Third temple being build in Jerusalem right now

[Timtofly]

Rubbish

So this nation is physical and in Paradise?

You call my words rubbish. I said the church is made up of a souls with physical incorruptible bodies. They are ambassadors on earth and not even citizens. While on earth, they have corruptible bodies and sin natures. You have to be born physically, before you can be born from above. None of your verses changes any of these points you claim rubbish.

Your point being? You do not accept they have bodies, but are only souls. I never claimed a church does not exist. Scriptures tend to point out they in Paradise have physical properties and not just ghosts.

 

[Timtofly]

Because that's what the bible does in about a thousand places.
(See what I did there with the number 1000? I do not mean that literally, but in the Psalm 50 sense where it means "heaps!")


Um, I think you'll find it's the bible's case.


IF by that we mean a gathering of God's people - the elect - who remain faithful when others do not, then yes there was a 'church' before Jacob was born. But that's just a semantic game. One could as easily say 'faithful Hebrew' or 'faithful Jew'.


That's just a semantic game. One could as easily say 'faithful Hebrew' or 'faithful Jew'.


So?
Jesus reigns now from heaven during this '1000 years' and his gospel is advancing. Who says WE get to reign over political structures? Remember, "My kingdom is not of this world" and then he died and rose again. Then the martyrs die and are before the thrones of earlier Revelation, which are in heaven.


Wrong! I've linked to the article that defines the church universal - did you bother to read the whole thing? It explains a lot of the key bible verses that show us how the bible views the church.


That would be awful given how they treat other religions and the Palestinians! It's also completely unnecessary from a biblical point of view.


The OT verses that picture Paradise see it through the lens of Jewish faithfulness in a perfect temple on perfect Mount Zion etc. But in the NT that is all spiritualised by Jesus and the apostles themselves.


What? Huh? Wow. Talk about putting up a strawman.
The New Jerusalem itself is picture language for the New Heavens and New Earth - 12,000 stadia which is the people of God (12 tribes, 12 apostles) times a gazillion bajillion! Yup, that's how Jewish number symbolism multiplied out works. That's also why the 144,000 is not literal. It's Israel multiplied by a gazillion bajillion!

So I do not have to take you literally. All your posts are symbolized words, and have no points in reality.

 

[eclipsenow]

So I do not have to take you literally. All your posts are symbolized words, and have no points in reality.

Now now - it's not my fault you can't defend your position - whatever it actually is. Also, our salvation is spoken of in dozens of symbols and metaphors. Does that mean it's not real?

And this is?

 

[Timtofly]

Now now - it's not my fault you can't defend your position - whatever it actually is. Also, our salvation is spoken of in dozens of symbols and metaphors. Does that mean it's not real?

If you don't know my position what are you arguing against?

I never stated a position. You claim you know what is and what is not symbolism. So far, all you have proven is that the majority of God's Word is not literal, and only your "factual" man made statements interpret God's Word. Any other views you seem to make fun of.

 

[eclipsenow]

If you don't know my position what are you arguing against?

I never stated a position. You claim you know what is and what is not symbolism. So far, all you have proven is that the majority of God's Word is not literal, and only your "factual" man made statements interpret God's Word. Any other views you seem to make fun of.

Any other 'views' are poor genre recognition and therefore like picking up Shakespeare to fly a 747.

 

[eclipsenow]

Your point being? You do not accept they have bodies, but are only souls. I never claimed a church does not exist. Scriptures tend to point out they in Paradise have physical properties and not just ghosts.

Yes! I agree that in Paradise we'll have bodies. I agree with calling it Paradise because Heaven is too loaded with Greek gnosticism (spirit good, matter bad.) But I still maintain that Rev 20 is symbolic of heaven because they 'came alive' after being martyred and we know from other verses that vastly more stuff happens when Christians actually 'come alive'. These guys 'came alive' in 'heaven' before the thrones where Jesus is ruling. They're a picture of how our martyred brothers and sisters are safe, however long the gazillion years runs between the Lord's ascension and his return. But what does that actually mean? Is it soul sleep, or a heavenly 'virtual' dwelling until they are properly 'clothed' in a body when the Lord Returns on Judgement Day to establish a New Heavens and a New Earth, or some other thing where the person actually travels through time to the last day the moment they die? I just don't know - and I don't know that Rev 20 answers that. Why? Because it's not literally describing what's happening with the martyrs, but figuratively, theologically, just like the use of 1000, just like the use of 7 and 3.5, just like diamonds and rainbows and lambs and 7 horns and 7 eyes - it's all figurative!

But whoever said that because something is a metaphor it can't tell us something true?
What do the 7 eyes mean? Perfect knowledge.
7 horns? Perfect power.
Lamb slain? Jesus, the sacrifice made on our behalf.
What does this image mean? Even though he was slain, he has perfect power and knowledge of what is happening on the earth as he reigns, and is the one who can open the scroll.
What's the scroll? The mystery of the ages that we've been debating - how is God going to save his people on the last day? How? This...

 

[BABerean2]

Israel will rule on earth.

Heb 11:14 For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country.
Heb 11:15 And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned.
Heb 11:16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.


.

 

[eclipsenow]

Heb 11:14 For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country.
Heb 11:15 And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned.
Heb 11:16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.


.

I love Hebrews 11, especially in a modern translation like the NIV.

8 By faith Abraham, when called to go to a place he would later receive as his inheritance, obeyed and went, even though he did not know where he was going. 9 By faith he made his home in the promised land like a stranger in a foreign country; he lived in tents, as did Isaac and Jacob, who were heirs with him of the same promise. 10 For he was looking forward to the city with foundations, whose architect and builder is God. 11 And by faith even Sarah, who was past childbearing age, was enabled to bear children because she considered him faithful who had made the promise. 12 And so from this one man, and he as good as dead, came descendants as numerous as the stars in the sky and as countless as the sand on the seashore.

13 All these people were still living by faith when they died. They did not receive the things promised; they only saw them and welcomed them from a distance, admitting that they were foreigners and strangers on earth. 14 People who say such things show that they are looking for a country of their own. 15 If they had been thinking of the country they had left, they would have had opportunity to return. 16 Instead, they were longing for a better country—a heavenly one. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he has prepared a city for them.​

 

[jgr]

Israel will rule on earth.

Since Israel's genes are now present in the entire human race, how will the rulers be distinguished from the ruleds?

 

[Timtofly]

Since Israel's genes are now present in the entire human race, how will the rulers be distinguished from the ruleds?

Their children. Can anyone one tell a difference between you and you children or grandchildren? The first generation will be the rulers. Their offspring will be the ruled.

Did any one after the 5th generation know Adam and Eve? Or did they get mixed up with others and lost in the crowd?

 

[jgr]

Their children. Can anyone one tell a difference between you and you children or grandchildren? The first generation will be the rulers. Their offspring will be the ruled.

Scripture for that?

Over the course of 1,000 years there will be anywhere from ten to twenty generations. All of them will want to be the rulers, and none will want to be the ruled.

Your speculations will quickly be demonstrated to be illegitimate.

 

[Timtofly]

Scripture for that?

Over the course of 1,000 years there will be anywhere from ten to twenty generations. All of them will want to be the rulers, and none will want to be the ruled.

Your speculations will quickly be demonstrated to be illegitimate.

They reign with Christ. That iron rod will send many of your alledged usurpers to their Death. If you think they will want to rebel, you are already putting many on Satan's side, and Satan is not even around. In Death one will instantly be by Satan's side.

 

[jgr]

They reign with Christ. That iron rod will send many of your alledged usurpers to their Death. If you think they will want to rebel, you are already putting many on Satan's side, and Satan is not even around. In Death one will instantly be by Satan's side.

Scripture for that?

What happens when the first generation of rulers dies? Which generation becomes the next generation of rulers?

 

[Timtofly]

Scripture for that?

What happens when the first generation of rulers dies? Which generation becomes the next generation of rulers?

Where is your Scripture saying they die?

 

[jgr]

Where is your Scripture saying they die?

Isaiah 65:20
"...the child shall die an hundred years old..."

 

[AlasBabylon]

.

Edomite Herod's temple was the third temple.

Rebuilding Herod's temple would be an antichrist abomination.

 

[Douggg]

.

Edomite Herod's temple was the third temple.

Rebuilding Herod's temple would be an antichrist abomination.

There will be the rebuilding of the temple buildings on the current temple mount platform. How big the sanctuary will be in its initial stages - it is likely to be downsized to get the temple ordinances operational as soon as possible.

 

[BABerean2]

There will be the rebuilding of the temple buildings on the current temple mount platform.

What does the New Testament say?


Mat 24:1 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.
Mat 24:2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.


Luk 19:41 And when he was come near, he beheld the city, and wept over it,
Luk 19:42 Saying, If thou hadst known, even thou, at least in this thy day, the things which belong unto thy peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes.
Luk 19:43 For the days shall come upon thee, that thine enemies shall cast a trench about thee, and compass thee round, and keep thee in on every side,
Luk 19:44 And shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave in thee one stone upon another; because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation.


Act_21:34 And some cried one thing, some another, among the multitude: and when he could not know the certainty for the tumult, he commanded him to be carried into the castle.

Act_21:37 And as Paul was to be led into the castle, he said unto the chief captain, May I speak unto thee? Who said, Canst thou speak Greek?

Act_22:24 The chief captain commanded him to be brought into the castle, and bade that he should be examined by scourging; that he might know wherefore they cried so against him.

Act_23:10 And when there arose a great dissension, the chief captain, fearing lest Paul should have been pulled in pieces of them, commanded the soldiers to go down, and to take him by force from among them, and to bring him into the castle.

Act_23:16 And when Paul's sister's son heard of their lying in wait, he went and entered into the castle, and told Paul.

Act_23:32 On the morrow they left the horsemen to go with him, and returned to the castle:


See the symbol of the 10th Roman Legion at time 23:00 in the video below.

"The Temple Mount" is Roman Fort Antonia:

.

 

[Douggg]

What does the New Testament say?


Mat 24:1 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.
Mat 24:2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.


Luk 19:41 And when he was come near, he beheld the city, and wept over it,
Luk 19:42 Saying, If thou hadst known, even thou, at least in this thy day, the things which belong unto thy peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes.
Luk 19:43 For the days shall come upon thee, that thine enemies shall cast a trench about thee, and compass thee round, and keep thee in on every side,
Luk 19:44 And shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave in thee one stone upon another; because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation.


Act_21:34 And some cried one thing, some another, among the multitude: and when he could not know the certainty for the tumult, he commanded him to be carried into the castle.

Act_21:37 And as Paul was to be led into the castle, he said unto the chief captain, May I speak unto thee? Who said, Canst thou speak Greek?

Act_22:24 The chief captain commanded him to be brought into the castle, and bade that he should be examined by scourging; that he might know wherefore they cried so against him.

Act_23:10 And when there arose a great dissension, the chief captain, fearing lest Paul should have been pulled in pieces of them, commanded the soldiers to go down, and to take him by force from among them, and to bring him into the castle.

Act_23:16 And when Paul's sister's son heard of their lying in wait, he went and entered into the castle, and told Paul.

Act_23:32 On the morrow they left the horsemen to go with him, and returned to the castle:


See the symbol of the 10th Roman Legion at time 23:00 in the video below.

"The Temple Mount" is Roman Fort Antonia:

.

BaB2, you are ignoring Mark 13, although I have posted it to you a couple of times.

It is the buildings that no stone would be left on the other. Not the temple mount platform.


1 And as he went out of the temple, one of his disciples saith unto him, Master, see what manner of stones and what buildings are here!

2 And Jesus answering said unto him, Seest thou these great buildings? there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.

 

[BABerean2]

BaB2, you are ignoring Mark 13, although I have posted it to you a couple of times.

It is the buildings that no stone would be left on the other. Not the temple mount platform.

You are ignoring what Jesus said in Luke 19:41-44 about the whole city being destroyed, and you are ignoring the word "castle" in the Book of Acts.

G3925
παρεμβολή
parembolē
par-em-bol-ay'
From a compound of G3844 and G1685; a throwing in beside (juxtaposition), that is, (specifically) battle array, encampment or barracks (tower Antonia): - army, camp, castle.
Total KJV occurrences: 10


Act_21:34 And some cried one thing, some another, among the multitude: and when he could not know the certainty for the tumult, he commanded him to be carried into the castle.

Act_21:37 And as Paul was to be led into the castle, he said unto the chief captain, May I speak unto thee? Who said, Canst thou speak Greek?

Act_22:24 The chief captain commanded him to be brought into the castle, and bade that he should be examined by scourging; that he might know wherefore they cried so against him.

Act_23:10 And when there arose a great dissension, the chief captain, fearing lest Paul should have been pulled in pieces of them, commanded the soldiers to go down, and to take him by force from among them, and to bring him into the castle.

Act_23:16 And when Paul's sister's son heard of their lying in wait, he went and entered into the castle, and told Paul.

Act_23:32 On the morrow they left the horsemen to go with him, and returned to the castle:


Where is this "castle" now located?


The modern model does not match what Josephus said about the size of Fort Antonia.

You are also creating a term known as "the temple mount platform", which is not found in the Bible, or in the writings of Josephus. It is a modern invention which attempts to turn Fort Antonia into the site of the temple.

.