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Featured Where is the Soul located? And how does it wield the earthly body?

Discussion in 'General Theology' started by The Times, Aug 28, 2018.

  1. Bobber

    Bobber Well-Known Member

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    I think your argument falls apart for when Jesus cast out spirits demons were indeed inside the physical body.

    “Teacher, I brought my son to you because he has a speechless spirit. Wherever it seizes him, it throws him to the ground, and he foams at the mouth and grinds his teeth and loses his strength. I asked your disciples to expel it, (cast it out) but they were not able to do so. In one place it says Mk 9: 17

    Yeah but there's no reason to not believe our spirits are not inside our physical bodies.

    Well I'd say we're here but we're there at the same time. We are seated with Christ in Heavenly places in our position In Christ. It's not that Heaven is a billion miles away but I'd say we have two universal orders which over lap each other. When Jesus said he came down from ABOVE he wasn't saying he came down from above the stars but it's ABOVE because its a higher universal order in the capacity of what it is and what it can do. Some would say an existence on a higher universal order. Both are real but one is the more so reality. We can think of the physical order as a child's sandbox, and yes even though it goes outwards for trillions of light years. The sand box is REAL, and substantial and the children playing within it have their own type of kingdom, but still....it's NOT THE REAL PLACE....It's not the REAL KINGDOM. The higher order of the spirit is that.
     
  2. Bobber

    Bobber Well-Known Member

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    Well sure. The rich man in hell was not in the physical body with his physical brain and yet he remembered all things about his past in Hell. Lk 16:19–31
     
  3. Theo Book

    Theo Book Member Supporter

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    God breathed into Adam's nostrils the breath or life, and Adam BECAME a living SOUL.

    A soul therefore is who you are, not what you have.

    WHAT DID ADAM BECOME...
    "When God breathed into Adam the breath of life, Adam became a living soul."[Gen 2:7]

    WHAT DOES A BEAST BECOME
    "Who knoweth the spirit of man that goeth upward, and the pneuma spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth?" [Ecc 3:21]

    GOD IS A SOUL WITH A HEART
    "Yea, I will rejoice over them to do them good, and I will plant them in this land assuredly with my whole heart and with my whole soul." [Jer 32:41]

    A PERSON IS EQUIVALENT TO A SOUL
    NOAH HAD A WIFE AND THREE SONS = 8 PERSONS WENT INTO THE ARK
    "And Noah went in, and his (3)sons, and his wife, and his sons' wives(3) with him, into the ark, because of the waters of the flood."[Gen 7:7]

    8 SOULS WERE SAVED IN THE ARK
    "Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water."[I Pet 3:20]
     
  4. oldrunner

    oldrunner Member Supporter

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    Yeah, the real world is the spiritual-where God lives, that will be brought into the physical world again (the world system now is not the real reality that God intend it to be-the Matrix movie) when death and hades/hell are done away with. God will dwell with man again, but we will have material bodies that will also be spiritual in nature. We will want only spiritual things, when now we want mostly material and earthy things. This will be great! :clap:


    Rev 21:1  Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. Also there was no more sea. 

    Rev 21:2  Then I, John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 

    Rev 21:3  And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, "Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God. 

    Rev 21:4  And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor crying. There shall be no more pain, for the former things have passed away." 

    Rev 21:5  Then He who sat on the throne said, "Behold, I make all things new." And He said to me, "Write, for these words are true and faithful." 

    Rev 21:6  And He said to me, "It is done! I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. I will give of the fountain of the water of life freely to him who thirsts. 

    Rev 21:7  He who overcomes shall inherit all things, and I will be his God and he shall be My son. 

    So back to the garden, but only better! No evil or no one wanting evil things. :amen:
     
  5. Mountainmike

    Mountainmike Well-Known Member Supporter

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    As a physicist/ engineer I have to say it's a fascinating question. It is also constrained by trying to describe "where" with our current science concept of location.


    Indeed " consciousness" is not easily explained. Our atheist friends would have us believe it is simply a chemical process.

    Just one thing I would like to add to the question: relevant to the thread but at right angles to it... there is fascinating evidence of consciousness having awareness of other places and even times.

    Many examples could be cited , but an example is the locating of " panaghia capouli" " meryemana evi" -
    Mary's house in Ephesus, was found in dense undergrowth on a very remote hillside, miles from anywhere by following the documented vision of a bed ridden peasant who cannot possibly have been there, and the views reported from the location. The kicker is - the unusual outline of the foundation and lower walls was only found by digging into ground - so the vision was of the location but as it was 2000 years before. And even a person who had seen it in the nuns era would not have described it as she did, so is Apparently evidence of consciousness in another time and location.

    Also that the statistical evidence for remote telepathy is overwhelming , the question is how not whether.

    So is " consciousness" just a chemical process?
    Not so.


     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2018
  6. guibox

    guibox Newbie

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    As was previously mentioned, the 'soul' is not a separate, cogitating essence that lives on without the body. This is a Greek concept, not a Hebrew or Christian one. The word for 'soul' in the OT 'nephesh' NEVER means that. It is a wholistic term denoting 'life'. When mankind dies, that 'nephesh' ceases to exist. It is only in resurrection that there is life. This is a concept that permeates through both the OT and NT. Job 14:11-14, John 5:28,29, 1 Corinthians 15:51-55, Revelation 20:4-6 for just a few examples. It is this misinterpretation and misunderstanding of the soul that has spawned the erroneous belief of 'eternal torment in hell'. This view rises and falls on the concept of what the 'soul' is.
     
  7. Mountainmike

    Mountainmike Well-Known Member Supporter

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    You would struggle to reconcile that oblivion with for example the transfiguration. Moses and Elijah clearly conscious and talking.

     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2018
  8. oldrunner

    oldrunner Member Supporter

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    IMO, telephaty is explained by spiritual possession. Angels were created first and are spiritual beings. What we see on the negitive side can only be explianed by the spiritual beings observing everything since creation and knowing things. Thus, the people that claim knowledge of past events, and sometime future, are led by these spirits, or demons.

    On the positive side, I see it as revelation given by God or angels on things He wnats us to know, like Daniel or John. But this would be very rare and must line up with the reveled Scriptures.
     
  9. oldrunner

    oldrunner Member Supporter

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    Well, you got to talk to Jesus about the soul not being conscius in torments. :wave:

    The Rich Man and Lazarus

    Luk 16:19  "There was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and fared sumptuously every day. 

    Luk 16:20  But there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, full of sores, who was laid at his gate, 

    Luk 16:21  desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table. Moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. 

    Luk 16:22  So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham's bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. 

    Luk 16:23  And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. 

    Luk 16:24  "Then he cried and said, 'Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.' 

    Luk 16:25  But Abraham said, 'Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented. 

    Luk 16:26  And besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, so that those who want to pass from here to you cannot, nor can those from there pass to us.' 

    Luk 16:27  "Then he said, 'I beg you therefore, father, that you would send him to my father's house, 

    Luk 16:28  for I have five brothers, that he may testify to them, lest they also come to this place of torment.' 

    Luk 16:29  Abraham said to him, 'They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.' 

    Luk 16:30  And he said, 'No, father Abraham; but if one goes to them from the dead, they will repent.' 

    Luk 16:31  But he said to him, 'If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.' "
     
  10. Childofgodharrison

    Childofgodharrison Member

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    God gave us a spirit, soul and body. The soul is what holds our emotions. The soul is where sin comes from. When the devil deceived Eve and told her that her eyes would be opened, the eyes to the soul are the eyes that were opened. Before they sinned Adam an Eve were living by the human spirit. The human spirit is how we communicate with God. Spirit to spirit. Depending on which is leading the flesh determines the why the body is used. John 3:6 Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit.
     
  11. SPF

    SPF Well-Known Member

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    Reading your post for some reason made me think of Jonathan Edwards work, The Religious Affections, you should give it a read. In fact, it's actually the free audio book of the month at Christian Audio: https://christianaudio.com/free/
     
  12. Hawkins

    Hawkins Member Supporter

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    I think that your theory here is very much close to it. However I have some input.


    Animals have no soul at all. If they can operate by themselves so can humans without a soul, though I agree with the "high self" description. That is, it's possible that more intelligent thoughts can be initiated by the soul instead of our physical brain.

    So the soul is more like a clustered computer, it has everything our body has including our five senses for us to perceive a physical world. However soul as a clustered computer doesn't reside on our realm (time-space), our soul resides in another spatial dimension (it can be material but with particles available inside that dimension, which can be different from ours). When we die our soul naturally descend to Hades (the spatial realm where it naturally resides). The soul thus lost the 5 sensors for it to possibly perceive our physical world (especially light). Capable spirits (possibly including trained human souls) may have the obsession in perceiving our world again by hacking into a host with his (or even its) 5 senses.

    A spirit is something else. It acts more like a key in binding the soul to the body. The spirit is the first one who knows your death and will try to get out. You are not actually dead without giving out your spirit. After giving out the spirit you are done and won't be able to return to this world without a resurrection. The spirit possibly carries our earthly affections (say between mother and son, wife and husband and etc.) and/or even your conscience. After getting out the spirit can be considered as "being returned to God".

    Souls in Hades (i.e., those remain awaken) thus no longer have the love for their sons or parents. This situation is more like you still remember everything about your ex, but now your love is no longer with him/her as your love now goes to your wife/husband. And I doubt that they still have conscience or moral code with them.
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2018
  13. NW82

    NW82 Quote scripture or your argument is invalid.

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    You have to look at the original Hebrew to answer this. According to the Hebrew we are Body, Soul and Spirit. The key being we are Spirits, as in that is who we are, the body is just a shell. Soul, in the Hebrew refers to the ability to breathe, think and reason...that said even animals have souls and bodies. The difference, again, is the Spirit, which is what sets us apart from any other creation. So where does the Spirit reside? Trick question, we are the Spirit, the body is a shell and the soul is our ability to control the body.
     
  14. Dirk1540

    Dirk1540 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    According to Archie Bunker it moves around

     
  15. The Times

    The Times Well-Known Member

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    The Breath of Life believe it or not is the very sound of the name of God.

    Two syllables sounding phonics as in...

    YAH-WEH

    Listen to God's name in our very breathing, the breath of life he breathed into Adam.



    The Breath is actually Nephesh.
    The Ruarch is actually the Soul.

    So when we say the Ruarch of God we are actually saying the Soul, that is the uncreated being of God. The word Spirit is used interchangeably to mean both, yet saying Holy Spirit and Holy Soul/Ruarch is the same thing.

    Think about it for a moment. The Spirit with a Capital is both Soul and Life together, owing to a conscious Being and Him being the source of all life.
     
  16. The Times

    The Times Well-Known Member

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    Interesting take I must say. I agree animals don't have a soul self awareness being remotely controlling them, which makes them in my thinking AI living Organisms designed to emulate and learn/evolve.
     
  17. Halbhh

    Halbhh Everything You say is Life to me Supporter

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    Somehow your individual spirit is put into or attached to your body, and this conditions (your) soul over time even as you (you the individual soul/spirit) can make choices at key moments in life, if the body (mind, ego) isn't too trained to ignore the soul.
     
  18. Fish Catcher Jim

    Fish Catcher Jim Radically Saved

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    Part of. Incorporated into. Attached
     
  19. Fish Catcher Jim

    Fish Catcher Jim Radically Saved

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    You make no sense.
    Soul = mind , will and emotions.
    It is part of the spirit of man which never dies.
     
  20. The Times

    The Times Well-Known Member

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    How is it incorporated locally or remotely, because the thread claims remotely giving reasons.
     
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