Sin is...

[JIMINZ]

I'm not saying I'll never ever sin again or haven't sinned before cause all have sinned. But yes baptism washes away those sins you were born with and added early in life while the Holy Ghost gives you the ability to resist sin and repentance a changed heart aka mind about it. So yes since I'm born again I no longer have sin sitting on the inside at least if that's your question... but I still have this flesh I must resist everyday which is why I say it's still possible to yeah sin. Could say a white lie or something

Can you provide a verse which says you can sin again?

I have already provided 3 verses why we cannot.

 

[Hammster]

.

The only problem is you have totally misinterpreted what Rom.7 said.

You have total misunderstood what Paul was Teaching, and the reconciliation of his own comments.

Okay.

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

Can you provide a verse which says you can sin again?

1 John 2:1King James Version (KJV)
2 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: Comment: it's possible if you slack or start backsliding is what I'm saying. But if not you can easily not sin again espsicully if you get past the initial stage of dealing with your past life. You should eventually reach a spiritual stage where you have the ability to not sin. 1 John 3:9 9Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God

 

[Hammster]

If you think you are saved while in sin you've been sold the goods not me. What is salvation useful for if it can't save you? Yet people like you still buy into such an ideology. Also again I showed you scripture 2 peter 1:5-9 or so indicating that we can be good through the Spirit above where good gifts come from ... paul is just saying him alone following the law couldn't be good... he's not referring to himself after Holy Spirit reception.

Okay.

 

[JIMINZ]

1 John 2:1King James Version (KJV)
2 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: Comment: it's possible if you slack or start backsliding is what I'm saying. But if not you can easily not sin again espsicully if you get past the initial stage of dealing with your past life. You should eventually reach a spiritual stage where you have the ability to not sin. 1 John 3:9 9Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God

If that is what you pin your belief in, then what happens when Jon reaches 1 John 3
1Jn. 3:4
Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Are you saying John is now contradicting himself?

1Jn. 3:6
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

Is it your Belief you can walk in and out of Christ?

1Jn. 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

If you commit sin you are of the Devil, it doesn't differentiate between Christian and Non Christian, you cannot be of God and the Devil at the same time, any more than you can walk in an out of sin and Christ at your leisure.

1Jn 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

If you have the Holy Spirit, (The Seed of God) you cannot sin, did you get that?

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

If that is what you pin your belief in, that what happens when Jon reaches 1 John 3
1Jn. 3:4
Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Are you saying John is now contradicting himself?

1Jn. 3:6
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

Is it your Belief you can walk in and out of Christ?

1Jn. 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

If you commit sin you are of the Devil, it doesn't differentiate between Christian and Non Christian, you cannot be of God and the Devil at the same time, any more than you can walk in an out of sin and Christ at your leisure.

1Jn 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

If you have the Holy Spirit, (The Seed of God) you cannot sin, did you get that?

No what I'm saying is what you should learn... you don't just reach walking in Spirit and truth right away when you're saved... there's a sanctification process and learning process early on which is why 1 john 2:1 is there. Some will reach the sin not category and enter 1 john 3 territory earlier then others while others will sin and have an advocate with the father at first.

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

If that is what you pin your belief in, then what happens when Jon reaches 1 John 3
1Jn. 3:4
Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Are you saying John is now contradicting himself?

1Jn. 3:6
Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.

Is it your Belief you can walk in and out of Christ?

1Jn. 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

If you commit sin you are of the Devil, it doesn't differentiate between Christian and Non Christian, you cannot be of God and the Devil at the same time, any more than you can walk in an out of sin and Christ at your leisure.

1Jn 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

If you have the Holy Spirit, (The Seed of God) you cannot sin, did you get that?

Look at 1 john 1:9 or so it's about entering salvation in the first place.. then 1 john 2:1 the middle stage of new born babe stage where you may sin still or hang out to certain things and still learning the word as a newly saved ain't then.. 1 john 3 walking in Spirit and truth

 

[JIMINZ]

No what I'm saying is what you should learn... you don't just reach walking in Spirit and truth right away when you're saved... there's a sanctification process and learning process early on which is why 1 john 2:1 is there. Some will reach the sin not category and enter 1 john 3 territory earlier then others while others will sin and have an advocate with the father at first.

I'm still waiting on those verses which say you can sin.

Now How do you acquire the Holy Spirit?

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

I'm still waiting on those verses which say you can sin.

Now How do you acquire the Holy Spirit?

I guess you can't read 1 john 2:1 or something it says if you sin which implies you may sin if you're a newly saved saint who doesn't know the word yet to walk in spirit and truth... it's crazy to say everyone who just gets saved grew up in church and knows the word. A lot have a rocky start.

 

[JIMINZ]

G.O.A.T.

Do you believe we as Christians are dead to the Law?
WHY?

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

G.O.A.T.

Do you believe we as Christians are dead to the Law?
WHY?

Because we are under a new convent and have a new way to be saved that is more effective. Repentance, baptism, Holy Spirit reception. Also Paul knew the law better then anyone and failed to achieve holiness through it he even admitted this in romans 7 for example

 

[JIMINZ]

I guess you can't read 1 john 2:1 or something it says if you sin which implies you may sin if you're a newly saved saint who doesn't know the word yet to walk in spirit and truth... it's crazy to say everyone who just gets saved grew up in church and knows the word. A lot have a rocky start.

You said we can sin after we are Saved, (Christian) I asked you for a verse which says that, you have provided a verse which YOU believe IMPLIES we can sin. nothing in the Bible should be understood and believe in if they are Assumptions, suppositions, Implications, or Alluded to.

The Word of God is Truth, if you belief is based in any of these things which I just listed , then your Faith (belief) does not have a foundation of Truth but of Assumption.

Do you assume Jesus died for your sins?

Then don't assume anything else, prove it, don't leave room for doubt, have a Scripture to back up your Beliefs.

 

[JIMINZ]

Because we are under a new convent and have a new way to be saved that is more effective. Repentance, baptism, Holy Spirit reception. Also Paul knew the law better then anyone and failed to achieve holiness through it he even admitted this in romans 7 for example

You have as bad an Interpretation of that Chapter as Hammster does.

What Paul said in Rom. 7 is not that he sinned.

Tell me specifically why we are dead to the Law?
Give me a verse.

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

You said we can sin after we are Saved, (Christian) I asked you for a verse which says that, you have provided a verse which YOU believe IMPLIES we can sin. nothing in the Bible should be understood and believe in if they are Assumptions, suppositions, Implications, or Alluded to.

The Word of God is Truth, if you belief is based in any of these things which I just listed , then your Faith (belief) does not have a foundation of Truth but of Assumption.

Do you assume Jesus died for your sins?

The don't assume anything else, prove it, don't leave room for doubt, have a Scripture to back up your Beliefs.

. The Bible has assumptions in it though... such as the fact that eve and Adam had other children besides Cain and Abel. Look bud if no one would sin after being saved there wouldn't be backsliders and 1 john 2:1 wouldn't say if anybody sins you have an advocate with the father. Implied in regards to the Bible means you can assume... because it's correct based off other scripture some of which I will show you in a sec Also there's also these scriptures
1 Timothy 4:1

“Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;”
Matthew 7:21-23King James Version (KJV)
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord,have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Comment: the only way you can cast out demons and perform miracles is by the Holy Spirit. Even saved folk can slack or miss in a certain area and miss out

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

You have as bad an Interpretation of that Chapter as Hammster does.

What Paul said in Rom. 7 is not that he sinned.

Tell me specifically why we are dead to the Law?
Give me a verse.

You're the guy here suggesting we are perfect 24/7 based off scripture and you're saying our interpretations are off? I would take hamsters view over your delusional one. I mean you're suggesting you can get saved and walk in spirit and truth right away even if you never went to church or got into the word much before that day...

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

You have as bad an Interpretation of that Chapter as Hammster does.

What Paul said in Rom. 7 is not that he sinned.

Tell me specifically why we are dead to the Law?
Give me a verse.

Ask are you saying Paul never sinnedv?

 

[JIMINZ]

You're the guy here suggesting we are perfect 24/7 based off scripture and you're saying our interpretations are off? I would take hamsters view over your delusional one. I mean you're suggesting you can get saved and walk in spirit and truth right away even if you never went to church or got into the word much before that day...

Let me ask again
1) Tell me specifically why we are dead to the Law?
2) How do we acquire the Holy Spirit?

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

Let me ask again
1) Tell me specifically why we are dead to the Law?
2) How do we acquire the Holy Spirit?

I answered question 1 already not going to do it again. For question 2 you receive the Holy Spirit by seeking it in order to receive the Holy Spirit you must first repent and believe though. If you don't acknowledge you need to be saved and don't want to be saved from sin then God will not force the Spirit on you. And if you don't believe the Bible says you have an evil heart an that tends to kill the vibe if you will. Jesus even said they received not the Holy Spirit because they didn't believe in scripture

 

[JIMINZ]

I answered question 1 already not going to do it again. For question 2 you receive the Holy Spirit by seeking it in order to receive the Holy Spirit you must first repent and believe though. If you don't acknowledge you need to be saved and don't want to be saved from sin then God will not force the Spirit on you. And if you don't believe the Bible says you have an evil heart an that tends to kill the vibe if you will. Jesus even said they received not the Holy Spirit because they didn't believe in scripture

I'm sorry G.O.A.T.
I seem to have agitated you, please forgive me, it was not my intention.
.
While it is true, the Christian is still in the BODY, but the body is not "The Flesh" it is not the body which sins it is the Flesh, the inner man...Therefore.

Rom. 8:3
For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, (CONDEMNED SIN IN THE FLESH):

Gal. 2:20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and (THE LIFE WHICH I NOW LIVE IN THE FLESH I LIVE BY THE FAITH OF THE SON OF GOD), who loved me, and gave himself for me.

Rom. 6:10,11
10) (FOR IN THAT HE DIED, HE DIED UNTO SIN ONCE): but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11) (LIKEWISE RECKON YE YOURSELVES DEAD INDEED UNTO SIN), but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Rom. 7:4
Wherefore, my brethren,
(YE ALSO ARE BECOME DEAD TO THE LAW BY THE BODY OF CHRIST); that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

Rom. 6:2
God forbid. (HOW SHALL WE THAT ARE DEAD TO SIN LIVE ANY LONGER THEREIN)?

Rom. 8:10
And if Christ be in you,
(THE BODY IS DEAD BECAUSE OF SIN);
but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

Gal. 5:24
And they that are Christ's have (CRUCIFIED THE FLESH) with the affections and lusts.

So you see, the Christian is.
1) Dead to the Law
2) Dead to Sin
3) Dead to the Flesh

It's always a good thing to know exactly where you stand "IN CHRIST" that way you cannot be deceived.

.

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

I'm sorry G.O.A.T.
I seem to have agitated you, please forgive me, it was not my intention.
.
While it is true, the Christian is still in the BODY, but the body is not "The Flesh" it is not the body which sins it is the Flesh, the inner man...Therefore.

Rom. 8:3
For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, (CONDEMNED SIN IN THE FLESH):

Gal. 2:20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and (THE LIFE WHICH I NOW LIVE IN THE FLESH I LIVE BY THE FAITH OF THE SON OF GOD), who loved me, and gave himself for me.

Rom. 6:10,11
10) (FOR IN THAT HE DIED, HE DIED UNTO SIN ONCE): but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11) (LIKEWISE RECKON YE YOURSELVES DEAD INDEED UNTO SIN), but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Rom. 7:4
Wherefore, my brethren,
(YE ALSO ARE BECOME DEAD TO THE LAW BY THE BODY OF CHRIST); that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

Rom. 6:2
God forbid. (HOW SHALL WE THAT ARE DEAD TO SIN LIVE ANY LONGER THEREIN)?

Rom. 8:10
And if Christ be in you,
(THE BODY IS DEAD BECAUSE OF SIN);
but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

Gal. 5:24
And they that are Christ's have (CRUCIFIED THE FLESH) with the affections and lusts.

So you see, the Christian is.
1) Dead to the Law
2) Dead to Sin
3) Dead to the Flesh

It's always a good thing to know exactly where you stand "IN CHRIST" that way you cannot be deceived.

.

What makes you think I'm agitated by you? You've done nothing wrong you haven't cussed at me or anything.


I mean if you feel you're offending me you're not... so don't worry about it.



Also you seem to not get my posistion.


I never said i'm against the ideoligy of being dead to sin I clearly said I support that a christian can reach that stage..I just disagree that everyone can reach that 1 john 3 stage right away partly based off my own experience. Some have to sit in the 1 john 2:1 for a bit espeicully those who don't know the word or never grew up in church. What you need to understand is it's not possible to walk in Spirit and Truth if you don't yet know the Truth... that's what i'm trying to get you to understand...it's good to have bible knowledge but it's also key to have common sense and some wisdom.


I agree a Christian is

1. dead to the law (this actually applies to anyone... in the sense that no one has to live by the Torah anymore)


2. dead in flesh (at least in the sense that a christian can... "put ye on the Lord JESUS Christ and make no provision to fulfill the lust thereof, or "walk in the Spirit and you'll not fulfill the lust of the flesh". But to say the flesh isn't present and warring trying to overcome an individual would be false.

3. Dead to sin and able not to walk therein (I agree a christian can not sin if he chooses to and grows into 1 john 3 status...but I believe a christian can backslide and depart the faith..or at least get weak spiritually to where they end up needing to have an advocate with the Father.)



What you don't seem to understand is at least when it comes to the framework or concept we agree....we just disagree in regards to how much does free will play a factor here. The bible says for example no one can pluck you from his grasp...but you can choose to walk out of that grasp though. The bible says that whoever is born of God doesn't commit sin for his seed is in him and he cannot sin. But so/so person chooses to slack when it comes to reading the word and not pray enough, or fast enough, or seek God enough then they can regress and possible end up walking in the flesh again.


The problem is you seem to believe in OSAS...while I don't I could be wrong but that's my conclusion as of now. I believe the bible when it says "they that endure unto the end shall be saved." But I also believe it when it says some will depart the faith. I believe it's possible to stay saved after being saved, and possible to not sin...but I also believe it's possible to backslide (i've seen it myself as well) and possible to sin after being saved...because if it's possible to backslide (which requires a load of sin and regress) then it's possible to commit a sin here or there as well if you slack somewhat.


In other words you can go from 1 john 3: to simply 1 john 2:1 status rather then full on back down to 1 john 1:9 where you have to be saved completely again and repent again and filled again. If you slack or have a hole somewhere you can address it...but if you don't... you depart...you backslide... and you gotta start again with 1 john 1:9.

 

[JESUS=G.O.A.T]

I'm sorry G.O.A.T.
I seem to have agitated you, please forgive me, it was not my intention.
.
While it is true, the Christian is still in the BODY, but the body is not "The Flesh" it is not the body which sins it is the Flesh, the inner man...Therefore.

Rom. 8:3
For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, (CONDEMNED SIN IN THE FLESH):

Gal. 2:20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and (THE LIFE WHICH I NOW LIVE IN THE FLESH I LIVE BY THE FAITH OF THE SON OF GOD), who loved me, and gave himself for me.

Rom. 6:10,11
10) (FOR IN THAT HE DIED, HE DIED UNTO SIN ONCE): but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11) (LIKEWISE RECKON YE YOURSELVES DEAD INDEED UNTO SIN), but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Rom. 7:4
Wherefore, my brethren,
(YE ALSO ARE BECOME DEAD TO THE LAW BY THE BODY OF CHRIST); that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

Rom. 6:2
God forbid. (HOW SHALL WE THAT ARE DEAD TO SIN LIVE ANY LONGER THEREIN)?

Rom. 8:10
And if Christ be in you,
(THE BODY IS DEAD BECAUSE OF SIN);
but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

Gal. 5:24
And they that are Christ's have (CRUCIFIED THE FLESH) with the affections and lusts.

So you see, the Christian is.
1) Dead to the Law
2) Dead to Sin
3) Dead to the Flesh

It's always a good thing to know exactly where you stand "IN CHRIST" that way you cannot be deceived.

.

I guess i was a little agitated I guess about you asking me to say how I felt about the law...I kind of wanted to hear your take on it already and I just did with this response.