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What is the purpose of the thousand-year reign of Christ?

DavidPT

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Revelation 19:11-21 & Revelation 20:7-15 are the same event of the final battle of Armageddon, second advent, final judgment.

The 7th trump takes place at the second advent, final judgment, eternal kingdom.

This takes place in the "Twinkling of an eye"

I don't understand your obsession with verse 21?

Verse 21 is read again as seen in verse 17-18 common practice in the bible?


My obsession about is that I don't see the twinkling of an eye explaining all of these events. Surely it will require more time for some of these things than that. You apparently need this twinkling of an to explain everything, in order for your doctrine to supposedly work. Nowhere in the text does it indicate all of these other events also happen in this same twinkling of an eye. We're not supposed to add things to the text not in the text.
 
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Truth7t7

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My obsession about is that I don't see the twinkling of an eye explaining all of these events. Surely it will require more time for some of these things than that. You apparently need this twinkling of an to explain everything, in order for your doctrine to supposedly work. Nowhere in the text does it indicate all of these other events also happen in this same twinkling of an eye. We're not supposed to add things to the text not in the text.
When Jesus Christ returns in the "Last Trump" 7th Trump, "Death Is Swallowed Up in Victory" in the twinkling of an eye, 1 Corinthians 15:52-54, Gods word defines this truth :)
 
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mmksparbud

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I know this will be thrown out--but here goes. This is intertwined with this:

Exo 23:10 And six years thou shalt sow thy land, and shalt gather in the fruits thereof:
Exo 23:11 But the seventh year thou shalt let it rest and lie still; that the poor of thy people may eat: and what they leave the beasts of the field shall eat. In like manner thou shalt deal with thy vineyard, and with thy oliveyard.
Exo 23:12 Six days thou shalt do thy work, and on the seventh day thou shalt rest: that thine ox and thine ass may rest, and the son of thy handmaid, and the stranger, may be refreshed.
ev 25:3 Six years thou shalt sow thy field, and six years thou shalt prune thy vineyard, and gather in the fruit thereof;
Lev 25:4 But in the seventh year shall be a sabbath of rest unto the land, a sabbath for the LORD: thou shalt neither sow thy field, nor prune thy vineyard.
Lev 25:5 That which groweth of its own accord of thy harvest thou shalt not reap, neither gather the grapes of thy vine undressed: for it is a year of rest unto the land.

Jer 4:23 I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void; and the heavens, and they had no light.
Jer 4:24 I beheld the mountains, and, lo, they trembled, and all the hills moved lightly.
Jer 4:25 I beheld, and, lo, there was no man, and all the birds of the heavens were fled.
Jer 4:26 I beheld, and, lo, the fruitful place was a wilderness, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the LORD, and by his fierce anger.
Jer 4:27 For thus hath the LORD said, The whole land shall be desolate; yet will I not make a full end.
Jer 4:28 For this shall the earth mourn, and the heavens above be black: because I have spoken it, I have purposed it, and will not repent, neither will I turn back from it.

There is a pattern--6 days labor, 1 day rest, six years labor one year rest, 6000 years, 1000 years rest.
The Sabbath rest and the 6th year rest of the land are also symbolic of the 1000 years rest of the earth.

2Pe_3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
2Pe_3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

The earth is destroyed at His coming.
The saved are gathered into the clouds with God. The earth and living lost are destroyed. Satan is bound to this void, empty world.

Rev_20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
Rev_20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

Rev_20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Rev_20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
Rev_20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

It is at the end of the 1000 years that the wicked are resurrected to face judgement and they come against God and the city that God is bringing down from heaven. It will be placed in a newly remae earth after the judgement of the wicked.

Rev 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.


Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
Rev 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

After that the earth is remade.

v 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
Rev 21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
Rev 21:3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.


I know this will be disputed. I am not going to debate--I am just putting this out to whomsoever is interested in a different view.
 
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DavidPT

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When Jesus Christ returns in the "Last Trump" 7th Trump, "Death Is Swallowed Up in Victory" in the twinkling of an eye, 1 Corinthians 15:52-54, Gods word defines this truth :)

While I do agree with this, in context it is only swallowed up in victory for the saved. It means they have become alive for forever, as in have become immortal and that they have literally risen from the dead. This has nothing to do with the unsaved as well.

1 Corinthians 15:57 But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.


Anyone who claims this also fits the lost, probably someone who I plan on not taking too seriously about things if they can't even discern that the text in 1 Corinthians 15:51-57 only concerns the saved, and not also the lost who eventually gets cast into the lake of fire.
 
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Davy

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While I do agree with this, in context it is only swallowed up in victory for the saved. It means they have become alive for forever, as in have become immortal and that they have literally risen from the dead. This has nothing to do with the unsaved as well.

1 Corinthians 15:57 But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.


Anyone who claims this also fits the lost, probably someone who I plan on not taking too seriously about things if they can't even discern that the text in 1 Corinthians 15:51-57 only concerns the saved, and not also the lost who eventually gets cast into the lake of fire.

If you don't believe the unsaved are resurrected also on the day of Jesus' return, then you stand in contradiction to what He taught in John 5:28-29:

John 5:28-29
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear His voice,

29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
KJV

By that our Lord Jesus revealed that BOTH resurrections will occur at the same time of His second coming.

In 1 Cor.15:53, Paul uses four different Greek words for the change he spoke of; "corruptible", "incorruption", "mortal", and "immortality" are four different Greek words in the NT manuscripts, and have four different meanings.

In a nutshell, those who have done evil will be given resurrected bodies too. Afterall, that is the meaning of "the resurrection of damnation".

So what's the difference between them and those of us who belong to Christ Jesus? Well, what was the difference our Lord Jesus showed Nicodemus about being saved? and according to Paul with his idea of those in Christ becoming a "new creature"?
 
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Davy

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I know this will be thrown out--but here goes. This is intertwined with this:
....

2Pe_3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
2Pe_3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

The earth is destroyed at His coming.
The saved are gathered into the clouds with God. The earth and living lost are destroyed. Satan is bound to this void, empty world.



Not really correct. We cannot leave off other Scripture which declares where our Lord Jesus and His elect are coming at His return. Acts 1 and Zechariah 14 reveal our Lord Jesus returning to this earth, specifically to the Mount of Olives east of Jerusalem where He ascended from. Zechariah 14 is also specific that He brings all the saints with Him there when He comes.

What your preachers apparently have not shown you is how God's Word reveals the saints that have already died return with Jesus in the clouds, and then those of us still alive on earth are then "caught up" to them (1 Thess.4), and then we all together go to Jerusalem on earth, where our Lord Jesus' feet will touch down upon the Mount of Olives (Zech.14).

In other words, we are NOT... going to live in the clouds with the earth then being destroyed. Those sensationalist preachers you're listening to are filling you with their own doctrines of men (apparently the one Darby began in 1830's Britain).



It is at the end of the 1000 years that the wicked are resurrected to face judgement and they come against God and the city that God is bringing down from heaven. It will be placed in a newly remae earth after the judgement of the wicked.
....

Consider what our Lord Jesus said in John 5:28-29 about those who did evil being also resurrected on that same day as those of the resurrection of life.
 
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mmksparbud

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Not really correct. We cannot leave off other Scripture which declares where our Lord Jesus and His elect are coming at His return. Acts 1 and Zechariah 14 reveal our Lord Jesus returning to this earth, specifically to the Mount of Olives east of Jerusalem where He ascended from. Zechariah 14 is also specific that He brings all the saints with Him there when He comes.

What your preachers apparently have not shown you is how God's Word reveals the saints that have already died return with Jesus in the clouds, and then those of us still alive on earth are then "caught up" to them (1 Thess.4), and then we all together go to Jerusalem on earth, where our Lord Jesus' feet will touch down upon the Mount of Olives (Zech.14).

In other words, we are NOT... going to live in the clouds with the earth then being destroyed. Those sensationalist preachers you're listening to are filling you with their own doctrines of men (apparently the one Darby began in 1830's Britain).





Consider what our Lord Jesus said in John 5:28-29 about those who did evil being also resurrected on that same day as those of the resurrection of life.


Only to say this---I listen to what the bible has to say, and toss out what others say that does not agree with it and the character of God. I believe in putting all verses together so they line up with everything stated. No one has to agree with me. Those verses you quoted also have to agree with this---
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection
 
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Davy

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Only to say this---I listen to what the bible has to say, and toss out what others say that does not agree with it and the character of God. I believe in putting all verses together so they line up with everything stated. No one has to agree with me. Those verses you quoted also have to agree with this---
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection

If you're insinuating that what I've declared does not agree with Scripture, then you would have to actually prove it by Scripture, and not just insinuate a falsehood.

As for Rev.20:5, you haven't really shown me that you are ready to understand that. What Paul taught in 1 Cor.15 about the resurrection, and what our Lord Jesus said in John 5:28-29 about the resurrection, must be understood in conjunction with that first. Show that you understand the 1 Cor.15 and John 5:28-29 resurrection subject linked to that Rev.20:5 subject.
 
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mmksparbud

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If you're insinuating that what I've declared does not agree with Scripture, then you would have to actually prove it by Scripture, and not just insinuate a falsehood.

As for Rev.20:5, you haven't really shown me that you are ready to understand that. What Paul taught in 1 Cor.15 about the resurrection, and what our Lord Jesus said in John 5:28-29 about the resurrection, must be understood in conjunction with that first. Show that you understand the 1 Cor.15 and John 5:28-29 resurrection subject linked to that Rev.20:5 subject.


Excuse me? I must prove to YOU that I understand something? I said what you quoted has to also agree with Rev 2:5--- It is up to you to show that what you said agrees with that. If you consider me to ignorant to comprehend what you wish to say, that is OK. If you simply do not wish to do so, that is OK, also.
 
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Davy

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Excuse me? I must prove to YOU that I understand something? I said what you quoted has to also agree with Rev 2:5--- It is up to you to show that what you said agrees with that. If you consider me to ignorant to comprehend what you wish to say, that is OK. If you simply do not wish to do so, that is OK, also.

You offered nothing in your previous post about that Rev.20:5 verse. You just threw it out there, not showing how you think it's relevant.
 
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mmksparbud

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You offered nothing in your previous post about that Rev.20:5 verse. You just threw it out there, not showing how you think it's relevant.

No, I didn't just throw it out there---I quoted it with the verses around it in post #163. Those verses seem to be to be self explanatory, it seems you so not think so. What is it about it you do not understand?
 
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Davy

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No, I didn't just throw it out there---I quoted it with the verses around it in post #163. Those verses seem to be to be self explanatory, it seems you so not think so. What is it about it you do not understand?

If you're going to try and give me the SDA teaching on that verse, I'm not interested. Nor am I interested in playing games with you.
 
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mmksparbud

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If you're going to try and give me the SDA teaching on that verse, I'm not interested. Nor am I interested in playing games with you.

I am not trying to give you anything. I put out several verses and what my thoughts were and said I did not put it out to debate. And you came out with this---

Those sensationalist preachers you're listening to are filling you with their own doctrines of men (apparently the one Darby began in 1830's Britain).

No need for that and quite untrue. I merely asked that you reconcile Rev 20:5 with
Consider what our Lord Jesus said in John 5:28-29 about those who did evil being also resurrected on that same day as those of the resurrection of life.

Than you go on to say I am not showing you that I understand and you are not showing how you reconcile the 2 trains of thought. On the whole, I think this conversation should be done as you seem to be in search of an argument and I am not. I will assume you do not wish to reconcile the 2 and will just move on--thank you.
 
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Davy

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....

No need for that and quite untrue. I merely asked that you reconcile Rev 20:5 with


Than you go on to say I am not showing you that I understand and you are not showing how you reconcile the 2 trains of thought. On the whole, I think this conversation should be done as you seem to be in search of an argument and I am not. I will assume you do not wish to reconcile the 2 and will just move on--thank you.

So what does your just throwing out Rev.20:5 have to do with my question of what Jesus said in John 5:28-29? and about your idea of living in the clouds when Jesus comes?
 
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Davy

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No, I didn't just throw it out there---I quoted it with the verses around it in post #163. Those verses seem to be to be self explanatory, it seems you so not think so. What is it about it you do not understand?

Rev 20:5
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
KJV

So I take your lack of explanation on that above verse to mean you may think those "dead" represent that "first resurrection". That's what happens when you just throw out that one verse by itself like that, without including the other verses that go with it.
 
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mmksparbud

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So what does your just throwing out Rev.20:5 have to do with my question of what Jesus said in John 5:28-29? and about your idea of living in the clouds when Jesus comes?

This is the last thing I will say---I never said a word about living in the clouds. I said what the bible said that we will be with the Lord --who happens right now to live in heaven (I doubt very much there are clouds there) and that is where the New Jerusalem is and the bible also says the city will be brought down to earth--I quoted all those verses.
Again. You are not reconciling Rev 20 with your point that Math. states that both lost and saved will be resurrected at the same time.
It does not say that. That both will be resurrected is obvious. However, it says there is a resurrection to life and a resurrection to damnation--and never states they occur at the same time. Rev. states the rest of the dead do not live again until AFTER the 1000 years. And that this is the first resurrection. That was the point you were making and so I asked that you state how you reconcile those 2 trains of thought which you still haven't. So, unless you wish to do so--I will say goodbye.
 
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mmksparbud

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Rev 20:5
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
KJV

So I take your lack of explanation on that above verse to mean you may think those "dead" represent that "first resurrection". That's what happens when you just throw out that one verse by itself like that, without including the other verses that go with it.

Again I did not throw out that verse---It was quoted with the surrounding verses.
 
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Davy

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These verses by our Lord Jesus are an obvious problem for those on the doctrine of men that think the wicked are in graves throughout Christ's future "thousand years" reign
This is the last thing I will say---I never said a word about living in the clouds. I said what the bible said that we will be with the Lord --who happens right now to live in heaven (I doubt very much there are clouds there) and that is where the New Jerusalem is and the bible also says the city will be brought down to earth--I quoted all those verses.
Again. You are not reconciling Rev 20 with your point that Math. states that both lost and saved will be resurrected at the same time.
It does not say that. That both will be resurrected is obvious. However, it says there is a resurrection to life and a resurrection to damnation--and never states they occur at the same time. Rev. states the rest of the dead do not live again until AFTER the 1000 years. And that this is the first resurrection. That was the point you were making and so I asked that you state how you reconcile those 2 trains of thought which you still haven't. So, unless you wish to do so--I will say goodbye.

Indirectly you did infer the living in clouds idea when you linked the time of the gathering of the saints to Christ in the clouds and the earth being destroyed:

You said:
"The earth is destroyed at His coming.
The saved are gathered into the clouds with God. The earth and living lost are destroyed. Satan is bound to this void, empty world."


That is why I pointed you to Acts 1 that declares where Jesus will return to, and also Zechariah 14 which further declares where He will literally return to, with all His saints.

Then with your remarks about events after the 1,000 years of Rev.20, I pointed you to Scripture about the resurrection topic which must agree.
 
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mmksparbud

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These verses by our Lord Jesus are an obvious problem for those on the doctrine of men that think the wicked are in graves throughout Christ's future "thousand years" reign


Indirectly you did infer the living in clouds idea when you linked the time of the gathering of the saints to Christ in the clouds and the earth being destroyed:

You said:


That is why I pointed you to Acts 1 that declares where Jesus will return to, and also Zechariah 14 which further declares where He will literally return to, with all His saints.

Then with your remarks about events after the 1,000 years of Rev.20, I pointed you to Scripture about the resurrection topic which must agree.


Consider what our Lord Jesus said in John 5:28-29 about those who did evil being also resurrected on that same day as those of the resurrection of life.

Not dealing with what you originally said, are you?---Ok. Good night.
 
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