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ebedmelech said:You simply missed the qualifier...look at the WHOLE phrase:
Romans 15:27:
27 Yes, they were pleased to do so, and they are indebted to them. For if the Gentiles have shared in their spiritual things, they are indebted to minister to them also in material things.
Paul is saying that...true enough...but why do you ignore that these Gentile saints WERE PLEASED to do so.
Probably because you don't get it...they had a right Spirit. Their willingness shows the Holy Spirit working in them.
Paul then speaks from the same point of view he shares in Romans 11:17-24.
You simply chose to focus on one point...and that's pretty sad.
Yes...I said sad...because you CHOOSE to ignore what the scripture straight fowardly says using different words.You're making me laugh dudebed, sad? We're friends man
Why do you insist on saying Oct. 6, 2013 is the star sign of Rev 12, when it clearly isn't? Where are the 12 stars at her head? Absolute nonsense.
This is the star sign of Rev. 12, sun clothing her, moon at her feet, w/ 12 stars (9+3 planets in Leo), giving birth to Jupiter. This occurs on Rosh Hashanah Sept. 22, 2017, 70 years from 11-29-47 (the "days are shortened"). I posted Sept 23 because the verses say she is in the throes of giving birth, not that she has given birth (meaning it is applicable to Sept. 22 not 23), I show Jupiter as already being born just for simplicity's sake.
As to the 40 day call to repentance, that will occur Nov. 7, 2013 by Billy Graham Billy Graham: Final call for America to repent
add 40 days to get Dec. 17, 2013 when all the Comet Ison BS will be in full swing.
"Let not your heart be troubled: you believe in God, believe also in me. 2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a PLACE for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a PLACE for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there you may be also."
Matthew 17:12
Matthew 17:11
And Jesus answered and said to them, Elias truly shall(future tense) first come, and restore all thing
Do you not think one of the two witnesses will be Elijah?....much easier to restore all things when you can call fire from the sky and not be killed as it says in Revelation of the 2 witnesses
ebedmelech said:Pretty much wrong intojoy. Revelation 11 tells us how to understand this. It is not Elijah...but a type of Elijah.
But rather than contend with you on it, I'll let you continue, since I enjoy "apocalyptic fiction"...
Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the great and terrible day of Jehovah come.
In chapter 3:1a, the prophet announced the coming of a forerunner before the First Coming of the Messiah. Although he never named the forerunner, John the Baptist was the forerunner of the First Coming, according to the New Testament. Now Malachi announced a forerunner before the Second Coming of the Messiah, and this one is specifically named. It will be someone who has been here once before: Elijah the prophet. There is no reason to spiritualize this verse away. He made a very simple statement: I will send you Elijah the prophet, and so Elijah will come! Elijah was not promised before the First Coming.
The timing of the coming of Elijah is stated as before the great and terrible day of Jehovah. Again, the expression the day of Jehovah is the most common term for the seven years of the Great Tribulation. Malachi stated that, before the Tribulation starts, Elijah will return. The Tribulation will begin with the signing of a seven year covenant between Israel and the Antichrist. Before that covenant is actually signed, Elijah the Prophet will return.
And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers; lest I come and smite the earth with a curse. In verse 6a, the primary purpose for Elijah's coming is to restore the Jewish family unit, which is known for its closeness and togetherness. The one thing that has divided the Jewish family structure has been the issue of the Messiahship of Jesus. As close knit as the Jewish family may be, if one member becomes a believer in Jesus, there is instantaneous division in that Jewish family unit. Indeed, when the Messiah came the first time, He pointed out that He would become a point of division in the Jewish world and the Jewish family unit (Mat. 10:34-37). Some would believe and some would not, and this would result in father being against son, son against father, daughter against mother, and so on. To this day, the issue of the Messiahship of Yeshua is a point of division in the Jewish family unit.
The purpose of the return of Elijah the Prophet, then, is to restore the family unit, to work in such a way that Jesus will no longer be a point of division within the Jewish family unit. As a result, this will lead to Israel's national salvation. The national salvation of Israel is the one prerequisite to the Second Coming. There will be no Second Coming until Israel, as a nation, has turned to Him in believing faith. If Elijah does not succeed, the text states in verse 6b: lest I come and smite the earth with a curse. As other passages bring out, Elijah will succeed in his ministry.
Old Testament history ends with the judgment of a curse, known as cherem; it is the worst type of curse, one of utter destruction. The rabbis, in their reading of the Book of Malachi in the synagogue, do not like to conclude the reading with a curse. After reading verse 6, they repeat verse 5 so that it will not close with a curse. But regardless of how they might try to euphemize it away, the curse is the curse and the judgment of the Day of Jehovah still stands. Ultimately , the perversion of the Mosaic Law that came about through Pharisaism and Sadduceeism, led to the rejection of the Messiahship of Jesus. It is this sin that leads Israel, in the end, to the Great Tribulation. According to Zechariah, this will lead ultimately to Israel's national restoration and regeneration . Although this curse ends the Old Testament, it sets the stage for the blessings of the fulfillment of chapter 3:1 with the coming of John the Baptist, the forerunner of the First Coming of the Messiah. Eventually , the second forerunner, Elijah the Prophet, will come and that will be followed by the Second Coming of the Messiah.
Ariel Ministries: Messianic Bible Studies NUMERICAL INDEX
karen4you said:The two witness in Rev will be enoch and elijah. Or perhaps john and elijah. One from the old test. and one from the new test. That is when those who are in the tribulation will see them dead for two days, and then resurrected there after.
remember the law of my servant Moses, the decrees I gave him at Horeb for all of Israel
There are pretty clear reasons why the two witnesses are not literally Moses and Elijah.The two witness in Rev will be enoch and elijah. Or perhaps john and elijah. One from the old test. and one from the new test. That is when those who are in the tribulation will see them dead for two days, and then resurrected there after.
Revelation 1:12-13
I saw seven golden candlesticks; And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle.
Revelation 1:20
The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches:and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches.
Revelation 2:1
These things saith he that holdeth the seven stars in his right hand, who walketh in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks;
Revelation 3:1
And unto the angel of the church in Sardis write; These things saith he that hath the seven Spirits of God, and the seven stars;
Revelation 11:3
And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy (PREACH THE GOSPEL) a thousand two hundred and threescore days (APOSTOLIC AGE), clothed in sackcloth (GREAT COMMISSION PRIESTLY CLOTHING).
These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth. And if any man will hurt them, fire (HOLY SPIRIT) proceedeth out of their mouth (SPOKEN CONDEMNATION), and devoureth their enemies:and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.
Revelation 11:1-3
And there was given me a reed like unto a rod:and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein. But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles:and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
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