What is the purpose of the Sabbath?

[Leaf473]

since this is off topic, let me ask those who Say the Sabbath is not binding on Christians, what did Scripture or Jesus mean when he said
1. "I am Lord even of the Sabbath"?
2. "Until Heaven & Earth Pass away not one Jot ot Tittle will pass from the law?"
3. "The Law will be written on your Heart?"
4. What do you do with the fact the Sabbath is the Sign of the 1000 years of rulership on the Earth"

Hi AH, good to see you again

It may be more on topic than it seems.

Does Jesus say I am the Lord... Or the son of man is Lord...?

I think it occurs in more than one gospel, so I'm not sure.

But assuming it's son of man is... I think it starts with Jesus being the truly human one, the one who lives as humans are supposed to, and were intended to, live.

As a true human, He is master of the Sabbath, because it was created for him / us, not the other way around.

So the Sabbath exists to benefit humans, especially those humans who have been renewed to live as Jesus lived.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

Hi AH, good to see you again

It may be more on topic than it seems.

Does Jesus say I am the Lord... Or the son of man is Lord...?

I think it occurs in more than one gospel, so I'm not sure.

But assuming it's son of man is... I think it starts with Jesus being the truly human one, the one who lives as humans are supposed to, and were intended to, live.

As a true human, He is master of the Sabbath, because it was created for him / us, not the other way around.

So the Sabbath exists to benefit humans, especially those humans who have been renewed to live as Jesus lived.

son of man is not about being fully human. it is a title. another way of saying it is "the Son of ADAM" he is claiming to be the promised one made to Adam and EVE. The New ADAM


If Sabbath exists to benefit humans then how is it done away with. You are saying you want to rob people of their benefis.

 

[Bob S]

Jesus calls himself LORD of the SABBATH. The New Covenant is the Law written on the Heart. so where do you see that being done away with.

Hi AH, Where in all of scripture does it tell us the Sabbath law is written om our hearts??? I was a Sabbath observer for 40 years and I knew absolutely nothing about the Sabbath given only to Israel until at age 23 I started studying with SDAs. My wife didn't either. Millions upon millions of born-again Christians whose hearts are full of love for Jesus and their fellow man and would do anything for our Savior if it were on their hearts have never heard of Sabbath keeping. Sabbath keeping is not taught in the New Testament. Jesus, under Old Covenant Law didn't teach Gentiles Sabbath keeping. Old Covenant Law was for only the Jews and converts.

Had I dug deeper into what SDAs really believe I would have never joined them. I thought I had to keep the Sabbath because of the 10 Commandments. If only I would have studied scripture I would never left the church I am now back in.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

Hi AH, Where in all of scripture does it tell us the Sabbath law is written om our hearts??? I was a Sabbath observer for 40 years and I knew absolutely nothing about the Sabbath given only to Israel until at age 23 I started studying with SDAs. My wife didn't either. Millions upon millions of born-again Christians whose hearts are full of love for Jesus and their fellow man and would do anything for our Savior if it were on their hearts have never heard of Sabbath keeping. Sabbath keeping is not taught in the New Testament. Jesus, under Old Covenant Law didn't teach Gentiles Sabbath keeping. Old Covenant Law was for only the Jews and converts.

Had I dug deeper into what SDAs really believe I would have never joined them. I thought I had to keep the Sabbath because of the 10 Commandments. If only I would have studied scripture I would never left the church I am now back in.

that is really just great

2 Corinthians 3:3; Ezekiel 11:19,​

Jeremiah 31:33​

Pretty clear that the sabbath is part of that show me where you get the ideas that it is not? As far as Sabbath not being taught in the NT what bible are you reading. Try the book of acts. Gal, Hebrews & Col. all the text that you claim do away with the Sabbath actually prove it. the whole circumcision arguments proves they were still keeping Sabbath because who wants you to circumcise Jews. Where do Jews meet the Synagogue. When do they meet in the Synagogue, The Sabbath Day. Sorry that went on for over 300 years. you have no leg to stand on. you have to wrench everything out Theological and Historical and Cultural context to draw the conclusions you do. You have to ignore the plain statements of the Lord that the Law will remain until after the 1000 years. You claim you will do anything for the Lord but won't obey him on the 1 day that is literally about his character and his plan for the planet. The 1 day a week he says he will come and meet with us and give us his presence you won't show up for, You say that has changed but scriptures say I am God and i change NOT. you says the substance of the Law has changed rather then the location. What foolishness.

 

[Bob S]

that is really just great

2 Corinthians 3:3; Ezekiel 11:19,​

Jeremiah 31:33​

Pretty clear that the sabbath is part of that show me where you get the ideas that it is not? As far as Sabbath not being taught in the NT what bible are you reading. Try the book of acts. Gal, Hebrews & Col. all the text that you claim do away with the Sabbath actually prove it. the whole circumcision arguments proves they were still keeping Sabbath because who wants you to circumcise Jews. Where do Jews meet the Synagogue. When do they meet in the Synagogue, The Sabbath Day. Sorry that went on for over 300 years. you have no leg to stand on. you have to wrench everything out Theological and Historical and Cultural context to draw the conclusions you do. You have to ignore the plain statements of the Lord that the Law will remain until after the 1000 years. You claim you will do anything for the Lord but won't obey him on the 1 day that is literally about his character and his plan for the planet. The 1 day a week he says he will come and meet with us and give us his presence you won't show up for, You say that has changed but scriptures say I am God and i change NOT. you says the substance of the Law has changed rather then the location. What foolishness.

-Okay let's look at Acts, Gal and Col. In all of the book of Acts there is not one mention of Sabbath indoctrination. The Apostles were attending the Synagogues to preach Jesus Christ to the Jews.

In the 9 accounts that mention Sabbath none of them was about indoctrination
No accounts of Sabbath keeping in Galatians. In fact, Paul wrote in gal3 that the law was until Christ Gal3:19. He had to be referring to the 613 laws of the old covenant of which the 10 were part. In Hebrews the writer was writing to the Jews and telling them that Jesus had a rest for them. A rest they had never entered. That could not have the weekly Sabbath since they had been observing the weekly Sabbath since before Sinai. The Rest that remains is the rest in Christ. If you study Col2:16 that mentions the Sabbath the next verse tells the Jews that the Sabbath was a shadow and the reality is Christ.

Eph 2: 10 tells us that Jesus ended the law. 2Cor3:6-11 tells us the ministry of death; the 10 commandments WERE glorious and now they have been replaced by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit as our guide and what was glorious now has no glory.

Honestly, I cannot find anything in the New Testament that would lead me to Sabbath keeping. Sabbath was made for the Israelites so that they would have time to reflect on God's leading them out of Egypt and rest from their labor. It did not involve any other nation of the World.

Another thing, try to find any indication that anyone before the Israelites that would have kept the Sabbath in either the Bible or World History.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

-Okay let's look at Acts, Gal and Col. In all of the book of Acts there is not one mention of Sabbath indoctrination. The Apostles were attending the Synagogues to preach Jesus Christ to the Jews.

because they were Jews. What foolishness. this line of thought is lunacy. They believe that Jews were the keepers of the oracles of God and that they proper represantive of God on earth. this is foolish. you somehow think Jesus showed up and invalidated all of what had come before. what nonsense

In the 9 accounts that mention Sabbath none of them was about indoctrination

he says in Acts 15 "that from Sabbath to Sabbath Moses is read" in other words the minimum standard to attend the synagogue set in the letter written at the acts 15 counsel in Jerusalem and they would get the rest of it later when they went to the synagogue on the sabbath and would hear Moses read. far from removing the Sabbath he encouraged to observe it.

No accounts of Sabbath keeping in Galatians. In fact, Paul wrote in gal3 that the law was until Christ Gal3:19. He had to be referring to the 613 laws of the old covenant of which the 10 were part.

Nonsense. The fact that he wrote the book of Galatians and had to address the circumcision issue is proof they were still attended the synagogue. Only Jews circumcised and they met in the synagogue

In Hebrews the writer was writing to the Jews and telling them that Jesus had a rest for them. A rest they had never entered. That could not have the weekly Sabbath since they had been observing the weekly Sabbath since before Sinai. The Rest that remains is the rest in Christ.

Hebrews does not invaladiate Sabbath it says there is more, not less. More rest to come not less.

If you study Col 2:16 that mentions the Sabbath the next verse tells the Jews that the Sabbath was a shadow and the reality is Christ.

Col 2:16 does not invaladate Sabbath observance. It is saying don't let people who are judging you, Jews, tell you how to observe it. They were saying you are doing it right. He did not say don't do it at all. Just like a good evangelical you argue the wrong point to the wrong group of people. WE are not Jews. Paul was not talking to us. No one is saying Sabbath is a substitute for Jesus. We are saying that it is an appointment with him and encounter with him and a representation of him. and it is necessary at the end of days to demonstrate you still believe in him, you are loyal to him and you want to represent him properly represent Him,

Eph 2: 10 tells us that Jesus ended the law.

yes he is the legal system of Moses. You are not to go to the temple for sacrifice any more. he did not mean the end of the Law, meaning you can steal,kill and barefalse wittness, you can have some other God other then me you can now enjoy adultery. that is nonsense, but for some reason you think that applies to the Sabbath. Foolishness

2Cor3:6-11 tells us the ministry of death; the 10 commandments WERE glorious and now they have been replaced by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit as our guide and what was glorious now has no glory.

Not relevant to us, because we are not saying it is a substitute for the Holy Spirit. "I will put my laws in you and you will walk in my ways and do them" you evangelicals all think that when people do something it is to earn salvation.

Honestly, I cannot find anything in the New Testament that would lead me to Sabbath keeping. Sabbath was made for the Israelites so that they would have time to reflect on God's leading them out of Egypt and rest from their labor. It did not involve any other nation of the World.

then you haven't read the history or the bible. Gen 26:5 says that Abraham kept all the Commandment, statutes and Judgemts. that shows a law before Sinai.

Another thing, try to find any indication that anyone before the Israelites that would have kept the Sabbath in either the Bible or World History.

Gen 26:5 very easy. only someone unfamilure with the subject matter make that boast.

 

[Leaf473]

son of man is not about being fully human.

I think there are multiple ways to interpret Son of man.

it is a title. another way of saying it is "the Son of ADAM" he is claiming to be the promised one made to Adam and EVE. The New ADAM

If Sabbath exists to benefit humans then how is it done away with. You are saying you want to rob people of their benefis.

I don't think the principles of the Sabbath are done away with. All of God's laws are eternal.

But the physical, literal, earthly things of the Sabbath commandment ended at the cross, Yes, I believe that.

Bible Gateway passage: Exodus 31:17 - New American Standard Bible

It is a sign between Me and the sons of Israel forever; for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, but on the seventh day He ceased from labor, and was refreshed.”

www.biblegateway.com

Wait, God was refreshed? Because he was tired? Or is there something else going on here?

 

[Adventist Dissident]

I think there are multiple ways to interpret Son of man.

I don't

I don't think the principles of the Sabbath are done away with. All of God's laws are eternal.

But the physical, literal, earthly things of the Sabbath commandment ended at the cross, Yes, I believe that.

one problem. The Lord still makes an appointment and his presence is still there, you are missing out and robbing his people.

 

[Leaf473]

I don't

Have you ever had the experience of reading something in literature and then reading it again years later and seeing something in it that you hadn't seen the first time?

How much more so the scriptures.

one problem. The Lord still makes an appointment and his presence is still there, you are missing out and robbing his people.

After the cross, God's appointment with us is 24/7.

Bible Gateway passage: Colossians 3:17 - New American Standard Bible

Whatever you do in word or deed, do everything in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks through Him to God the Father.

www.biblegateway.com

Jesus is present when people are gathered in his name.

Bible Gateway passage: Matthew 18:20 - New American Standard Bible

For where two or three have gathered together in My name, I am there in their midst.”

www.biblegateway.com

Indeed, the purpose of the Sabbath is to teach us that we start by devoting one day a week to God, and grow into everyday devoted to God 24/7.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

Have you ever had the experience of reading something in literature and then reading it again years later and seeing something in it that you hadn't seen the first time?

Have you ever had an encounter with the Lord. I have. I have had the Lord's presence come to me on the Sabbath. It is amazing. you are missing out.

 

[Leaf473]

Have you ever had an encounter with the Lord.

Yes.

I have. I have had the Lord's presence come to me on the Sabbath. It is amazing. you are missing out.

It is amazing, I'm not missing out

Bible Gateway passage: 1 Corinthians 12:6-7 - New Century Version

And there are different ways that God works through people but the same God. God works in all of us in everything we do. Something from the Spirit can be seen in each person, for the common good.

www.biblegateway.com

 

[HIM]

Come on Him, you should know better than that. Ex 20: 6 is not one of the ten commands.

Come on Bob you should see better than that. There love is in the midst through and by God as He was speaking in respect to idols on Mt Sinia.

 

[HIM]

son of man is not about being fully human. it is a title. another way of saying it is "the Son of ADAM" he is claiming to be the promised one made to Adam and EVE. The New ADAM


If Sabbath exists to benefit humans then how is it done away with. You are saying you want to rob people of their benefis.

If we read the verses as they are one does not see that. One sees Jesus using it as a general term in respect to being the son of man as we are.

 

[HIM]

Indeed, the purpose of the Sabbath is to teach us that we start by devoting one day a week to God, and grow into everyday devoted to God 24/7.

No it isn't. The purpose of the Sabbath is for us to stop working on the day that God sanctified and made holy because of the creation of everything and His giving us freedom from the world and the things of it through His Spirit. In it, in our communities as a whole we have or are to have 24 hours totality devoted to Him and His without the hustle and bustle that we do in order to survive. And as a people of God our lives are devoted to Him and His everyday. The Sabbath is special because God has set it apart to be a day without the hustle and bustle of our normal routines that we do to survive. A day for us all to come together in our communities and be refreshed in fellowship in the spirit one with Him without the distractions that come with what we do to survive..

 

[Bob S]

because they were Jews. What foolishness. this line of thought is lunacy. They believe that Jews were the keepers of the oracles of God and that they proper represantive of God on earth. this is foolish. you somehow think Jesus showed up and invalidated all of what had come before. what nonsense

3 You foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you? Before your very eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed as crucified. 2 I would like to learn just one thing from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by believing what you heard? 3 Are you so foolish? After beginning by means of the Spirit, are you now trying to finish by means of the flesh? 4 Have you experienced[b] so much in vain—if it really was in vain? 5 So again I ask, does God give you his Spirit and work miracles among you by the works of the law, or by your believing what you heard? 6 So also Abraham “believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness.”

7 Understand, then, that those who have faith are children of Abraham. 8 Scripture foresaw that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, and announced the gospel in advance to Abraham: “All nations will be blessed through you.” 9 So those who rely on faith are blessed along with Abraham, the man of faith. Gal3

The Judaizers had convinced the Galatians that they had to keep the old covenant laws. SDAs are doing the same thing with their Sabbath keeping and tithing.
But if we turn aside from the fourth commandment, so positively given by God, to adopt the inventions of Satan, voiced and acted by men under his control, we cannot be saved. We cannot with safety receive his traditions and subtleties as truth. {RH, July 6, 1897 par. 4}

No one who disregards the fourth commandment, after becoming enlightened in regard to the claims of the Sabbath, can be held guiltless in the sight of God. {RH, July 6, 1897 par. 14}

All will be judged according to the light that has shone upon them. If they have light upon the Sabbath, they cannot be saved in rejecting that light.{HS 234.3}

As persons become convinced from the Scriptures that the claims of the fourth commandment are still binding, the question is often raised, Is it necessary in order to secure salvation that we keep the Sabbath? This is a question of grave importance. If the light has shone from the word of God, if the message has been presented to men, as it was to Pharaoh, and they refuse to heed that message, if they reject the light, they refuse to obey God, and cannot be saved in their disobedience. {RH, January 5, 1886 par. 2}

We should regularly reserve something for God's cause, that He may not be robbed of the portion which He claims. When we rob God we rob ourselves also. We give up the heavenly treasure for the sake of having more of this earth. This is a loss that we cannot afford to sustain. (5T 271.3)

he says in Acts 15 "that from Sabbath to Sabbath Moses is read" in other words the minimum standard to attend the synagogue set in the letter written at the acts 15 counsel in Jerusalem and they would get the rest of it later when they went to the synagogue on the sabbath and would hear Moses read. far from removing the Sabbath he encouraged to observe it.

Talk about nonsense, there is absolutely nothing to back up your supposition. Paul continuedly wrote that we are not under the law. How is it you read the New Testament and do not comprehend what it is all about? Jeremiah didn't prophesy a warmed over old covenant1, he prophesied a New one not like the one He gave Israel. By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear. heb8:13

19 This is how we know that we belong to the truth and how we set our hearts at rest in his presence: 20 If our hearts condemn us, we know that God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything. 21 Dear friends, if our hearts do not condemn us, we have confidence before God 22 and receive from him anything we ask, because we keep his commands and do what pleases him. 23 And this is his command: to believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as he commanded us. 24 The one who keeps God’s commands lives in him, and he in them. And this is how we know that he lives in us: We know it by the Spirit he gave us. 1jn3

If not keeping the old covenant Sabbath given only to the Israelite nation causes us to be eternally lost why isn't this ever mentioned. Jesus said in Jn15:9 “As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you. Now remain in my love. 10 If you keep my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have kept my Father’s commands and remain in his love. 11 I have told you this so that my joy may be in you and that your joy may be complete. 12 My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you. 13 Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends. 14 You are my friends if you do what I command. Notice Jesus told us He kept the Torah, His Father's commands, and asks us to keep His commands. Love is the great command. We are to love others as Jesus loves us. Exactly what John wrote in 1Jn3. Also, 1Jn3 repeats the very same thing. Again, if the Sabbath is so important to keep that we will lose our eternal inheritance, why is it not mentioned to all of the Gentile World??? In place of telling me all I write is nonsense show me where I am wrong. According to you SDAs I am going to hell for something that is not spelled out in scripture.​

Nonsense. The fact that he wrote the book of Galatians and had to address the circumcision issue is proof they were still attended the synagogue. Only Jews circumcised and they met in the synagogue.

I admonish you to read Gal 5 and then tell me they went to the synagogue to learn how to keep Torah. Ask yourself why you do not keep all the laws of the old covenant that would pertain to you.

Hebrews does not invaladiate Sabbath it says there is more, not less. More rest to come not less.

Right. it does not invalidate Sabbath and neither does it validate it. It tells us we can find rest today. Jesus said some profound words that I believe indicates what that rest really is.

Matthew 11:28
“Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest.

Col 2:16 does not invaladate Sabbath observance. It is saying don't let people who are judging you, Jews, tell you how to observe it. They were saying you are doing it right. He did not say don't do it at all. Just like a good evangelical you argue the wrong point to the wrong group of people. WE are not Jews. Paul was not talking to us. No one is saying Sabbath is a substitute for Jesus. We are saying that it is an appointment with him and encounter with him and a representation of him. and it is necessary at the end of days to demonstrate you still believe in him, you are loyal to him and you want to represent him properly represent Him,

yes he is the legal system of Moses. You are not to go to the temple for sacrifice any more. he did not mean the end of the Law, meaning you can steal,kill and barefalse wittness, you can have some other God other then me you can now enjoy adultery. that is nonsense, but for some reason you think that applies to the Sabbath. Foolishness

It never fails when debating with SDAs, they will come up with the inanest interpretations to avoid what scripture is really telling us. You are not an exception. If it does not invalidate Sabbath observance it also would not invalidate new moon cerebrations and the feast days all of which you fail to observe.

Not relevant to us, because we are not saying it is a substitute for the Holy Spirit. "I will put my laws in you and you will walk in my ways and do them" you evangelicals all think that when people do something it is to earn salvation.

What do you mean by "not relevant"? Those verses tell the Jews they were no longer under the guidance of the 10 commandments. gentiles never were under them. According to you we are under them, so show us where, from scripture.

then you haven't read the history or the bible. Gen 26:5 says that Abraham kept all the Commandment, statutes and Judgemts. that shows a law before Sinai.

Prove that the commands, statutes and judgements contained the Sabbath command. Abraham was not a slave in Egypt. Duet 5: 15 Remember that you were slaves in Egypt and that the Lord your God brought you out of there with a mighty hand and an outstretched arm. Therefore the Lord your God has commanded you to observe the Sabbath day.

Gen 26:5 very easy. only someone unfamilure with the subject matter make that boast.

Okay, if it is so easy why didn't you provide a valid example? Seems like all blow and no go.

 

[Gary K]

No it isn't. The purpose of the Sabbath is for us to stop working on the day that God sanctified and made holy because of the creation of everything and His giving us freedom from the world and the things of it through His Spirit. In it, in our communities as a whole we have or are to have 24 hours totality devoted to Him and His without the hustle and bustle that we do in order to survive. And as a people of God our lives are devoted to Him and His everyday. The Sabbath is special because God has set it apart to be a day without the hustle and bustle of our normal routines that we do to survive. A day for us all to come together in our communities and be refreshed in fellowship in the spirit one with Him without the distractions that come with what we do to survive..

I would add, from Isaiah 58, that on Sabbath we keep all distractions out of the way from listening to secular music to watching tv, etc... Anything of this world, which is run by the devil, that will distract us from our communion with God,

 

[Leaf473]

No it isn't. The purpose of the Sabbath is for us to stop working on the day that God sanctified and made holy because of the creation of everything and His giving us freedom from the world and the things of it through His Spirit. In it, in our communities as a whole we have or are to have 24 hours totality devoted to Him and His without the hustle and bustle that we do in order to survive. And as a people of God our lives are devoted to Him and His everyday. The Sabbath is special because God has set it apart to be a day without the hustle and bustle of our normal routines that we do to survive. A day for us all to come together in our communities and be refreshed in fellowship in the spirit one with Him without the distractions that come with what we do to survive..

We can have fellowship with the Holy Spirit in the hustle and bustle.

Bible Gateway passage: 2 Corinthians 13:14 - New Century Version

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all.

www.biblegateway.com

 

[Gary K]

We can have fellowship with the Holy Spirit in the hustle and bustle.

Bible Gateway passage: 2 Corinthians 13:14 - New Century Version

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all.

www.biblegateway.com

I think you misunderstand HIM. Sabbath is a day set aside for communion with Jesus without any kind of distractions. It is a restful and joyful day like no other. We get to know His promise of peace on Sabbath unlike any other day of the week.

Joh 14:27 Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

 

[Leaf473]

Come on Bob you should see better than that. There love is in the midst through and by God as He was speaking in respect to idols on Mt Sinia.

When you and I were talking about this, HIM, I understood the big issue to be: Can you keep the Ten Commandments without loving?

When people talk about this loosely, it sometimes comes out as: Is Love in The Ten Commandments?

Well, it's not one of the actual Commandments, but the word Love does occur in the same passage as the 10.

 

[Leaf473]

I think you misunderstand HIM. Sabbath is a day set aside for communion with Jesus without any kind of distractions. It is a restful and joyful day like no other. We get to know His promise of peace on Sabbath unlike any other day of the week.

(When you quoted my post, the quote tags got removed somehow, but no biggie )

If a person believes that Jesus doesn't like everyday activities and so won't come around if you're doing them, then what you say makes sense

The peace of Jesus left with us, we probably agree that it's not available just on one day of the week.

Bible Gateway passage: Philippians 4:7 - New American Standard Bible

And the peace of God, which surpasses all comprehension, will guard your hearts and minds in Christ Jesus.

www.biblegateway.com

And the key to that is found in the words just before

Bible Gateway passage: Philippians 4:4-6 - New American Standard Bible

Rejoice in the Lord always; again I will say, rejoice! Let your gentle spirit be known to all people. The Lord is near. Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything by prayer and pleading with thanksgiving let your requests be made known to God.

www.biblegateway.com

Do everyday activities make you unable to rejoice?