Sunday Worship/Mark of the Beast

[woobadooba]

Enoch did not have a bible.... neither did Abraham, or Noah... so what did those folks who had a relationship with God rely on when there was no bible? They relied on God Himself...

Even the text you supplied it was NOT talking about the scripture that we now quote... at that time the NT was still being written....

Think about this text: And Enoch walked with God and was not for God took him.....

Clearly that relationship was so deep that Enoch was taken...

I am not suggesting that we don't need the bible, or that we do away with it, I am suggesting that God is more than willing and capable to commune with or without the bible...

The purpose of prayer is to commune with God. I see it functioning as you suggest the bible does... It is through communication with the Living God that we know what He wants for us here and now.... The bible reminds us that He is willing to interact with man.... prayer helps us to understand that He is willing to interact with us right now in our time....

I hear what you're saying but in all honesty, for the simple fact that we do have a Bible, which contains God's expressed will for humanity, we have more of an advantage then Enoch did!

The sad thing is that most of us, including myself, haven't learned how to walk with God through the Bible; and that is why we are often so confused about issues that were never intended to be confusing, and so discouraged about matters for which God has given us promises to resolve!

I am thankful God has given us His word!

 

[StormyOne]

Everytime God talks to you via prayer you are receiving His word....

 

[woobadooba]

Everytime God talks to you via prayer you are receiving His word....

Well, you must be exceptionally close to God then because I don't hear the voice of God like that, so I need to read His word to know what His will is for me.

 

[StormyOne]

Well, you must be exceptionally close to God then because I don't hear the voice of God like that, so I need to read His word to know what His will is for me.

Woobad... when you pray, and God communicates with you via prayer, you are hearing his words, and his will... afterall isn't the purpose of prayer? Or are you telling me you don't trust God to talk to you via prayer?

 

[woobadooba]

Woobad... when you pray, and God communicates with you via prayer, you are hearing his words, and his will... afterall isn't the purpose of prayer? Or are you telling me you don't trust God to talk to you via prayer?

What I'm telling you is that God doesn't communicate with me like that. It isn't that I don't trust God. It's that I hear His voice in His word, not in my ears.

 

[HoneyDew]

What I'm telling you is that God doesn't communicate with me like that. It isn't that I don't trust God. It's that I hear His voice in His word, not in my ears.

What about "being impressed," Woobadooba? Ever had that feeling?

 

[Sophia7]

Enoch did not have a bible.... neither did Abraham, or Noah... so what did those folks who had a relationship with God rely on when there was no bible? They relied on God Himself...

Even the text you supplied it was NOT talking about the scripture that we now quote... at that time the NT was still being written....

Think about this text: And Enoch walked with God and was not for God took him.....

Clearly that relationship was so deep that Enoch was taken...

I am not suggesting that we don't need the bible, or that we do away with it, I am suggesting that God is more than willing and capable to commune with or without the bible...

The purpose of prayer is to commune with God. I see it functioning as you suggest the bible does... It is through communication with the Living God that we know what He wants for us here and now.... The bible reminds us that He is willing to interact with man.... prayer helps us to understand that He is willing to interact with us right now in our time....

It's true that Enoch did not have a Bible and that God communicates with us in other ways as well. However, people in Old Testament times did have Scripture even though it was not always written and even though most of them probably couldn't read and write anyway. God didn't always communicate directly with everyone, such as He did with Abraham and Enoch and Moses. He also told them to pass His teachings on from generation to generation. The law was spelled out repeatedly, orally, in addition to the written tables of stone given to Moses. Deuteronomy 6:4-9 says:

DT 6:4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one. 5 Love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength. 6 These commandments that I give you today are to be upon your hearts. 7 Impress them on your children. Talk about them when you sit at home and when you walk along the road, when you lie down and when you get up. 8 Tie them as symbols on your hands and bind them on your foreheads. 9 Write them on the doorframes of your houses and on your gates.

People in the New Testament actually had written Scriptures even though the Bible as we know it was obviously still being written. Still, though, most of the common people wouldn't have been able to read them or have access to them.

In some ways we do have an advantage in that we have a written Bible to reference, but the very fact that we need things spelled out so much is evidence that God isn't able to speak as directly to us anymore as He was to the patriarchs. I heard God speak to me directly once in my life, but that was a different thing than I experience when I pray regularly. Other times I have felt more impressions and thoughts in my own mind than audible words or visions, such as I have always assumed God used with the patriarchs and prophets.

I believe that we should not focus exclusively on prayer or on Bible study as the only way of getting revelation from God. Certainly, I do not see prayer functioning exactly the same way the Bible does. The Bible does more than just remind us that God interacts with man. It gives specific counsel and directives that we need to apply to our lives. We should not discount its practical relevance in our lives or its prophetic guidance but instead take advantage of it as a means God uses to speak to us today, when we can't always hear God's voice as clearly as could our ancestors in the faith.

 

[woobadooba]

What about "being impressed," Woobadooba? Ever had that feeling?

Yes. In fact, God spoke to me audibly on two occassions in my life. Those were incredible experiences!

But like I said, I hear God's voice in His word. God has given me the gift of interpretation, and so I often see things that many people don't see when studying God's word, and glean insights into the scriptures that many people overlook.

That's what I mean by God speaking to me in His word.

 

[HoneyDew]

The "still small voice" that some refer to, or our conscience ... do you believe that is God talking to us?
I don't believe that it is a supernatural occurance when God speaks to us.

 

[woobadooba]

The "still small voice" that some refer to, or our conscience ... do you believe that is God talking to us?
I don't believe that it is a supernatural occurance when God speaks to us.

I believe that God can speak to us in that way, but so can satan! That's why I take everything to the scriptures, to see that it is according to God's will.

 

[Cliff2]

I believe that God can speak to us in that way, but so can satan! That's why I take everything to the scriptures, to see that it is according to God's will.

That is what we should always do. Is. 8:20.

We cannot believe this person or that person as the standard. It is God's Word and God's Word alone that is the final position.

 

[StormyOne]

I believe that God can speak to us in that way, but so can satan! That's why I take everything to the scriptures, to see that it is according to God's will.

I submit that once you are use to hearing "His" voice you will not mistake it for any other.... Jesus said, my sheep hear my voice..... anyway... I get your point, though you haven't gotten mine.....

 

[payattention]

That is what we should always do. Is. 8:20.

We cannot believe this person or that person as the standard. It is God's Word and God's Word alone that is the final position.

God is the standard. The Bible is a human record of His interaction with men seen through human eyes under varying circumstances. You cannot restrict the word of an infinite God to finite book. If your God is restricted to this book that men compiled then He is too small.

 

[payattention]

The "still small voice" that some refer to, or our conscience ... do you believe that is God talking to us?
I don't believe that it is a supernatural occurance when God speaks to us.

In most cases "the voice of God" is just commonsense. He created our minds in the image of His mind. Only on rare occassions has God given men specific messages. In most cases they are expected to figure out what to do and if they consider who God is they can determine what decisions they should make. It is important to bear in mind the example of the first man who got directions from God. God did not tell Adam how to take care of the garden. He told him, "I have given you a working brain. Use it to decide how this garden should look." If you know God you will know His will. When people tell me they heard God's voice I am tempted to ask them how they were able to identify it as the voice of God. It is a claim that sounds great but there is nothing to support it. If God came to you today you would know it was Him. No human alive has incontrovertible evidence that she has heard the voice of God. That they may have heard a voice is a given. Whose voice it was we do not know. This is why we are admonished to test every spirit. Use your commonsense.

 

[payattention]

The sad thing is that most of us, including myself, haven't learned how to walk with God through the Bible; and that is why we are often so confused about issues that were never intended to be confusing, and so discouraged about matters for which God has given us promises to resolve!

I am thankful God has given us His word!

If we would take the time to observe carefully we would realise that while the Bible contains the direct word of God it is not "The Word of God." The Word of God is the full complement of the mind of God and nowhere is it most evident than in the things He made.

 

[Cliff2]

God is the standard. The Bible is a human record of His interaction with men seen through human eyes under varying circumstances. You cannot restrict the word of an infinite God to finite book. If your God is restricted to this book that men compiled then He is too small.

That is why God gave to His modern day Church the Spirit of Prophecy.

Look in there, you may find something that will help you.

 

[woobadooba]

I submit that once you are use to hearing "His" voice you will not mistake it for any other.... Jesus said, my sheep hear my voice..... anyway... I get your point, though you haven't gotten mine.....

Careful stormy! I got your point. God has His way of communicating with you, and He has His way of communicating with me.

I hear His voice in His word and you hear it in your head. It doesn't make either one of us less spiritual than the other, or less in tune to God's will than the other.

We can't make the manner in which God communicates with any one person the standard by which He must communicate with all men. We should not put limitations on God's ability to access the hearts of His people.

 

[payattention]

Why don't you look at what the Bible says.

I will say it again for your sake.



What do you make of this text?

I will tell you what I see in it.

We are to rest on the 7th day, we are to keep it holy, it was santified and that what holy means to be santified.

If God rested then why should His creation?

Not even Adam is asked to rest. The text says God rested from His work which He had made. He was done creating. Did you expect Moses to say that after He was finished creating He continued creating? He stopped. That is all the text says. Claiming what you will not convince anyone that you have the ability to rightly divide the word of truth. It only proves that you know what you have been taught. Nothing in that text says that we should rest on it and keep it holy.

While you are at it, do you believe that the other six days of the creation week were not holy?

 

[tall73]

Not even Adam is asked to rest. The text says God rested from His work which He had made. He was done creating. Did you expect Moses to say that after He was finished creating He continued creating? He stopped. That is all the text says. Claiming what you will not convince anyone that you have the ability to rightly divide the word of truth. It only proves that you know what you have been taught. Nothing in that text says that we should rest on it and keep it holy.

While you are at it, do you believe that the other six days of the creation week were not holy?

Why stress over it? you have already said you don't believe what the text plainly says ever actually happened in the garden. You believe Moses glossed the whole blessed and made it holy part into the text from earlier experience.

If that is your statement, we clearly will not at all agree with anything you comment on about this text.

 

[payattention]

Why stress over it? you have already said you don't believe what the text plainly says ever actually happened in the garden. You believe Moses glossed the whole blessed and made it holy part into the text from earlier experience.

If that is your statement, we clearly will not at all agree with anything you comment on about this text.

Why should that prevent you from addressing the implications of what you wish the text to say? We both know that the Sabbath is not in Genesis so there really is not debate. What I don't understand is why some think that the Sabbath is of no value unless it can be found in Genesis. The fact is that it means more to the Christian if it is not in Genesis because the connection to the Exodus as a type of the Plan of Salvation links it to our salvation experience.

This is the second time you have made this claim about Moses but I know I never made it. That is enough. It may be best to stick to what I say rather than what you imagine I should have said. Pay attention to my chosen name.