Seemingly Anti-OSAS Scriptures

[JLB777]

I said:
"What you've failed to do is prove that Jesus didn't teach eternal security in John 5:24 and 10:28.

Any reasonable person easily sees the truth of eternal security from those 2 verses.

Then there's Eph 1:13,14 and 1 Pet 1:23 that you can't explain.

So you just "explain away", huh."

More lies from you. First, I gave no opinion. I gave facts that you cannot refute.

Second, there were no insults in my post. Facts are NOT insults.


And again, more lies.

But then, it's clear that you don't consider John 5:24, John 10:28, Eph 1:13,14 and 1 Pet 1:23 to be Scripture.

And that is just very sad. Because they are all Scripture. And you have rejected them.

No scripture here.

Just references tagged to your opinion.


Is hearing His voice and following Him in obedience required for eternal life?


Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 2 John 9



JLB

 

[FreeGrace2]

What if your soul is no longer with Jesus?

That would never happen. In fact, because I have been sealed with the Holy Spirit, as a guarantee of my inheritance until the day of redemption as God's possession, my soul can NEVER be without Jesus.

And Jesus said that those who believe possess eternal life in John 5:24, 6:47 and John said the same thing in 1 John 5:13.

Then Jesus said that recipients of eternal life shall never, no, not ever, perish.

And then Peter said believers have been born again, of imperishable seed.

So, between Jesus, Paul, John and Peter, I'm good.

Is it still being kept safe?

My soul has ALWAYS been kept safe. No doubts about it.

By whom?

By Jesus Himself.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I believe every word in the Bible.

And I don't believe this. From your posts, it's clear that you believe that recipients of eternal life CAN perish.

YOU love lexicons,,,go check out what believe means.

I did, and I shared it with you. Apparently you aren't interested in them. But I am.

I even look up English words that I don't know the meaning of.

It's nothing to be ashamed of. I'm always looking to improve my knowledge. I recommend it to others who are interested in truth.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I said:
"What you've failed to do is prove that Jesus didn't teach eternal security in
John 5:24 and 10:28.

Any reasonable person easily sees the truth of eternal security from those 2 verses.

Then there's Eph 1:13,14 and 1 Pet 1:23 that you can't explain.

So you just "explain away", huh."

More lies from you. First, I gave no opinion. I gave facts that you cannot refute.

Second, there were no insults in my post. Facts are NOT insults.

And again, more lies.

But then, it's clear that you don't consider John 5:24, John 10:28, Eph 1:13,14 and 1 Pet 1:23 to be Scripture.

And that is just very sad. Because they are all Scripture. And you have rejected them.

No scripture here.

That is the most idiotic thing one could say about my post.

But then, it figures, only because you have rejected these 5 verses, since all of them refute your opinions.

Just references tagged to your opinion.

No opinions, just truth. Truth that you persistently reject.

Is hearing His voice and following Him in obedience required for eternal life?

Believing in Him is required for eternal life.

Here is the proof of that, from Scripture.

Salvation:

Mark 16:16 " He who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned.

Luke 8:12 "Those beside the road are those who have heard; then the devil comes and takes away the word from their heart, so that they will not believe and be saved.

Acts 4:12 "And there is salvation in no one else; for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must be saved."

Acts 11:14 and he will speak words to you by which you will be saved, you and all your household.'

Acts 16:31They said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household."

Rom 10:9, 10 9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.

Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek.

1 Cor 1:21 - For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe.

Eph 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;

2 Tim 3:15 and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

1 Peter 1:5 who are protected by the power of God through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

1 Peter 1:9 obtaining as the outcome of your faith the salvation of your souls.

2 Thess 2:13 But we should always give thanks to God for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God has chosen you from the beginning for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and faith in the truth.

Eternal Life:

John 3:15-16 15 so that whoever believes will in Him have eternal life. 16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

John 3:36 "He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."

John 5:24 "Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

John 6:40 "For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day."

John 6:47 "Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes has eternal life.

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord

1 Tim 1:16 Yet for this reason I found mercy, so that in me as the foremost, Jesus Christ might demonstrate His perfect patience as an example for those who would believe in Him for eternal life.

Gal 3:22 But the Scripture has shut up everyone under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe.

1 John 5:13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life.

Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 2 John 9

OK, now to explain what this verse means. Which you never do.

"Anyone who runs ahead and does not continue in the teaching of Christ does not have God; whoever continues in the teaching has both the Father and the Son." NIV

If the church John was addressing was not vigilant as he had just warned them to be, or if one or more of its members gave in to false theology, John states that such a person transgresses (parabaino - to go aside) and does not abide (meno - to stay) in the doctrine of Christ. He turns aside from the truth instead of remaining in it.

By golly, this verse describes you and your ilk to a T.

You have gotten yourselv entangled in false theology (loss of salvation) and as such, you are no longer abiding in the docrtrine of Christ. Which is that those who believe possess eternal life, and that those He gives eternal life (believers) shall never perish.

You and your ilk have turned aside from truth instead of remaining in it.

Impressive. This isn't the first time you have presented a verse that directly applies to yourself. Really amazing.

 

[JLB777]

Wrong. Obedience functions to produce swhat God intends. Don't you understand Rom 16:26? but now revealed and made known through the prophetic writings by the command of the eternal God, so that all the Gentiles might come to the obedience that comes from faith—

Since obedience comes from faith, they can't be synonymous.

Couldn’t be further from the truth.


Faith comes to us from hearing God.

We must obey what He says in order for the faith we received from Him to function and produce the intended divine result.


Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? James 2:21

Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made perfect? James 2:22


Faith is incomplete without our obedience to the word of faith.


If Abraham does not obey God to call free his son Isaac on the altar, then Abraham will not be justified.


Faith without the action of obedience is incomplete and does not function, like a body without a spirit is incomplete and does not function.


For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also. James 2:26




JLB

 

[JLB777]

I said:
"What you've failed to do is prove that Jesus didn't teach eternal security in
John 5:24 and 10:28.

Any reasonable person easily sees the truth of eternal security from those 2 verses.

Then there's Eph 1:13,14 and 1 Pet 1:23 that you can't explain.

So you just "explain away", huh."

More lies from you. First, I gave no opinion. I gave facts that you cannot refute.

Second, there were no insults in my post. Facts are NOT insults.

And again, more lies.

But then, it's clear that you don't consider John 5:24, John 10:28, Eph 1:13,14 and 1 Pet 1:23 to be Scripture.

And that is just very sad. Because they are all Scripture. And you have rejected them.


That is the most idiotic thing one could say about my post.

But then, it figures, only because you have rejected these 5 verses, since all of them refute your opinions.


No opinions, just truth. Truth that you persistently reject.


Believing in Him is required for eternal life.

Here is the proof of that, from Scripture.

Salvation:

Mark 16:16 " He who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned.

Luke 8:12 "Those beside the road are those who have heard; then the devil comes and takes away the word from their heart, so that they will not believe and be saved.

Acts 4:12 "And there is salvation in no one else; for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must be saved."

Acts 11:14 and he will speak words to you by which you will be saved, you and all your household.'

Acts 16:31They said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household."

Rom 10:9, 10 9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.

Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek.

1 Cor 1:21 - For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe.

Eph 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;

2 Tim 3:15 and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

1 Peter 1:5 who are protected by the power of God through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

1 Peter 1:9 obtaining as the outcome of your faith the salvation of your souls.

2 Thess 2:13 But we should always give thanks to God for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God has chosen you from the beginning for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and faith in the truth.

Eternal Life:

John 3:15-16 15 so that whoever believes will in Him have eternal life. 16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

John 3:36 "He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."

John 5:24 "Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life.

John 6:40 "For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day."

John 6:47 "Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes has eternal life.

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord

1 Tim 1:16 Yet for this reason I found mercy, so that in me as the foremost, Jesus Christ might demonstrate His perfect patience as an example for those who would believe in Him for eternal life.

Gal 3:22 But the Scripture has shut up everyone under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe.

1 John 5:13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, so that you may know that you have eternal life.


OK, now to explain what this verse means. Which you never do.

"Anyone who runs ahead and does not continue in the teaching of Christ does not have God; whoever continues in the teaching has both the Father and the Son." NIV

If the church John was addressing was not vigilant as he had just warned them to be, or if one or more of its members gave in to false theology, John states that such a person transgresses (parabaino - to go aside) and does not abide (meno - to stay) in the doctrine of Christ. He turns aside from the truth instead of remaining in it.

By golly, this verse describes you and your ilk to a T.

You have gotten yourselv entangled in false theology (loss of salvation) and as such, you are no longer abiding in the docrtrine of Christ. Which is that those who believe possess eternal life, and that those He gives eternal life (believers) shall never perish.

You and your ilk have turned aside from truth instead of remaining in it.

Impressive. This isn't the first time you have presented a verse that directly applies to yourself. Really amazing.

What does John 10:28 say?

 

[Danthemailman]

You've explain nothing.

You have tried to explain away the truth. That's all.

For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. Romans 10:10

Tell me then, what does it say -

Believe unto salvation or with the mouth confession is made unto salvation?

For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also. James 2:26

JLB

I have thoroughly explained the truth to you numerous times, but unfortunately, you just don’t have eyes to see or ears to hear and there is a reason for that.

 

[Danthemailman]

Wrong. Obedience functions to produce what God intends. Don't you understand Rom 16:26? but now revealed and made known through the prophetic writings by the command of the eternal God, so that all the Gentiles might come to the obedience that comes from faith—

Since obedience comes from faith, they can't be synonymous.

JLB777 doesn't understand because he basically defines faith "as" obedience/works, as do all works-salvationists. Been there, done that, prior to my conversion.

 

[Danthemailman]

How about answering a simple question that comes Romans 10:10

For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. Romans 10:10

Tell me then, what does it say -

Believe unto salvation or with the mouth confession is made unto salvation?

For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also. James 2:26

JLB

I ALREAD explained this to you NUMEROUS times. For the thousandth time: You continue to misinterpret Romans 10:9,10 in such a way that means we can believe unto righteousness today, (but are still lost) until we confess Christ later, like tomorrow or next week and then we will finally be saved tomorrow or next week (after the verbal confession), but that is not what Paul is talking about here. Also, someone who is moot (unable to speak) would remain lost according to your erroneous interpretation of Romans 10:9,10 for failing to verbally confess with their mouth.

Confessing with our mouth that Jesus is Lord and believing in our heart that God raised Him from the dead are not two separate steps to salvation but are chronologically together. Romans 10:8 - But what does it say? "THE WORD IS NEAR YOU, in your mouth and in your heart" (TOGETHER) that is, the word of faith which we are preaching, (notice the reverse order from verse 9-10) - that if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10 for with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. Confess/believe; believe/confess.

1 Corinthians 12:3 - Therefore I make known to you that no one speaking by the Spirit of God calls Jesus accursed, and no one can say that Jesus is Lord except BY the Holy Spirit. There is divine influence or direct operation of the Holy Spirit in the heart of a person when confessing Jesus as Lord. This confession is not just a simple acknowledgment that Jesus is the Lord (even the demons believe that), but is a deep personal conviction, without reservation, that Jesus is that person's Lord and Savior. So simply believing in our head (and not in our heart) that God raised Him from the dead does not result in righteousness and simply giving a "lip service" recital of the words "Jesus is Lord" not by the Holy Spirit is not unto salvation.

Confession is an expression of faith, yet you turn it into a work for salvation. Does "believes unto righteousness" = not unto salvation? NO. Romans 4:5 - But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies his faith is accounted for righteousness. (Does "his faith is accounted for righteousness" equate to still lost?) NO. 6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works. Believes unto righteousness = saved.
*Once again, not two separate steps to salvation, but chronologically together.

In James 2:26, the comparison of the human spirit and faith converges around their modes of operation. The spirit (Greek pneuma) may also be translated "breath." As a breathless body emits no indication of life, so fruitless faith exhibits no indication of life. The source of the life in faith is not works; rather, life in faith is the source of works (Ephesians 2:5-10).

 

[JLB777]

JLB777 doesn't understand because he basically defines faith "as" obedience/works, as do all works-salvationists. Been there, done that, prior to my conversion.

So you teach people to disobey God and I teach people The obedience of faith.


Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 2 John 9


You teach people not to abide in Christ and I teach them how to remain in Him.


Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.
1 John 3:24


His commandments are about loving God by loving His people.


He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 1 John 2:4-5


Those who do not obey God hate both Him and His people.


You are teaching a doctrine of demons.


JLB

 

[JLB777]

I ALREAD explained this to you NUMEROUS times. For the thousandth time: You continue to misinterpret Romans 10:9,10 in such a way that means we can believe unto righteousness today, (but are still lost) until we confess Christ later, like tomorrow or next week and then we will finally be saved tomorrow or next week (after the verbal confession), but that is not what Paul is talking about here. Also, someone who is moot (unable to speak) would remain lost according to your erroneous interpretation of Romans 10:9,10 for failing to verbally confess with their mouth.

Those who do not obey the Gospel are condemned.

in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. These shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, when He comes, in that Day, to be glorified in His saints and to be admired among all those who believe, because our testimony among you was believed. 2 Thessalonians 1:8-9


JLB

 

[Danthemailman]

So you teach people to disobey God and I teach people The obedience of faith.

When all else fails, pull out the straw man argument. Seeking salvation by works is not the obedience of faith.

Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 2 John 9

Descriptive of unbelievers.

He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son. 2 John 9

Descriptive of believers.

You teach people not to abide in Christ and I teach them how to remain in Him.

Another straw man argument. Where have I taught people to not abide (stay, remain) in Christ? You teach salvation by works, which is not teaching people how to remain in Him.

Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us. 1 John 3:24

He who "keeps" (Greek word "tereo" - guard, observe, watch over) His commandments is descriptive of those who abide in Him. 1 John 2:3 - By this we know that we have come to know Him, (demonstrative evidence) if we keep (guard, observe, watch over) His commandments.

His commandments are about loving God by loving His people.

1 John 4:7 - Beloved, let us love one another, for love is from God; and everyone who loves is born of God and knows God.

1 John 2:4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

Descriptive of unbelievers. Perverting the gospel by teaching salvation by works is not how we keep His commandments or abide in Christ.

5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him.

This is the demonstrative evidence that we know we are in Him.

 

[Danthemailman]

Those who do not obey the Gospel are condemned.

in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. These shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, when He comes, in that Day, to be glorified in His saints and to be admired among all those who believe, because our testimony among you was believed. 2 Thessalonians 1:8-9

JLB

Those who do not obey the gospel are those who do not believe the gospel. *Romans 10:16 - But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our report?”

Romans 1:16 - For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ for it is the power of God unto salvation to everyone that BELIEVES..

2 Corinthians 4:3 - But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: 4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

 

[BNR32FAN]

The state says you can get your driver’s license if you can pass the test. But passing the test isn’t the only requirement. You must reside in that state and be of legal age. So does that mean that saying you can get your license if you pass the test is incorrect? No it’s just one of the major requirements. Would you point out to the clerk at the DMV office that it says in the DMV handbook it says here I need to pass the test and I can get my license? The clerk will tell you to keep reading there are more requirements in the book. In the same way a person will be saved if they believe but believing isn’t the only requirement. If you keep reading you will see that repentance and producing fruit are also required. The authors of the Bible kept writing because their message wasn’t complete. They didn’t stop at believing. So we must keep reading to get the full message.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Those who do not obey the gospel are those who do not believe the gospel. *Romans 10:16 - But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed our report?”

Romans 1:16 - For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ for it is the power of God unto salvation to everyone that BELIEVES..

2 Corinthians 4:3 - But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: 4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

John 15:1-8 Jesus teaches that we must produce fruit to abide in Him. If we don’t produce fruit we are not abiding in Him and we will be cut off from Him. John 3:1-8 Jesus says we must be born again to enter the kingdom of God. John 3:11-12 explains why believing is imperative to salvation. To say only believing is necessary for salvation is saying that all of Christianity was wrong for the first 1500+ years and everyone before Luther was misinformed about the gospel by the church. John 15:1-8 smashes both faith without works and eternal security along with Calvinism.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said: ↑
Wrong. Obedience functions to produce swhat God intends. Don't you understand Rom 16:26? but now revealed and made known through the prophetic writings by the command of the eternal God, so that all the Gentiles might come to the obedience that comes from faith—

Since obedience comes from faith, they can't be synonymous.

Couldn’t be further from the truth.

Your misunderstanding of the verse couldn't be further from the truth.

The words are clear enough to refute your misreading of the verse.

 

[Danthemailman]

In the same way a person will be saved if they believe but believing isn’t the only requirement. If you keep reading you will see that repentance and producing fruit are also required.

Repentance precedes believing the gospel. Those who have truly repented believe the gospel and those who believe the gospel have already repented in the process of changing their mind and choosing to believe the gospel. *Two sides to the same coin. Producing fruit is the effect of salvation, not the cause.

The authors of the Bible kept writing because their message wasn’t complete. They didn’t stop at believing. So we must keep reading to get the full message.

Believing in Christ for salvation is sufficient to save because the OBJECT of our belief/faith (Christ's finished work of redemption) is sufficient and complete to save believers. No supplements needed. (Romans 3:22-28).

 

[FreeGrace2]

I said:
"What you've failed to do is prove that Jesus didn't teach eternal security in
John 5:24 and 10:28.

Any reasonable person easily sees the truth of eternal security from those 2 verses.

What does John 10:28 say?

That's it? just go and ignore all the 24 verses that speak of believing for salvation and eternal life? Well, that's sure convenient for your position. Just ignore that which refutes your position.

We all know what John 10:28 says. I've quoted it plenty enough. You should have it memorized by now, if you've been paying any attention.

John 10:28 says that recipients of eternal life shall never perish. That's eternal security.

And John 5:24 says whoever believes possesses eternal life.

So, from John 5:24, we know that eternal life is given WHEN one believes, in order for John 5:24 to be true and accurate. And you've NOT shown otherwise.

So, from the MOMENT one believes, they shall never perish. Again, eternal security.

So, why haven't you ever provided any verse that just out and out says that salvation can be lost? huh?

 

[FreeGrace2]

JLB777 said: ↑
So you teach people to disobey God and I teach people The obedience of faith.

When all else fails, pull out the straw man argument. Seeking salvation by works is not the obedience of faith.

And he's blatant about his works salvation system.

He even claims Rom 2:7 is HOW one receives eternal life; by continuance in doing good.

He quotes that verse all the time.

And you've nailed his problem with understanding clear words of Scripture.

 

[FreeGrace2]

John 15:1-8 Jesus teaches that we must produce fruit to abide in Him. If we don’t produce fruit we are not abiding in Him and we will be cut off from Him.

The Arminian failure is their rejection of the concept of fellowship. How can any believer bear fruit if they are out of fellowship? Of course they can't.

But Arminians don't understand fellowship at all. Instead of being out of fellowship, to them, the person is out of salvation.

John 3:1-8 Jesus says we must be born again to enter the kingdom of God. John 3:11-12 explains why believing is imperative to salvation. To say only believing is necessary for salvation is saying that all of Christianity was wrong for the first 1500+ years and everyone before Luther was misinformed about the gospel by the church. John 15:1-8 smashes both faith without works and eternal security along with Calvinism.

Let's not bring Calvin into this. He had as many errors as Arminians.

Even Calvin didn't understand fellowship.