• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

Tithing, A requirement?

BeforeThereWas

Seasoned Warrior
Mar 14, 2005
2,450
59
Midwest City, OK
✟18,060.00
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
I have a hard time understanding why people take issue with giving a token amount to their church community. The electric and heating bills aren't going to pay for themselves.

-CryptoLutheran

I don't think anyone in this thread expressed that nothing should be handed over to support a communal building and its professional staffing. What most people fail to understand is that buildings and staffing are luxuries, not necessities.

Many people hand over the primary, largest portion of their giving to such things rahther than doing with it what's exemplified throughout scripture.

Religious institutions routinely rob God when they teach that the people's primary giving should be handed over to them, because most turn right around and absorb the largest portion into the facility and its staffing.

If they're such great teachers of the Bible, then why can't they see their obvious hypocrisy?

BTW
 
Upvote 0

BeforeThereWas

Seasoned Warrior
Mar 14, 2005
2,450
59
Midwest City, OK
✟18,060.00
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Then why did Jesus tell His disciples that if they wanted to be great in the kingdom of God, they ought to keep, and teach others to keep, the least of the law and the prophets? A commandment he later told them to teach to all new converts? (Matt 5:19-20; Matt 28:20?)

First of all, Jesus was addressing people who were, at that time, still fully under the Law, and therefore required to tithe.

Secondly, there's a difference between the moral commandments and the ceremonial Law that defined the tithe, and which Jesus later fulfilled; thus the temple veil having been ripped open from top to bottom.

Thirdly, God's Law at NO time ever required wage earners to hand over a tenth of their wages to the Levites.

If you can find any example within scripture of the people handing over a portion of their wages to the Levites, then I'd certainly like to see it.

But the main concern I have with what you say, is that you seem to be basing it on scripture, and not on prophetic hearing.

Tell you what...if you ever hear a prophetic utterance that contradicts scripture, then I suggest you rebuke the speaker for uttering heretical trash.

I hear Him telling me that attention to tithing is profitable, especially in praying for government leaders in dealing with the unsaved poor.

If the Lord instructed you personally to tithe, then do so, but don't assume His instructions to you personally are to be spoken into the lives of others in a "Thus saith the Lord," command teaching.

They are poor because they are stealing from God, and ought to be told so. They might then get convicted, test God, learn to fear Him, and then choose salvation. But meditation on tithing for deluded is profitable to help them learn their true condition, to learn that they are deluded about their salvation.

And where does scripture demand that tithing is a proof to the unsaved about their spiritual state? You didn't even discern from scripture that tithing was never practiced anywhere in the Bible as something handed over from wage earners, which describes the vast majority of us today, and yet you're going to tell us that you hear from the Lord?

Were I to gauge the integrity of your claim to having allegedly heard from God in relation to everyone else around you, I'd have to say that your having flunked one of the most basic of observations about tithing from scripture forces me to assume you're hearing the voice of your own thoughts and emotions, obviously sparked by false teaching sermons and Bible studies that have no basis in scripture for demanding that wage earners today should tithe into the coffers of organized religion on the basis of OT Law.

I know that I am saved because I heard Jesus Himself tell me so this morning.

Are you sure that was His voice. Scripture doesn't confirm that His way of assuring salvation is to hear His voice declare that to us individually.

My aim in the above statement is to clarify that not everyone hears a verbal or spiritual declaration from the Lord to know they are saved.

But, through mentoring and studying the rules and commandments for knowing what was true, by "receiving the love of the truth," He taught me what I needed to know to be assured it was Him talking to me.

Irregardless, if some voice is telling you that everyone today needs to be tithing to church organizations, then you clearly are not hearing the voice of God, because such a declaration is extra-biblical, not biblical.

No believer needs to tithe to be saved, but they must hear and know His voice.

Amen

Additionally, no believer should be handing his primary, largest portion giving to church organizations, but rather to meet genuine needs of fellow believers and those in his local community.

THAT is the example scripture shows us throughout the NT.

BTW
 
Upvote 0
Z

Zeleste

Guest
The New Testament requires a tenth of all of a person's income just like it is mentioned in the Old Testament. The new church I have been going to on Sunday, requires me to give a tenth of my income. But I am in disagreement with this. If this church does require me to give a tithe, then there is no choice than me to leave that church. Please comment. Thanks and God bless you.

The NT do not require for you to tithe. Actually, the NT prohibit you from tithing or practicing any other Law.

The only tithe mentioned in the Bible is the OT tithe. It works like this:
1 Only the 11 trybes of Israel has to tithe.
2 Only those owning land tithe.
3 Tithe is only on produce, never in money
4 Tithe is only for the aaronic priests
 
Upvote 0

Hismessenger

Senior Member
Nov 29, 2006
2,886
72
77
Augusta Ga
✟25,933.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
"Tithing"
Judaism still lives for lack of understanding the true nature of obedience to God's word. True obedience is to trust God by faith, no matter what the situation. The book of Job is a glaring example of the obedience of Faith. Though he slay me, yet will I trust him.
We have never been under the law as Christ's church. Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law. Anyone trying to keep any of the laws are desecrating Christ.

hismessenger
 
Upvote 0

Hismessenger

Senior Member
Nov 29, 2006
2,886
72
77
Augusta Ga
✟25,933.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
I have a hard time understanding why people take issue with giving a token amount to their church community. The electric and heating bills aren't going to pay for themselves.

This statement expresses the confusion that Satan has planted in the apostate church. Many are willing to give to the structure but truly have a hard time in giving as God wants us too. To give to your fellow man without looking for recompense for what you have given to your fellow brothern. Many give to get in the apostate church, instead of giving because of the love for God and his people. To help thier faith grow in God.

hismessenger
 
Upvote 0

josephearl

Friend
Nov 5, 2009
294
4
Mid-West USA
✟15,460.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
Odd how so many argue about something that does not in anyway resemble what the Bible says it is. Tithing that is. What was one supposed to actually give in obedience to the Law? Who was supposed to give? Where is the giving done? These are the questions that need to be asked and the answers should quickly define what an acceptable tithe is in the eyes of the Lord not in the twisted words that man come up with to set their own agendas. Who has given the teachers the right to spiritualize clear Biblical teaching on tithes? No one, they have assumed that authority for themselves. There is a certain amount of evil in that.
Jesus dealt with this more then once with the Pharisee's and Sadducee's. What he had to say was not the most complimentary things one could say about another if I recollect properly!
 
Upvote 0

BeforeThereWas

Seasoned Warrior
Mar 14, 2005
2,450
59
Midwest City, OK
✟18,060.00
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
The New Testament requires a tenth of all of a person's income just like it is mentioned in the Old Testament. The new church I have been going to on Sunday, requires me to give a tenth of my income. But I am in disagreement with this. If this church does require me to give a tithe, then there is no choice than me to leave that church. Please comment. Thanks and God bless you.

Above is a quote of the OP:

I keep hearing people claim the above, and yet I can't get any of those same people to show me where ANYONE in the OT was required to hand over to the Levites a tenth of their monetary incoome....people such as fishermen (hint, hint), laborers, carpenters (hint, hint), tax collectors (hint, hint), doctors (hint, hint), or anyone else who owned NO producing lands or livestock.

Additionally, the NT makes no demands of ten percent from ANYONE, including those who own producing lands and/or livestock, and yet some people seem to think it can be observed on almost every other page of the NT.

Can someone please show me any of this stuff in the Bible? I'd REALLY like to see it.

BTW
 
Upvote 0

Jack Terrence

Fighting the good fight
Feb 15, 2013
2,917
202
✟39,591.00
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Libertarian
The New Testament requires a tenth of all of a person's income just like it is mentioned in the Old Testament. The new church I have been going to on Sunday, requires me to give a tenth of my income. But I am in disagreement with this. If this church does require me to give a tithe, then there is no choice than me to leave that church. Please comment. Thanks and God bless you.
Wrong! First, the old testament never required a tenth of income. It required every tenth one of the herd that passed under the rod. Every tenth animal that passed under the rod belonged to God. If a man had a herd of 49 sheep, and every tenth one that passed under the rod belonged to God, then a total 4 of the herd would belong to God. That did not add up to 10%. That would have been 8%. If a man had a herd of 19 sheep, then only 1 of 19 would have been God's. That comes to 5%.

Second, the total income generated by the 45 sheep in the first example, or the 18 sheep in the second example belonged to the Israelite. There was no requirement to give any of that income.

Third, God required every tenth animal as a sin offering. Jesus Christ is the new covenant sin offering. Therefore, He is our tithe. The tithe is fulfilled in Him!

Fourth, Paul said to give as we are able, not out of compulsion or obligation. Even then he did not require it.
 
Upvote 0

BeforeThereWas

Seasoned Warrior
Mar 14, 2005
2,450
59
Midwest City, OK
✟18,060.00
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
This statement expresses the confusion that Satan has planted in the apostate church. Many are willing to give to the structure but truly have a hard time in giving as God wants us too. To give to your fellow man without looking for recompense for what you have given to your fellow brothern. Many give to get in the apostate church, instead of giving because of the love for God and his people. To help thier faith grow in God.
hismessenger

Oh yes. David Jeremiah once gave a sermon on nationwide radio that giving to get is perfectly acceptable to the Lord, using Malachi as his proof text.

The main thought in my reaction was, "What a moron!"

No wonder so many routinely rob God by handing over to institutionalized church organizations the largest, primary portion of their monthly "giving" (so-called).

Some claim that those who speak against tithing to institutionalized religion are guilty of greed.

I'd like to put forth that the opposite is true. Faithful "tithers" are more greedy because they hand over the largest, primary portion of their so-called "giving" to their "church" because they reap direct benefit from their own so-called "giving," with only the leftovers going to meet the needs of fellow belivrs and the needy in local communities and missions.

It's interesting how the Truth seems to always bring out the opposite as the absolutes in stark contrast to what's actually held as "true" by popularized religion.

BTW
 
Upvote 0

BeforeThereWas

Seasoned Warrior
Mar 14, 2005
2,450
59
Midwest City, OK
✟18,060.00
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Using money to take care of the church is not biblical unless you are providing for the saints, the real church.

Amen.

The true church doesn't need a dime to operate other than for you to open your mouth to the praise of God before men.

Very true indeed. That recognizes there's a difference between the (C)hurch and all those other things people call their (c)hurch.

We are a living sacrifice whom God is seeking to do his will.

Yes. I have yet to see anyone establish that someone has successfully rustled God's cattle on a thousand hills.....^_^

His will is to love your fellow man but do you believe that the church who has a auto teller in it's building will take care of the indigent and down trodden with the money it takes in or only those whom it deems members in their body.

In most cases, it's only with what's left over.

What is done is a sin which most never even consider. partiality!

That's one reason I call it a robbery of God.

BTW
 
Upvote 0

BeforeThereWas

Seasoned Warrior
Mar 14, 2005
2,450
59
Midwest City, OK
✟18,060.00
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
If ever i meet a preacher, or a pastor, who teach how paul worked, not to burden the church, in the middle of being stoned etc, i will freak out!

They hate that teaching.

Excellent observation.

:clap:

BTW
 
Upvote 0

Jack Terrence

Fighting the good fight
Feb 15, 2013
2,917
202
✟39,591.00
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Libertarian
No wonder so many routinely rob God by handing over to institutionalized church organizations the largest, primary portion of their monthly "giving" (so-called).
Robbing God in Malachi had nothing to do with income. The priests were presenting to God polluted sacrifices contrary to the law which required that they be without blemish.

Tithing was part of the old covenant priestly service. Hebrews 7 deals with tithing specifically, and then chapter 8 indicates the MAIN POINT of the tithe.

Now this is the main point of the things we are saying: We have such a High Priest, who is seated at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens, 2 a Minister of the sanctuary and of the true tabernacle which the Lord erected, and not man.

3 For every high priest is appointed to offer both gifts and sacrifices. Therefore it is necessary that this One also have something to offer. 4 For if He were on earth, He would not be a priest, since there are priests who offer the gifts according to the law;

The tithe was the sin ofering. Jesus offered up Himself for sin. Therefore, Jesus is our tithe.

Paul said that Christ is the "embodiment."
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

BeforeThereWas

Seasoned Warrior
Mar 14, 2005
2,450
59
Midwest City, OK
✟18,060.00
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Robbing God in Malachi had nothing to do with income. The priests were presenting to God polluted sacrifices contrary to the law which required that they be without blemish.

I agree.

BTW
 
Upvote 0
I have not read one post...

Question ? did the levi priests pay a tenth? if they did not ?

we are call priests in 1 peter 2:9 But ye [are] a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:

question #2 was not tithing during the law.

gal 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

gel 2:21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness [come] by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

are we to go under communal living as 2 cor 8:14

gal 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law..... so does this mean he will give more or less ... or as the spirit leads?

yet we have 2 thes 3:10 For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat.

thats not fair....
 
Upvote 0

Gospel Guy

Headed Home!
Aug 11, 2013
1,266
54
✟1,829.00
Faith
Word of Faith
You will be better off not going to a church that believes a Christian's life is a life under laws.

What about the "law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus" spoken of in Romans 8... where we learn we are expected to walk in the Spirit (IN CHRIST) instead of walking in the flesh (IN ADAM)... where we choose life, or death.

Turns out, we do have free will... but there's only two choices!

And, tithing was started before the law was ever given... and in the NT, Hebrews speak of Jesus receiving the tithe as our High Priest... so there are some advantages.

Although I would not say that not tithing is an unpardonable sin, since the New Testament never says that it is... but it is important to note that Jesus said where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

I always found it strange when people don't think enough of the Gospel of Jesus Christ to at least give 10% of their income to help fund His ministry...
 
Upvote 0

Crankitup

Fear nothing but God.
Apr 20, 2006
1,076
141
Perth, Australia
✟19,733.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
...

And, tithing was started before the law was ever given...

Your point being what exactly?

I assume that you are making the argument that because it was practiced before the law, it should also be practiced after the law was made redundant.

If that is the case then I have one question for you. Would you be consistent with this line of reasoning and apply it to circumcision which was practiced before the Law of Moses (e.g. Abraham & Jacob).

If your answer is yes, then you disagree with Paul's logic in Galatians.
 
Upvote 0

Jack Terrence

Fighting the good fight
Feb 15, 2013
2,917
202
✟39,591.00
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Libertarian
Good point

In all the NT we dont found a single teaching about christian tithing. Just because tithing is before the Law it is not enough to tithe. Any how, in the OT, we dont found a single case of a person tithing. Abraham did not practice tithe, neither did Jacob.
Correct! Christ is our tithe. Amen!
 
Upvote 0
Dec 28, 2014
44
8
65
Phoenix, Arizona
✟22,709.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
There is no commandment from God, Christ or His Apostles to the church to tithe. No commandment exist, no instructions on how to tithe exist and there are no Christian or Apostles who are examples of being tithers. The only type of giving that the Christian is to follow is one of meeting the needs of others. All giving in the New Testament was done out of love in desiring to meet the needs of the brethren.

Just ask the pastor of your church to provide you with the commandment from the Apostles or Christ. Ask him for Christian examples. Also, Acts 15 condemns those who desire to place the brethren under laws that the Apostles or Christ did not commit them to.

Christians have but one law to follow and that is the Law of Christ and we fulfill it by bearing one another's burdens.
 
Upvote 0

Hismessenger

Senior Member
Nov 29, 2006
2,886
72
77
Augusta Ga
✟25,933.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
The true church doesn't need a dime to operate. How many time did Jesus teach in the synagogue. There was a reason if you care to search it out But the truth is, did he need money to preach the gospel. The building are already destroyed when he told the disciples there would not be one stone left upon another. That should tell you how much contempt he had for the apostate churches.

hismessenger
 
Upvote 0