading this is, to discover that women abuse men in marriages more than the other way around..... and they file for divorce the majority of the time..... and for the most part....because they believe they can do better.

Dont get me wrong... I find no fault in any of this.... I am just a proponent of the truth.

 

[Paidiske]

Throughout my decades of living....I only really seen men vilified.

Really? Have you read this whole thread?

Which is why I was as shocked as everyone else reading this is, to discover that women abuse men in marriages more than the other way around.....

Can you post your source for this? Because every reputable source I can find says otherwise.

 

[RDKirk]

I'd add to that, that many women are leaving abusive, harmful or dysfunctional husbands. And also that often, even when it is the man who has left, he leaves it up to the woman to do the admin work to make it all official.

I honestly don't think Millennial men are worse or even as "bad" as Boomer or War Gen men. Might as well say Millennial whites are just as racist as Boomer and War Gen whites...same silly politics.

 

[RaymondG]

Really? Have you read this whole thread?

Can you post your source for this? Because every reputable source I can find says otherwise.

This is one thread that is specifically about marrying a former intimate worker.....and some how we still managed to talk about the fictional idea that most men are abusers.

Look at the many thread in support of women and the few women that are abused......you will not find one comment talking about women negatively there....only support and praise.

Here, I have to show proof before anything positive about a man is believed....and i don't believe it will be believed even after that.....but here you go.

Note this was an abstract study which only include about 20k relationships:

"Results. Almost 24% of all relationships had some violence, and half (49.7%) of those were reciprocally violent. In nonreciprocally violent relationships, women were the perpetrators in more than 70% of the cases."

Differences in Frequency of Violence and Reported Injury Between Relationships With Reciprocal and Nonreciprocal Intimate Partner Violence

Objectives. We sought to examine the prevalence of reciprocal (i.e., perpetrated by both partners) and nonreciprocal intimate partner violence and to determine whether reciprocity is related to violence frequency and injury.Methods. We analyzed data on ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

If you like, you can give me a source that you trust and if they are honest, I will find the same information for you there.

One always find exactly what they look for. Most rarely look for blanket truth.

 

[Paidiske]

the fictional idea that most men are abusers.

Claiming that most abuse is perpetrated by men, is not to say that most men are abusers.

Note this was an abstract study which only include about 20k relationships:

"Results. Almost 24% of all relationships had some violence, and half (49.7%) of those were reciprocally violent. In nonreciprocally violent relationships, women were the perpetrators in more than 70% of the cases."

Differences in Frequency of Violence and Reported Injury Between Relationships With Reciprocal and Nonreciprocal Intimate Partner Violence

Objectives. We sought to examine the prevalence of reciprocal (i.e., perpetrated by both partners) and nonreciprocal intimate partner violence and to determine whether reciprocity is related to violence frequency and injury.Methods. We analyzed data on ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

If you like, you can give me a source that you trust and if they are honest, I will find the same information for you there.

One always find exactly what they look for. Most rarely look for blanket truth.

It's an old study now, but it seems legit. I've mostly seen very different data.

However, I would maintain my original point; many women initiate divorce because of abuse or other problem behaviour from their husbands.

All of which is really off topic to the thread, but the idea that somehow someone's past as a sex worker necessarily makes her a divorce risk seems to me to be buying into a lot of problematic stereotypes rather than being willing to assess each person on her merits.

 

[RaymondG]

Claiming that most abuse is perpetrated by men, is not to say that most men are abusers.

Maybe not....but, as all can now see documented..... 70% of one sided abuse is perpetrated by women. So your claims are false.

It's an old study now, but it seems legit. I've mostly seen very different data.

Old? It was conducted 23 years ago......are 23 year-olds now considered old? With all the new laws for women and against men....do you believe that the percentage of marriages with women abusers somehow went from 70% down to 49?

This article seems legit, yes, but the strange thing is.....this was one of the first things that popped up during a regular Google search....but you said all your search yielded opposite results. How is that?

I can give you more recent results but i believe they would be moreso against your argument and therefore be discarded....so we can end this here.

However, I would maintain my original point; many women initiate divorce because of abuse or other problem behaviour from their husbands.

The statement "many woman" without context is misleading. We have been mislead for too long. The fact is, a minority of woman leave for abuse.....and 3xs more leave for other reasons....or no reason at all....outside of growing apart.

But i get it....i use to believe most men were bad too......and most marital failures were their fault...and most, if not all, abuse was on the side of the man. This programming takes a while to overcome. I would advise not leading others until we are capable of being 100% objective.....speaking only from facts on majority studies.....and not from personal experiences(that are outside the norm), past misconceptions or emotions.

All of which is really off topic to the thread, but the idea that somehow someone's past as a sex worker necessarily makes her a divorce risk seems to me to be buying into a lot of problematic stereotypes rather than being willing to assess each person on her merits.

You speak on stereotypes and emotions.....I've only mentioned facts backed by scientific studies. I'm not concerned about the work...only the number of partners..... it is proven by studies....which you may find too old, that as the number of partners increase, the success rate of marriages decrease. I know no sex workers or any women who are married that had a lot of partners beforehand.....so I can't speak from personal experience.

If the studies show that less partners is better for marriages and God says no partners before marriage.....why are you arguing against it?

 

[Paidiske]

Old? It was conducted 23 years ago......are 23 year-olds now considered old?

23-year-old research is not current.

With all the new laws for women and against men....

I reject your premise that the laws are "for women and against men."

so we can end this here.

Probably just as well, since it is well off topic.

If the studies show that less partners is better for marriages and God says no partners before marriage.....why are you arguing against it?

What I am arguing against is making assumptions about people based on their history, without getting to know the person, their character and maturity in the present, etc.

 

[Pekka]

What you say sounds good, but is not rooted in reality. The more partners a woman has, the harder it is for them to bond with new people and be happy long term with them. Try to research and look up facts and studies....and forget about emotions and feelings.

This former prostitute is not broken....when God fixes something, or someone, how can you call them broken after? If they are changed....forget about their past and look forward..

The bonding I'm talking about has nothing to do with friendships and getting to know one another by choice. I'm talking about the chemical release in the body that happens during intimacy that affect the brain and the body unconsciously. This is why we should not fault people who stay in bad situations longer than they should and don't know why they can't just leave..... this is why it is easier to divorce the 2nd and 3rd time than it is the first. When the number of partners increase this subconscious connection decreases......the desire to stay through anything(sickness and health) decreases. This is hard to hear for people who aren't virgins, or who have reached the count science says that subconscious bonding is gone, but it is still reality....and we should instruct others on the best path....and not sugar coat it based on personal situations.

Facts...most divorces are started by women statistically. The likihood of divorce increases the more partners a woman has.....statically.

We can ignore this and go by what we feel should happen.....but it will be to our detriment and all those who follow our words.

Did you have a long term relationship? The chemical effect may help in the beginning but what you will end up is deep companionship and mutual respect as the physical part is just a small part that complements the whole. Two persons must match enough in their emotional understanding or they will grow apart. When there is no understanding between laughs and tears it is going to be a hard one learning to interpret your partner. Been there done that.

The physical and chemical attraction is what guides animals to procreate. Us humans are multiple factors more complex and we need to match in emotional level as well. Personality is not that important, emotional understanding is. Different personalities can complement each other, different emotional understanding requires lots of learning and work.

 

[FredVB]

Believers available to marry should really only marry another repentant believer who is in Christ and restored to God. There must be enough care to be made certain of that. What kind of life there was before that conversion is irrelevant to that.