Tithing, A requirement?

[BeforeThereWas]

So, jesusiam, are you saying that a group errecting monuments to their own pride (all in the name of God, or course), as an expression of their indifference to the needs of the needy, is wrong? How could that be wrong when they call such things their "house of God"?

After all, they had the temple back then, so why not the parallels today? Never mind that they are mostly a HUGE drain on resources.

I still can't seem to get an answer to my question from the pro-required-tithing camp. How is handing over the primary, largest portion of one's giving to religious organizations synonymous with giving to God; considering that the majority of what's handed over to them is absorbed into the facility expenditures and professional staffing paychecks?

How does denying the needs to the needy an honor unto the Lord? The system of tithing under the Law saw to the needs of the needy AND those who served the Lord. Today, many religious people see to the needs of their communal buildings and professional hirelings FIRST AND FOREMOST before the needs of the needy.

Does the problem here register for everyone? Will repeating it another way make it more clear? And yet, the status quo rolls along merrily without abating. The slowdown seems to be the result only of so many people losing their jobs, and therefore increasing the numbers of the needy in local communities, most of who go ignored by those handing their giving over to religious "church" organizations.

In my city, it's only the POOREST organizations that actually do ANYTHING for the needy in our local communities. The more wealthy medium and large sized organizations continue to pump their support overseas and into projects that bring them the most noteriety here on earth.

So, who has a legitimate defense of the status quo?

Anyone?

BTW

 

[Heavens]

I give Jesus my everything.

 

[tsr]

Tithing is a commandment in the Old Testament Law and those that were under the Law had to obey it to be righteous before God. However, since the Christian is righteous through Christ your still in good standing before God if you choose not to tithe.

The New Testament says that each should give as he has purposed in his heart. So if you want to give, then give and if you don't want to give then don't. Just don't let a Church pressure you into giving by saying God will curse you if you don't tithe because that's not true.

Remember, God loves a cheerful giver. You're not giving cheerfully if you're being forced into it.

Alan

I have to agree also with MrAl, you must give with a cheeful heart to the Lord and give from the heart, our Lord will bless you for it.

 

[Hismessenger]

Here are a few more scriptures which those who preach tithing will never approach as well as the redeeming the tithe scriptures. Here is more truth against the tithe as preached.

Deu 14:22 Thou shalt truly tithe all the increase of thy seed, that the field bringeth forth year by year.

Deu 14:23 And thou shalt eat before the LORD thy God, in the place which he shall choose to place his name there, the tithe of thy corn, of thy wine, and of thine oil, and the firstlings of thy herds and of thy flocks; that thou mayest learn to fear the LORD thy God always.

Deu 14:24 And if the way be too long for thee, so that thou art not able to carry it; [or] if the place be too far from thee, which the LORD thy God shall choose to set his name there, when the LORD thy God hath blessed thee:

Deu 14:25 Then shalt thou turn [it] into money, and bind up the money in thine hand, and shalt go unto the place which the LORD thy God shall choose:

Deu 14:26 And thou shalt bestow that money for whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, for oxen, or for sheep, or for wine, or for strong drink, or for whatsoever thy soul desireth:

and thou shalt eat there before the LORD thy God, and thou shalt rejoice, thou, and thine household,

Does that sound like you are suppose to give your tithe to the building.

They had more money than we have but God never required money as a tithe.

What the churches are doing today is using the tithe like the temple tax which was collected from Israel for the maintenance of the temple which was a half shekel.

That's $900.00 for those of you who don't know the value of a shekel. A shekel was valued at $1800.00 dollars.

Why won't they give you all the truth?

Because it is not to their advantage in keeping up THEIR MINISTRIES.

If God is behind it, then there is no need to beg you for money.

hismessenger

 

[Heavens]

That's right. I could never take a dime for ministering in the Word. Of all people, Paul said he could if he wanted to justify it, but he refused to take money. Instead, he worked, just as everyone should. Who would usurp that example?

 

[Schroeder]

The New Testament requires a tenth of all of a person's income just like it is mentioned in the Old Testament. The new church I have been going to on Sunday, requires me to give a tenth of my income. But I am in disagreement with this. If this church does require me to give a tithe, then there is no choice than me to leave that church. Please comment. Thanks and God bless you.

this denom as no authority over you period. The SPirit in you is to guide you. you answer to God only. they can help in you doing this though. but yea leave. Tithing is important but its not all about money when you tithe.

 

[Hismessenger]

I,ll give you one better to show what the tithe has always been about in the spirit;

Eze 20:37 "I will make you pass under the rod, and I will bring you into the bond of the covenant;

Eze 20:38 "I will purge the rebels from among you, and those who transgress against Me; I will bring them out of the country where they dwell, but they shall not enter the land of Israel. Then you will know that I [am] the LORD.

Eze 20:39 "As for you, O house of Israel," thus says the Lord GOD: "Go, serve every one of you his idols--and hereafter--if you will not obey Me; but profane My holy name no more with your gifts and your idols.
Eze 20:40 "For on My holy mountain, on the mountain height of Israel," says the Lord GOD, "there all the house of Israel, all of them in the land, shall serve Me; there I will accept them, and there I will require your offerings and the firstfruits of your sacrifices, together with all your holy things.
Eze 20:41"I will accept you as a sweet aroma when I bring you out from the peoples and gather you out of the countries where you have been scattered; and I will be hallowed in you before the Gentiles.
Eze 20:42"Then you shall know that I [am] the LORD, when I bring you into the land of Israel, into the country [for] which I raised My hand in an oath to give to your fathers.

If you do some research into the tithe chapters of the bible I think the spirit will show you His truth.

hismessenger

 

[myredeemer3]

The New Testament is based on what Jesus did for us. He makes all, all, things new. We are to be in the Spirit. The old has pasted away. Including the law. I see tithing as more than just money giving. It is giving anything that you can, gifts, time, income, teaching, ministering, missions, a kind heart, an understanding ear... give all these things with a joyful heart and give God the glory for being able to do whatever you can. It is the heart that He sees, not the money in your pocket.
Many blessings to you all!

 

[KRamey]

I'm sure that most people are attending their church for spiritual growth and to have a place to socialize themselves with people that have the same beliefs. Every time that church opens the door there are many things happening behind the scenes to make that happen. As a member, a child of God, and the spirit that resides in you, you should want and yearn for ways to help. Fact is... the money we give isn't ours and by giving it we lean on the promise that God will see to it we get more. Pray and search the answers to where God wants you to place his money. Believe it or not it's not to just your church. Tithing can be done daily while walking down the street and helping when you see the need. That's where the Spirit kicks in to let you know.

The economy has sucked the life out of many. Some people are taking whats been given and find themselves digging a hole to put it in for safe keeping. The sad truth is, times are not going to get better. Believe in Gods promise, listen for the Spirit to speak and give when you hear without hesitation.

As for a church that requires you to give 10% I must say that in most likely hood I would not attend such a church. It's important to help maintain the church you hold membership but at the same time I feel it's important to also tithe outside the church.

 

[JESUSIAM]

I'm sure that most people are attending their church for spiritual growth and to have a place to socialize themselves with people that have the same beliefs. Every time that church opens the door there are many things happening behind the scenes to make that happen. As a member, a child of God, and the spirit that resides in you, you should want and yearn for ways to help. Fact is... the money we give isn't ours and by giving it we lean on the promise that God will see to it we get more. Pray and search the answers to where God wants you to place his money. Believe it or not it's not to just your church. Tithing can be done daily while walking down the street and helping when you see the need. That's where the Spirit kicks in to let you know.

The economy has sucked the life out of many. Some people are taking whats been given and find themselves digging a hole to put it in for safe keeping. The sad truth is, times are not going to get better. Believe in Gods promise, listen for the Spirit to speak and give when you hear without hesitation.

As for a church that requires you to give 10% I must say that in most likely hood I would not attend such a church. It's important to help maintain the church you hold membership but at the same time I feel it's important to also tithe outside the church.

 

[Goinheix]

Christal clear:

Christian tithe is a form of financing the so called churches (not to confusi with the church and churches mentioned in the NT).

Christian tithe is not at all in the teachings of Jesus or any Apostle. It has not biblical suppoirt at all.

Moses tithing was only for the people under the Law.

Christian tithe and Moses tithe has no connection at all in ant aspect.


Pastors and doctrine teachers pervert the Scripture in order to decieve the brothers and impose a tax in the false prtetense of a doctrine.

 

[JESUSIAM]

A local church already has a credit card machine for those who want to use their credit cards to pay their tithes and offerings. And they call it going to the next level.

 

[KRamey]

We live in a time where most people don't carry cash anymore and writing checks is slowly becoming a thing of the past as well. Times change and our churches will be changing with them.

Here's a question... Can you go see a movie every week and not pay? It cost money for them to keep the doors open and supply the means necessary for you to come there and hopefully find enjoyment in what you have seen and the atmosphere you have seen it in.

What kind of Christian are we if we choose to believe that we can just go to church and not help? All through the Bible we clearly see that what we have isn't ours to begin with! Just like the parable of talents in Matthew 25 it is clear to see that the lord expects the church to do well with what he has given us. It's then up to you to listen to the spirit and give back when it's time to do so, and by doing that, God promises to give you more!

Who cares if the church you attend has a credit card machine. Try and go through life today without your credit card or bank card. I promise you will find that life will become much harder as you will be face to do simple things like having to go into the gas station to pay for gas, sometimes even twice if you have change coming!

Times are definitely different and they wont stop hear. Change is always right around the corner and through prayer and letting God's Spirit work through you, I believe you will always be prepared to do whats right.

 

[JESUSIAM]

We live in a time where most people don't carry cash anymore and writing checks is slowly becoming a thing of the past as well. Times change and our churches will be changing with them.

Here's a question... Can you go see a movie every week and not pay? It cost money for them to keep the doors open and supply the means necessary for you to come there and hopefully find enjoyment in what you have seen and the atmosphere you have seen it in.

What kind of Christian are we if we choose to believe that we can just go to church and not help? All through the Bible we clearly see that what we have isn't ours to begin with! Just like the parable of talents in Matthew 25 it is clear to see that the lord expects the church to do well with what he has given us. It's then up to you to listen to the spirit and give back when it's time to do so, and by doing that, God promises to give you more!

Who cares if the church you attend has a credit card machine. Try and go through life today without your credit card or bank card. I promise you will find that life will become much harder as you will be face to do simple things like having to go into the gas station to pay for gas, sometimes even twice if you have change coming!

Times are definitely different and they wont stop hear. Change is always right around the corner and through prayer and letting God's Spirit work through you, I believe you will always be prepared to do whats right.

 

[Goinheix]

We live in a time where most people don't carry cash anymore and writing checks is slowly becoming a thing of the past as well. Times change and our churches will be changing with them.

Here's a question... Can you go see a movie every week and not pay? It cost money for them to keep the doors open and supply the means necessary for you to come there and hopefully find enjoyment in what you have seen and the atmosphere you have seen it in.

What kind of Christian are we if we choose to believe that we can just go to church and not help? All through the Bible we clearly see that what we have isn't ours to begin with! Just like the parable of talents in Matthew 25 it is clear to see that the lord expects the church to do well with what he has given us. It's then up to you to listen to the spirit and give back when it's time to do so, and by doing that, God promises to give you more!

Who cares if the church you attend has a credit card machine. Try and go through life today without your credit card or bank card. I promise you will find that life will become much harder as you will be face to do simple things like having to go into the gas station to pay for gas, sometimes even twice if you have change coming!

Times are definitely different and they wont stop hear. Change is always right around the corner and through prayer and letting God's Spirit work through you, I believe you will always be prepared to do whats right.

Paul is very clear in two points (he is clear in many points, but concerning this thread):
1 We have as christians suposed to suport our local church with responsability and love.
2 Tithing is not a christian doctrine and those teaching tithe as doctrine are false pastors seaking for money

In few words:
We must support our church but not with tithe.
We must walk away from any church teaching tithing

 

[Goinheix]

Here's a question... Can you go see a movie every week and not pay? It cost money for them to keep the doors open and supply the means necessary for you to come there and hopefully find enjoyment in what you have seen and the atmosphere you have seen it in.

.

This is the sad part; many pastors see the need to offer a good show for collecting money. Many churches have become a show atracting paying public.

 

[KRamey]

The point i was trying to make is that there is a cost behind the scenes of any church that you attend. Mortgage, taxes, utilities, upkeep, salaries, equipment, buses, missionary work, and that's just a short list.

A church filled with members who believe they shouldn't have to give back will probably find it impossible to keep the doors open or grow and will not have the ability to play a roll in helping the community it serves.

The fact that you do not support "tithing" and come here and try to convince others that giving back is wrong is something that you need to talk to God about. My question to you is, are you saying that you go to church and not offer any monetary funds back to help support daily and future expectations?

As for me and my walk I will continue to give when the Spirit urges me to do so, which is sometimes more than the 10% the old law describes and I will continue to stand on the promises that there is plenty more where that came from!

Getting to your statement that many churches have become a show attracting paying public is actually true in many ways however let's be honest here and again say that times are changing and always will. Churches are competing for the public's attention in a day that is charged with so much outside stimuli that they must do the same to hold many peoples attention. Through this show that you call it, we pray that the spirit of God continues to touch the lives of all the people who are ready to hear it. I'm fairly certain that the show that goes on in Heaven is much better than anything we will ever see here.

 

[JESUSIAM]

The thing is, churches are spending more of their collections in the function and maintance of the building than doing what the collection was originally intended, that is to help the poor and widowed. Pastors are saying that tithing is a commantment of God for today's church. Jesus and Paul did most of their ministry outdoors and they were not asking for money for their own personal needs.

 

[Goinheix]

The fact that you do not support "tithing" and come here and try to convince others that giving back is wrong is something that you need to talk to God about. My question to you is, are you saying that you go to church and not offer any monetary funds back to help support daily and future expectations?
.

I have already declare that Paul teaches christians to be responsible and care for the financial needs of the local church and the pastor. When I go to church (I am seaman and spend the most of the time at sea) I do offer money and I think that is correct to do it.

What I say and do is the next: if I know of a church/pastor/denomination teaching christian tithe as biblical doctrine; I walk away because I know those are not a serious church and only seak for money.

You say that I dont support tithe. The Bible dont asupport christian tithe. Jesus dont support christian tithe. Paul and the Apostles dont support tithe. The Holy Spirit prohibit to teach tithe.

 

[Goinheix]

Any church that need money to do evangelism or any other ministry to the Lord, has not the power of the Holy Spirit and is not doing the Lord mission.