The Mystery of the Church Age

[Guojing]

Expansion theology?

That argument is basically a tautological one. I call that a sophisticated version of Replacement Theology.

It goes like this

The Body of Christ has not replaced Israel.
Rather, Israel has always been defined as all those who believed God.
Therefore, the Body of Christ, by definition, is Israel, and has not replaced her.

 

[Thuycidides]

That argument is basically a tautological one. I call that a sophisticated version of Replacement Theology.

It goes like this

The Body of Christ has not replaced Israel.
Rather, Israel has always been defined as all those who believed God.
Therefore, the Body of Christ, by definition, is Israel, and has not replaced her.

I would say the spiritual and inward has supplanted the natural and outward, even as the New is brought in as the Old fades away (Heb 7):

"But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God."

"Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie."

"Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise...So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free."

"And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham."

The only thing that God cares about pertaining to the flesh of Abraham's seed is that they are beloved for the fathers' sake (Romans 11:28), and so God will graft them in again, if they abide no in unbelief.

God did not cast away natural Israel, they fell away as dead branches from a tree by their own dead weight of unbelief. It is angels that cast all such into the fire, whether Jew or Greek.

Jesus confirmed the promises of the last days to the Jews first, and now to all, and will not go back one final last and really really last time to the Jews only. The angel in mid-heaven preaching the everlasting Gospel of the cross is to all inhabitors of the earth, not just the Jews.

They wanted to be like other nation, when they demanded a king, and they got their wish and became like any other nation, when they had the Promisor killed. End of promise.

In Revelation 11 it is the nations of the earth, including the Jewish sort, that will tread the outer court of the temple of God, which is earth His footstool, while His temple and throne sits in heavenly places, which will be seen opened with the first resurrection at the end of revelation 11.

 

[RandyPNW]

Hi Randy,

I think you and others really need to look out your back door. There is NO Roman Empire ruling. We have the G7, G20 & UN, and who is in control of these?

1. Britain. (Lion) & America. (Eagle)
2. Russia. (Bear)
3. EU. (Leopard.

Look up wikipedia etc and see who is ruling in these world leadership gatherings.

regards, Marilyn.

You look at your back door, and I look into history. Historically, the Italian Kingdom in the West never fell. Rome did. The Roman Kingdom continued until France inherited it, then Germany, etc. With the rise of the Carolingians and the Hapsburgs we have a form of imperial Roman rule, because they worked in step with Catholic Rome.

In the Eastern part of the old Roman Empire, the Byzantine Empire continued for a thousand years until 1453 AD. Though the Ottoman Turks took control of Asia Minor, the Greek Orthodox tradition was perpetuated to the North, among various groups of Slavs. Ultimately, Russia became a sort of "3rd Rome," with a Czar, or "Caesar," ruling.

No, the Roman Imperial Tradition has never gone away, and has remained in Europe through the Catholics and even through the Protestants. If you think the UK, the EU, and Russia play into this, it is only because they have always been part of the Roman Imperial Tradition.

Daniel presented Rome as the 4th Beast. The Revelation presents this 4th Beast as a sort of amalgamation of all of the previous creatures, lion, leopard, and bear. But make no mistake--it is the 4th Beast--at least I believe so.

This Beast has 10 horns and 7 heads--10 horns because the 4th Beast breaks up into 10 states, and 7 heads because 3 of the 10 kings of these states get removed.

 

[Marilyn C]

You look at your back door, and I look into history. Historically, the Italian Kingdom in the West never fell. Rome did. The Roman Kingdom continued until France inherited it, then Germany, etc. With the rise of the Carolingians and the Hapsburgs we have a form of imperial Roman rule, because they worked in step with Catholic Rome.

In the Eastern part of the old Roman Empire, the Byzantine Empire continued for a thousand years until 1453 AD. Though the Ottoman Turks took control of Asia Minor, the Greek Orthodox tradition was perpetuated to the North, among various groups of Slavs. Ultimately, Russia became a sort of "3rd Rome," with a Czar, or "Caesar," ruling.

No, the Roman Imperial Tradition has never gone away, and has remained in Europe through the Catholics and even through the Protestants. If you think the UK, the EU, and Russia play into this, it is only because they have always been part of the Roman Imperial Tradition.

Daniel presented Rome as the 4th Beast. The Revelation presents this 4th Beast as a sort of amalgamation of all of the previous creatures, lion, leopard, and bear. But make no mistake--it is the 4th Beast--at least I believe so.

This Beast has 10 horns and 7 heads--10 horns because the 4th Beast breaks up into 10 states, and 7 heads because 3 of the 10 kings of these states get removed.

Hi Randy,

God judged each of the first four world rulers of the Great Image. Judged and they are NO MORE. You cannot revive what God has judged!

`The back door` picture is what is happening NOW.

The `lion, eagle, bear & leopard,` emblems are representative of who is ruling NOW. And they certainly are NOT the RRE. They are great powers in their own right.

There is rising the final great power that will deceive those 3, and that is Islam. It is the most terrifying beastly power that man has ever seen.

Marilyn.

 

[Marilyn C]

They wanted to be like other nation, when they demanded a king, and they got their wish and became like any other nation, when they had the Promisor killed. End of promise.

.

Hi Thuycidides,

Man cannot stop God`s purposes and promises.

Marilyn.

 

[Guojing]

They wanted to be like other nation, when they demanded a king, and they got their wish and became like any other nation, when they had the Promisor killed. End of promise.
.

Did the promise in 2 Samuel 7:12-16, that Israel will have someone from the loin of David ruling over them, conditional upon Israel's behavior?

 

[Marilyn C]

You look at your back door, and I look into history. .

Hi Randy,

I thought I`d get you up to speed.

The 2021 G7 summit is taking place in Carbis Bay, Cornwall from June 11th to June 13th. May 13, 2021 What is the G7 Summit? The Group of Seven - or G7 for short - is an organisation made up of the world's seven richest nations: Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, the United Kingdom and the United States.

 

[RandyPNW]

Hi Randy,

I thought I`d get you up to speed.

The 2021 G7 summit is taking place in Carbis Bay, Cornwall from June 11th to June 13th. May 13, 2021 What is the G7 Summit? The Group of Seven - or G7 for short - is an organisation made up of the world's seven richest nations: Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, the United Kingdom and the United States.


View attachment 300554

I know about the G7, Marilyn.

 

[RandyPNW]

Hi Randy,

God judged each of the first four world rulers of the Great Image. Judged and they are NO MORE. You cannot revive what God has judged!

`The back door` picture is what is happening NOW.

The `lion, eagle, bear & leopard,` emblems are representative of who is ruling NOW. And they certainly are NOT the RRE. They are great powers in their own right.

There is rising the final great power that will deceive those 3, and that is Islam. It is the most terrifying beastly power that man has ever seen.

Marilyn.

Islam is indeed one of the first great antichrists in history, following the pagan Roman Empire. Islam has tried to unseat the Roman Imperial Tradition in the East, conquering Constantinople in 1453. But the Ottomans did not hold this territory forever. They endured a steady decline until they ceased to exist early in the 20th century.

European Culture has remained predominant *now,* and is not a passé culture. The Catholic Church has gone nowhere, and the tradition of imperialistic rule remains entrenched in the mind of European leaders. Whether you speak of European leaders like Napoleon, Hitler, and Stalin, or you speak of European colonialism and economic domination, you will know that *today* Europe remains firmly entrenched in an imperial mentality.

The 4th Beast Daniel indicates is the last in history. And so, it must continue until Christ returns. Roman Europe must remain in place until Antichrist comes to rule over it. And then Christ will return to defeat him.

The 1st 3 Beasts did indeed suffer defeat. Elements of their cultures remain in their representative modern states, Iraq, Iran, and Greece. However, they did lose their imperial dominance.

Europe, however, has never lost their dominance from the time of the ancient Roman Empire. As I said, there have always been occasions for Rome to rise again, with its culture, people, and imperial tradition. This is both an Eastern and a Western culture, dominated by Slavic and Germanic peoples.

The ancient Empire in the West lasted up to 476 AD in the West, and up to 1453 AD in the East. That is a *long time!* And the Holy Roman Empire was created in 800 AD, continuing the Roman tradition in the West, while the Russian Empire picked up after Constantinople fell in the East. The European powers remain formidable, even in their present state of religious apostasy. The G7 includes some of these powers, and I do find significance in that.

 

[Marilyn C]

The G7 includes some of these powers, and I do find significance in that.

Hi Randy,

Glad to hear that. Let`s have a look at the line up.

1. British Commonwealth. - Britain & Canada. (Lion/ Monarchy, Crowned) America. (Eagle which came off the Lion)
2. Russia. (Bear) in the G 8.
3. EU, represented by the early leaders, (France, Germany, Italy) (Leopard)

(Japan is in there for its part in WW2 and is kept under control by the others)

As to `land,` that is not what God judges but the governments. Four world rulers (governments) have been judged and they are no more.

You rightly said the last global government is made up of those beasts - lion, (& eagle) bear and leopard. And this is what we see forming today. It is governments, (people) that God is dealing with, not land. History has come and gone and now there are different people who will be judged.

regards, Marilyn.

 

[RandyPNW]

Hi Randy,

Glad to hear that. Let`s have a look at the line up.

1. British Commonwealth. - Britain & Canada. (Lion/ Monarchy, Crowned) America. (Eagle which came off the Lion)
2. Russia. (Bear) in the G 8.
3. EU, represented by the early leaders, (France, Germany, Italy) (Leopard)

(Japan is in there for its part in WW2 and is kept under control by the others)

As to `land,` that is not what God judges but the governments. Four world rulers (governments) have been judged and they are no more.

You rightly said the last global government is made up of those beasts - lion, (& eagle) bear and leopard. And this is what we see forming today. It is governments, (people) that God is dealing with, not land. History has come and gone and now there are different people who will be judged.

regards, Marilyn.

Yes, that's very interesting. I've seen and considered that before. I couldn't find much explicit biblical information to confirm it. But nonetheless, it is interesting. I'd never heard of the eagle thing coming off the lion. I had heard of Tarshish and her "young lions" in Eze 39 as possibly referring to American colonies planted under Spanish jurisdiction.

 

[Marilyn C]

Yes, that's very interesting. I've seen and considered that before. I couldn't find much explicit biblical information to confirm it. But nonetheless, it is interesting. I'd never heard of the eagle thing coming off the lion. I had heard of Tarshish and her "young lions" in Eze 39 as possibly referring to American colonies planted under Spanish jurisdiction.

Hi Randy,

So glad you have heard something like that before. If you want details from God`s word I can give it.

regards, Marilyn.

 

[RandyPNW]

Hi Randy,

So glad you have heard something like that before. If you want details from God`s word I can give it.

regards, Marilyn.

Thank you, I've been reading the details of God's word all of my life, and I'm getting close to 70. Marilyn, you're not God's oracle, but I appreciate the conversation.

 

[Marilyn C]

Thank you, I've been reading the details of God's word all of my life, and I'm getting close to 70. Marilyn, you're not God's oracle, but I appreciate the conversation.

Hi Randy,

Oh you do make me laugh. Yes I am certainly not God`s oracle. And thanks for the compliment as it seems you think I am young. In fact I am well over 70, (you can check my profile).

I was taught this view by my teachers many, many years ago, and I have seen it all coming to pass.

regards, Marilyn.

 

[Thuycidides]

Hi Randy,

God judged each of the first four world rulers of the Great Image. Judged and they are NO MORE. You cannot revive what God has judged!

`The back door` picture is what is happening NOW.

The `lion, eagle, bear & leopard,` emblems are representative of who is ruling NOW. And they certainly are NOT the RRE. They are great powers in their own right.

There is rising the final great power that will deceive those 3, and that is Islam. It is the most terrifying beastly power that man has ever seen.

Marilyn.

"There is rising the final great power that will deceive those 3, and that is Islam."

Tell that to Genghis and the Mongolian horde.

Terrorism as the only means of power is not a terrifying power that actually rules.

Assyria was a great terrifying power, that also used terrorist treatment of defeated people. They actually ruled over them as well.

IF America had ever gone Imperial in the classic sense, it would have been unstoppable.

The image in Daniel is done away with 2 possibilities:

1. With the return of the Lord to break it into pieces, beginning at the feet, and the millennial reign.
2. With the Gospel of the Lord breaking the pagan powers into pieces over time with the spread of Christianity.

 

[RandyPNW]

Hi Randy,

Oh you do make me laugh. Yes I am certainly not God`s oracle. And thanks for the compliment as it seems you think I am young. In fact I am well over 70, (you can check my profile).

I was taught this view by my teachers many, many years ago, and I have seen it all coming to pass.

regards, Marilyn.

I wasn't trying to make you laugh. You just seem a bit *too sure* of yourself. When we spend as much time with God as we have, we should tend to be a little *less sure* of ourselves...unless, of course, we're really sure!

I never treated you as if I thought you were "young." But you do appear to treat me as if I'm ignorant, and need you to explain things to me. But it's difficult to tell, and I don't want to jump to conclusions.

So I can just fall back on this. We have different gifts, and can learn from one another. Let's build one another up in love, and consider each other better than ourselves?

 

[Marilyn C]

I wasn't trying to make you laugh. You just seem a bit *too sure* of yourself. When we spend as much time with God as we have, we should tend to be a little *less sure* of ourselves...unless, of course, we're really sure!

I never treated you as if I thought you were "young." But you do appear to treat me as if I'm ignorant, and need you to explain things to me. But it's difficult to tell, and I don't want to jump to conclusions.

So I can just fall back on this. We have different gifts, and can learn from one another. Let's build one another up in love, and consider each other better than ourselves?

Hi Randy,

well it was you who was putting me down bro, unless you forgot. Then you played the age card as though I was young. And now you are saying I treated you this or that, when all I have done is present what I have been taught.

So I think you needed to consider your final statement when you were first talking to me and not ridiculing me. Seems you have forgotten how you treated me.

Marilyn.

 

[Marilyn C]

"There is rising the final great power that will deceive those 3, and that is Islam."

Tell that to Genghis and the Mongolian horde.

Terrorism as the only means of power is not a terrifying power that actually rules.

Assyria was a great terrifying power, that also used terrorist treatment of defeated people. They actually ruled over them as well.

IF America had ever gone Imperial in the classic sense, it would have been unstoppable.

The image in Daniel is done away with 2 possibilities:

1. With the return of the Lord to break it into pieces, beginning at the feet, and the millennial reign.
2. With the Gospel of the Lord breaking the pagan powers into pieces over time with the spread of Christianity.

Hi Thuycidides,

I agree what you said about terrorism, however we know from God`s word that the A/C comes in first as the deceiver. (Dan. 8: 25).

The Lord deals with the Gentiles ruling, as per the Great Image. The Gentiles have only been given a certain time to rule throughout history and then the Lord judges them. The Great Image as a whole represents the times of the Gentiles ruling the world. (Luke 21: 24)

regards, Marilyn.

 

[RandyPNW]

Hi Randy,

well it was you who was putting me down bro, unless you forgot. Then you played the age card as though I was young. And now you are saying I treated you this or that, when all I have done is present what I have been taught.

So I think you needed to consider your final statement when you were first talking to me and not ridiculing me. Seems you have forgotten how you treated me.

Marilyn.

Maybe I misread your comments. Sorry if that's what I did, and responded by "ridiculing" you.

I looked it up. In #147 you said:
I thought I`d get you up to speed."

And then in #152 you said:
So glad you have heard something like that before. If you want details from God`s word I can give it.

So it seemed a bit insulting that right after I told you I was aware of world history, you inform me that I need to "get up to speed" on current affairs, and can check in with you for the details?

That's why I said you shouldn't consider yourself an "oracle." If the shoe doesn't fit, and you didn't mean to be snarky, then don't wear it. I intend to get along with you the best I know how.

I like the subject matter, so anything you have to share on it, please feel free. I'm open to whatever the Lord brings my way!

 

[Marilyn C]

Maybe I misread your comments. Sorry if that's what I did, and responded by "ridiculing" you.

I looked it up. In #147 you said:
I thought I`d get you up to speed."

And then in #152 you said:
So glad you have heard something like that before. If you want details from God`s word I can give it.

So it seemed a bit insulting that right after I told you I was aware of world history, you inform me that I need to "get up to speed" on current affairs, and can check in with you for the details?

That's why I said you shouldn't consider yourself an "oracle." If the shoe doesn't fit, and you didn't mean to be snarky, then don't wear it. I intend to get along with you the best I know how.

I like the subject matter, so anything you have to share on it, please feel free. I'm open to whatever the Lord brings my way!

Hi Randy,

I see. I said that because you ridiculed me as to not knowing history, (which I do). Then I said I can give you details from God`s word, (as per teachers who have taught me), because you said you had looked into God`s word and not seen any. I thought I was being helpful. However I do see it could have come over as you said, like an oracle. Sorry for that.

So much gets misunderstood ay, Randy. So I appreciate your kindness asking me to share. Thank you.

And yes, I would like to get on better with you too bro.

As this thread is about the `Church` I think I should perhaps start another thread to do with the `details of the contemporary view of Dan. 7.`

regards, Marilyn.