really not praying to Mary???

[mike1reynolds]

How great it will be to draw close to Our Lady, and when we die and meet our Lord, Jesus will say.."Come in, I have heard so much about you from My Mother."

Are you kidding?

No, this is just a crazy analogy that ignores the real state of everyone in Heaven. It has nothing to do with the RCC position, it is instead a misunderstanding of the nature of souls in Heaven, as it were just like here. On Earth 2000 years ago, that could easily have been the case, but even for YOUR mother that could not be the case in Heaven.

However, you assume that if your crazy analogy is not the case then there must be no relationship what-so-ever between Jesus and His mother. You are swinging from one crazy extreme to another.

 

[Iollain]

That's the problem I have. Catholics explain it differently. It's just difficult to see with the semantics they employ.

yeah it's like they have some mummy's boy, imo

 

[mike1reynolds]

yeah it's like they have some mummy's boy, imo

Or it could be said that it is like you are jealous of His mother.

 

[Tonks]

More people that know nothing of Christianity. Sad state of affairs. Luckily Christ knows our hearts so I hope that He decides to feel merciful on some of the more difficult people around here. They need it.

 

[Iollain]

Yes you do don't ya.

 

[Tonks]

Yes you do don't ya.

Actually, I was speaking directly at you.

 

[Iollain]

Yes i know that.

 

[Tonks]

I could care less if we agree. I simply wish you'd show a bit more respect. A "mummy's boy" religion is pushing it a wee bit far.

 

[Iollain]

How about you guys show some respect for God. Your the ones pushing it a bit to far.

 

[Tonks]

How about you guys show some respect for God. Your the ones pushing it a bit to far.

Fine. But only if the solo scriptura types stop treating Mary as some sort of rented womb.

 

[Iollain]

Show me where i've done this then...actually i don't think you can as i don't try to contact Mary to treat her in any way.

 

[mike1reynolds]

How about you guys show some respect for God. Your the ones pushing it a bit to far.

Ah, yes, while you attack the Apostolic Tradition that Jesus gave to the world, because we disagree with you we disagree with God. Such Christian humility you demonstrate.

 

[mike1reynolds]

BTW, I need to stress that I am not defending the RCC or the EO. John Wesley was heavily influenced by Apostolic Tradition since he was a true Christian, and these facts permeate all of Methodist theology, even if Methodists in general are only just beginning to show interest in Marion veneration.

So I am defending Christianity as a whole, not my separate denomination. Apostolic Tradition is an integral part of the legacy that Jesus left behind, and I am defending Jesus, not any particular denomination.

 

[simonthezealot]

Tonks,
You find Iollain offensive, listen to what your saying "sola scriptura types" your degradingly saying "Those people who honor the bible as God's final word of authority" types, that sounds pretty disrespectful to what God gave us for correction and reproof.
None of us have ever said anything similar to considering her a rent a womb... come'on, any Christian knows she is blessed among humans, it's that you guys seem to take it to far, if I was Catholic I would go to confession and ask for forgiveness for praying TO a deceased human now in heaven. This truly can not be pleasing to our Lord even if it is Mary. You bow to her statue yet Peter yelled at Cornelius for doing this " I am only human he exclaimed"

 

[mike1reynolds]

if I was Catholic I would go to confession and ask for forgiveness for praying TO a deceased human now in heaven.

How many times do they have to repeat that they ask saints to pray FOR them?

As to the rent-a-womb comment, I think it is an appropriate synopsis of the criticisms. The denial that there is anything special about Mary, other than who she gave birth to, is to deny any real connection between Jesus and His mother.

 

[Davidnic]

How many times do they have to repeat that they ask saints to pray FOR them?

Also, that prayer does not equal worship. Prayer is realtionship. With God that realtionship includes worship. With saints it does not.

 

[simonthezealot]

My quote isn't working but Mike, why is it you think anyone other than our; all knowing, all seeing, all hearing, Father can hear and understand and do anything about our prayers.
We all know she is special,(blessed among women not above women) not a diety though. And judging by the conversations Catholics have with her, I gotta argue that they consider her able to hear their prayers, wouldn't that make her a diety?

 

[Tonks]

We all know she is special,(blessed among women not above women) not a diety though. And judging by the conversations Catholics have with her, I gotta argue that they consider her able to hear their prayers, wouldn't that make her a diety?

Hardly. Any Saint in Heaven can interecede on our behalf. The key being intercede not answer.

The quotes seem to be working now - though it is a bit of a crap-shoot these days.

 

[Iollain]

What about the apparition who was supposidly Mary who said she has graces to hand out, if only people would ask her? The one with the rings on her hand and the dark ones represent graces noone has asked for?

 

[simonthezealot]

Hardly. Any Saint in Heaven can interecede on our behalf. The key being intercede not answer.

quote]

Scripture me please!