Why worry about the Ten Commandments, if you are disregarding the Sabbath?

Kristofor · Mar 25, 2006

Hi, in lite of me not having to read the last 56 pages bar the original post...here is what I think.

The bible tells us in Matthew 19:17 that Jesus Himself said that to enter heaven you must obey the Comandments. Now this must mean all 10, so if you skip one than you are not doing what God has told us to do.

What about this from matthew 5

" 17"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven."

We know Jesus didnt come to abolish the law which means the law still stands after His death and resurection!! How can so many people believe differently when its there in plain language. The only thing the bible points to as right is keeping every commandment including the Sabbath day!

cavymom · Mar 25, 2006

tall73 said:
That does not appear to be the application that the author of Hebrews makes.

Actually the author of the bible as a whole made that statement

cavymom · Mar 25, 2006

Kristofor said:
Hi, in lite of me not having to read the last 56 pages bar the original post...here is what I think.

The bible tells us in Matthew 19:17 that Jesus Himself said that to enter heaven you must obey the Comandments. Now this must mean all 10, so if you skip one than you are not doing what God has told us to do.

What about this from matthew 5

" 17"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven."

We know Jesus didnt come to abolish the law which means the law still stands after His death and resurection!! How can so many people believe differently when its there in plain language. The only thing the bible points to as right is keeping every commandment including the Sabbath day!

Mark 12:28 One of the scribes approached. When he heard them debating and saw that Jesus answered them well, he asked Him, "Which commandment is the most important of all?" 29 "This is the most important," Jesus answered: Hear, O Israel! The Lord our God is one Lord. 30 And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength. 31 "The second is: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. There is no other commandment greater than these."

Matthew 22:35 And one of them, an expert in the law, asked a question to test Him: 36 "Teacher, which commandment in the law is the greatest?" 37 He said to him, "You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind. 38 This is the greatest and most important commandment. 39 The second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. 40 All the Law and the Prophets depend on these two commandments."

Galatians 5:4 You who are trying to be justified by the law are alienated from Christ; you have fallen from grace! 5 For by the Spirit we eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness from faith. 6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision accomplishes anything; what matters is faith working through love.

tall73 · Mar 25, 2006

cavymom said:
Actually the author of the bible as a whole made that statement

there is a human instrumentality, but yes I uphold the inspiration of the Bible.

JimfromOhio · Mar 25, 2006

Legalism is: "It's pretending to be holy without really being holy". Jesus had a problem with the pharisees who were very legalists and they had about 613 rules to protect God's commandments. Jesus especially had problems with Pharisees views of the Sabbath law. Today, we will have people working on Sabbath day (Saturday) because they are to help and protect people. I am talking about people who serve in hospitals, medics, police and etc. Luke 14:3-4 " Jesus asked the Pharisees and experts in the law, "Is it lawful to heal on the Sabbath or not?" But they remained silent. So taking hold of the man, he healed him and sent him away."

Scriptures clearly teaches that you can have your own sabbath on every 7th day of your work cycle. Colossians 2:16 "Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day."

The more I see threads about legalism, the less I respect the denomimations who supports such legalism. Colossians 4:5 "Be wise in the way you act toward outsiders; make the most of every opportunity."

Galatians 3:1-3
Faith or Observance of the Law
You foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you? Before your very eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed as crucified. I would like to learn just one thing from you: Did you receive the Spirit by observing the law, or by believing what you heard? Are you so foolish? After beginning with the Spirit, are you now trying to attain your goal by human effort?

Later in Galatians 3:23-25
Before this faith came, we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until faith should be revealed. So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith. Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law.

I have learned so much about denominations through this message board's threads.

Kristofor · Mar 25, 2006

JimfromOhio said:
Legalism is: "It's pretending to be holy without really being holy". Jesus had a problem with the pharisees who were very legalists and they had about 613 rules to protect God's commandments. Jesus especially had problems with Pharisees views of the Sabbath law. Today, we will have people working on Sabbath day (Saturday) because they are to help and protect people. I am talking about people who serve in hospitals, medics, police and etc. Luke 14:3-4 " Jesus asked the Pharisees and experts in the law, "Is it lawful to heal on the Sabbath or not?" But they remained silent. So taking hold of the man, he healed him and sent him away."

Scriptures clearly teaches that you can have your own sabbath on every 7th day of your work cycle. Colossians 2:16 "Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day."

The more I see threads about legalism, the less I respect the denomimations who supports such legalism. Colossians 4:5 "Be wise in the way you act toward outsiders; make the most of every opportunity."

mmm I reliase that it may be important for docotrs etc to work if their needed, and its widely agreed that this is ok because they are there to help mostly rather than make money. We also know Jesus tossed thhose that used the temple to make money out because it was a sacred place.

The collsions text does not teach us to have our own sabbath day, we cannont change God's law because we dont like how it is. The collsions text teaches us that we are not to obey the sabbath because we are told by people to obey it. We must obey it out of our own free will which God gave us! That is what it means.

Kristofor · Mar 25, 2006

cavymom said:
Mark 12:28 One of the scribes approached. When he heard them debating and saw that Jesus answered them well, he asked Him, "Which commandment is the most important of all?" 29 "This is the most important," Jesus answered: Hear, O Israel! The Lord our God is one Lord. 30 And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength. 31 "The second is: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. There is no other commandment greater than these."

Matthew 22:35 And one of them, an expert in the law, asked a question to test Him: 36 "Teacher, which commandment in the law is the greatest?" 37 He said to him, "You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind. 38 This is the greatest and most important commandment. 39 The second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. 40 All the Law and the Prophets depend on these two commandments."

Galatians 5:4 You who are trying to be justified by the law are alienated from Christ; you have fallen from grace! 5 For by the Spirit we eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness from faith. 6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision accomplishes anything; what matters is faith working through love.

Yes Jesus said some are more important, but never did he said that rendered the others unimportant. We still must obey every comandment!

JimfromOhio · Mar 25, 2006

Kristofor said:
mmm I reliase that it may be important for docotrs etc to work if their needed, and its widely agreed that this is ok because they are there to help mostly rather than make money. We also know Jesus tossed thhose that used the temple to make money out because it was a sacred place.

The collsions text does not teach us to have our own sabbath day, we cannont change God's law because we dont like how it is. The collsions text teaches us that we are not to obey the sabbath because we are told by people to obey it. We must obey it out of our own free will which God gave us! That is what it means.

God examine my heart more than my actions of confession. Jeremiah 17:10 "I the LORD search the heart and examine the mind, to reward a man according to his conduct, according to what his deeds deserve." Wisdom sees everything in focus, each in proper relation to all, and is able to work toward God's perspective rather than ours. A determination to know what cannot be known will harm fellow Christians. Using wisdom, you will see all things fit into shape and form when you look from God's perspective. Jesus Christ taught the fullness of the spirit of the Law compared to the letter of Law. The rest which the old Sabbath promised has come in Christ: Come to Me, all who are weary and heavy-laden, and I will give you rest (Matt. 11:28). It is my belief that sabbath (a day of rest) to the pattern of work six days and rest one day. There are people who work Saturdays and Sundays. And rest one day during the week. They even worship on a different day. Those who restricts God's Grace for christians observe the Sabbath with rules and regulations. The definition of legalism is a strict, literal or excessive conformity to the law or to a religious or moral code. In Hebrews 4 simply means that a believer can have a Sabbath rest at any day of the week.

The Sabbath observance was a part of the ceremonial law of the Old Testament, along with such things as circumcision and eating restrictions. These ceremonial laws showed that the Israelites were set apart (sanctified) from all other nations (Exodus 31:12, 13).

The New Testament shows that all ceremonial law (restrictive eating - Timothy 4:4, 5), circumcision - I Corinthians 7:18, and Sabbath-keeping - Colossians 2:16, 17) was fulfilled in Christ, and our need to observe it for justification and sanctification abolished. We are even warned against Sabbath-keepers who want to judge others for not keeping it: "Let no man judge you...regarding...sabbaths" (Colossians 2:16).

Keeping the Sabbath day holy is a commandment that requires a lot of heart searching. Jesus condemned the Pharisees saying "The Sabbath is made for man, not man for the Sabbath" (Mark 2:27). Sunday is the Christian Sabbath because it is the day Christ arose.

rstrats · Mar 25, 2006

JimfromOhio,

re: "Scripture clearly teaches that you can have your own sabbath on every 7th day of your work cycle. Colossians 2:16..."

I don’t think that I have ever seen anyone try to use that verse quite that way. How have you been able to rule out that Paul wasn’t simply telling the Colossians that they should not let anyone - other than the body of Christ, which is the church (verse 17) - criticize them for HOW they were observing the things mentioned in verse 16?
?

JimfromOhio · Mar 25, 2006

rstrats said:
JimfromOhio,

re: "Scripture clearly teaches that you can have your own sabbath on every 7th day of your work cycle. Colossians 2:16..."

I dont think that I have ever seen anyone try to use that verse quite that way. How have you been able to rule out that Paul wasnt simply telling the Colossians that they should not let anyone - other than the body of Christ, which is the church (verse 17) - criticize them for HOW they were observing the things mentioned in verse 16?
?

We judge others based on the Sabbath Day so we will be judged by God. In Romans 2:17-18 says "Now you, if you call yourself a Jew; if you rely on the law and brag about your relationship to God; if you know his will and approve of what is superior because you are instructed by the law" Then later in Romans 2:28-29 "A man is not a Jew if he is only one outwardly, nor is circumcision merely outward and physical. No, a man is a Jew if he is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a man's praise is not from men, but from God."

Ephesians 2:14-16 For he himself is our peace, who has made the two one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace, and in this one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility.

Everyone is making a big issue regarding the Sabbath. Hebrews 4:9 10 "There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God; for anyone who enters God's rest also rests from his own work, just as God did from his." Colossians 2:16 "Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day."

Legalism is an interesting topic here !!

JimfromOhio · Mar 25, 2006

I forgot... today is sabbath day for those who supports legalism sabbath day. None of SDA members are online. I will wait until another day to discuss this.

ThreeAM · Mar 25, 2006

JimfromOhio said:
I forgot... today is sabbath day for those who supports legalism sabbath day. None of SDA members are online. I will wait until another day to discuss this.

Don't forget we also support not lieing, not murdering , not stealing , not commiting adultry, not coveting, respecting our parents , no idols, not having others gods before God and not profaning God's name all those other forms of legalism.

JimfromOhio · Mar 25, 2006

ThreeAM said:
Don't forget we also support not lieing, not murdering , not stealing , not commiting adultry, not coveting, respecting our parents , no idols, not having others gods before God and not profaning God's name all those other forms of legalism.

What Christian leaders making Christians make their faith HARD? For those who are without Christ in our hearts, if we broke ONE law... we broke them all. We all are sinners and we need to be saved. For those who are WITH Christ in our hearts, the Ten Commandments are about LOVE. Christians do not look at the Ten Commandments as laws but Grace of Love. We are to LOVE God first (first 4 commandments) and we are to love one another (last 6 commandments).

Its really simple but PEOPLE makes it HARD. In Proverbs 21:2, "People may think they are doing what is right, but the Lord examines the heart." (NLT). Our flesh search for pleasure, pride, passions and selfish motives therefore God is looking for Christians who will worship and obey Him from their hearts, minds and bodies. Christ through the Holy Spirit produces power, love, a sound mind through us. Without Christ, we are nothing. Along with love and under the control of the Holy Spirit, the power of love and Holy Spirit flows through us. The only way the spiritual gifts are going to operate is love. Love is the key. God is love. He gave us two commandments. We are to love God and others. With the Holy Spirit and love, I will walk in the Spirit, Christ produces the fruit. And out of that fruit comes whatever the ministry of the gifts Christ wanted me to use.

When Jesus rebuked the Pharisees, He said: "They do all their deeds to be noticed by men" (Mt. 23:5). . . . Theirs was a problem of priorities: Their first priority was social status, to which end God was but a means. What greater affront to God could there be? Better to ignore Him altogether than to exploit Him as a means to something else you value more highly. Would we be rejoicing to live in a Pharisaic-dominated society? Jesus said to the Pharisees one day as they picked up stones to stone an adulterous woman: Whoever is "without sin... throw the first stone."

Pride magnifies the faults of other Christians and diminishes their graces, while it diminishes the faults and magnifies the graces of the situation. We live in a proud and egotistical generation. People continually promote themselves.

Pride is FORGETTING the FIRST Commandment. Exodus 20:3 (KJV). Thou shalt have no other gods before me. James 4:6 But he gives us more grace. That is why Scripture says: "God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble."

Jesus reserved his hardest words for the hidden sins of hypocrisy, pride, greed and legalism." Philip Yancey

"Whatever makes us feel superior to other people, whatever tempts us to convey a sense of superiority, that is the gravity of our sinful nature, not grace." Phillip Yancey

Kristofor · Mar 25, 2006

JimfromOhio said:
We judge others based on the Sabbath Day so we will be judged by God. In Romans 2:17-18 says "Now you, if you call yourself a Jew; if you rely on the law and brag about your relationship to God; if you know his will and approve of what is superior because you are instructed by the law" Then later in Romans 2:28-29 "A man is not a Jew if he is only one outwardly, nor is circumcision merely outward and physical. No, a man is a Jew if he is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a man's praise is not from men, but from God."

Ephesians 2:14-16 For he himself is our peace, who has made the two one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace, and in this one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility.

Everyone is making a big issue regarding the Sabbath. Hebrews 4:9 10 "There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God; for anyone who enters God's rest also rests from his own work, just as God did from his." Colossians 2:16 "Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day."

Legalism is an interesting topic here !!

Legalism is interesting, and what I was saying is the Collosions verse only tells us not to obey the sabbath because other people instruct us, we must discover that we should obey for ourselves. Many people wonder, whyy Saturday is the sabbath, but then the very first mention of a week is at creation, this is onle part of how we know the sabbath the 7th day is saturday. I think its rediculous for us to bend what the bible says because it doesnt suit us. I think by saying we can have sabbath any day we want thats absolutely not in accordance with what the Bible teaches. It teaches us to have a Sabbath a day of rest on the 7th day, which God rested on after creation, not the 7th day which happens to fit into our lifestyle!!

the1888message · Mar 25, 2006

JimfromOhio said:
I forgot... today is sabbath day for those who supports legalism sabbath day. None of SDA members are online. I will wait until another day to discuss this.

If it is legalism to keep to fourth commandment of God, then why should I have to keep the sixth which, states that I am not to kill, or the eight that teaches us not to steal or any of them?
I you claim that by keeping the fourth Commandment you are a legalist, then I would be a legalist for not killing people or stealing from people or taking someone’s wife from them.
Man, who would want to be a legalist anyway, sounds to boring!!!!!!!!!!!

Get real, man, the Commandments of God show us His character, it shows us His love for us. And since I have accepted Christ as my saviour and I have faith in Christ God gives me the gift of Salvation. Now that I have salvation and because God first loved me I can live the way that He preordained for me to live.

1 John 2:1-6, teaches that if anyone claims to know Christ and they do not keep His Commandments then that person is a liar and the Truth (Christ) is not in that person. And if you do keep the Commandments of God then the Love of God is perfected in you.
And as for the liar well, we all know where he ends up, don’t we. Can we say crispy critters!!!

Peace and Grace
David
Sabbath Keeper and loving it.

JimfromOhio · Mar 25, 2006

Kristofor said:
It teaches us to have a Sabbath a day of rest on the 7th day, which God rested on after creation, not the 7th day which happens to fit into our lifestyle!!

No doctors should work on Sabbath day, huh? A Doctor is a lifestyle. Luke 14:2-4 "There in front of him was a man suffering from dropsy. 3Jesus asked the Pharisees and experts in the law, "Is it lawful to heal on the Sabbath or not?" But they remained silent. So taking hold of the man, he healed him and sent him away.

Keep working at Sabbath works and find better solutions how people who heals on Sabbath won't have their own sabbath.

JimfromOhio · Mar 25, 2006

the1888message said:
If it is legalism to keep to fourth commandment of God, then why should I have to keep the sixth which, states that I am not to kill, or the eight that teaches us not to steal or any of them?
I you claim that by keeping the fourth Commandment you are a legalist, then I would be a legalist for not killing people or stealing from people or taking someones wife from them.
Man, who would want to be a legalist anyway, sounds to boring!!!!!!!!!!!

Get real, man, the Commandments of God show us His character, it shows us His love for us. And since I have accepted Christ as my saviour and I have faith in Christ God gives me the gift of Salvation. Now that I have salvation and because God first loved me I can live the way that He preordained for me to live.

1 John 2:1-6, teaches that if anyone claims to know Christ and they do not keep His Commandments then that person is a liar and the Truth (Christ) is not in that person. And if you do keep the Commandments of God then the Love of God is perfected in you.
And as for the liar well, we all know where he ends up, dont we. Can we say crispy critters!!!

Peace and Grace
David
Sabbath Keeper and loving it.

1 John 2:5-6 "But if anyone obeys his word, God's love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are in him: Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did." God is looking for Christians who will worship and obey Him from their hearts, minds and bodies. Christ through the Holy Spirit produces power, love, a sound mind through us. Without Christ, we are nothing. Along with love and under the control of the Holy Spirit, the power of love and Holy Spirit flows through us. The only way the spiritual gifts are going to operate is love. Love is the key. God is love. He gave us two commandments. We are to love God and others. With the Holy Spirit and love, I will walk in the Spirit, Christ produces the fruit. And out of that fruit comes whatever the ministry of the gifts Christ wanted us to use.

Lordship of Jesus Christ is about LOVE. Philippians 3:12-14 (NIV) "Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already been made perfect, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me. Brothers, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus."

ThreeAM · Mar 25, 2006

JimfromOhio said:
What Christian leaders making Christians make their faith HARD? For those who are without Christ in our hearts, if we broke ONE law... we broke them all. We all are sinners and we need to be saved. For those who are WITH Christ in our hearts, the Ten Commandments are about LOVE. Christians do not look at the Ten Commandments as laws but Grace of Love. We are to LOVE God first (first 4 commandments) and we are to love one another (last 6 commandments).

Its really simple but PEOPLE makes it HARD. In Proverbs 21:2, "People may think they are doing what is right, but the Lord examines the heart." (NLT). Our flesh search for pleasure, pride, passions and selfish motives therefore God is looking for Christians who will worship and obey Him from their hearts, minds and bodies. Christ through the Holy Spirit produces power, love, a sound mind through us. Without Christ, we are nothing. Along with love and under the control of the Holy Spirit, the power of love and Holy Spirit flows through us. The only way the spiritual gifts are going to operate is love. Love is the key. God is love. He gave us two commandments. We are to love God and others. With the Holy Spirit and love, I will walk in the Spirit, Christ produces the fruit. And out of that fruit comes whatever the ministry of the gifts Christ wanted me to use.

When Jesus rebuked the Pharisees, He said: "They do all their deeds to be noticed by men" (Mt. 23:5). . . . Theirs was a problem of priorities: Their first priority was social status, to which end God was but a means. What greater affront to God could there be? Better to ignore Him altogether than to exploit Him as a means to something else you value more highly. Would we be rejoicing to live in a Pharisaic-dominated society? Jesus said to the Pharisees one day as they picked up stones to stone an adulterous woman: Whoever is "without sin... throw the first stone."

Pride magnifies the faults of other Christians and diminishes their graces, while it diminishes the faults and magnifies the graces of the situation. We live in a proud and egotistical generation. People continually promote themselves.

Pride is FORGETTING the FIRST Commandment. Exodus 20:3 (KJV). Thou shalt have no other gods before me. James 4:6 But he gives us more grace. That is why Scripture says: "God opposes the proud but gives grace to the humble."

Jesus reserved his hardest words for the hidden sins of hypocrisy, pride, greed and legalism." Philip Yancey

"Whatever makes us feel superior to other people, whatever tempts us to convey a sense of superiority, that is the gravity of our sinful nature, not grace." Phillip Yancey

This is how things work

FAITH leads use to Christ who imparts His GRACE which JUSTIFIES us and gives us RIGHTEOUSSNESS covering our sins with His sinnles blood which gives us SALVATION which leads us to SANCTIFICATION were because of our love and respect for Christ were become more Christ like in our behavior. Christ obeyed the Commandments of God and so should we not be save but because we are saved.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Rom 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Eph 1:7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

Rom 3:25 Whom God hath set forth [to be] a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

Rom 3:22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Luk 1:77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins,

1Pe 1:9 Receiving the end of your FAITH, even the salvation of your souls

John 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

Act 5:32 And we are his witnesses of these things; and [so is] also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.

Hbr 5:9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

You assume following God is hard apparently the saints don't find it hard. When you have the LOVE of Christ in your heart you WANT to obey and respect him. Do you find it hard not to steal? Hard not to commit adultry? Hard not to lie? Hard not to profane God's name? Hard not to respect your parents. Hard not to covet. Hard not to worship idols. Hard not to worship a false God? I doubt it.

1Jo 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

1Jo 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.

1Jo 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

2Jo 1:6 And this is love, that we walk after his commandments. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it.

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, AND the faith of Jesus.

tall73 · Mar 25, 2006

JimfromOhio said:
"Whatever makes us feel superior to other people, whatever tempts us to convey a sense of superiority, that is the gravity of our sinful nature, not grace." Phillip Yancey

does that includes being proud that you are not a "legalist?"

I have never said I am saved by the Sabbath. To me the Sabbath issue is not about how you are saved at all. No one will be saved by observance of the law. So when you make these points, and then say that they show the Sabbath is not in effect, you lose me completely.

The question of whether the Sabbath was a ceremonial law, and done away with is a different question than wheether certain individuals obey the law out of duty, or walk in the Spirit with Christ's love.

So again, address the specific texts and historical accounts mentioned in the thread, or don't. But raising the legalism question to me is just saying that you haven't bothered to read what I put, or several others (though granted there are undoubtedly many legalistic sabbatarians).

The only two people I have seen take the time to go somewhat point by point on this topic are Repentant and Nitefire. I may have missed others. but in general most are drive by posters with their minds made up that all of us are legalists. While I quite obviously disagree with Repentant and Nitefire, they gain my respect by addressing the details. You are free to think that we are all legalists. But it is not supported by the facts.

.

the1888message · Mar 25, 2006

You must remember to get a complete quote so that it can be understood. 1John 2:1-6 “My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world. And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him. He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.”
Notice that this verse teaches that we are not to sin and that there is a way for us not to sin, and if we do then we have the Son of God to stand for us. This is if we are truly repentant of our sins.
Further it teaches that we are to keep the Commandments if we CLAIM that we know Christ. IF we do not keep them the we do not truly know Christ and that the Love of God can not be perfected in us if we do not keep the Commandments of God.
Yes Christ gave us two Commandments, Read Matthew 22:36-40, “Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.”
Please notice that upon those two laws that you quoted both the LAW and the Prophets HANG. Also notice that the Pharisees, which was a lawyer asked the question to the Son of God, which, is the great commandment IN the Law? So the response that Christ gave can be found IN the Law of God.
We must always read in context, my friend. If the LAW is hung on these to Laws of Love then that is all the more reason to keep the law.
Peace and Grace
David

Why worry about the Ten Commandments, if you are disregarding the Sabbath?

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