And what if "society" decided, as it did in Nazi Germany, to devalue completely whole segments of society? If an individual's value is solely the product of the value that society places upon them, what happens when society's view of their value changes? Terrible, evil places like Auschwitz-Birkenau, Kulmhof-Chelmno, and Maidenek come into being.
If you persist in comparing atheists to Nazis, Im going to invoke Godwins Law.
Such invocation would be inappropriate. Where in the above statement of mine do I say anything about atheists being like Nazis? What I did say is that deriving an individual's value from society leads to terrible evils. That is all. I can find equally awful examples from non-Nazi quarters if you like. Doing so would not affect my point. I should say, though, that your threat here reminds of the saying, "The guilty flee when no man pursues."
As an atheist, why do you value human life? Is it merely for reasons of survival? Or is there some higher, nobler reason for doing so?
Empathy. I value human life because they are fellow humans and I have empathy.
Yes, but empathy is a highly subjective thing. This means that it is easier to have greater empathy for some fellow humans than for others. "Birds of a feather flock together," and it is those "birds" whose likeness of "feathers" we share with whom we tend to have the greatest empathy. The more antagonistic or distant another person is to one's own being and experience the less one is disposed toward empathy with them. Of course, there is always an exception to the rule, so I can only speak generally in this instance. Nonetheless, in light of what I've just noted, mere empathy hardly seems a good basis by which to determine the value of others.
Why do you feel the need to think that you have no intrinsic value at all?
Because I think your God is imaginary. I dont think humans are special in the way you do. Value is something that people impose on things. Humans value other humans because they have empathy. There is no external arbiter of value.
And that is a
very scary basis upon which to establish a society. Thankfully, not all people agree with you. I, for one, am absolutely sure there is an "external arbiter of human value." Whether you recognize it or not, you daily benefit from the lack of agreement with your beliefs.
"What does your atheistic viewpoint offer to someone who is born into destitution, disease and death?"
My atheistic viewpoint offers nothing to someone born into destitution, disease and death because it makes no hollow promises, but that isnt to say that atheists arent capable of rendering aid to others.
This statement isn't entirely accurate. Your atheistic viewpoint offers nothing to someone born into destitution, disease and death, not because it doesn't make hollow promises, but because it has
nothing to offer! I would contend that if you offer aid to those who are in such desperate straits that it is inconsistent with the naturalistic underpinnings of your atheism.
"How do they find reasons for living in atheism?"
I would think that people born into destitution, disease and death would find it quite easy to think there is no God.
Well, you will be surprised to know that the reverse is true. The Christian faith often finds particularly fertile ground among those who don't labor under the illusions of control, and safety, and personal power that deceive and make complacent and arrogant so many in more affluent cultures. Very often desperation and hardship presses people to God rather than away. The life of Annie J. Flint is a good example of this. Though she wasn't destitute, she did live in constant pain most of her adult life, bedridden and incontinent, yet she was able to pen the following:
He giveth more grace as our burdens grow greater,
He sendeth more strength as our labors increase;
To added afflictions He addeth His mercy,
To multiplied trials he multiplies peace.
When we have exhausted our store of endurance,
When our strength has failed ere the day is half done,
When we reach the end of our hoarded resources
Our Fathers full giving is only begun.
His love has no limits, His grace has no measure,
His power no boundary known unto men;
For out of His infinite riches in Jesus
He giveth, and giveth, and giveth again.
"What comfort can you give to those whose lives are, from birth to death, nothing but sickness, and pain, and poverty?"
I can contribute to aid organisations that provide real comfort to those people here and now rather than empty promises of a better life after they are dead.
"Rather than"? Are you suggesting that Christians
only offer "empty promises of life after death"? I sure hope not because some of the largest humanitarian aid organizations in the world have Christian origins. In addition, many thousands of smaller charitable aid organizations have been started by local churches all over Canada and America. I wonder how atheists as a group compare in their charitable endeavours? Just as a guess, I would say not very well.
How would you know if God's promises are empty? Have you put them to the test?
No, I havent died to check whether there is an afterlife. Have you tested that promise? Has anyone ever provided any sound, tested evidence that such a promise is true?
Its the one promise of God I can't avoid testing even if I wanted to. I've tested many of His other promises, however, and found Him to be as good as His Word. Gives me a lot of confidence about this unavoidable one.
Peace.
Peace.
A better life awaits you my friend do not be afraid.
