When do the biblical days begin?

  • morning

    Votes: 2 14.3%
  • evening

    Votes: 12 85.7%

  • Total voters
    14

Yeshua HaDerekh

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Brother, what did God say in this passage?

And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day. (Genesis 1:3-5 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

He said "Yehi Ohr"! BTW, WHAT was the light? There was already darkness...you do not understand the significance of this...
 
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guevaraj

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He said "Yehi Ohr"! BTW, WHAT was the light? There was already darkness...you do not understand the significance of this...
Brother, I know that "evening" does not mean "night" and that "morning" does not mean "day" as our tradition makes us believe when they are different words with a different meaning. I know that from evening to morning is only 12 hours compared to the 24 hours of a Sabbath in Israel from evening to evening, a period bordered by two evenings. Where are the other 12 hours left to complete the first day? God ends the first day in a "morning"! The other 12 hours are before the 12 hours from evening to morning of the night that end the days of creation. The missing period is the 12 hours from morning to evening that God called "day". The period of light before the end of the first day with a "night".

And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day. (Genesis 1:3-5 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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Brother, I know that "evening" does not mean "night" and that "morning" does not mean "day" as our tradition makes us believe when they are different words with a different meaning. I know that from evening to morning is only 12 hours compared to the 24 hours of a Sabbath in Israel from evening to evening, a period bordered by two evenings. Where are the other 12 hours left to complete the first day? God ends the first day in a "morning"! The other 12 hours are before the 12 hours from evening to morning of the night that end the days of creation. The missing period is the 12 hours from morning to evening that God called "day". The period of light before the end of the first day with a "night".

You never answered my question...
 
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guevaraj

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You never answered my question...
Brother, the sun existed from the first day. There are three pieces of evidence. First, the word "evening" which means sunset reveals that the sun is the greater light from the first day. It’s obvious that the greater light is present from day one for its purpose to count the days already listed before the fourth day. Second, the use of the “waw-consecutive” on the fourth day continues events that end chronologically after the start of the fourth day. On the fourth day, added is the lessor light of the moon to go with the greater light to complete God's plan for these two lights in the sky. All phrases underlined are a single word from the original language in “waw-consecutive” form. The “waw-consecutive” form tells us that there is a chronological continuation of events with something new added on day four, the moon, which is not necessary before day four, while the sun was necessary to count the earlier days from the first day. Third, there is a different verb used on the fourth day that in the later context with Abraham shows that it means prepared (asah) and not create (bara') as in the previous verses.

And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years, and let them be lights in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth.” And it was so. God made (asah) two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made (asah) the stars. God set them in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth, to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day. (Genesis 1:14-19 NIV)​

The sun already existed from the first day as explained here to separate the days and added was the moon to the sun to prepare (asah) and not create (bara') the sun that already existed from the first day to decide from now on the seasons of the year in addition to the days from the first day.

So Abraham hurried into the tent to Sarah. “Quick,” he said, “get three seahs of the finest flour and knead it and bake some bread.” Then he ran to the herd and selected a choice, tender calf and gave it to a servant, who hurried to prepare (asah) it. He then brought some curds and milk and the calf that had been prepared (asah), and set these before them. While they ate, he stood near them under a tree. (Genesis 18:6-8 NIV)​

United in our hope of the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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Brother, the sun existed from the first day. There are three pieces of evidence. First, the word "evening" which means sunset reveals that the sun is the greater light from the first day. It’s obvious that the greater light is present from day one for its purpose to count the days already listed before the fourth day. Second, the use of the “waw-consecutive” on the fourth day continues events that end chronologically after the start of the fourth day. On the fourth day, added is the lessor light of the moon to go with the greater light to complete God's plan for these two lights in the sky. All phrases underlined are a single word from the original language in “waw-consecutive” form. The “waw-consecutive” form tells us that there is a chronological continuation of events with something new added on day four, the moon, which is not necessary before day four, while the sun was necessary to count the earlier days from the first day. Third, there is a different verb used on the fourth day that in the later context with Abraham shows that it means prepared (asah) and not create (bara') as in the previous verses.

And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years, and let them be lights in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth.” And it was so. God made (asah) two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made (asah) the stars. God set them in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth, to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day. (Genesis 1:14-19 NIV)​

The sun already existed from the first day as explained here to separate the days and added was the moon to the sun to prepare (asah) and not create (bara') the sun that already existed from the first day to decide from now on the seasons of the year in addition to the days from the first day.

See I knew you would not know. You are making things up again. The sun was on the 4 day...that is what the text says...
 
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guevaraj

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See I knew you would not know. You are making things up again. The sun was on the 4 day...that is what the text says...
Brother, there is a different verb used on the fourth day that in the later context with Abraham at the end of this post shows that it means prepared (asah) and not create (bara') as in the previous verses.

And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years, and let them be lights in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth.” And it was so. God made (asah) two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made (asah) the stars. God set them in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth, to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day. (Genesis 1:14-19 NIV)​

The sun already existed from the first day as explained here to decide the days and added was the moon to the sun to prepare (asah) and not create (bara') the sun that already existed from the first day to decide from now on the seasons of the year in addition to the days from the first day.

So Abraham hurried into the tent to Sarah. “Quick,” he said, “get three seahs of the finest flour and knead it and bake some bread.” Then he ran to the herd and selected a choice, tender calf and gave it to a servant, who hurried to prepare (asah) it. He then brought some curds and milk and the calf that had been prepared (asah), and set these before them. While they ate, he stood near them under a tree. (Genesis 18:6-8 NIV)​

United in our hope of the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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Brother, there is a different verb used on the fourth day that in the later context with Abraham at the end of this post shows that it means prepared (asah) and not create (bara') as in the previous verses.

And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years, and let them be lights in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth.” And it was so. God made (asah) two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made (asah) the stars. God set them in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth, to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day. (Genesis 1:14-19 NIV)​

The sun already existed from the first day as explained here to decide the days and added was the moon to the sun to prepare (asah) and not create (bara') the sun that already existed from the first day to decide from now on the seasons of the year in addition to the days from the first day.

So Abraham hurried into the tent to Sarah. “Quick,” he said, “get three seahs of the finest flour and knead it and bake some bread.” Then he ran to the herd and selected a choice, tender calf and gave it to a servant, who hurried to prepare (asah) it. He then brought some curds and milk and the calf that had been prepared (asah), and set these before them. While they ate, he stood near them under a tree. (Genesis 18:6-8 NIV)​

United in our hope of the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

According to Jewish beliefs and tradition, God created the sun, the moon and the stars as the fourth day began.

Asah can mean "make". Making a strong distinction between bara and asah in Genesis 1–2 is unjustified.
 
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guevaraj

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According to Jewish beliefs and tradition, God created the sun, the moon and the stars as the fourth day began. Asah can mean "make". Making a strong distinction between bara and asah in Genesis 1–2 is unjustified.
Brother, written is it that they were wrong in many things that we must correct by studying the written word of God and not assume that they are right because the human tradition is with us for so long.

You have let go of the commands of God and are holding on to human traditions.” And he continued, “You have a fine way of setting aside the commands of God in order to observe your own traditions! For Moses said, ‘Honor your father and mother,’ and, ‘Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death.’ But you say that if anyone declares that what might have been used to help their father or mother is Corban (that is, devoted to God)— then you no longer let them do anything for their father or mother. Thus you nullify the word of God by your tradition that you have handed down. And you do many things like that.” (Mark 7:8-13 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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Brother, written is it that they were wrong in many things that we must correct by studying the written word of God and not assume that they are right because the human tradition is with us for so long.

The only reason you say that is because it goes against your false theory
 
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HARK!

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Brother, written is it that they were wrong in many things that we must correct by studying the written word of God and not assume that they are right because the human tradition is with us for so long.

(CLV) Gn 1:14
And Elohim said: Let luminaries come to be in the atmosphere of the heavens to separate between the day and the night, that they may be for signs, for appointed seasons, for days and years.

"Let them come to be." What were they before they came to be, on the fourth day? What does come to be mean? What did they "be," before they "be?"

(CLV) Gn 1:15
Let them be for luminaries in the atmosphere of the heavens to give light on the earth. And it came to be so.

(CLV) Gn 1:16
Elohim made two great luminaries, the greater luminary for ruling the day and the smaller luminary for ruling the night, and also the stars.]

Elohim made two great luminaries on the fourth day. What were they before he made them?

(CLV) Gn 1:17
Elohim placed them in the atmosphere of the heavens to give light on the earth,

Elohim placed them on the fourth day. Where were they before he placed them?

(CLV) Gn 1:18
to rule the day and the night, and to separate between the light and the darkness. And Elohim saw that it was good.

(CLV) Gn 1:19
And evening came to be, and morning came to be: the fourth day.
 
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guevaraj

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The only reason you say that is because it goes against your false theory
"Let them come to be." What were they before they came to be, on the fourth day? What does come to be mean? What did they "be," before they "be?" Elohim made two great luminaries on the fourth day. What were they before he made them? Elohim placed them on the fourth day. Where were they before he placed them?
Brothers, the word "evening" which means sunset reveals that the sun is the greater light from the first day. It’s obvious that the greater light is present from day one for its purpose to count the days already listed before the fourth day. The use of the “waw-consecutive” on the fourth day continues events that end chronologically after the start of the fourth day. On the fourth day, added is the lessor light of the moon to go with the greater light to complete God's plan for these two lights in the sky. All phrases in red are a single word from the original language in “waw-consecutive” form. The “waw-consecutive” form tells us that there is a chronological continuation of events with something new added on day four, the moon, which is not necessary before day four, while the sun was necessary to count the earlier days from the first day.

And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years, and let them be lights in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth.” And it was so. God made two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars. God set them in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth, to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day. (Genesis 1:14-19 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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The use of the “waw-consecutive” on the fourth day continues events that end chronologically after the start of the fourth day. On the fourth day, added is the lessor light of the moon to go with the greater light to complete God's plan for these two lights in the sky. All phrases in red are a single word from the original language in “waw-consecutive” form. The “waw-consecutive” form tells us that there is a chronological continuation of events with something new added on day four, the moon, which is not necessary before day four, while the sun was necessary to count the earlier days from the first day.

And God said, “Let there be lights in the vault of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark sacred times, and days and years, and let them be lights in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth.” And it was so. God made two great lights—the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars. God set them in the vault of the sky to give light on the earth, to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the fourth day. (Genesis 1:14-19 NIV)​

What on earth are you talking about?!?!? You still can't answer my question regarding day 1
 
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guevaraj

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What on earth are you talking about?!?!? You still can't answer my question regarding day 1
Brother, in Genesis 1:16, from Hebrew syntax I translate the first portion of the verse "God prepared two great lights." God prepared the sun on the first day and now God simply describes its role. The word translated "made" refers to a prior "doing." I say that the light of the first day comes from the sun. Here's how someone I found on the internet explained it so you know I'm not alone in my reading:

Now you'd also see in the fourth day it uses the word asah for the Sun, Moon, and stars, but it's in the past tense. God made past tense and it's in a parenthetical context after the nathan usage. Which means that it could have been made any time before.... There is only one past tense in the Hebrew, you can't tell if its pluperfect or whatever. (Ross, Genesis One. An Ancient Earth—Recent Man Interpretation, 1989 (tape 2))​

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HARK!

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Brothers, the word "evening" which means sunset reveals that the sun is the greater light from the first day.

You didn't answer any of my questions. Obviously evening can mean something other than sunset; since scripture clearly states that the sun wasn't created until the fourth day.

Conjecture is fun; but I'm not willing to chop passages out of scripture to support my conjecture.
 
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guevaraj

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(CLV) Gn 1:14 And Elohim said: Let luminaries come to be in the atmosphere of the heavens to separate between the day and the night, that they may be for signs, for appointed seasons, for days and years. "Let them come to be." What were they before they came to be, on the fourth day? What does come to be mean? What did they "be," before they "be?"
Brother, there was only the sun. God added the moon on the fourth day. As God explains, the sun is the sign that separates the periods that God called "day" and "night" from the first day. For three days before the fourth, the purpose of the sun needed was as the sign for the days of creation explained on the fourth day. The novelty of the fourth day is the moon as a sign of the seasons and the year. Before there were two, the sun and the moon, there was one in the days of creation explained on the fourth, the sun. The phrase "It came to be" says that the result is present without saying how it "came to be." Before they both "be" there was only one, the sun.
(CLV) Gn 1:15 Let them be for luminaries in the atmosphere of the heavens to give light on the earth. And it came to be so. (CLV) Gn 1:16 Elohim made two great luminaries, the greater luminary for ruling the day and the smaller luminary for ruling the night, and also the stars.] Elohim made two great luminaries on the fourth day. What were they before he made them?
That word "made" does not mean created as the tradition forces in contradiction to the purpose of the sun as the sign needed since the first day. For God to separate the two periods of the first day He called "day" and "night" necessitates the sun as the sign explained in the fourth day. In a later verse with Abraham, the word “made” clearly means prepare something already created.
(CLV) Gn 1:17 Elohim placed them in the atmosphere of the heavens to give light on the earth, Elohim placed them on the fourth day. Where were they before he placed them?
Before God placed the two together, there was only one, the sun, as He explains as the sign to divide the periods, He named from the first day.
(CLV) Gn 1:18 to rule the day and the night, and to separate between the light and the darkness. And Elohim saw that it was good. (CLV) Gn 1:19 And evening came to be, and morning came to be: the fourth day.
On the fourth day God created the moon during what God called day between morning to evening before the period from evening to morning elapsed without incident, because God has nothing to report during the period of the night every day of the creation week. He only creates during the earlier period of light from morning to evening before ending each day of creation with the period He called night from evening to morning.

And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day. (Genesis 1:3-5 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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Brother, in Genesis 1:16, from Hebrew syntax I translate the first portion of the verse "God prepared two great lights." God prepared the sun on the first day and now God simply describes its role. The word translated "made" refers to a prior "doing." I say that the light of the first day comes from the sun. Here's how someone I found on the internet explained it so you know I'm not alone in my reading:

Now you'd also see in the fourth day it uses the word asah for the Sun, Moon, and stars, but it's in the past tense. God made past tense and it's in a parenthetical context after the nathan usage. Which means that it could have been made any time before.... There is only one past tense in the Hebrew, you can't tell if its pluperfect or whatever. (Ross, Genesis One. An Ancient Earth—Recent Man Interpretation, 1989 (tape 2))​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

So when something does not agree with your theory, it is either a bad translation or that Jews do not know Hebrew...I see...

According to Jewish beliefs and tradition, God created the sun, the moon and the stars as the fourth day began.

Asah can mean "make". Making a strong distinction between bara and asah in Genesis 1–2 is unjustified.
 
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guevaraj

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So when something does not agree with your theory, it is either a bad translation or that Jews do not know Hebrew...I see...According to Jewish beliefs and tradition, God created the sun, the moon and the stars as the fourth day began. Asah can mean "make". Making a strong distinction between bara and asah in Genesis 1–2 is unjustified.
Brother, the word "make" is never creation out of thin air and is best translated as prepared. Inspiration beats "human tradition"! For my church, I have our prophetess to help me correct the Sabbath tradition. It's what Jesus expects when we find a contradiction. When tradition says something different from what God wrote, shown is God's inspiration above "human tradition". Written is it that they were wrong in many things that we must correct by studying the written word of God and proved correct is God's word, especially when the human tradition is with us for so long.

To this John replied, “A person can receive only what is given them from heaven. You yourselves can testify that I said, ‘I am not the Messiah but am sent ahead of him.’ The bride belongs to the bridegroom. The friend who attends the bridegroom waits and listens for him, and is full of joy when he hears the bridegroom’s voice. That joy is mine, and it is now complete. He must become greater; I must become less.” (John 3:27-30 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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Yeshua HaDerekh

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Brother, the word "make" is never creation out of thin air and is best translated as prepared. Inspiration beats "human tradition"! For my church, I have our prophetess to help me correct the Sabbath tradition. It's what Jesus expects when we find a contradiction. When tradition says something different from what God wrote, shown is God's inspiration above "human tradition". Written is it that they were wrong in many things that we must correct by studying the written word of God and proved correct is God's word, especially when the human tradition is with us for so long.

To this John replied, “A person can receive only what is given them from heaven. You yourselves can testify that I said, ‘I am not the Messiah but am sent ahead of him.’ The bride belongs to the bridegroom. The friend who attends the bridegroom waits and listens for him, and is full of joy when he hears the bridegroom’s voice. That joy is mine, and it is now complete. He must become greater; I must become less.” (John 3:27-30 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

All SDA here disagree with you. That should tell you something!
Shabbat Shalom!
 
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guevaraj

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All SDA here disagree with you. That should tell you something! Shabbat Shalom!
Brother, happy Sabbath! The church is not inspired with its understanding of the word of God. Inspired is our prophetess and her inspiration is consistent with what I see in Genesis. When I say her inspiration, I don't mean what she understood but what she wrote. She wrote that we would understand more in the future and she highlights when evening falls as something to learn that we haven't changed, although I found the reason to change it. We still think that the days of creation begin with an evening when I found out that Genesis reveals that the evening falls in the middle of the first day and not at the beginning as supposed was due to the Sabbath in Israel, which is not a day of the week as set were the weekdays in the creation week from morning to morning.

And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day. (Genesis 1:3-5 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Brother, happy Sabbath! The church is not inspired with its understanding of the word of God. Inspired is our prophetess and her inspiration is consistent with what I see in Genesis. When I say her inspiration, I don't mean what she understood but what she wrote. She wrote that we would understand more in the future and she highlights when evening falls as something to learn that we haven't changed, although I found the reason to change it. We still think that the days of creation begin with an evening when I found out that Genesis reveals that the evening falls in the middle of the first day and not at the beginning as supposed was due to the Sabbath in Israel, which is not a day of the week as set were the weekdays in the creation week from morning to morning.

And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light. God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day. (Genesis 1:3-5 NIV)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Ellen White said Sabbath is from sundown to sundown. This is your own belief not one from the Bible or Ellen White.
 
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