The problem of evil

[ToddNotTodd]

So, how do you "know" that your view is the "moral" one?

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I don't believe in a "the" moral one. I believe that I have my morality, and you have your morality.

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

I don't believe in a "the" moral one. I believe that I have my morality, and you have your morality.

So, what would make something Immoral?

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[ToddNotTodd]

So, what would make something Immoral?

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Something to me that isn't moral.

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

Something to me that isn't moral.

So how you would determine something to be moral or immoral is based entirely on your own personal opinion? Do you find that some people have superior discernment in what is moral or immoral?

 

[Dave Ellis]

I believe what you are talking about is "generational curses". The Bible mentions “generational curses” in several places (Exodus 20:5; 34:7; Numbers 14:18; Deuteronomy 5:9). God warns that He is “a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the fathers to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me.”

It sounds unfair for God to punish children for the sins of their fathers. However, there is more to it than that. The effects of sin are naturally passed down from one generation to the next. When a father has a sinful lifestyle, his children are likely to practice the same sinful lifestyle. Implied in the warning of Exodus 20:5 is the fact that the children will choose to repeat the sins of their fathers. A Jewish Targum specifies that this passage refers to “ungodly fathers” and “rebellious children.” So, it is not unjust for God to punish sin to the third or fourth generation – those generations are committing the same sins their ancestors did.

There is a trend in the church today to try to blame every sin and problem on some sort of generational curse. This is not biblical. God’s warning to visit iniquity on future generations is part of the Old Testament Law. A generational curse was a consequence for a specific nation (Israel) for a specific sin (idolatry). The history books of the Old Testament (especially Judges) contain the record of this divine punishment meted out.

The cure for a generational curse has always been repentance. When Israel turned from idols to serve the living God, the “curse” was broken and God saved them (Judges 3:9, 15; 1 Samuel 12:10-11). Yes, God promised to visit Israel’s sin upon the third and fourth generations, but in the very next verse He promised that He would show “love to a thousand [generations] of those who love me and keep my commandments” (Exodus 20:6). In other words, God’s grace lasts a thousand times longer than His wrath.

For the Christian who is worried about a generational curse, the answer is salvation through Jesus Christ. A Christian is a new creation (2 Corinthians 5:17). How can a child of God still be under God’s curse (Romans 8:1)? The cure for a “generational curse” is repentance of the sin in question, faith in Christ, and a life consecrated to the Lord (Romans 12:1-2).


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So is it moral for humans to punish each other to the third or fourth generation?

 

[Dave Ellis]

He's GOD.

That's not an answer to my question.

I asked how is he morally justified to punish people for crimes their ancestors committed.

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

So is it moral for humans to punish each other to the third or fourth generation?

No.

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[HitchSlap]

No.

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Then why does your god punish the child for "sins of the father?"

 

[ToddNotTodd]

So how you would determine something to be moral or immoral is based entirely on your own personal opinion?

Like I said, nature, nurture and logic dictate my morality.

Do you find that some people have superior discernment in what is moral or immoral?

I don't know what "superior discernment" would mean in this context. Everyone has their own reasons for their moral systems. I suppose you could say that superior discernment could be accurately assessing your own moral system.

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

Then why does your god punish the child for "sins of the father?"

Because He has the authority to do so and humans do not.

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[HitchSlap]

Because He has the authority to do so and humans do not.

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Sounds like a bully.

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

Sounds like a bully.

Is there anything else I can help you with?

 

[HitchSlap]

Is there anything else I can help you with?

Certainly not with morality.

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

Certainly not with morality.

OK, if you ever change your mind just let me know. I am happy to help.

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[HitchSlap]

OK, if you ever change your mind just let me know. I am happy to help.

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No doubt.

 

[Anna the Seeker]

My answer to why evil exists is rather simple. God didn't create us His puppets, nothing but empty vessels. If we were that, evil surely wouldn't exist. Neither would free will.

But He did give us free will, and as it seems to me, He just may have valued it more than using us as puppets on His stage. He surely knew the price - with free will and true souls able to pick their life path, good and evil will both inevitably exist. But without each other and the grey areas in between, it wouldn't make a story worth telling.

While He may seek certain kind of people to enter His presence, choosing Him by free will gives their choice even more weight and value.

I have always been content enough with this answer. It may be philosophy from an author's point of view, but it works for me.

 

[Dave Ellis]

No.

If it's not moral for humans to do it, then why is it moral for god to do it?

 

[Dave Ellis]

My answer to why evil exists is rather simple. God didn't create us His puppets, nothing but empty vessels. If we were that, evil surely wouldn't exist. Neither would free will.

But He did give us free will, and as it seems to me, He just may have valued it more than using us as puppets on His stage. He surely knew the price - with free will and true souls able to pick their life path, good and evil will both inevitably exist. But without each other and the grey areas in between, it wouldn't make a story worth telling.

While He may seek certain kind of people to enter His presence, choosing Him by free will gives their choice even more weight and value.

I have always been content enough with this answer. It may be philosophy from an author's point of view, but it works for me.

Creating us with no inclination to do evil would not affect free will in the slightest.

 

[Kenny'sID]

I asked how is he morally justified to punish people for crimes their ancestors committed.

May we back up a bit?

First, site reference to the particular immoral act you accuse God of so we can take a close look and determine if it is indeed immoral.

 

[Dave Ellis]

May we back up a bit?

First, site reference to the particular immoral act you accuse God of so we can take a close look and determine if it is indeed immoral.

The act in question is punishing people three or four generations down the line for the sins of their ancestors.