What have you understood about the charcater of The Ten Commandments??

[Rick Otto]

QUOTE=Elder 111;Did not Jesus come and show us that it can be kept?

Yes, by Him alone.

Is that not what the indwelling of the Holy Spirit does?

No.

Is the law the problem/curse: or the tendencies of man to sin?

It is the instrument by which we may know of condemnation. So, no it is notself the problem, it rather points out the problem.

Is it not that committing adultery is the curse/the cause of death, and not the law that says thou shall not commit adultery?

Until the law came, men were unaware of sin.

 

[Rick Otto]

How is all this a curse?

It condemns behavior human beings are naturally inclined to.

 

[MamaZ]

The curse comes when one believes that they have to live by the 10 commandments to be accepted by God.. Sad as it is.. For these 10 commandments will never get you close to the Living God. Only one can do that. His name is Jesus Christ the Risen king and through His shed blood on the cross all was fulfilled when it came to the law. Even the 10 commandments.. This is why His Spirit in us is not one of the 10 commandments but of a greater commandment.. Love and one can only love as commanded by the love of God shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Spirit.

 

[Elder 111]

The real issue to those promoting the 10 IS the Sabbath. When Christians (wrongly) admit that they are bound to the 10 by those who demand it they march in and demand they observe (improperly) the Sabbath. Christians by Jesus 2 commands already cover 9 of the 10 commandments but to Sabbath Keepers this isn't enough. I have yet to see ANY Sabbath keeper come across a valid argument involving the Holy Spirit inspiring new believers who are ignorant of the Sabbath to suddenly desire to keep it. It is only those who have some sort of a clue about it prior to salvation that seem even mildly interested in it. We don't see them flocking to keeping the Sabbath because the Holy Spirit does NOT convict them that it is a SIN NOT TO keep it. I have however seen Christians convicted of idolatry, murder, adultery, essentially 9 of the 10 commandments but never the Sabbath. In other words the Holy Spirit seems to be IGNORING the Sabbath command in Christians which means...... it apparently isn't abiding by the 10 commandments for us to keep.

The Sabbath is the test. The tree in the mist of the Garden. That person have to decide on.

 

[Elder 111]

Death is harsh.... very harsh and Paul equated the Law to death

The law is not death. Breaking the law is.

 

[Elder 111]

Yes, by Him alone.


No.

It is the instrument by which we may know of condemnation. So, no it is notself the problem, it rather points out the problem.


Until the law came, men were unaware of sin.

Was the law there in the time of Joseph?

 

[Elder 111]

It condemns behavior human beings are naturally inclined to.

If I am evil, I am a curse unto myself not the law that tell me I am wrong!

 

[Elder 111]

The curse comes when one believes that they have to live by the 10 commandments to be accepted by God.. Sad as it is.. For these 10 commandments will never get you close to the Living God. Only one can do that. His name is Jesus Christ the Risen king and through His shed blood on the cross all was fulfilled when it came to the law. Even the 10 commandments.. This is why His Spirit in us is not one of the 10 commandments but of a greater commandment.. Love and one can only love as commanded by the love of God shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Spirit.

No one that I know have promoted the keeping of the Ten Commandments as the means of acceptance and salvation before God. The Point is that once we have accepted Jesus we keep the Ten commandment. How can you be a Christian and worship and idol? That is part of the Ten commandments! Should that be disregarded?

 

[Rick Otto]

If I am evil, I am a curse unto myself not the law that tell me I am wrong!

I take your point, but mine is that sin wasn't against the law before the law was there to be against sin.
To avoid confusion over meaning, I am specifically referring to the written law as given by Moses.

 

[Rick Otto]

Was the law there in the time of Joseph?

Not sure how to answer this. What's your point in asking, sir?

 

[MamaZ]

I have entered into the very Sabbath of God by resting from all my works and Honoring the one to whom He sent. For He alone is my King. I do not look at days as any different from each other any more. For my God is eternal and with Him I have eternal life. So my Sabbath is in Christ and not in a day.. WOOT WOOT Oh how I love Him . The one who set me free.. If only now those darkened eyes would open so they could see.. That in the day there is no rest but in Him is where we nest..

 

[Rick Otto]

I have entered into the very Sabbath of God by resting from all my works and Honoring the one to whom He sent. For He alone is my King. I do not look at days as any different from each other any more. For my God is eternal and with Him I have eternal life. So my Sabbath is in Christ and not in a day.. WOOT WOOT Oh how I love Him . The one who set me free.. If only now those darkened eyes would open so they could see.. That in the day there is no rest but in Him is where we nest..

LOL! 7:45 am & you are already "Woot, wooting" for God.

 

[VictorC]

The Sabbath is the test. The tree in the mist of the Garden. That person have to decide on.

There isn't a hint of the sabbath being a test of any sort to God's redeemed possession anywhere in the Bible. You didn't get this from any Biblically literate source. This is further evidence that you're a seventh-day Adventist, who alone made this up.

Every man has been placed on trial, as were Adam and Eve in Eden. As the tree of knowledge was placed in the midst of the garden of Eden, so the Sabbath command is placed in the midst of the decalogue. In regard to the fruit of the tree of knowledge, the restriction was made, “Ye shall not eat of it, ... lest ye die.” Of the Sabbath, God said, Ye shall not defile it, but keep it holy. “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.” As the tree of knowledge was the test of Adam’s obedience, so the fourth command is the test that God has given to prove the loyalty of all his people. The experience of Adam is to be a warning to us so long as time shall last. It warns us not to receive any assurance from the mouth of men or of angels that will detract one jot or tittle from the sacred law of Jehovah.​

Linking the tree in the garden with the sabbath reveals your true source.
And yet in this same document written by Ellen White opens with this unBiblical claim:

The Sabbath was given to all mankind to commemorate the work of creation.​

We've already seen this isn't true. The sabbath wasn't given to the Gentiles, no one in Barbados has this commandment foreign to them, and it appears nowhere as a commandment given to God's adopted children.

Elder111's reliance is on a false prophet.
Not the Bible.

 

[Rick Otto]

I think I may be seeing this in the framework of the "security vs liberty" argument.

 

[squint]

The Sabbath is the test. The tree in the mist of the Garden. That person have to decide on.

You've bought into (one of MANY) theological constructs designed to invoke personal fear and the exercise of ritual to, in essence, save yourself via that exercise.

Unfortunately christianity is filled with every form of manipulation possible to scare and divide the masses and heap up disciples of certain teachers and names.

The construct that SDA has on 'sabbath matters' is speculation based on shadows and what 'they think' is happening in heaven, as if they know.

It's a speculated fantasy by people who think they know something, and then use that something to make people fear and serve their 'personally contrived system.' Obviously as well other sights are factually available by other limited forms of speculation designed to the detriment of others and the promotion of even more 'sects.' And on and on it goes in christiandom in general.

If a believer wants to go to church on Saturday as a matter of conscience, hey, good on you. But doing so to 'save yourself' is another matter altogether because in that every participant now implies that other believers who do not are potentially damned, in the SDA's case by eternal death.

Their gathering is one of factual condemnation to other believers.

Many in christiandom are rightfully rejecting that vile practice in any form, not desiring to be found sitting in Gods Seat as a phony judge, even as a remote possibility. And also do so from a position of conscience and placing a greater priority on mercy and living in actual love rather than condemnation.

Christianity itself has largely dessicated itself along these types of various constructs. They are all suspect for accuracy.

No one sees well enough to make those kinds suppositions.

But they all certainly think they do.

One may as well drape a viper around their neck in the name of Jesus. Oh, wait, they do that too.

snore.

s

 

[Sophrosyne]

The Sabbath is the test. The tree in the mist of the Garden. That person have to decide on.

NO. Adam and the tree is nothing like the Sabbath as Adam failing put mankind on a path of sin when he himself was essentially righteous to begin with. Man is already sinning prior to keeping the Sabbath and breaking it doesn't put the whole human race from the position of righteous to sinful. The Sabbath isn't that special to anyone but Israel, and with Jesus death he is the Lord of the Sabbath so he now retains that attention and NOT the Sabbath itself.

 

[Sophrosyne]

The law is not death. Breaking the law is.

Same difference, laws that require death for breaking them are essentially death in themselves if nobody can keep them.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by Elder 111

The Sabbath is the test. The tree in the mist of the Garden. That person have to decide on.
​

What is it testing?

http://www.christianforums.com/t7620348-101/#post59427767
What Commandment did God say to; "Remember", that the world wants to forget?

It is a strange thing that 99% of Christendom profess to love Jesus, and yet, they transgress the 4th Commandment every time they forget to keep the Sabbath day holy week after week, year after year. Those same 99%, when questioned regarding the other nine commandments will most likely say that they keep them, and that all people should obey them as well, because its wrong to steal, commit adultery, use the Lord's name in vain, murder, lie, dishonor your father or mother, covet, or worship graven images of God, or worship any other gods, other than God.

Since God himself wrote all of these Commandments with His own finger, how is it that men and women who profess to be Christians, ignore one of the 10?

 

[GratiaCorpusChristi]

Did not Jesus come and show us that it can be kept? Is that not what the indwelling of the Holy Spirit does?
Is the law the problem/curse: or the tendencies of man to sin? Is it not that committing adultery is the curse/the cause of death, and not the law that says thou shall not commit adultery?

Jesus wasn't merely human. We are. And he wasn't born sinful. We are.

And the law is a problem because of the tendency of humankind to sin. It's not a problem in and of itself, because it is a reflection of God's holy framework for human action. But because we are sinners, that makes it a problem, and a problem that cannot be solved simply by trying harder.

 

[from scratch]

Jesus wasn't merely human. We are. And he wasn't born sinful. We are.

And the law is a problem because of the tendency of humankind to sin. It's not a problem in and of itself, because it is a reflection of God's holy framework for human action. But because we are sinners, that makes it a problem, and a problem that cannot be solved simply by trying harder.

I'll go for that.