Where is the Soul located? And how does it wield the earthly body?

[Dorothy Mae]

I dont think you are that far from the truth. I think Life could be more closely likened to a Game with infinite continues until you are able to reach the end and become the player of the game...... I dont think one death automatically places you in the soul....but quite the opposite... "He that liveth and believeth in me shall never die...."

Sounds like Hinduism

 

[The Times]

Why do you think immaterial matters cannot be accessed by created beings or matters? I don’t see that.

Soul being is immaterial unless you can measure it or associate it with physiological workings of the biomechanical body.

I believe that the Soul being is behind the wheel of the earthly body, not the other way around.

Not at all. Many souls/spirits are so filthy, He wouldn’t want proximity let alone in dwelling. The demon spirits don’t reside in Him.

Scripture states that demon spirits are separated from the souls of humans after biological death, but both are immaterial and do exist without a body.

Wrong again. We reside in a material body and have access to creation through that.

This is the heart of the question is us the soul local or remote to the body?

No, it resides at the base of the spine.

Do you have a reasoning behind this claim?

Not remote but internal.

Ok, but please explain how a body and spirit/nephesh can be snuffed out, yet the soul cannot be killed?

No we inhabite new bodies.

Sure we inhabit the Heavenly New bodies as Lord from Heaven, but does our soul inhabit the earthly body?

If our soul is an integral part of the earthly body that is not eternal then would the soul not perish with the body? Just saying.

In this regard is the soul temporal like our earthly body?

No one ought to be alarmed by the above as there no evidence for this and plenty against. We are really here. We are not remote. I see no evidence for your position in life or otherwise. We are not machines.

I did not say that we are machines.
I claimed that we are like avatars where our soul is controlling our biomechanical bodies and that our soul being is within the Soul repository of God.

Scripture alludes to a man is a beast of the earth, yet the soul is more than the beast that it remotely wields.

 

[The Times]

Let’s not make a distinction between soul and spirit for ease of discussion.

Dorothy the whole purpose of the thread is to discuss the distinction between the soul and the spirit (Nephesh/breath), how do you say? "Let's not make a distinction between soul and spirit for ease of discussion".

Why?

 

[The Times]

C. Pre-existentianism- The souls exist in Heaven long before their bodies are conceived in the womb, and God brings the soul to Earth (from the well of souls, or soul repository)

I did not infer pre-existtentianism, but rather the soul is existing whenever God brought it into existence for the earthly body that was prepared for the soul. Whether the soul is created at the moment of conception is for another thread.

Having said that God and his Christ do declare that there is a registry of souls called the Book of Life. The Angel in Revelation 17:8 does allude implicitly when the book of life came into existence.

Revelation 17:8
they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world.

It alludes that the Book of Life is referring to the procuring of souls within God's Soul Repository. Those saved have their names already registered in the book of Life. Obviously for The Book to be published by God before the foundation of the world as a soul registry, implicitly implies that those souls had to have existed from the foundation of the world when God created Adam (the Adama of the Dirt). So those souls that were not written, like Judas Iscariot the son of perdition was one of those souls who Jesus said he could not save, further alluding that Judas was one of those predestined to not be saved from the foundation of the world.

Now I do not want to go off topic for the topic of Predestination is for another thread.

A. is the most prevalent viewpoint in Christianity today. B. Has some followers. C. Has few because it is akin to reincarnation.

Scripture states that all men are destined to biologically die once then the judgment. (Hebrews 9:27)

So the user license that God gives the soul to access a biomechanical earthly body is a single user license that can log on only once, then after logging out, it cannot relog back into creation again, thereby ruling out the concept of reincarnation (Hinduism).

So in today's society, many elites think that they can have immortality by making technological copies of themselves, but they fail to realize that once the soul's remote connection is severed they cannot log back on again. The elites can literally transplant their heads with brain and central nervous system and all and they will still not be able to log back in as that particular soul, but what may happen is a soulless copy of themselves that has no self-awareness and acts like a beast/Artifical Intelligence biomechanical Borg Like Collective.

Self-awareness is also for another thread topic.

#3. The souls under the altar already died, so this cannot be used to support souls already being in Heaven. These are souls that come out of the Great Tribulation, because of the timeframe (seal), and they are killed in the same manner.

They are somewhere other than earth, that is why they are calling for the judgment upon the inhabitants of the earth.

So where are these souls after their earthly bodies had biologically died?

The answer is the Soul Repository of God owing to the Book of Life Soul Registry. Under the Altar of God is alluding to a Bank/repository where the Souls are kept unto the Final Judgement of the World after God decides to Judge the inhabitants of the world before Christs Brilliant Coming, where he will judge the living and the dead.

Also, the problem I have with someone not becoming a soul until the breath of life is breathed into them, is abortion. This is how Bill Clinton justifies abortion. That is why I lean toward creationism.

Just food for thought.

The soul to body/spirit connection is when the flesh starts to go thud thud thud thud and at any time during this process, God is establishing a wireless licensed connection for that particular soul within his Creation System Registry (The Book of Life). Again the computer analogy works well in modeling it so that we understand the concepts of what is going on.

Always has been a mistake to understand consciousness or the soul in terms of our current technological standing.
People used to talk about the brain working like valves, before we had computer chips. They they talked about it being like computer chips, working on ones and zeros.

I used the computer hardware analogy to disassociate the actual user/soul from the hardware platform itself, where I compared the hardware platform to the biomechanical physiological workings of the body within creation and the soul as the user who is registered within God's Soul System Registry (The Book of Life).

Now, neuroscientists are beginning to realise that an explanation for consciousness will never be found from a study of the material components of the brain.

Consciousness is not found because it is NOT located locally within the body, brain, central nervous system or blood in order to be found in the first place and this forms the basis of the thread Thesis.

In the same way, the OP is trying to fit something, that is probably wholly outside of the finite, time-bound mind's ability to understand, into a contemporary understanding of computing.

It is merely an analogy to disassociate the actual material creation from the actual immaterial soul and the analogy I believe serves that purpose by separating the biomechanical earthly dirt body from the souls within the Book of Life implicitly said to have existed before the material foundations of the world.

Yes, I agree. The brain itself is sarx, or flesh. But the blood carries the life. Here is an interesting verse and commentary by John Gill. That is why God wanted a blood sacrifice, and we cannot live without blood.

But in Hebrews 9:15-17 below

15And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance. 16For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.17For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

And couple it with Paul's statement below

"I declare to you, brothers and sisters, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable." (1 Corinthians 15:50)

For the life of the flesh is in the blood,.... The animal life or soul, the life and soul of every creature, and even the animal life and soul of man;

Are you saying that the soul of a person is in the physiological blood?

agreeably to which our famous Dr. Harvey, who found out the circulation of the blood, says of it, that it is the principal part which first appears in generation; is the genital part, the fountain of life the first that lives, and the last that dies; the primary seat of the soul or life, from whence motion and pulsation take their rise;

Well, blood is not carried over into the resurrection of the new heavenly body. What do you say to that?

and therefore it is spread all over the body, and according to the condition that it is in, such is the health and such the diseases of the body; yea, the affections of the mind, such as fear, shame, joy, and anger are discovered by it.

But the soul according to Revelation 17:9 exists regardless of human physiology owing to experiences, emotions, and thoughts.

the sentiments of various Jewish writers agree herewith: says Aben Ezra, it is a truth, that the soul or life, with which man lives, is in the blood of the heart; so says Jarchi the soul or life depends upon the blood; and Ben Gersom observes, that the blood is the vessel of the soul to carry in it the fundamental heat, and food to the parts of the body; and hence the animal only dies when the blood is removed:

Paul said, "I declare to you, brothers and sisters, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable." (1 Corinthians 15:50)

Note also that the resurrection body of Jesus is absent of blood.

Jesus said,
"Look at my hands and my feet. It is I myself! Touch me and see; a ghost does not have flesh and bones, as you see I have."

What is absent from the resurrection body is blood and blood is what counts within DNA ancestry and the myriads of diseases that are carried in it.

So that leaves us with what is imperishable that shall inherit the kingdom of God after biological death?

Obviously, it cannot be the blood, it cannot be the biomechanical body/brain, it can't be the breath of life (Nephesh/spirit). So what is left that is imperishable that will inherit the Kingdom of God?

The Soul that was registered in the Book of Life before the foundation of the world.

 

[sparow]

Don't you find it interesting that context usually distinguishes between spirit (lower case) meaning Nephesh (breath) and soul/Spirit (upper case) meaning Ruarch.

Ruarch according to Jesus cannot be killed, whereas Nephesh (spirit) can be snuffed out.

Ruarch seems to be an adjective or title appended to God or components thereof. It could be seen as a tank full whereas the breath component of soul is a single drop.

 

[oldrunner]

I did not infer pre-existtentianism, but rather the soul is existing whenever God brought it into existence for the earthly body that was prepared for the soul. Whether the soul is created at the moment of conception is for another thread.

Having said that God and his Christ do declare that there is a registry of souls called the Book of Life. The Angel in Revelation 17:8 does allude implicitly when the book of life came into existence.

Revelation 17:8
they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world.

It alludes that the Book of Life is referring to the procuring of souls within God's Soul Repository. Those saved have their names already registered in the book of Life. Obviously for The Book to be published by God before the foundation of the world as a soul registry, implicitly implies that those souls had to have existed from the foundation of the world when God created Adam (the Adama of the Dirt). So those souls that were not written, like Judas Iscariot the son of perdition was one of those souls who Jesus said he could not save, further alluding that Judas was one of those predestined to not be saved from the foundation of the world.

Now I do not want to go off topic for the topic of Predestination is for another thread.



Scripture states that all men are destined to biologically die once then the judgment. (Hebrews 9:27)

So the user license that God gives the soul to access a biomechanical earthly body is a single user license that can log on only once, then after logging out, it cannot relog back into creation again, thereby ruling out the concept of reincarnation (Hinduism).

So in today's society, many elites think that they can have immortality by making technological copies of themselves, but they fail to realize that once the soul's remote connection is severed they cannot log back on again. The elites can literally transplant their heads with brain and central nervous system and all and they will still not be able to log back in as that particular soul, but what may happen is a soulless copy of themselves that has no self-awareness and acts like a beast/Artifical Intelligence biomechanical Borg Like Collective.

Self-awareness is also for another thread topic.



They are somewhere other than earth, that is why they are calling for the judgment upon the inhabitants of the earth.

So where are these souls after their earthly bodies had biologically died?

The answer is the Soul Repository of God owing to the Book of Life Soul Registry. Under the Altar of God is alluding to a Bank/repository where the Souls are kept unto the Final Judgement of the World after God decides to Judge the inhabitants of the world before Christs Brilliant Coming, where he will judge the living and the dead.



The soul to body/spirit connection is when the flesh starts to go thud thud thud thud and at any time during this process, God is establishing a wireless licensed connection for that particular soul within his Creation System Registry (The Book of Life). Again the computer analogy works well in modeling it so that we understand the concepts of what is going on.



I used the computer hardware analogy to disassociate the actual user/soul from the hardware platform itself, where I compared the hardware platform to the biomechanical physiological workings of the body within creation and the soul as the user who is registered within God's Soul System Registry (The Book of Life).



Consciousness is not found because it is NOT located locally within the body, brain, central nervous system or blood in order to be found in the first place and this forms the basis of the thread Thesis.



It is merely an analogy to disassociate the actual material creation from the actual immaterial soul and the analogy I believe serves that purpose by separating the biomechanical earthly dirt body from the souls within the Book of Life implicitly said to have existed before the material foundations of the world.



But in Hebrews 9:15-17 below

15And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance. 16For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.17For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

And couple it with Paul's statement below

"I declare to you, brothers and sisters, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable." (1 Corinthians 15:50)



Are you saying that the soul of a person is in the physiological blood?



Well, blood is not carried over into the resurrection of the new heavenly body. What do you say to that?



But the soul according to Revelation 17:9 exists regardless of human physiology owing to experiences, emotions, and thoughts.



Paul said, "I declare to you, brothers and sisters, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable." (1 Corinthians 15:50)

Note also that the resurrection body of Jesus is absent of blood.

Jesus said,
"Look at my hands and my feet. It is I myself! Touch me and see; a ghost does not have flesh and bones, as you see I have."

What is absent from the resurrection body is blood and blood is what counts within DNA ancestry and the myriads of diseases that are carried in it.

So that leaves us with what is imperishable that shall inherit the kingdom of God after biological death?

Obviously, it cannot be the blood, it cannot be the biomechanical body/brain, it can't be the breath of life (Nephesh/spirit). So what is left that is imperishable that will inherit the Kingdom of God?

The Soul that was registered in the Book of Life before the foundation of the world.

A lot to think about for sure! Thanks for the detailed post!
　

 

[The Times]

Ruarch seems to be an adjective or title appended to God or components thereof. It could be seen as a tank full whereas the breath component of soul is a single drop.

So the Nephesh is the spark of life, that gets the biomechanical body going like thud thud thud thud.

The soul must be unique in that it has to have qualities from God and in his fullness of making man patented to his own Image. So the Soul is not the thud thud thud thud but something fuller to the question of existential being that makes us us and not just beasts with a brain and a body like animals.

 

[The Times]

A lot to think about for sure! Thanks for the detailed post!

Just bouncing around those questions of yours has really put me in a deep spiritual thought process where my entire mourning was allocated to answering your inquisitive questions that required deep reflection and thought. I truly want to thank you, brother be blessed in Christ Jesus forever!

 

[sparow]

The close and intimate act of God breathing into Adam is the very Image of God, the self existential being. Notice animals who were created didn't have that intimate connection or self awareness, that is the becoming of a self aware being.

Adam became more than just a living creature/animal, he became self aware of his own existence. Self existential traits are the domain of the Ruarch/Soul.

Ruarch is not Nephesh/Breath.

Even though soul and spirit are used interchangeably, but context determines whether Ruarch/being is talked about or just the Nephesh (physiological breath).

As far as I am aware, Ruarch, does not appear in the scripture I quoted. There are creatures who are not self aware but mammals are self aware; man is certainly a different level but all are called breathing animal.

 

[RaymondG]

Sounds like Hinduism

I can't agree or disagree with you until I have spent some time in that religion. How long have you spent in it, and what message did you intend to relay with your post? Sounds like Hinduism, therefore it must be right?

 

[Paul of Eugene OR]

Dorothy the whole purpose of the thread is to discuss the distinction between the soul and the spirit (Nephesh/breath), how do you say? "Let's not make a distinction between soul and spirit for ease of discussion".

Why?

We don't have a soul. We ARE a soul.

 

[The Times]

As far as I am aware, Ruarch, does not appear in the scripture I quoted. There are creatures who are not self aware but mammals are self aware; man is certainly a different level but all are called breathing animal.

Self awareness is to reflect and to ask questions about the self. Humans do this all the time.

Inform me of manmals who self reflect and are self aware of the self and please show me how you came to that finding?

 

[The Times]

We don't have a soul. We ARE a soul.

I don't follow, please explain.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Soul being is immaterial unless you can measure it or associate it with physiological workings of the biomechanical body.

Correct. So are honor, courage, love, hate, jealousy, kindness and many things.

I believe that the Soul being is behind the wheel of the earthly body, not the other way around.

Probably not clear cut. Body hurts? Soul suffers. Soul wounded? Body suffers.

Scripture states that demon spirits are separated from the souls of humans after biological death, but both are immaterial and do exist without a body.

Can you please give the quote for this?

This is the heart of the question is us the soul local or remote to the body?

Since reports indicate local and no one has ever reported a hint of remote, local is the answer. Since it leaves the body, local.

Do you have a reasoning behind this claim?

Yes I do.

Ok, but please explain how a body and spirit/nephesh can be snuffed out, yet the soul cannot be killed?

Body and spirit are not the same.

Sure we inhabit the Heavenly New bodies as Lord from Heaven, but does our soul inhabit the earthly body?

Yes, why not?

If our soul is an integral part of the earthly body that is not eternal then would the soul not perish with the body? Just saying.

Don’t know enough to comment on this.

I did not say that we are machines.
I claimed that we are like avatars where our soul is controlling our biomechanical bodies and that our soul being is within the Soul repository of God.

Machines are remotely controlled. Your description is that of a machine.

Scripture alludes to a man is a beast of the earth, yet the soul is more than the beast that it remotely wields.

Well it says we’re made in the image of God. No beast is.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

I can't agree or disagree with you until I have spent some time in that religion. How long have you spent in it, and what message did you intend to relay with your post? Sounds like Hinduism, therefore it must be right?

The description you give lines up with Hinduism. But no one has to be a Hindu to understand the faith dame as a male doctor can be a good OBGYN and will never be pregnant.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Dorothy the whole purpose of the thread is to discuss the distinction between the soul and the spirit (Nephesh/breath), how do you say? "Let's not make a distinction between soul and spirit for ease of discussion".

Why?

When do you mention that in the OP?

 

[The Times]

When do you mention that in the OP?

It does not explicitly state it in the Thread, however, the back and forth dialogue has presented us with the pertinent question of distinguishing soul from spirit. Some posters have asked questions along those lines.

Another poster has opened a thread uniquely for that pertinent question and has called it as follows

Is there a difference between soul and spirit?

My reply to him was in Post #59 & #60. The links are below.

https://www.christianforums.com/thr...-soul-and-spirit.8079438/page-3#post-73123964

https://www.christianforums.com/thr...-soul-and-spirit.8079438/page-3#post-73123966

 

[Dorothy Mae]

It does not explicitly state it in the Thread, however, the back and forth dialogue has presented us with the pertinent question of distinguishing soul from spirit. Some posters have asked questions along those lines.

Another poster has opened a thread uniquely for that pertinent question and has called it as follows

Is there a difference between soul and spirit?

My reply to him was in Post #59 & #60. The links are below.

https://www.christianforums.com/thr...-soul-and-spirit.8079438/page-3#post-73123964

https://www.christianforums.com/thr...-soul-and-spirit.8079438/page-3#post-73123966

So it’s really NOT in the OP at and my statement is valid and your question not. Soul and Spirit are not in this discussion from thr OP. That it deviates requires reading everything.

 

[The Times]

So it’s really NOT in the OP at and my statement is valid and your question not. Soul and Spirit are not in this discussion from thr OP. That it deviates requires reading everything.

Well you need to read the entire thread. It is implicitly there. So please do contribute.

 

[The Times]

So it’s really NOT in the OP at and my statement is valid and your question not. Soul and Spirit are not in this discussion from thr OP. That it deviates requires reading everything.

@Dorothy Mae look at page one.

So soul is not spirit. Soul is immaterial right, where as spirit or life is here.

Could I ask you to elaborate what soul is?
What spirit is?