Women, Head Coverings, and Hillsong.

[justbyfaith]

You are mistaken if you think that I have in any way questioned Taya's salvation.

 

[Root of Jesse]

She's the one who made a big deal of it, so I think your take is correct.

Yeah, I once heard Glen Beck speak of a time when he wanted fame too much, and it made him just plain bad. He humbled himself, stepped out of the limelight, and grounded himself. If you find you want that so much, you need to step back.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

Why? She isn't exposing her breasts, navel or anything else.

Sorry, I assumed that on a Christian forum the Bible is the basis for what is depraved or not. Just my Protestant bias, I'm afraid. I must stop making such assumptions. My apologies. I meant no harm.

Is exposing one's navel a sin in your religion?

 

[Root of Jesse]

I agree about prayers, brother.

Seriously.

GOD is first, whether one is a worship leader, Sunday school teacher, part of the choir, or sitting there in that pew.

ESPECIALLY if one is there on that stage "leading" in "worship".

To become the center of attention (regardless of how one does this) has NO place in worshiping the living God nor as a "leader" of said worship. It dis-places God Himself, and by golly, right there in the sanctuary, and right on stage.

This is nothing new.

It goes waaaaaay back.

For there was one that was wanting to de-throne God and be "as" God.

it was so from the beginning.

And he's been trying to do so ever since.

Nothing new.

He's quite good at it.

Always has been.

That's why I close my eyes during most of our Mass. Keeps out the distractions.

 

[justbyfaith]

I think that one of the points that God makes in His word is that you have to come to Him on His terms. If you would lose out on eternal life because you consider the Lord "misogynistic" for certain things He says in His word, I think that you are not very intelligent. Being subservient to your husband is a small price to pay for pleasures forevermore at His own right hand.

This represents everything I so hate about christianity. The pettiness, pedantic non-sensical dogma along with plain old misogyny is totally repelling to me.

There are many men that support this type of tyranny.
Hillsong Pressured To Remove Controversial,

Interesting that one of the most extreme pastors, Jack Schapp, was unapologetically anti-female and was later convicted for 11 years for paedophilia.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

I think that one of the points that God makes in His word is that you have to come to Him on His terms. If you would lose out on eternal life because you consider the Lord "misogynistic" for certain things He says in His word, I think that you are not very intelligent. Being subservient to your husband is a small price to pay for pleasures forevermore at His own right hand.

I mostly agree with you; however, a wife obeying her husband or a husband loving his wife are not "a small price to pay". They both bring blessing and riches. They only appear to cost.

 

[justbyfaith]

I mostly agree with you; however, a wife obeying her husband or a husband loving his wife are not "a small price to pay". They both bring blessing and riches. They only appear to cost.

Amen to that brother. I am in 100% agreement. Of course, from her perspective, she may consider it to be something that she simply doesn't want to do (thus an unwanted cost), hence her hatred of Christianity and its requirements towards women.

 

[jimmyjimmy]

Amen to that brother. I am in 100% agreement. Of course, from her perspective, she may consider it to be something that she simply doesn't want to do (thus an unwanted cost), hence her hatred of Christianity and its requirements towards women.

Obeying God always seems like death, but when we do, we then realize it gives life.

 

[bekkilyn]

Amen to that brother. I am in 100% agreement. Of course, from her perspective, she may consider it to be something that she simply doesn't want to do (thus an unwanted cost), hence her hatred of Christianity and its requirements towards women.

Outside of the fact that God doesn't actually have such requirements towards women. Sinful men came up with it all on their own by interpreting scripture through the lens of Hellenistic pagan philosophy.

As far as any prices to pay go, Jesus did that as his free gift to us.

 

[Jezmeyah]

I am from no denomination...I do rely on The Holy Bible and the Holy Spirit to reveal His ways and how to live as He calls us to be.

I stated that I came from a Methodist background.. or if not I meant to which makes my previous mention of church association to be a train of thought typo.
I've since gone on to another church that emphasizes personal Bible study and leading of the Holy Spirit in life. Come to think of it, what Christian's church doesn't?

My views concerning the Hillsong girl are from a cosmetology position regarding her damaged hair.

I've looked it up, the Hillsong singers are Pentecostal which puts them in the non denominational category. From what media there is available, the singers and all fellowship and leadership in their circle of influence are demonstrating an apparent lenient view of the girl's hair problem. The way that they are dealing with it is markedly different than your personal beliefs and those of others on the issue.

That is interesting since you both are non denominational. Clearly the category allows for the personal variations in expression of godliness.

I don't think that any Christian would say differently than what you did. "I do rely on The Holy Bible and the Holy Spirit to reveal His ways and how to live as He calls us to be."

 

[LadyCrosstalk]

Sorry, I assumed that on a Christian forum the Bible is the basis for what is depraved or not. Just my Protestant bias, I'm afraid. I must stop making such assumptions. My apologies. I meant no harm.

Is exposing one's navel a sin in your religion?

I think Christian women know that they should not be exposing their navels--but that is a measure of worldliness which most young Christian women seem to have these days. The entertainment industry is pushing the limits (even for THEM) on modesty to a new low. Do men really want to think back on the immodest way their wives dressed before they married them? Maybe none of them are planning to marry?

 

[HeLeadethMe]

This represents everything I so hate about christianity. The pettiness, pedantic non-sensical dogma along with plain old misogyny is totally repelling to me.

There are many men that support this type of tyranny.
Hillsong Pressured To Remove Controversial,

Interesting that one of the most extreme pastors, Jack Schapp, was unapologetically anti-female and was later convicted for 11 years for paedophilia.

Honey, if we understand it right, being submissive to husbands doesn't mean subservient and being a doormat, sometimes we just don't say things quite the way we mean, it's not always easy to express what we are trying to say accurately. Remember we are talking about a marriage relationship, mutual love and sharing a life together. It just means the woman respects her husband.........you know how women have a need to feel her husband is attentive to her, well similarly men have a need to feel respected by their wife. And it is God's way that a husband should be loving to his wife and that a wife should respect her husband, that's all.......the Lord really is helping us to understand the needs of our mate and saying that we should try to give each other what we each need. That is not slavish to either man or wife, it is a recipe for a happy marriage........see how wise our God is, and wrote this down long before there was such a thing as psychologists.

Unfortunately the Christian church as a whole is in a mess nowadays, and this has been prophesied in the bible, along with many other things about the days we are living in.....because the time of His return is getting near. Please do not close your heart to Jesus Christ because of misunderstandings and less than perfect communication or because of imperfect Christians and churches......you certainly don't have to follow a "church", but I encourage you to seek Jesus Himself, read about Him in the bible and ask Him to help you to know Him and understand His ways. The truth is we all need forgiveness and the good news is that forgiveness and having peace in our hearts is available through receiving and believing in His Son, Jesus Christ. Bless you my dear.

 

[WolfGate]

I stated that I came from a Methodist background.. or if not I meant to which makes my previous mention of church association to be a train of thought typo.
I've since gone on to another church that emphasizes personal Bible study and leading of the Holy Spirit in life. Come to think of it, what Christian's church doesn't?

My views concerning the Hillsong girl are from a cosmetology position regarding her damaged hair.

I've looked it up, the Hillsong singers are Pentecostal which puts them in the non denominational category. From what media there is available, the singers and all fellowship and leadership in their circle of influence are demonstrating an apparent lenient view of the girl's hair problem. The way that they are dealing with it is markedly different than your personal beliefs and those of others on the issue.

That is interesting since you both are non denominational. Clearly the category allows for the personal variations in expression of godliness.

I don't think that any Christian would say differently than what you did. "I do rely on The Holy Bible and the Holy Spirit to reveal His ways and how to live as He calls us to be."

Just a tiny little detail, but being Pentecostal puts them in the Pentecostal denomination - more specifically the Australian Christian Churches (Assemblies of God).

 

[Zoii]

I think that one of the points that God makes in His word is that you have to come to Him on His terms. If you would lose out on eternal life because you consider the Lord "misogynistic" for certain things He says in His word, I think that you are not very intelligent. Being subservient to your husband is a small price to pay for pleasures forevermore at His own right hand.

HI - I understand yours and others point in this section of the bible - usually citing St Paul. Its just that I disagree with it. I feel certain that it is not intended in the way its been suggested and I am pretty sure if Paul came to my school and addressed the girls on the topic he would go ... "what!!! my message was to people in year 40 AD - things were way different then - women and relationships were way different - I had no idea my words would be used in this way in 2017"

Can you not understand why and my friends would feel this way about this issue. Especially when it is taken to the extreme I am told by a man to what length I can cut my hair

 

[justbyfaith]

Outside of the fact that God doesn't actually have such requirements towards women. Sinful men came up with it all on their own by interpreting scripture through the lens of Hellenistic pagan philosophy.

As far as any prices to pay go, Jesus did that as his free gift to us.

There are requirements towards women, based on the literal "interpretation" of scripture, which is the only way to interpret it unless you are looking at an obvious parable.

I think that the whole of the words on obedience in the Bible are exhortations to men, which women also ought to obey, and if a passage of scripture singles out the female gender (such as in Ephesians 5:22, 1 Timothy 2:9-15, or 1 Peter 3:1-6) then that is what God requires specifically of women.

 

[justbyfaith]

I'm of the understanding and opinion that the word of God is eternal and contains truths that are timeless--so culture of the times do not dictate to us biblical princiiple but it is (or ought to be) the other way around!

HI - I understand yours and others point in this section of the bible - usually citing St Paul. Its just that I disagree with it. I feel certain that it is not intended in the way its been suggested and I am pretty sure if Paul came to my school and addressed the girls on the topic he would go ... "what!!! my message was to people in year 40 AD - things were way different then - women and relationships were way different - I had no idea my words would be used in this way in 2017"

Can you not understand why and my friends would feel this way about this issue. Especially when it is taken to the extreme I am told by a man to what length I can cut my hair

 

[WolfGate]

But what did a shaven head signify in those times? It was a sign of mourning - but more applicable to the passage a sign that the woman had committed a sin resulting in great shame, such as adultery. Is that the sign we use today? No. It was not the shaving of the head that was shameful but that act that resulted in her shaving her head.

 

[justbyfaith]

In today's culture it can be a sign of homosexuality or gender confusion...this is an insanity that ought to be avoided. (I used the word "insanity" rather than repeating the word "confusion", as my wife told me that it would be a synonym).

 

[justbyfaith]

I believe that the Bible ought to be taken at face value...adding to our intepretation things that have to do with the culture of biblical times only serves to create division against those who do take it at face value, by nullifying the power of certain scriptures saying they are not valid because they were "written in a certain culture". People try to make the word of God null and void in this manner.

 

[WolfGate]

I believe that the Bible ought to be taken at face value...adding to our intepretation things that have to do with the culture of biblical times only serves to create division against those who do take it at face value, by nullifying the power of certain scriptures saying they are not valid because they were "written in a certain culture". People try to make the word of God null and void in this manner.

Yes, the bible is the inspired word of God, without error in the original writings. But I think your comment is logically nonsensical. To understand what the inerrant original writings mean, you have to understand the context surrounding them. Otherwise you're creating understand out of today's cultural context and not understanding the possible errors. This is particularly true when illustrations are used to demonstrate or clarify the concept the bible is instructing us to follow - the illustration is totally relevant to us only in context. As is the case with this scripture. So, I would argue to take the scriptures at face value you have to pay attention in those cases to context.

I do agree people will often try to wash away scriptures that make them uncomfortable by simply claiming they are not relevant today. That is the other extreme of the same error.