Salvation vs : service.

[BNR32FAN]

Not so far.

You skipped post 772.

 

[Sidon]

They were chosen before the foundation of the world.

Same as God knowing Hitler would be born again before He died, if indeed He was...
I dont know, yet.

Also, Its Christ who said to the Father, that He gave all 12 to Him.

Jesus Himself chose and appeared to Paul, after Christ was back in Glory.

 

[Ligurian]

Well, the verse was correct, but your interpretation isn't.

John 3:16, says that """for God so loved the world"", not just the predestined elect.

The Sacrifice of God on the Cross, is for the sin of the entire world. "ALL who will believe", or as Jesus says...."If i be lifted up, i will draw ALL men, to me".....not just the predestined.

God has redeemed the entire world's sin, until forever.

In context, for the record:

Matthew 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call His name JESUS: for He shall save His people from their sins.

Which Ones Are His People?

John 10:26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of My sheep, as I said unto you. 27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me: 28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any [man] pluck them out of My hand.

John 3:18 He that believeth on Him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. 19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their works were evil.

Matthew 20:20:1 For the Kingdom of Heaven is like unto a man [that is] an householder, which went out early in the morning to hire labourers into His vineyard. ... 16 So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen.

 

[Sidon]

Jesus also said “many will fall away but the one who endured to the end will be saved.”

Yes, you've used the "endure" verse, a few times.
It fails each time, because as i told you the last 2 times, ... you have no idea what the "end" is, and you are not able to recognize that you dont use symbolic verses to try to teach literal doctrine.

Jesus will tell you this........if you meet him.

"All that call upon the name of Jesus, shall be saved".

He will tell you that, and not talk about enduing.

Notice something.
The verse says......He who endures......shall be saved.

Yet the born again are already saved.

Now, i can't cause you to understand this......i can only show you what to see.

 

[Sidon]

I think Sidon must be confusing this forum for his on-stage performances... gotta be hard to have that guy for a brother.

When you try to substitute hateful sarcasm for IQ evidence, it shows.

Work on that, issue.
Do better, if possible.

 

[Sidon]

What thinking person believes that you can murder your brethren and still be saved?

Popes had thousands burned.
Calvin only burned one.

Do you think they can still be saved?

 

[Sidon]

The word “abide” means to stay, remain, continue, or dwell. So your basically saying we don’t stay in Christ to go to heaven.

No, im specifically saying that when you are born again into the Spirit of God, by God's Holy Spirit, you are IN CHIRST.
There is your abiding, found, maintained, and completed.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

In context, for the record:

Matthew 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call His name JESUS: for He shall save His people from their sins.

Which Ones Are His People?

According to scriptures His people has these characteristics:

Revelations 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

Revelations 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

 

[Sidon]

Are you trying to say that a born again person can’t sin?

I didnt skip this post.
I just missed it, as im in a hurry to respond to so many today.

See, this is Mon.
This is my night to hit the hay early, 7pm.....and i need to practice for 30 mins before i do that.
This means i have less then 6 mins, and i have 10 posts left to respond to, that will turn into at least 10 more, tonight.
Tomorrow i get up at 2:25am, to prepare my initial warm up stretching and light workout before i then to and do my 75 mins in a gym.
Then i do 20 flights of stairs carrying 10lbs, followed by carrying (2) 20lb dumbbells for about 10 mins as my aerobics.
Then a slight warm down of stretching and light weights.
This takes 2.5 hrs, and i do it 4x a week.
So, 2 days a week i do the early gym, and 2 days, i go in later.
I thought you might want to know this Bnr32fan, , as you are so interested in my "likes" count, i wanted to share something personal with you.

So,

Here is the answer to your inquiry.

The born again are to exit here :

"being made free from sin, we have Peace with God".
"Christ always gives me the Victory".

 

[Ligurian]

Listen, lets just jump to the "dead faith" issue you have, as all legalist teach that "dead faith" means "dead salvation".
Yet, if you actually read James, and not a heretic's commentary on James, then you find James teaching that dead faith is a product of a backslidden spiritual condition.
Nothing more, nothing less.

All born again people who are caught up in loving the things of the world, have dead faith.
All commandment keeping legalists, have dead faith.

Look at this closely...

What God did to resolve your separation from His Holy Spirit, (because you have sinned), was come here as the 2nd Adam, with the same holiness, righteousness, and Holy SPIRIT.
This is offered to you, as a "Gift".
This is what Jesus is talking about when He says dying on The Cross....."it is Finished".
This is the completion of what Jesus had to do, so that God could offer you the only way to become reconciled to God. John 14:6

Man is where YOU go for knowledge, Sidon... you proved it by saying you're a seminary guy... so, please stop pretending we're twins.

Have you met "all legalist", "All born again people", or "All commandment keeping legalists"? Have you ever been a law-keeper? No? So you'd be wise to not pretend you speak for them.

Personally, I don't even know what "dead faith" or "dead salvation" means. And James never uses the word "backslidden" either... are they seminarisms?

The Kingdom Gospel teaches that the prince of this world is judged for bringing death into the world.

John 14:6 is part of the Kingdom Gospel... it isn't a stand-alone document. It links to this unbroken chain of events: If you keep His commandments, Jesus will pray the Father, and the Father will give you the Holy Spirit. John 14:15-17

This is not what happens in the grace gospel. Figure out how to present your grace gospel without doing damage to the words of Jesus. If you're smart enough, you'll be able to do this.

 

[Ligurian]

According to scriptures His people has these characteristics:

Revelations 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

Revelations 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Yes. Jesus came to give His sheep the Father's words:

John 12:44 Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on Me, believeth not on Me, but on Him that sent Me. 45 And he that seeth Me seeth Him that sent Me. 46 I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on Me should not abide in darkness. 47 And if any man hear My words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. 48 He that rejecteth Me, and receiveth not My words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. 49 For I have not spoken of Myself; but the Father which sent Me, He gave Me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 50 And I know that His commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto Me, so I speak.

The same warning is in both of these verses /\ \/.

Deuteronomy 18:18 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee(Moses), and will put My words in His mouth; and He shall speak unto them all that I shall command Him. 19 And it shall come to pass, [that] whosoever will not hearken unto My words which He shall speak in My name, I will require [it] of him.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Yes. Jesus came to give His sheep the Father's words:

John 12:44 Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on Me, believeth not on Me, but on Him that sent Me. 45 And he that seeth Me seeth Him that sent Me. 46 I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on Me should not abide in darkness. 47 And if any man hear My words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. 48 He that rejecteth Me, and receiveth not My words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. 49 For I have not spoken of Myself; but the Father which sent Me, He gave Me a commandment, what I should say, and what I should speak. 50 And I know that His commandment is life everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto Me, so I speak.

The same warning is in both of these verses /\ \/.

Deuteronomy 18:18 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee(Moses), and will put My words in His mouth; and He shall speak unto them all that I shall command Him. 19 And it shall come to pass, [that] whosoever will not hearken unto My words which He shall speak in My name, I will require [it] of him.

True, but your post was directed on how we identify God’s people, which according to scriptures posted they are identified as a remnant and they still keep God’s commandments. Not too many people left who still believe in all of God’s commandments.

Anyway, just wanted to add that, I’m bowing out of this thread, not sure you can reason with the OP.

God bless

 

[Ligurian]

Is it?
And just think, i have to keep repeating it to this member, since the 1st day im here.
Maybe you can pm him and say...>"hey, stop talking about the "dudes', Likes, and stop bringing up that born again shooter, 20 times."..

Alright then.
If you have a legit NT question to ask me that isn't about a symbolic verse, from "the Revelation", then that would be great.
Start any time you like.

You missed my whole point... it has to do with where you were before this forum.

 

[Ligurian]

When you try to substitute hateful sarcasm for IQ evidence, it shows.

Work on that, issue.
Do better, if possible.

hmmm... Matthew 7:4

Listen, lets just jump to the "dead faith" issue you have,
as all legalist teach that "dead faith" means "dead salvation".

Yet, if you actually read James, and not a heretic's commentary on James,
then you find James teaching that dead faith is a product of a backslidden spiritual condition.

All born again people who are caught up in loving the things of the world, have dead faith.
All commandment keeping legalists, have dead faith.

I don't really see how someone can love the things of the world AND be a commandment keeping legalist... the two things cancel each other out.

James 1:25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth [therein], he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his works.

"a heretic's commentary on James"... you can't be talking about me, since you call me a 'legalistic commandment keeper', as though that's a curse or something. Because Jesus says He's my only teacher, and I keep that commandment... and these two things cancel each other out, as well. Can't really be reading what other people think James meant AND be keeping Matthew 23:8-10 and John 17:20.

See, we are taught that "good works = good people".

Who would not want to hear all about what Paul said when you consider that He wrote most of the New Testament?
Who? A dark light.

A "dark light", really? (sigh)
Ooorr... they'd be a follower of the Kingdom Gospel, Galatians 2:7-9

Jesus to the Disciples given to Him by the Father
John 13-John 15:2 Every branch in Me that beareth not fruit He taketh away: and every [branch] that beareth fruit, He purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. 3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. 16 Ye have not chosen Me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and [that] your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in My name, He may give it you.

Revelation 3:8 I know thy works: behold, I have set before thee an open door, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept My word, and hast not denied My name.

Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Revelation 17:14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with Him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

 

[Ligurian]

Popes had thousands burned.
Calvin only burned one.

Do you think they can still be saved?

Matthew 19:17 And He said unto him, Why callest thou Me good? [there is] none good but one, [that is], God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. 18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, 19 Honour thy father and [thy] mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Revelation 22:14 Blessed [are] they that do His commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. 15 For without [are] dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

 

[setst777]

No, im specifically saying that when you are born again into the Spirit of God, by God's Holy Spirit, you are IN CHIRST.
There is your abiding, found, maintained, and completed.

I see that you are not able to reconcile your teaching of "born again" with all those verses, in almost every book of the NT, admonishing and warning about the possibility of falling from the faith, and to endure, and stand, in the faith to the end to be saved. Most of those admonitions and warning are found in the Pauline Gospel.

So, what are you going to do?

Will you deny and ignore all the Scriptures of warning and admonition to the Church?

Will you consider that maybe your understanding of "born again" may be in error?

Do you think maybe your teaching of "born again" being "never lose salvation" may be in error, or are the Scriptures in error regarding the possibility of losing salvation?

 

[Sidon]

You need to find out what it means to be “in Christ”.

It means this for the last 2000 yrs.

"born again".

 

[Sidon]

Answer the questions and prove me wrong.

Jesus already answered you when He said....>"It is Finished".
And that is not you doing it.
Believe it.

 

[Sidon]

Jesus also said “many will fall away but the one who endured to the end will be saved.”
?

Salvation is not "enduring".

Salvation is : John 14:6

 

[Sidon]

In context, for the record:

Matthew 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call His name JESUS: for He shall save His people from their sins.

Which Ones Are His People?

.

all these.


1.) The Chosen are the jews

2.) the born again are the redeemed.