Questioning God being just due to Hell

[Russ Campbell]

You all need to post messages about Love and Caring for your fellow man, not fear spreading about Hell and Fire and Brimstone. Thats what a so called Christian group did to my mother and now she does not trust anyone that tells her anything about the Bible or Jesus, when you spread fear about Hell you do this to many non-Christians and Christians that read everything on this site, and in person by what you say. You need to preach about the LOVE that Jesus has for everyone , not their sins but about them being human beings, and loving them as HUMAN BEINGS, too many non-Christians have been turned off by fear spreading like not all of you but some of you, and thsi is not what Jesus Christ wanted to happen. He certainly did not wat that so called church group to scare my Mother for the rest of her life, and only LOVE and SINCERE LOVE LIKE I QUOTED TO HER AWHILE AGO will set her free. As for peoples sins, Jesus will look after their sins, YOU AND I ARE NOT JUDGES ONLY GOD THE FATHER IS. That is the way to preach, not fear and death and fire and brimstone , these things are NOT from Jesus. Sure He talked about them in the Bible but I think that He wants us to really express love for our fellow human being. He did point out: and again I will repeat it: Love your God with all your Heart, Body, Mind and Soul (I am paraphrasing it in my own words) and equally important Love your neighbour as yourself. And by saying this I am not fighting all of you here , I am fighting Satan. Lets put the hatred and fear where it belongs: for Satan, not our fellow man. Dont hate God , worship Him and praise Him and most of all Love Him , He deserves it... Think about it please !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! For those of you who still don't believe what I have said, I am willing to die for my Mother, if that is not LOVE then what is it, and she will know what I am talking about.

 

[Vicomte13]

You guys are all talking about Hell and death and all things negitive, this is what I posted to my mother on Facebook:

• Mom: I have told you why I am taking a stand againts tens of thousands of kids being forced to kill thier parents in Sudan only because they have said something negative against Islam , they are being forced by Government rebels to either KILL thier parents or be KILLED .... I have to wake you up, how would you feel if I was forced by my religion to either KILL you or be KILLED myself for simply saying something negative about Christianity...put yourself in their parents shoes...
• 
  
• Russ Campbell Mom: if I was ever forced by my religion to either be killed or kill you I would sacrifice myself myself thats how much I love you and when Jesus sacrificed himself on the cross , thats how much He loves YOU He wuld gladly do it for even for YOU even if you were the only one on earth , thats how much he loves you., and Im am crying while I am writing you this thats how much I care and I tell you this if He had to do it again in this fallen world He woul do it again gladly, thats how much He loves he whole world -Russ Campbell

I am ok now I am no longer crying but thats how much I love her, even a non Christian who hates everything I say not only about Jesus but about the Bible too , she does not believe in God or Jesus, Heaven or Hell , Adam and Eve , Mans Fall, the Resurection.... she is so blinded by Satan that she actually hates anything to do with Christiananity and has threatened to have me committed to mental hospital if I do not stop spreading the word, and one of the nurses at the retirement home that I live in agrees with her she is in the opinion that I have gone off my rocker because I am writing about Christianity and lets not forget spreading the word. for a while I hid it from her by putting all of my writings in a private Christian group but a lot of people left the group simply because it was private, I moved all of my messages to my public timeline and I am ready for a Holy War against her and that nurse and possibly my psych, I am hoping it does not go that far but I am ready and I have Jesus behind me , Satan cannot possibly win.. and when I told her about how I was healed today, she would not even hear of it, if the above does not reach her than nothing will, its that simple.... Russ Campbell

PS: I tell you all now: Jesus is a God of Love , not hatred like some of you are spreading here... yes Jesus wil send those that do not Love Him to the Lake of Fire to burn forever, but He will GREATLY CRY when He does it, that is how much He loves us, in fact I know He will weep bitterly for each soul lost in the Lake Of Fire. so the answer is to Love Jesus (or God) , but when Jesus said God he really meant Himself, to love Him with all of your might, and all of your strength and all of your heart. The second commandment is equally important: Love your Neighbour as yourself... if you do this and repent of your sins and really mean it , I mean with tears in your eyes, not fake tears but REAL tears , then you will be saved from the Lake of Fire. At that point your name will be written in the book of The Lamb, and its is simple ALL OF THOSE WHO DO NOT HAVE THIER NAME WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF TH LAMB WILL PERISH. My tears were real when I wrote that letter to my Mother, who hates Christianity, if they are so real to me that I bawled tears when wrting it and after wring it for at least 5 mins the can't some of you extend that love to non-Christians AND MUSLUMS , love them not thier religion, show them the love that I showed my Mother, even though she is threaening to have me committed if I do not stop talking religion especally to her
but I still love her enough that if I was forced by christianity to either Kill her or be killed , I would sacrifice myself for her.... that is love, and if you too will do that for someone who is your enemy then Jesus will honor all of you who are doing for that, cause it is His way. He set an example for us, its His Father who cannot stand sin at all, why do you think He said "Father: why have you forsaken me" just before He died on the cross, His Father simply could not look at Him because He had the whole world's sins upon Him", if the Father could not look at His Son at that moment how much will he not be able to look at you if you reject Jesus? If you accept Jesus the Father simply will not see any sin in you, that is why Jesus died on the cross an drose again.
Just think about it if only the world would do that (show love for each other) there would be NO Hatred, NO wars, NO poverty (because we would make sure that noone would be in poverty), but lets face it, this world is not like that, there are killings going on in the Sudan by children against thier parents for simply saying something negative about Islam, imagine if Christianity was that way, if children were forced to either kill their parents or be killed themselves simply because their parents said something negative about Christianity, think about how you and your parents would think about this if it ever happened, and both were placed in that prediciment. And I just got news about Justin Trudeau embracing Isis in Canada , I do not know if it is true or not but I will look on Google and see what they say, and yes they are fairly accurate about Good and Bad News and can usually tell you if something is a hoax (I am hoping it is) because millions of people are asking the same questions.... One thing is for sure STOP SPREADING YOU NEGATIVITY ABOUT HELL it only comes from Satan, think about it if Satan has already infiltrated the churches, causing petty bickering and division when we should all be united, Satan does not want that and he is doing it all of the time, just look at all of the comments here on Christian Forums and you will see all of his fingerprints all over the entire site. The good news is that God (Jesus again) is aways in control, no matter what we hear on the news (and it is all bad news , good news does not sell), Jesus is aways creating new life to balance out all of the death and murder in this fallen world, and He will always be in complete control. Don't forget Jesus defeated Satan not on the cross, but when He rose again.... Russ Campbell and yes I can see all of these things oing on here and I AM NOT blinded by Satan, yes He is trying to stop me because I am all of a sudden tying to show LOVE not hatred, and yes even I am guilty of doing that and not only can I see hatred and Satans fingerprints all over this site and many more , but I can see it in myself after a little while so my writings have been a journey as I have writte all of my thoughts down here o Christian Forums and I can see myself getting better and better through all of my writings, examine them and see where I have made errors and have suddenly today had a whole change of heart. My outlook on all of you has changed to one of love , when it used to be in some places hatred (that too came from Satan, but Jesus is triumphing in me)...thanks for listening to a young mans ravings ..... Your loving Brother in

Update after searching through Google this is what I found:

This is happening in Canada: a free country: Liberals mum on Trudeau’s mosque visit

There is always a third option for people given a gun and told to kill or be killed. This is true in armies in particular. You can always take the gun you are given to kill, and suddenly turn and kill the official giving you the order.

And then, in the surprise of the moment, shoot the next one.

You never have to kill somebody you don't want to kill if you have a weapon in your hand. You always have the option of turning that weapon to kill, or try to kill, whoever is giving the order. This is why the "I was under orders" excuse really doesn't fly. Yes, you were under orders. You have a gun and carried out the orders. You COULD HAVE shot the officer who gave you the orders. And then shot the others who come to his aid. Yes, you might end up dead. But then, we all die, and soldiers always face death. There is never an excuse for an armed man to do evil because he "HAS" to - the armed man can ALWAYS shoot the officers on his OWN SIDE that are commanding him to do it. And if they get into the habit of doing that, it rapidly brings down the system and turns into a civil war.

 

[Vicomte13]

Right, God was showing His mighty power and making His name be known as to be great. He is a terrible God. What I was thinking of though is when some
in Israel would disobey God's rules and then all of Israel would have to kill them or at least watch. It was to put the fear in them as to what happens when people disobey God. That is what I think the reason is for showing at the end of Isaiah 66 and Daniel 12:2 that the unjust will rise to shame and everlasting
contempt/abhorring. Why would others have to be abhorred by them? Isaiah 66 shows that at set times the wicked will be viewed and what other reason would it be other than to remind them what happens to sinners?

We do have to be careful not to read "cut off from your people" as "put to death", because it doesn't perforce mean that. When God commanded death, he said so explicitly. Both death and being "cut off from your people" meant the same thing as far as God's Covenant with the Hebrews at Sinai goes: it meant that that man lost his claim to land in the land of Israel.

Remember that the Mosaic Covenant was not about salvation. It was exclusively, on its own terms, about the Hebrews gaining a claim to a free farm in Israel, for good behavior. If they followed the law, they got the farm in peace and prosperity. If they broke the law, they got various degrees of punishment. Certain crimes were severe enough to cause the transgressor to be cut out of the family tree of Israel, and thereby to lose his hereditary land rights and all of his other privileges in Israel as a descendant of Jacob, Isaac and Abraham and/or the Exodus. This could take the form of being driven out. When God demanded an execution, he said so specifically. But there could be no execution without trial, witnesses, and the witnesses had to cast the first stone, etc.

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[BobRyan]

What do you think "their worm" part is about in Isaiah 66:24?
Do you agree that is a scene on the new earth?

No it happens before the New Earth as described in Rev 21 - the wicked are consumed in Rev 20 and then in Rev 21 - the New Earth.

The ashes under the souls of the foot described in Isaiah 66 is certainly the New Earth.

Christ points out that the "worm does not die" reference is to someone alive - burning in that lake of fire (fiery hell) so not the point in the New Earth where saints walk on the ashes. Or else the saints would be in hell.

Why are the others abhorred at the sight of the ones that their worm dieth not?
I see in the OT where worm seems to be linked to reproach/man.

It is a reference to the second death - and the fact that life continues on during that event until they are completely consumed to ashes "destroy both body and soul in fiery hell" Matt 10:28

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[vinsight4u]

/nvm

 

[Bible2+]

vinsight4u said in post #89:

We are not for sure told everything that the rich man saw and heard in the time of Luke 16. Did he see other people? He knew there was room there for his five brothers to reside in this place of torment.

Indeed.

And may God have mercy on us so we don't end up there ourselves (Luke 18:13-14).

Also, note that in Job 33:22, the original Hebrew word (shachath: H7845) translated as "the grave" can be translated as "the pit" (Job 33:28,30), meaning the extremely deep pit which is in hell/sheol (Isaiah 14:15, Psalms 30:3, Job 11:8), in the sides of which pit are the graves of the conscious souls of the unsaved dead (Isaiah 14:15,9-10, Ezekiel 32:21-23), who experience pain there (Psalms 116:3). This pit is in the "nether" (the lowermost, Hebrew: tachtiy: H8482) parts of the earth (Ezekiel 32:18-32, Psalms 63:9), and so it could reach down to the center of the earth (in the spiritual dimension). And it could continue past the center of the earth and continue on in a straight line up the other side of the earth almost to the surface, so that the pit is "bottomless" in that its lowest point is empty space at the center of the earth (in the spiritual dimension). Satan/Lucifer will be cast into this literal "bottomless pit" by an angel at Jesus' second coming (Revelation 19:7 to 20:3, Isaiah 14:15,12).

The bottomless pit may have a physical manifestation as a deep underground cavern. The top of this cavern could be deep under the city of Abadan (in Iran), just as the bottomless pit is under the angel Abaddon (Revelation 9:11). At one point during the first half of the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24, strange locust-like beings will swarm up from the bottomless pit to torment (but not kill) mankind with excruciating stings for five months (Revelation 9:2-10).

 

[dhh712]

I have some problems. I've been questioning God's justice.

To me, an eternal punishment doesn't seem fair for offenses against God. I get God is eternal, and sinning against an eternal being is graver than sinning against a fellow man. And all sins are against God. But torturing us for trillions of years for messing up once as humans seems insanely harsh to me. I don't get why God even created us if he planned on doing this to the majority of his creations before the world even began, as it says the way to life is narrow and few find it in the Bible. It seems wrong to do this to living beings.

And I also question my salvation because it's hard to say I love God with my whole heart when I think of Him this way.

I don't want to think God treats his creations like this, but I believe in the Bible because most of the evidence I've seen points to it being true. Including talking to people who had demons cast out of them selves in Jesus name.

The doctrine of Hell is what causes me to see God in a bad light. Has anyone else went through this before and how did you come out of this?

Yes, I have the same doubts about it myself. I hate the thought of anyone suffering, so to think about this makes me feel just really sick and disturbed. The way I deal with it is that I trust the Lord's moral judgment over my own. There's a lot about the spiritual world and eternity which I don't understand (practically all of it); I consider that to look at it from my perspective with the limitations I have of being completely in the physical world (with my senses) and existing only in the presence of time (which does not exist in eternity), I most likely have quite a misunderstanding of what's to come.

Therefore I trust the Lord and lean not on my own understanding.