Where is hell in a round earth?

[daleksteve]

Not only is earth flat, it is fixed immovable so can not move according to scripture. Which means no spinning top revolving at 1000 mph and no going around the sun at 66,000 mph.

Earth is described to us as being placed on pillars, with a foundation, and has a cornerstone.

1 Samuel 2:8
He raises up the poor out of the dust and lifts up the needy from the ash heap, to make them sit with nobles and inherit the throne of glory. For the pillars of the earth are the Lord’s, and He has set the world upon them.

Job 9:6
Who shakes the earth out of its place, and the pillars of it tremble;

Psalm 75:3
When the earth totters, and all the inhabitants of it, it is I Who will poise and keep steady its pillars. Selah [pause, and calmly think of that]!

Psalm 104:5
You laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be moved forever.

1 Chronicles 16:30
Tremble and reverently fear before Him, all the earth’s peoples; the world also shall be established, so it cannot be moved.

Proverbs 8:29
When He gave to the sea its limit and His decree that the waters should not transgress [across the boundaries set by] His command, when He appointed the foundations of the earth—

Isaiah 24:18
And he who flees at the noise of the terror will fall into the pit; and he who comes up out of the pit will be caught in the snare. For the windows of the heavens are opened [as in the deluge], and the foundations of the earth tremble and shake.

Job 38:6
Upon what were the foundations of it fastened, or who laid its cornerstone,

And about that circle thing, the world is as God drew a circle on the face of the waters of the deep, then God stretches out the firmament over top of the flat circle as like a dome. The firmament contains the stars, moon and sun. No planets are mentioned, planets are really just lights in the firmament as are them all, revolving around the earth fixed in place in the firmament.
Proverbs 8:27
When He prepared the heavens, I [Wisdom] was there; when He drew a circle upon the face of the deep and stretched out the firmament over it,

Nice twisting of scripture there.

The earth is round.

If we going to play around with scripture...

Isaiah 40:22: He sits enthroned above the circle of the earth, and its people are like grasshoppers. He stretches out the heavens like a canopy, and spreads them out like a tent to live in

 

[sdowney717]

Nice twisting of scripture there.

The earth is round.

If we going to play around with scripture...

Isaiah 40:22: He sits enthroned above the circle of the earth, and its people are like grasshoppers. He stretches out the heavens like a canopy, and spreads them out like a tent to live in

The circle which He drew on the face of the deep, is that same circle mentioned here. A circle laid down flat on its face, not a circle upright, that would be a sphere not a circle, a different word exists for ball, sphere, which is not used in the verse you mentioned.

God sits above the (flat )circle which He drew of the earth on the face of the deep to define the boundary of the world.

Circle is compass, using which tool is described a flat circle on the deep. Deep is that same DEEP spoken of in Gen 1.
KJ21
When He prepared the heavens, I was there; when He set a compass upon the face of the deep,
ASV
When he established the heavens, I was there: When he set a circle upon the face of the deep,
AMP
“When He established the heavens, I [Wisdom] was there; When He drew a circle upon the face of the deep,
AMPC
When He prepared the heavens, I [Wisdom] was there; when He drew a circle upon the face of the deep and stretched out the firmament over it,
BRG
When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth:
CEB
I was there when he established the heavens, when he marked out the horizon on the deep sea,
CJB
When he established the heavens, I was there. When he drew the horizon’s circle on the deep,
CEV
I was there when the Lord put the heavens in place and stretched the sky over the surface of the sea.
DARBY
When he prepared the heavens I was there; when he ordained the circle upon the face of the deep;
DRA
When he prepared the heavens, I was present: when with a certain law and compass he enclosed the depths:
ERV
I was there when he set up the skies, when he drew a circle in the ocean to make a place for the land.
ESV
When he established the heavens, I was there; when he drew a circle on the face of the deep,
ESVUK
When he established the heavens, I was there; when he drew a circle on the face of the deep,
EXB
I was there when God ·put the skies in place [established the heavens], when he ·stretched [decreed] the horizon over the ·oceans [deep],
GNV
When he prepared the heavens, I was there, when he set the compass upon the deep:
GW
“When he set up the heavens, I was there. When he traced the horizon on the surface of the ocean,
GNT
I was there when he set the sky in place, when he stretched the horizon across the ocean,
HCSB
I was there when He established the heavens, when He laid out the horizon on the surface of the ocean,
ICB
I was there when God put the skies in place, when he stretched the horizon over the oceans.
ISV
when he crafted the heavens, I was there— when he marked out a circle on the face of the deep,
JUB
when he composed the heavens, I was there. When he set a compass upon the face of the depth,
KJV
When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth:
AKJV
When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth:
LEB
when he established the heavens, there I was, when he drew a circle upon the face of the deep,

 

[sdowney717]

Isaiah 40, v12, the word circle in no way means a sphere.

21 Do you not know? Do you not hear?
Has it not been told you from the beginning?
Have you not understood from the foundations of the earth?
22 It is he who sits above the circle of the earth,
and its inhabitants are like grasshoppers;
who stretches out the heavens like a curtain,
and spreads them like a tent to dwell in;

That he stretches out the heavens is the same word as firmament and Isaiah 40:12, is resaying Proverbs 8 in the same way.

22 “The Lord possessed me at the beginning of his work,[c]
the first of his acts of old.
23 Ages ago I was set up,
at the first, before the beginning of the earth.
24 When there were no depths I was brought forth,
when there were no springs abounding with water.
25 Before the mountains had been shaped,
before the hills, I was brought forth,
26 before he had made the earth with its fields,
or the first of the dust of the world.
27 When he established the heavens, I was there;
when he drew a circle on the face of the deep,
28 when he made firm the skies above,
when he established[d] the fountains of the deep,
29 when he assigned to the sea its limit,
so that the waters might not transgress his command,
when he marked out the foundations of the earth,

 

[sdowney717]

Genesis Chapter 1 (KJV)
Isaiah 40:22, the word חוּג chuwg means compass or circle, not sphere.

KJV Translation Count — Total: 3x
The KJV translates Strong's H2329 in the following manner: circle (1x), circuit (1x), compass (1x).
Outline of Biblical Usage [?]

1. circle, circuit, compass
   
   
2. (BDB) vault (of the heavens)
   
   
   Job 22:14

Thick clouds are a covering to him, that he seeth not; and he walketh in the circuit H2329 of heaven.
Pro 8:27

When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass H2329 upon the face of the depth:
Isa 40:22

It is he that sitteth upon the circle H2329 of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:

That which is spread out as a tent to dwell in is the firmament which is heaven, not the earth.

Genesis 1:8New King James Version (NKJV)
8 And God called the firmament Heaven. So the evening and the morning were the second day.

 

[daleksteve]

Not only is earth flat, it is fixed immovable so can not move according to scripture. Which means no spinning top revolving at 1000 mph and no going around the sun at 66,000 mph.

Earth is described to us as being placed on pillars, with a foundation, and has a cornerstone.

1 Samuel 2:8
He raises up the poor out of the dust and lifts up the needy from the ash heap, to make them sit with nobles and inherit the throne of glory. For the pillars of the earth are the Lord’s, and He has set the world upon them.

Job 9:6
Who shakes the earth out of its place, and the pillars of it tremble;

I samuel 2:8 It is a poetic prayer from Hannah. The whole thing is a poetic prayer.

The book of job is poetic.

 

[sdowney717]

I samuel 2:8 It is a poetic prayer from Hannah. The whole thing is a poetic prayer.

The book of job is poetic.

Poetry is not in the list of what scripture is for.
2 Timothy 3:16-17New King James Version (NKJV)
16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.

 

[daleksteve]

Poetry is not in the list of what scripture is for.
2 Timothy 3:16-17New King James Version (NKJV)
16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.

Take Palsm for example.. nothing more than heavily poetic religious songs and sayings! Should we take those literally.

There is no rock like our God comes from the same prayer by Hannah. So should we take the whole thing literally too? Does the writer really think no other rocks are like God? Do they think God is a rock?

 

[mmksparbud]

Not only is earth flat, it is fixed immovable so can not move according to scripture. Which means no spinning top revolving at 1000 mph and no going around the sun at 66,000 mph.

Earth is described to us as being placed on pillars, with a foundation, and has a cornerstone.

You can't use poetic language to prove scientific points. when the bible says
Son 1:15 Behold, thou art fair, my love; behold, thou art fair; thou hast doves' eyes.

Are you seriously going to believe her eyes are doves eyes and not human??

The bible doesn't say the earth doesn't move----it says it can't be moved--as in no one, nor anything is going to move it from its place in orbit. You can't kick it out of the way!!
Pillars and such just means that it is stable, we need nit worry about this earth wobbling all over the universe.
I've asked before, all you have to do is take a picture of this dome. As the dome hits the edge if the earth, the height is decreasing until it meets with the edge--so, as it nears the edges if this flat earth, the height is much less than in the middle, so it should be easy to get a picture if this dome the closer you get to the edges. So far, nit one if you have shown a picture of this dome, heck, you should be able to walk right up to the edge and touch it!
The foundations of the earth is simply the core of it, it's base as in when God first created
Gen 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

It is describing an asteroid like core here of rock, dirt and water--which He then separates.
Gen 1:9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.
Gen 1:10 And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.

At the flood the water came uo from the ground as well as from the sky "the windows of heaven" ----you think there are windows there----then you should be able to take pictures of them also.

Poetry is not in the list of what scripture is for.
2 Timothy 3:16-17New King James Version (NKJV)
16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.

You obviously have never read the book of Solomon!

 

[daleksteve]

Poetry is not in the list of what scripture is for.
2 Timothy 3:16-17New King James Version (NKJV)
16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.

Not read the song of songs then.

Song of Solomon 8:10 I am a wall, and my breasts are like towers ...

 

[sdowney717]

You can't use poetic language to prove scientific points. when the bible says
Son 1:15 Behold, thou art fair, my love; behold, thou art fair; thou hast doves' eyes.

Are you seriously going to believe her eyes are doves eyes and not human??
View attachment 186940View attachment 186941

The bible doesn't say the earth doesn't move----it says it can't be moved--as in no one, nor anything is going to move it from its place in orbit. You can't kick it out of the way!!
Pillars and such just means that it is stable, we need nit worry about this earth wobbling all over the universe.
I've asked before, all you have to do is take a picture of this dome. As the dome hits the edge if the earth, the height is decreasing until it meets with the edge--so, as it nears the edges if this flat earth, the height is much less than in the middle, so it should be easy to get a picture if this dome the closer you get to the edges. So far, nit one if you have shown a picture of this dome, heck, you should be able to walk right up to the edge and touch it!
The foundations of the earth is simply the core of it, it's base as in when God first created
Gen 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

It is describing an asteroid like core here of rock, dirt and water--which He then separates.
Gen 1:9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.
Gen 1:10 And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.

At the flood the water came uo from the ground as well as from the sky "the windows of heaven" ----you think there are windows there----then you should be able to take pictures of them also.


You obviously have never read the book of Solomon!

You and many others are like one of the disputers of this age, who reframe the scriptures according to human reasoning.
1 Cor 1
19 For it is written:

“I will destroy the wisdom of the wise,
And bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.”

20 Where is the wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the disputer of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?

You completely turn scripture into meaningless muck when you say it is all of poetry the things of which you dispute the clear meaning.

 

[daleksteve]

Genesis Chapter 1 (KJV)
Isaiah 40:22, the word חוּג chuwg means compass or circle, not sphere.

KJV Translation Count — Total: 3x
The KJV translates Strong's H2329 in the following manner: circle (1x), circuit (1x), compass (1x).
Outline of Biblical Usage [?]

1. circle, circuit, compass
   
   
2. (BDB) vault (of the heavens)
   
   
   Job 22:14

Thick clouds are a covering to him, that he seeth not; and he walketh in the circuit H2329 of heaven.
Pro 8:27

When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass H2329 upon the face of the depth:
Isa 40:22

It is he that sitteth upon the circle H2329 of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:

That which is spread out as a tent to dwell in is the firmament which is heaven, not the earth.

Genesis 1:8New King James Version (NKJV)
8 And God called the firmament Heaven. So the evening and the morning were the second day.

NKJV is also not a good translation either. Full of old English.

New International Version
God called the vault "sky." And there was evening, and there was morning--the second day.

 

[sdowney717]

NKJV is also not a good translation either. Full of old English.

New International Version
God called the vault "sky." And there was evening, and there was morning--the second day.

Matthew 15:6Amplified Bible, Classic Edition (AMPC)
6 So for the sake of your tradition (the rules handed down by your forefathers), you have set aside the Word of God [depriving it of force and authority and making it of no effect].

 

[daleksteve]

You completely turn scripture into meaningless muck when you say it is all of poetry the things of which you dispute the clear meaning.

You have done that yourself. All you have done is mis-intepret scripture to fit a dumb view that the earth is flat.

I can prove its round with science. mathematics and physics yet you cannot provide one piece of evidence that its flat.

 

[mmksparbud]

You and many others are like one of the disputers of this age, who reframe the scriptures according to human reasoning.
1 Cor 1
19 For it is written:

“I will destroy the wisdom of the wise,
And bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.”

20 Where is the wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the disputer of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?

You completely turn scripture into meaningless muck when you say it is all of poetry the things of which you dispute the clear meaning.

You do realize that you have addressed not one single point that has been made, don't you? And how do you know you are not the one that your verses are talking about? And I never said all scripture is poetry, that is stupid to think that, but poetry is obvious and you don't seem to see the obvious.

 

[daleksteve]

Matthew 15:6Amplified Bible, Classic Edition (AMPC)
6 So for the sake of your tradition (the rules handed down by your forefathers), you have set aside the Word of God [depriving it of force and authority and making it of no effect].

Do you have any non scriptural evidence that the earth is flat?

 

[daleksteve]

You and many others are like one of the disputers of this age, who reframe the scriptures according to human reasoning.

Like i said, if the earth was flat then would be non scriptural evidence to support it, however THERE is none.

 

[ButForGrace]

Proving that the Earth is a sphere, and not a flat plane, is absolutely TRIVIAL. All you need is, when the sun is at its maximum position in the sky in one location in the middle of the US (say, Iowa) for a friend on the West Coast to measure the angle of inclination of the sun at the same moment. The angle will tell you unequivocally that the Earth is a sphere of radius approximately 6370 km, and not a flat plane with the sun somewhere above it.

However, even this information will not convince the flat earth folks - and the fact that it is impossible for them to reproduce the calculation will not deter them from spewing forth their unfounded opinions on the matter.

 

[Der Alte]

According to this source sheol to the pre-NT Hebrews was the common grave or a place of darkness totally devoid of all human activity or thought.
Sheol Definition and Meaning - Bible Dictionary
What is Sheol? What is Hades?—Meaning of Bible Terms | Bible Teach

You ignored the fact that I quoted from the Jewish Encyclopedia which documents the historical beliefs and practices of the Jews. Now if you can produce any source which disproves the historical evidence I posted please do so. Just quoting something which states something different is not enough.
And you stopped reading to soon in the source you linked to. Here from your first link.

"The New Testament. By the time of Jesus, it was common for Jews to believe that the righteous dead go to a place of comfort while the wicked go to Hades ("Hades" normally translates "Sheol" in the LXX), a place of torment ( Luke 16:22-23 )."​

The second source is JW and does not merit consideration. They did not offer any historical evidence for the stated conclusions. So this is "itchy ear syndrome."

 

[jimbohank]

Veil.

You are correct on the spelling, thanks for calling me out on that.

 

[Der Alte]

As I said, I didn't say anything about the Jews. The Bible doesn't teach a place in the earth where the wicked are tormented for eternity.

That idea comes from a few misunderstood passages of Scripture. The Bible tells us that the Sadducees didn't believe in spirits or an afterlife and

the Pharisees believed in spirits and the Resurrection.

Whether you said anything about the Jews or not, is not relevant. What the Jews, at the time of Jesus, believed about hell is very relevant to this discussion. As I have shown from the Jewish Encyclopedia and the Talmud, before and during the time of Jesus, many Jews believed in "a place ... where the wicked are tormented for eternity" and they called it both sheol/hades and Gehinnom. Please explain to me how you think you know that the Jews misinterpreted their own Hebrew scriptures? The possible existence of an opposing view does not disprove the "hell" view.
Many Jews believed "The Lord, the Almighty, will punish them on the Day of Judgment by putting fire and worms into their flesh, so that they cry out with pain unto all eternity,"Jewish Encyclopedia. When Jesus taught the Jews that some would be "cast into hell where the fire is not quenched and the worm does not die." would the Jews understand that their view was wrong?

It isn't hades where the fire isn't quenched, it Gehenna. Jesus quoted Isaiah and called it Gehenna.

So there must be two places of fiery torment where people are sent after death?
In the OT the Hebrew word "sheol" is translated "Hades" in the LXX. It appears to be a place of fire and a parent disciplining their child can save the child from sheol/hades.

Deuteronomy 32:22
(22) For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell [sheol], and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains.
Proverbs 23:14
(14) Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell.[sheol]​