Why intercessory prayer?

[truthseeker32]

This Sunday there was a funeral liturgy at the parish I attend. One of the prayers asked God and the saints to save those who had passed. Afterwards I thought about this and became confused. If our salvation is ultimately between us and God, then why do we bother to pray for the salvation of others? Do we expect our prayers to change their's or God's mid?

 

[Dewi Sant]

Prayers are made in eternity.
Our prayers now are with them from their birth.

Also, it is an act of love to pray, to talk, with someone.

 

[Yeznik]

This Sunday there was a funeral liturgy at the parish I attend. One of the prayers asked God and the saints to save those who had passed. Afterwards I thought about this and became confused. If our salvation is ultimately between us and God, then why do we bother to pray for the salvation of others? Do we expect our prayers to change their's or God's mid?

Confess therefore your sins one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The supplication of a righteous man availeth much in its working.

James 5:16

 

[ArmyMatt]

God exists outside of time, so when you pray for someone who is reposed, that is a part of that person's life in God's economy. it is never too late for a timeless God. so in 30 years, if I pray for the salvation of my grandmother, who died in 2008, God heard and applied that prayer to her whole life and when she met Him face to face. it's not that you change anyone's mind, it's that God already heard the prayer.

in the NT, St Paul prays for the salvation of Onesephirus, who at the time was reposed.

 

[prodromos]

Love, between all members of Christ's body.

 

[InnerPhyre]

Salvation is not just between us and God. It's between all of us and God.

 

[truthseeker32]

God exists outside of time, so when you pray for someone who is reposed, that is a part of that person's life in God's economy. it is never too late for a timeless God. so in 30 years, if I pray for the salvation of my grandmother, who died in 2008, God heard and applied that prayer to her whole life and when she met Him face to face. it's not that you change anyone's mind, it's that God already heard the prayer.

in the NT, St Paul prays for the salvation of Onesephirus, who at the time was reposed.

But that makes it sound like God only does something if we ask him to. Wouldn't he work for your grandmother's salvation regardless of whether you asked for it or not?

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

As my brothers and sisters in here have said, we're in this thing together. God wants us to be a community. We don't get baptized by ourselves or take our own Eucharist in the closet at home nor do we marry ourselves or chrismate ourselves. We are to be an ecclesia, and assembly well pleasing to God. We need each other. We need a priest, altar boys, readers, someone to bake the bread, ushers, choir singers, deacons...we need each other.

The Communion of Saints is not a group of dead men. They are alive in Christ as we are alive in Christ on Earth in linear "regular" time. As others pointed out, God knows no time as we do.

The Saints are already with God! They are together in an intimacy and love. It is powerful. Just as we ask each other in the workplace or at church or with friends, "hey, bro, would you mind praying for my grandma" or "hey, Mike, would you mind praying for my wife? She's going in to have an MRI and she's worried," so do we ask the saints to pray for us.

If we don't bat an eye at the thought of asking a co-worker, friend, or family member to pray for us, why bat an eye at the thought of asking men who are WAY holier and more intimate with God in the Church Triumphant than we?

God listens to the prayers of righteous men. The Scriptures tell us as much. The Saints are fully-realized in Christ. They are holy men. Better to ask the Theotokos or St. John or St. John of Shanghai to pray for us than your next door neighbor if you think about it!

We're in this together. And the saints are part of that togetherness!

 

[truthseeker32]

"St. Silouan, will you ask God to save me? I am not holy so he ignores me, but he will listen to you because he likes you."

I don't really get that.

 

[ArmyMatt]

"St. Silouan, will you ask God to save me? I am not holy so he ignores me, but he will listen to you because he likes you."

I don't really get that.

often times people will go to a holy person to ask for their prayers and NOT pray themselves. the issue with this is that it can make the holy person proud (and therefore not holy) and the other will become slack.

St Silouan being humble saying God ignores him. usually the most holy see themselves as the greatest sinners. so the saint sees his prayers as being out of pride or lack of faith. and then he told the other person to pray because God would listen, so that person's effort would not become lukewarm.

a similar thing happens in the life of St Anthony the Great, where someone asked St Anthony to pray for him, and St Anthony told him to pray as well, so that the prayer would be answered. St Anthony also said that if he only went to others, and did not pray himself, God would not listen.

 

[Kristos]

apparently importunity gets God's attention...

Luk 11:1 He was praying in a certain place, and when he ceased, one of his disciples said to him, "Lord, teach us to pray, as John taught his disciples."
Luk 11:2 And he said to them, "When you pray, say: "Father, hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come.
Luk 11:3 Give us each day our daily bread;
Luk 11:4 and forgive us our sins, for we ourselves forgive every one who is indebted to us; and lead us not into temptation."
Luk 11:5 And he said to them, "Which of you who has a friend will go to him at midnight and say to him, 'Friend, lend me three loaves;
Luk 11:6 for a friend of mine has arrived on a journey, and I have nothing to set before him';
Luk 11:7 and he will answer from within, 'Do not bother me; the door is now shut, and my children are with me in bed; I cannot get up and give you anything'?
Luk 11:8 I tell you, though he will not get up and give him anything because he is his friend, yet because of his importunity he will rise and give him whatever he needs.
Luk 11:9 And I tell you, Ask, and it will be given you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.
Luk 11:10 For every one who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened.

 

[truthseeker32]

I guess I will go back to being Anglican until I can believe all this extra stuff. Thanks for the help, friends.

 

[ArmyMatt]

I guess I will go back to being Anglican until I can believe all this extra stuff. Thanks for the help, friends.

well, nothing you have ever posted has actually contradicted Orthodoxy. but Lord have mercy on you on your journey! don't be a stranger!